Heard about this first thing in the morning. What a bumber. My prayers go out to the survivors.
RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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My boss told me about this when I came into work today. This is just messed up.
Why is it that centers of education seem to be common sites of mass violence? In addition to this recent event, you've got the Columbine shootings, the whole Tienamen(sp?) Square issue (which wasn't actually at a school, but the protest was motivated by a group of students if I recall correctly), and I'm sure there are several others I'm forgetting right now. Why are students so angry!?
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I dunno...
I can understand the Tiananmen Square protest (oppressive govenment = unhappy citizens), and I could put myself into the place of a psychotic high school student hell-bent on destruction (if only for a moment. The public school system is a crock).
However, random shootings like that only happen when crazy people get their hands on guns.
I'm against gun control, but I really think that dumb-f#%# control would work wonders for this country.
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Why are students so angry!?
Because parents refuse to raise their children with realistic expectations and a balanced viewpoint. Then they go to school and find out that the world doesn't revolve around their every whim and decide that it isn't fair. BANG, BANG, BANG! They are also not taught that life is precious and that for every person murdered by them a group of possibly 100's are emotionally damaged by the loss of their brother, sister, son, daughter, friend, lover, confidant, cousin, neice, nephew, aquaintance, or even that well-spoken friendly girl who gets you your coffee at Starbucks every morning and is trying to put herself through college to become a doctor.
This sucks and it isn't fair. I pray for everyone who is touched by this senseless act and hope it never happens again. But I know it will....FH
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Why are students so angry!?Because parents refuse to raise their children with realistic expectations and a balanced viewpoint. Then they go to school and find out that the world doesn't revolve around their every whim and decide that it isn't fair. BANG, BANG, BANG! They are also not taught that life is precious and that for every person murdered by them a group of possibly 100's are emotionally damaged by the loss of their brother, sister, son, daughter, friend, lover, confidant, cousin, neice, nephew, aquaintance, or even that well-spoken friendly girl who gets you your coffee at Starbucks every morning and is trying to put herself through college to become a doctor.
This sucks and it isn't fair. I pray for everyone who is touched by this senseless act and hope it never happens again. But I know it will....FH
Well put, and well written.
Thoth-Amon
I go to law school in Knoxville which is on UT campus. Cops are every where, camra crews and reporters to. It is a extremely horrible thing that happen, but why do they assume because it happened at one University that it will happen at every University on the same day? All it's doing is making people paranoid and scare, when you see 10 cops in 30 square feet on 20 spots on campus. Why do they think that helps or will prevent something? Also why are there 10 reporters running around asking how we feel? Do we feel safe, and Do you think it's going to happen to you/here? I swear they are breeding mass histeria.
Fizz
Up date Cops are saying 22 dead "Officials" are saying 32 dead They said it was conflicting death counts? Now Bush is going to speak...........
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Also why are there 10 reporters running around asking how we feel? Do we feel safe, and Do you think it's going to happen to you/here? I swear they are breeding mass histeria.
They are. If you've ever seen Bowling for Columbine, you'll know that the news media breeds fear to make money. It's f&*~ing unbelievable.
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Update Cops are saying 22 dead "Officials" are saying 32 dead They said it was conflicting death counts? Now Bush is going to speak...........
I bet he's going to blame it on either Islamic radicals or anti-American subversives. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if he blamed the motherf*@%in' Illuminati. He needs to stop passing the buck and shoulder some of the blame.
Update Cops are saying 22 dead "Officials" are saying 32 dead They said it was conflicting death counts? Now Bush is going to speak...........I bet he's going to blame it on either Islamic radicals or anti-American subversives. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if he blamed the motherf#~&in' Illuminati. He needs to stop passing the buck and shoulder some of the blame.
He said he was shocked sadden and would pray. I honestly thought he was going to say something along the lines of what you said tho.
Fizz
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Update Cops are saying 22 dead "Officials" are saying 32 dead They said it was conflicting death counts? Now Bush is going to speak...........I bet he's going to blame it on either Islamic radicals or anti-American subversives. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if he blamed the motherf#~&in' Illuminati. He needs to stop passing the buck and shoulder some of the blame.
