I had a hypothetical question for Erik and the folks over at Paizo...But I decided I wanted everyone's opinion.
If WotC gave Piazo permission to make one last Greyhawk product....just one...and then Greyhawk would be put to rest forever...What would you want that one product to be? So for the Piaizo guys...what would you create?
In this hypotetical WotC is giving you complete freedom to do what you want since they never plan on ever revisiting this setting again.
So if you want to turn the setting on its head go right ahead. The only restriction is that its for 3.5 as a going away preasent for the setting and system.
Would you want a campaign setting hardcover? An adventure path that leads up to Oreth's end? A compilation of old material updated to 3.5?
If WotC gave Piazo permission to make one last Greyhawk product....just one...and then Greyhawk would be put to rest forever...What would you want that one product to be?
After reading Expedition to the Ruins of Greyhawk, that's easy. I'd want the Paizo troupe to completely flesh out the rest of the ruins. That'd be pretty cool.
Greg
The Complete Greyhawk Wikipedia or a Ptolus style book that compiles all the flavor with some new history.
Edit: I should clarify. NO system rules. Just a complete campaign setting. Then it could be used with any system. Ecologies on monsters with hints at stats (Strong, Extremely Strong, Weak, etc).
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
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A 'World of Greyhawk Boxed Set' that includes a giant poster map; a player's guide to Greyhawk with all the original greyhawk dieties, and with each country given a one page map; a Greyhawk City book with pull-out map; a DM guide that includes NPCs with both 3.5 and 4th edition stats, adventure hooks, and maps that locate all Greyhawk modules of any edition. Oh, yeah, and every boxed set comes with one randomly assigned miniatures of one of the Circle of Eight. ... What, that's one product. A boxed set is one product, right?
I would want a new and updated Greyhawk Players Guide, in the spirit of the old First Ed/Second Ed hardcover. It ought to cover the classic places of adventure, the secrets of the Circle of Eight (all those forgotten spells like Otto's Boiling Oil Bath and Nystul's Radiant Baton!), inner wisdom of the faiths of the various pantheons (spells and PRC's), geographical flavor and feats, major NPC's (with statblocks) of the setting, and a timeline sidebar with notations on major historical events. I'd like it to have a 3.5 updated compilation of the Greyhawk Journal articles. Monster Manual entries for the Greyhawk dragon and other classic GH specific creatures. And it needs great art; old school art like Elmore and Parkinson alongside new artists' works from the WotC stable. It should include a removable full-color painted geographical map of the Flaeness, like the multipart one from Dragon magazine. And last but not least, a splash page in the back with contact and online information for a new Greyhawk league in the vein of Living Greyhawk, by fans and for fans! I would of course envision no one other than Erik Mona as the smiling first member in the recruitment poster! :-)
Yeah Tarren a box set I guess would be one product. Very clever. ;)
I dont like the random miniature idea though. Trying to get the other 7 on e-bay would financially kill me (as if the price tag on your box set wouldnt already).
CEO
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The Complete Greyhawk Wikipedia or a Ptolus style book that compiles all the flavor with some new history.
This is pretty much what I would want. One super-sized compilation of everything Greyhawk as a standing testament to this great setting. And of course, we would fill out the stuff that hasn't already received the deluxe treatment. Don't forget the CD-ROM full of GH goodness that comes with the 1000 page book. Of course, it would cost $200, but who would care? It would be the Definitive Greyhawk. Ahhhhhh. One can dream. :)
As the Brand Manager for Greyhawk at WotC when we brought the campaign back from the dead, this would make me one happy camper.
-Lisa
A 'World of Greyhawk Boxed Set' that includes a giant poster map; a player's guide to Greyhawk with all the original greyhawk dieties, and with each country given a one page map; a Greyhawk City book with pull-out map; a DM guide that includes NPCs with both 3.5 and 4th edition stats, adventure hooks, and maps that locate all Greyhawk modules of any edition. Oh, yeah, and every boxed set comes with one randomly assigned miniatures of one of the Circle of Eight. ... What, that's one product. A boxed set is one product, right?
Oh that's easy...
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Please; I do not need another friggin' copy of the map of the World of Greyhawk.