He said he was shocked sadden and would pray. I honestly thought he was going to say something along the lines of what you said tho.
Fizz
Shrub has spoken again: he says he is 'concerned for the American people." Is that all he knows how to say? He seems to say that in every speech of his I have ever seen.
Henry Rollins makes some excellent points in a post Columbine cd of spoken word stuff that he did. Basically, the idea is that a lot of parents are disconnected from their kids. This isn't anything new; it happens during adolescence and it's normal. But the difference is that most of the time, even in adolescence, parents are at least interested in their kid. They want to know how school is going, what's happening with them, who they're hanging out with. And if you don't have that kind of connection, that reminder that someone gives a shit, then adolescence can be even more of a mindf%#$ than usual. The side effect of having hand-held personal phones, instant messaging, computer entertainment, the internet, etc. is a steady decline of real human contact, real human relationships. A lot of people (I've noticed it in myself) aren't as comfortable as they may be around other human beings, unless it's on the opposite end of a modem or telephone line.
And teachers in public schools can't be looked to to curb this. These are people that are underpayed, overworked and asked to do a saint's job every day for eight months out of the year. They can't replace a parent as a caring influence in a person's life; they have their own lives to worry about. They can contribute, but in the end, it falls to parents to be connected to their kids, to understand and accept them. It's tough to grow up, now as much as ever, and if there isn't that stabilizing factor, then you get someone that is an awkward ball of rage and hormones waiting to explode.
These are so common that I believe some senators and governors are trying to get teachers armed in the classroom. How unreal is that? On top of their other responsibilities, educators also have to carry a firearm in case one of their students decides to go insane and shoot everyone? Is that a responsibility they should have? And won't that divorce us all further from each other? I'm not a fan of guns and I wouldn't own one. But even I know that it's just a tool, if a deadly one. The problem is our culture and our inability to connect to each other.
Kurt Vonnegut wanted to write,"We could have saved ourselves, but we were too damn lazy and too damn stubborn to do it." (maybe not exactly that, but something like it) on the wall of the Grand Canyon for aliens to read so that they would know what happened to us. And increasingly it seems that he's right. All the shrinks in the world can't fix this. We either have to tear ourselves off the couch and away from the tv and start relating to each other again or else we have to be content with the disgusting world we live in.
I'm against gun control, but I really think that dumb-f#!~ control would work wonders for this country.
Amen to that. If only we could figure out how to manage it...
Managing it is easy -- pass laws.
Oh, wait -- first we'd need to elect lawmakers that aren't contemptible, deceitful sycophants.
Oh, wait -- first we'd need to elect lawmakers that aren't contemptible, deceitful sycophants.
It always seems me that those are the only types of people who want those jobs!
What can we do?
I'm against gun control, but I really think that dumb-f#!~ control would work wonders for this country.Amen to that. If only we could figure out how to manage it...Managing it is easy -- pass laws.
Oh, wait -- first we'd need to elect lawmakers that aren't contemptible, deceitful sycophants.
Plenty of gun control laws on the books already that aren't enforced or enforcable. Even countries with extreme gun control laws can't put a lid on this kind of violence, because there is always a way to get guns if you want them. Erfurt in 2002
Gun control laws are feel good band aids to let the sycophants thump their chests and then go sip martinis.
There are no easy answers. The only ones who will turn in their guns if there's gun control are the law-abiding citizens, whom you would probably want armed if the sh!t hits the fan around you and there's no cop for 5 miles. Remember that the LAPD had to go borrow assault rifles from a gun shop during the 1997 North Ridge shootout because their 9mm's were just bouncing off the bad guys' body armor.
Better security at public facilities? Maybe, but how much would that help on a college campus? Can't turn into a Stalag, who would want that? More college campus police? Maybe, but who wants to pay that much extra for tuition? How much good would it do anyway?
It's senseless, it's baseless, it's horrible, but I'm afraid no immediate knee jerk reaction or visceral call for total gun control is going to do any good at all. Dumbsh*t control would work, of course :)
Plenty of gun control laws on the books already that aren't enforced or enforcable. Even countries with extreme gun control laws can't put a lid on this kind of violence...
Perhaps not, but murders are rare because they are illegal. Nations with strict limits on firearm ownership have far fewer incidents involving guns. While people have all sorts of reasons for that fact, I tend to go with the simple explanation -- fewer guns means fewer gun-related crimes.
I don't want to start a lengthy debate on gun control, and I certainly don't have all the answers. It's especially difficult in the US, where a right to bear arms is constitutionally-guaranteed (though the details are hotly debated).
It makes it worse that I live close to VT :(
Where have all the heroes of the world gone; nobody stepped up to stop this so lots of lambs were led to slaughter, evil, evil propages evil. Where is the light in the darkness here; it is all hubris; I cannot find it, am only left to pray for the dead, the injured; the hurting and that poor soul who enacted such evil.
Perhaps not, but murders are rare because they are illegal. Nations with strict limits on firearm ownership have far fewer incidents involving guns. While people have all sorts of reasons for that fact, I tend to go with the simple explanation -- fewer guns means fewer gun-related crimes.
I don't want to start a lengthy debate on gun control, and I certainly don't have all the answers. It's especially difficult in the US, where a right to bear arms is constitutionally-guaranteed (though the details are hotly debated).
Yeah, I struggle with that, too. I'm against banning just about ANYTHING, and the arguments for citizens with guns make sense. But then I look at Houston (everyone has a concealed weapons permit) and Toronto (actually slightly more people there than in Houston, but they have gun control). Both are highly multicultural and highly urban. And I read that Toronto has ONE TENTH of the gun murder rate that Houston does... and that in like 90% of those incidences, the gun in question was supposedly obtained in the U.S. Are these bogus statistics provided by perfidious Canadians to entice people to actually live in that frozen wasteland? Quite possibly. But it does make me think.
Perhaps not, but murders are rare because they are illegal. Nations with strict limits on firearm ownership have far fewer incidents involving guns. While people have all sorts of reasons for that fact, I tend to go with the simple explanation -- fewer guns means fewer gun-related crimes.
I don't want to start a lengthy debate on gun control, and I certainly don't have all the answers. It's especially difficult in the US, where a right to bear arms is constitutionally-guaranteed (though the details are hotly debated).
Yeah, I struggle with that, too. I'm against banning just about ANYTHING, and the arguments for citizens with guns make sense. But then I look at Houston (everyone has a concealed weapons permit) and Toronto (actually slightly more people there than in Houston, but they have gun control). Both are highly multicultural and highly urban. And I read that Toronto has ONE TENTH of the gun murder rate that Houston does... and that in like 90% of those incidences, the gun in question was supposedly obtained in the U.S. Are these bogus statistics provided by perfidious Canadians to entice people to actually live in that frozen wasteland? Quite possibly. But it does make me think.
Could this have saved the people in VA? No way to prevent all atrocities, but if you could prevent some meaningful fraction of them...
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
-2nd amendment
ya, I can see how this law can be taken both ways.
Gun control is a non-issue. Those who want guns to commit crimes or atrocities will always be able to get them.
The only thing "laws" affect is those who choose to obey them. Those who choose to obey laws are not the ones society needs to worry about.
Drunk drivers kill thousands of more people each year than criminals with guns do. We have tough drunk driving laws......enough said, right?
Why do we get nervous in airplanes? They kill way less people each year than cars/drunk drivers do....it's all about the publicity, then I guess, because airplane crashes sure are good TV aren't they?
Not minimizing what happened at VT--horrible, of course...but let's think this through rationally.
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -2nd amendment
ya, I can see how this law can be taken both ways.
Not picking a fight, but I don't know if there's sarcasm here or not.
There are many gun control advocates that claim that the right to bear arms is granted only within a well-regulated militia -- that private ownership was not the intent of the nation's founders. On the other hand, others focus on the "right... shall not be infringed" wording, claiming that everyone has an inalienable right to own firearms. Each side believes its own argument to be incontrovertible.
Those who want guns to commit crimes or atrocities will always be able to get them.
In theory, but not in fact. Prosperous, industrialized countries which outlaw guns have few gun-related crimes.