What I would like is a clear reason to start or continue a campaign in a world which, by our assumptions is never going to be supported again:
[list]
I know some (many) people will probably disagree with me but here it goes. For me the ultimate greyhawk thing to come out with would be an updated version of "Castle Greyhawk" done in the traditional style (unlike the expeditions) with a whole new section of new similarly themed wacky stuff.
There I said it, and I'm proud of it. I LOVED Castle Greyhawk. It was one of the first things I could really get into in D&D. Unfortunately someone stole my copy. :(
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I've still got my old brown box Greyhawk set (my brother had the slightly older Greyhawk folder thing). I always use it as my source of info on Greyhawk, and many bits and pieces in there really inspired by gaming style. I don't really need much more than what's available now for setting information for Greyhawk. Admittedly, I don't run a lot of stuff there.
If I could have a new Greyhawk product of my choice, it would be a mega adventure playing the refugees from the Rain of Colourless Fire, travelling to the Flanaess and trying to build a new life for themselves. A historical piece that would act as a new prequel/flashback/introduction to the setting.
And Swirler, you are wlecome to my copy of Castle Greyhawk, except that I may have burned it after a DM tried to run it as a serious adventure. Actually that book gave me mixed feelings. I laughed so hard I almost cried while reading it, but I had actually bought it hoping to run it. And you can't, really.
And Swirler, you are wlecome to my copy of Castle Greyhawk, except that I may have burned it after a DM tried to run it as a serious adventure. Actually that book gave me mixed feelings. I laughed so hard I almost cried while reading it, but I had actually bought it hoping to run it. And you can't, really.
yeah trying to run it would take a special (read: Insane) DM. I've always thought it could be fun to run given the right group (read: drunk and insane). And, if you DO still have it, I would LOVE it. heh
re: WG7. I say again, Level 6, "The Temple of the Really Bad Dead Things" by Greg Gorden is both funny and perfectly playable.
yes the generic evil mosters and the upc barcode scanner
lolclassic
I've personally always loved the "Mithril Knife of Greyhawk"
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re: WG7. I say again, Level 6, "The Temple of the Really Bad Dead Things" by Greg Gorden is both funny and perfectly playable.
Actually, IIRC there are a few individual playable levels, and that one certainly had the best story/mystery/puzzle elements of the lot. But the adventure as a whole had no cohesion, even in terms of style of humour.
A complete campaign setting book. The golden age of Greyhawk was before my time in gaming, and it drives me utterly crazy that I missed out on it and can't get a complete, in-one-book compilation of all the goodness that was spawned from this world setting.
Lisa's idea works for me too. :)
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A complete campaign setting book. The golden age of Greyhawk was before my time in gaming, and it drives me utterly crazy that I missed out on it and can't get a complete, in-one-book compilation of all the goodness that was spawned from this world setting.
Lisa's idea works for me too. :)
Yeah, me too.
RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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A complete campaign setting book. The golden age of Greyhawk was before my time in gaming, and it drives me utterly crazy that I missed out on it and can't get a complete, in-one-book compilation of all the goodness that was spawned from this world setting.
Lisa's idea works for me too. :)
That would be nice.
Something respectful to send the old girl off in style.
Greyhawk did so much for D&D, and yet the setting was constantly put on the back-burner for other projects.
I loved Greyhawk, played it almost exclusively for many years. I dabbled in FR, completely skipped Eberron, and now I'm moving into Golarion full time. (Though, I do admit that Wolfgang Baur's Zobeck material will probably get meshed with my Golarion to some extent.)
Still, Greyhawk was really where it all began for me. An all-in-one, "you have everything you need to play this game into perpetuity regardless of WotC's decision to drop this setting" collection would be great.
Heh. Is "one product line" also ok? Then I would like to have a Gazetteer Series (like that one done for the old Basic D&D Setting, before it was Mystara), with history, religion, descriptions, people, places, rumours, a section "what everyone knows about...", adventure ideas etc. for each country on the map. Especially the later ones, with a Players booklet and a DMs guide were very useful. Around 100 pages per country... Similar to what Carl Sargent did with The Marklands and Iuz the Evil and Ivid the Undying.