Of course, I'm falling into what I wanted to avoid -- a pointless debate that will change no one's opinion.
Sorry all (sort of) :/
Jack
Drunk drivers kill thousands of more people each year than criminals with guns do. We have tough drunk driving laws......enough said, right?
Apples and oranges.
If you outlawed the sale and ownership of alcohol, far fewer alcohol-related crimes would be committed.
Similarly, outlawing guns would dramatically reduce gun-related crimes (my opinion); that's exactly what happens in other countries (fact, not opinion).
Regards,
Jack
Gun Control Nut
Finally, and to continue beating this horse...
Everything I've said is moot if gun control is unconstitutional -- an argument that may be valid (though I don't hold that opinion).
Regards again,
Jack
Why are students so angry!?Because parents refuse to raise their children with realistic expectations and a balanced viewpoint. Then they go to school and find out that the world doesn't revolve around their every whim and decide that it isn't fair. BANG, BANG, BANG! They are also not taught that life is precious and that for every person murdered by them a group of possibly 100's are emotionally damaged by the loss of their brother, sister, son, daughter, friend, lover, confidant, cousin, neice, nephew, aquaintance, or even that well-spoken friendly girl who gets you your coffee at Starbucks every morning and is trying to put herself through college to become a doctor.
This sucks and it isn't fair. I pray for everyone who is touched by this senseless act and hope it never happens again. But I know it will....FH
Yep. Kids snap. That happens, and we are left to deal with it. There are people who channel this and spew their hatred of everyone and everything about, and then get shocked when someone who has much more stress or lack of caring people in their life, or are way overly egotistical snaps and goes on a rampage. Happens every day, just nobody reports on stabbings nationally.
[quote="The Eldritch Mr. Shiny"}
I'm against gun control, but I really think that dumb-f#!~ control would work wonders for this country.
Amen.
(begins rant)What amazes me is that I didn't read the news until about 4pm today (checking my email on MSN), and I just glazed over it. I guess I'm a bit desensitized (spelling's gotta be wrong there), but I was one of the kids who was told "you're a threat" on April 21, 1999 (one day after Columbine).
As the schools are there to help you, and educate you, it is infuriating to me to be told that. It made me laugh out loud, mainly because they couldn't do anything to me. The school board had had a meeting that dealt with me, specifically, and didn't invite me to the meeting. What they discussed was how THEIR children treated me. At that point, I had stopped caring what others thought of me, and just did what I was there to do... Read the textbooks & learned what I could from them. I think I got the better deal, especially since I pointed out security risks & how many friends I had & how easy it would be at my school... Yeah, they didn't like that, but I was right and they knew it. And they actually did something about it, other than trying to expel/suspend me (which was really the whole point of that excercise).
(/rant)
So, the "news" wants to over cover this, dragging it out and focusing the news on something other than the governing body of our country removing our rights (it's going to happen). What I truly believe it will do to the families is prolong the grieving process. It will hurt them to wake up to "Good Morning America" or some other show I don't watch ever and see their children's face on the mantle under or over the TV and make them break down. Yeah, that's what I want to do, cause suffering and pain to some random stranger I'd never meet. COME ON, that's really really mean.
As to the families:
I can only imagine your loss. I've only come close, and that nearly killed me. I'm sorry beyond what you will probably ever know or care. I pray that your loved ones recover quickly or pass on to their proper places in the afterlife. This was a horrid act, and I hope that your memories of your loved ones remain bright and cheerful, not focusing on the pain that was today.
/d
Drunk drivers kill thousands of more people each year than criminals with guns do. We have tough drunk driving laws......enough said, right?
Not really. Our drunk driving laws are incredibly weak. I know a number of people arrested for drunk driving who are still on the road, and still doing it every Friday. Maybe if we tried each one for attempted murder, that would make a difference. Like I said, I'm no fan of bans on anything, but today is starting to make me wonder. If you could prevent even one such incident, without causing more of them...
it. I guess I'm a bit desensitized (spelling's gotta be wrong there), but I was one of the kids who was told "you're a threat" on April 21, 1999 (one day after Columbine).
Darkmeer,
It took some guts to post that. Respects to you, man. You've made a difference twice now.
It is sickening to think that someone can decide to take the life of other people. I personaly think that school shootings are the worst type. The people involved, even if you don't know them personaly, are connected to you in some way. Even if they are just someone you pass in the hall everyday they still are connected to you.
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Where have all the heroes of the world gone; nobody stepped up to stop this so lots of lambs were led to slaughter, evil, evil propages evil. Where is the light in the darkness here; it is all hubris; I cannot find it, am only left to pray for the dead, the injured; the hurting and that poor soul who enacted such evil.
I thought this same thing. A whole bunch of people were there watching friends, classmates, and fellow humans being butchered and all they did was cower and pray for it not to be them.
*STAND THE F#CK UP! If 3-6 of you had rushed this POS you would have saved many lives! Why is it OK to sit back and do nothing?!? A brave man once stood up and gave his life to help save others and his call was "Let's roll" stated simply and calmly and those 2 words are not the words of a hero, they are the words of a human. A person who won't allow himself to die without a purpose.I would lay my life down without thinking about it in this type of situation. Why? I have a beautiful wife and kids, a damn-near perfect life, and every thing to lose. It's not because I wanna be hero but because I refuse to be a lamb. Fight, dammit! If you won't fight in these circumstances then what will you for?
I am angered that 50+ people were shot, 30+ fatally and nobody stood against the evil. The decision not to act is a decision to allow evil to win, thereby making it an evil act committed in selfishness.
It is sickening.
FH
The warrior instinct you speak of Fakey--it went away a long time ago...when it resurfaces now and again we call it heroism, but it was once commonplace.
It's the same kind of people who drive by an accident with injuries. Someone else is going to call 911. Someone else is going to stop. Someone else is going to help. Someone else......
If you could prevent even one such incident, without causing more of them...
...still wouldn't be worth the Constitution, nor the knowledge that my wife would have no way to protect herself and our children when I'm not home. Gun laws are not the answer. The problem here is so deeply embedded in society that anything like more or stricter gun laws is just a bandaid on a sucking chest wound. Between the bad parenting, the violence immersion on TV/video games, the lack of connection to society felt by many, the isolation, the inability to resolve conflicts effecively and YES--the availability of firearms (I'm not totally stupid, okay?...just mostly ;)....just one thing isn't going to fix it. There is no fix for it any more--just more effective countermeasures and reaction when it happens.
Where have all the heroes of the world gone; nobody stepped up to stop this so lots of lambs were led to slaughter, evil, evil propages evil. Where is the light in the darkness here; it is all hubris; I cannot find it, am only left to pray for the dead, the injured; the hurting and that poor soul who enacted such evil.I thought this same thing. A whole bunch of people were there watching friends, classmates, and fellow humans being butchered and all they did was cower and pray for it not to be them.
*STAND THE F#CK UP! If 3-6 of you had rushed this POS you would have saved many lives! Why is it OK to sit back and do nothing?!? A brave man once stood up and gave his life to help save others and his call was "Let's roll" stated simply and calmly and those 2 words are not the words of a hero, they are the words of a human. A person who won't allow himself to die without a purpose.
I would lay my life down without thinking about it in this type of situation. Why? I have a beautiful wife and kids, a damn-near perfect life, and every thing to lose. It's not because I wanna be hero but because I refuse to be a lamb. Fight, dammit! If you won't fight in these circumstances then what will you for?
I am angered that 50+ people were shot, 30+ fatally and nobody stood against the evil. The decision not to act is a decision to allow evil to win, thereby making it an evil act committed in selfishness.
It is sickening.FH
Are you sure? You ever been in that kind of situation? I think seeing one anonymous person get smoked, let alone 30 that you likely have known for several months at least, will put most normal people without combat experience into a lot of shock. It's not even a matter of acting or not; it's a matter of being able to hold a clear thought in your head. I doubt most of those people were acting in anything but reflex and fear. I doubt they were playing Tetris under their desks while this went down, Macho Man. It's easy to be intense when you weren't there.