Otherwise, I´d be content with the book Lisa proposed :-)
Stefan
a Ptolus style book that compiles all the flavor with some new history.This is pretty much what I would want. One super-sized compilation of everything Greyhawk as a standing testament to this great setting. And of course, we would fill out the stuff that hasn't already received the deluxe treatment. Don't forget the CD-ROM full of GH goodness that comes with the 1000 page book. Of course, it would cost $200, but who would care? It would be the Definitive Greyhawk. Ahhhhhh. One can dream. :)
-Lisa
I don't know how I get sucked into responding to these GH threads, b/c they're always just a tease...but. I would love a HC the size of Ptolus, w/ bonus CD doubling the page count, etc.
Some specifics: flesh out the areas on the periphery of the Flanaess (e.g., Sea of Dust), or slightly beyond (like what Greg Vaughan hinted at w/ his Mur material in "Temple of Celestial Winds"). And for maps, sure, everyone loves maps. How about maps of the Flanaess (and beyond!) that covered important historical periods. Along w/ write-ups of major events, nations, etc. at the time. Think about it: the book could lay a framework for an historical campaign far in GH's past. Who wouldn't love to run a campaign just prior to the Invoked Devastation/Rain of Colorless Fire?! Or early Great Kingdom stuff. Or even migration campaigns. Oh gods, the possibilities...
a Ptolus style book that compiles all the flavor with some new history.This is pretty much what I would want. One super-sized compilation of everything Greyhawk as a standing testament to this great setting. And of course, we would fill out the stuff that hasn't already received the deluxe treatment. Don't forget the CD-ROM full of GH goodness that comes with the 1000 page book. Of course, it would cost $200, but who would care? It would be the Definitive Greyhawk. Ahhhhhh. One can dream. :)
-LisaI don't know how I get sucked into responding to these GH threads, b/c they're always just a tease...but. I would love a HC the size of Ptolus, w/ bonus CD doubling the page count, etc.
Some specifics: flesh out the areas on the periphery of the Flanaess (e.g., Sea of Dust), or slightly beyond (like what Greg Vaughan hinted at w/ his Mur material in "Temple of Celestial Winds"). And for maps, sure, everyone loves maps. How about maps of the Flanaess (and beyond!) that covered important historical periods. Along w/ write-ups of major events, nations, etc. at the time. Think about it: the book could lay a framework for an historical campaign far in GH's past. Who wouldn't love to run a campaign just prior to the Invoked Devastation/Rain of Colorless Fire?! Or early Great Kingdom stuff. Or even migration campaigns. Oh gods, the possibilities...
I CONCUR!!!!
That being said: Yeah, it's a tease, but I remain stupidly optimistic. Sure it's not likely to happen, but who knows a decade or two could change that.
And Swirler, you are wlecome to my copy of Castle Greyhawk, except that I may have burned it after a DM tried to run it as a serious adventure. Actually that book gave me mixed feelings. I laughed so hard I almost cried while reading it, but I had actually bought it hoping to run it. And you can't, really.
Rambling Scribe, if you were serious, and you actually do still have it, I would love to have that copy. Let me know. my email is
alandhandy [at] gmail [dot] com
Some specifics: flesh out the areas on the periphery of the Flanaess (e.g., Sea of Dust), or slightly beyond (like what Greg Vaughan hinted at w/ his Mur material in "The Coming Storm").
Edited for the correct adventure name.
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Some sort of Players Guide to Oerth, similar to the one for the Realms setting, with what sort of racial variants one would see in Greyhawk (Grugach elves, for instance), and some Alternate Class abilities / levels specific to the setting, to help create some more concrete suggestions as to how a Scarlet Brotherhood Monk is different from a 'standard' Monk and how a Baklunish Wizard is different from a Sueloise one, and what sort of brutal tactics a Knight from the Old Kingdom would have.
Some of the spells from Greyhawk Adventures, such as Tenser's Hunting Hawk or Otiluke's Fire and Ice, could be updated for 3rd edition, as well as some adventure areas, like the Pinnacles of Azor-alq or the Pits of Azak-Zil, as well as a fleshed out 'starter town' such as Highfolk or Safeton.
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Well Carl Sargent had begun to work on "the great kingdom", and several articles are available online (if somebody could write down the links again, please...).
A huge book about the great kingdom (sea barons, medegia, ahlissa and northern part, including its former "colonies" or close (Sunndi, lordship, Idee, Irongate, Onnwall)... and its small neighbours (Ratik and so) that would be great !!
The whole eastern part of GH would be available in books (with "the scarlet brotherhoods", "Iuz the evil" and "the marklands," only the barbarians country would be left over...).
...concrete suggestions as to how a Baklunish Wizard is different from a Sueloise one...Well, we're not albino corpse-fondlers, for a start!
But some of you are all ignorant blow-hards apparently.
'Iggwilv's Guide to the Flanaess and Conquering Everything In It'. A tome penned by that most infamous of mages detailing every ruin, dungeon, and keep in the Flanaess and what's valuable inside that will serve the Witch-Queen's cause in the hour of her inevitable triumph.
What tdewitt and Lisa said.
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I'll readily admit to being a blowhard. But only because we Baklunish have so much to blow hard about!
On a serious note, if I may quote the Living Greyhawk Gazeteer;
The Baklunish, unlike the Suloise, retained much of their culture after the fall of their empire. Honor, family, generosity and piety are fundamental virtues. (page 5)
Many skilled wizards are Baklunish, including experts in elemental magic, divination, and summoning and binding spells (used on extraplanar beings) Cooperative spellcasting is practiced by many of the clergy, particularly among the desert mystics. (page 5)
If that glowing recommendation of my magnificent heritage offends you, then I suggest you take it up with a certain Mr Eric Mona...
I'll readily admit to being a blowhard. But only because we Baklunish have so much to blow hard about!
On a serious note, if I may quote the Living Greyhawk Gazeteer;
The Baklunish, unlike the Suloise, retained much of their culture after the fall of their empire. Honor, family, generosity and piety are fundamental virtues. (page 5)
Many skilled wizards are Baklunish, including experts in elemental magic, divination, and summoning and binding spells (used on extraplanar beings) Cooperative spellcasting is practiced by many of the clergy, particularly among the desert mystics. (page 5)
If that glowing recommendation of my magnificent heritage offends you, then I suggest you take it up with a certain Mr Eric Mona...
You mistake me sir, I don't care enough about your culture (one way or the other) to be offended, but I'm sure you have reason to be proud of whatever little blurb you can find in your precious books to justify your sense of superiority. I was merely correcting an error in your previous statement about my particular bloodline. I'm sure you didn't wish to look the fool.
As to my own blood I can offer few easy answers, we are a diverse people, but I think we can all agree that the world is a far safer place after we Suloise abandoned the dark and cruel ways of our ancestors. I can thankfully say that, for the most part, we Suloise have learned our lessens. You say that your Baklunish retain much of your culture? How quaint. Too each their own. I would never assume to tell your people to do anything different.
Well Carl Sargent had begun to work on "the great kingdom", and several articles are available online (if somebody could write down the links again, please...).
Carl Sargent wrote Ivid the undying, and there are some maps accompanying it as well. Did you refer to this? The cover planned for it was used for a birthright product later, this one. There is even a great pdf version of it, found here . That reminds me, I still have to get my printed copy bound...
Stefan
Right now? A Kingdom of Keoland sourcebook, with a bunch of maps of the Hool Marsh, The Dreadwood, and some warped Lady Bathory/Amber family/Borgia type nobles.
Heh. I seem to recall that there was some kind of Keoland Gazetteer online somewhere. Funny you mention the Amber family - I placed them in Keoland in one of my games - seemed to be the most fitting. Great Kingdom might work as well, though.
Stefan
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Well Carl Sargent had begun to work on "the great kingdom", and several articles are available online (if somebody could write down the links again, please...).Carl Sargent wrote Ivid the undying, and there are some maps accompanying it as well. Did you refer to this? The cover planned for it was used for a birthright product later, this one. There is even a great pdf version of it, found here . That reminds me, I still have to get my printed copy bound...
Stefan
Thanks Stefan, yes, this is what I meant.
Got to find a way to print the maps in color...|
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Carl Sargent wrote Ivid the undying, and there are some maps accompanying it as well.
BTW, would you mind sending me the folder to silenttimo(at)yahoo(dot)fr , since I didn't find a way on my computer to open the link you sent me ?
Thanks in advance,
Silenttimo
A big compilation book yes-
With serious details of the religions of greyhawk- myth, practical stuff, the whole bit
Player's Guide to Greyhawk.
I've always liked the various human cultures in Greyhawk, and I would like to have strong regional feats (or better yet, alternate racial traits), new base classes and PrC's to highlight the differences (fore example) in Baklunish wizards from Suloise, or a supernatural defense ability for the Olman warriors that will allow them to wear tribal armor or no armor and still have a great AC.
I like the flavor of the Olman warriors, running around the jungle in a loin cloth, like the pictures show, but if I wanted to run a PC Olman fighter, he'd have to have armor... so what's the point of the great flavor text if it can't be practically accomplished in game play?
Sure, an Olman sorceror would rock, thematically and conceptionally, because they don't wear armor. (I ran one... very cool.) But I really wanted a fighter. The encounters with the people on the Isle of Dread from Savage Tide re-emphasized that point to me.
I wanted a PC from the ilse, one that drew from the regional feats, and would look like the pictures in the magazines, but I ran up against the same thing... you have to wear armor or you're going to be toast.
So... that's what I would want if it were the last thing made. Player's Guide with hard-wired mechanics to bring in the flavor of the Greyhawk people.
As a DM, I have everything I need to make great, long-lasting campaigns. As a player, I don't have crunch I want to really immerse my PC into the world. I like how Eberron brought in new races, classes, PrC's, and mechanics to go along with the flavor of the setting, and I would want that for Greyhawk.
Some sort of Players Guide to Oerth, similar to the one for the Realms setting, with what sort of racial variants one would see in Greyhawk...
Ummm... yeah. Like Set said.
Sorry Set, I didn't read your post and didn't realize how similar my was until just now.
"Great minds," right?
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...I'm sure you have reason to be proud of whatever little blurb you can find in your precious books to justify your sense of superiority.
The quote was for the benefit of Monsieur Set, who asked the original question. I simply quoted my source, in case he wishes to investigate further.
I tactfully chose not to repeat what was written there regarding the Suel Empire, in case it caused you, or others offence.As to my own blood I can offer few easy answers, we are a diverse people, but I think we can all agree that the world is a far safer place after we Suloise abandoned the dark and cruel ways of our ancestors.
It is indeed; and I regret that I may have let my personal experiences cloud my perceptions. Since being bought, like a piece of meat, by the aforementioned 'albino corpse-fondler' (a contemptible creature, who is now, thankfully, quite messily deceased), I have yet to encounter a single arcanist in this gods-forsaken dirt-bowl of a city who follows the noble, nurturing, self-sacrificing path of abjuration. Instead, if the notches on my kill-list are to be believed, the entire wizardly population of this coast is comprised of necromancers and diabolists, of one faction or another.
I accept that in Sasserine, this may not be the case, and that some, such as yourself, may work tirelessly to prevent the influx of vile creatures from beyond, If so, it would make a refreshing change of pace to spend some quality time with you some evenings (in the interests of research).I can thankfully say that, for the most part, we Suloise have learned our lessons.
I took the liberty to correct your spelling, if you will forgive my boldness.
You say that your Baklunish retain much of your culture? How quaint. Too each their own. I would never assume to tell your people to do anything different.
Indeed. We all know where that can lead...
PS: Have you ever sat for a portrait?
You look oddly familiar, but I can't quite place why.
Greyhawk Amusement park with a series of themed locations in the park reflecting the cool history of Greyhawk and it's supercool adventures and characters!
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Some sort of Players Guide to Oerth, similar to the one for the Realms setting, with what sort of racial variants one would see in Greyhawk...Ummm... yeah. Like Set said.
Sorry Set, I didn't read your post and didn't realize how similar my was until just now.
"Great minds," right?
Definitely.
And for the regional Olman fighter, perhaps he could have a Monk-like Dodge bonus to AC only usable when unarmored, and start with no Armor proficiencies. Otherwise, he'd be a Fighter. Instead of a Feat, it would be a regional Alternate Class Feature.