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The warrior instinct you speak of Fakey--it went away a long time ago...when it resurfaces now and again we call it heroism, but it was once commonplace.
It's the same kind of people who drive by an accident with injuries. Someone else is going to call 911. Someone else is going to stop. Someone else is going to help. Someone else......
I have risked my life for others 3 times. Once a guy was stuck in a rope tied to his boat that was dragging him in circles in the Chesapeake river. He almost drowned and had his foot chopped up fairly severely before I could jump from my bros jet-ski onto his boat to shut off the motor. I bruised several ribs in the jump, almost lost my grip and went under the boat before I could hit the killswitch on his motor. 2 other times I have stumbled upon people getting brutally beaten and stepped in to drive off the attacker(s) and took whatever blows were necessary at the time. I don't believe any of that deserves name in the paper or kudos or anything because that should be what humans do for fellow humans. It is what separates us from the beasts, supposedly.
Why can't we all see that life is better when we stand up for each other?I just wish someone would stand up. Better to die on your feet than to live on your knees.
FH
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Are you sure? You ever been in that kind of situation? I think seeing one anonymous person get smoked, let alone 30 that you likely have known for several months at least, will put most normal people without combat experience into a lot of shock. It's not even a matter of acting or not; it's a matter of being able to hold a clear thought in your head. I doubt most of those people were acting in anything but reflex and fear. I doubt they were playing Tetris under their desks while this went down, Macho Man. It's easy to be intense when...
I am sure. I have fought for my life and I have fought for people I never seen before's lives. I have never been in a mass killing environment before but I know that every life around me is worth the same as my own. I am willing to risk mine for the sake of others. I am intense because this type of inaction leads to death by fear of doing something and degrades society as a whole. Philly is succumbing to gun violence because witnesses are too scared to get involved and point fingers at perps, meanwhile this year is already on track to far surpass last year's record numbers of shootings and homicides.
People need to be taught to stand up.FH
There was a time once when boys were taught to fight and were taught that it was okay to whip someone's ass when and only when they deserved it.
Non-violence at all costs has been browbeaten into kids for so long now that I'm not surprised no one tried to bum rush the fu cker.
...but I'm probably way off the mark with my amateur sociology....
I ranted about this at work today. Why can't we get mad any more? Why can't I punch that dumb f&@* that said something about my mother and leave it at that? WE ARE PEOPLE HUMANS ANIMALS WE NEED TO GET MAD! It's healthy to blow off steam to do the small thing so that don't make us snap 5 years down the road. I was taught you fight if you have to. I was raised around guns and respect the hell out of them. I remember get the shit smacked out of me for pointing toy guns at people when I was very young. FTK I agree with your amateur sociology. I wasn't shocked either when no one did anything when "he was reloading several times" this is what the news said. Non-violence is a good thing to a point and I don't think kids realize that. I also think guns have been evil and forbidden for so long now that most people not realize there power. Yes I'm sure they know they kill, but I don't think they respect the power and how not to use it.
Fizz
I'm not sure that made sense
Chinese foreign exchange student? That did surprise me. I figured it would be a white young male that was a loner, and listened to “satanic” music and was to enthrall by games like grand theft auto.
I just heard it in the morning news. This mass killing just is horrible, I´m out of words. My thougts are with the victims and their relatives.
[rant]
Gun control migh help reduce the number of those incidents, but, as F2K pointed out, even with strong laws you cannot completely stop them - the killing in Erfurt shows this all too clearly. It was quite a shock in germany, nobody thought it possible here.
One positive aspect of a weapon ban is: If you find somebody who has a gun and he has no permit, the police can confiscate it immediately, and this may just prevent a crime. I´m an advocate for a ban on guns, as it prevents even more gun-related crimes in my opinion. I think the argument that "if you have a law against guns, only the law-abiding citizens will stick to it, so the law is useless" is a faulty argument - with this reasoning, you could declare any law useless. Laws don´t stop any hard-bitten criminals, sure, but they might stop "normal" people just about to cross the line - opportunity makes the thief, as a saying goes.
But I can see the point in the argument that banning guns is only doctoring at the symptoms, not at the cause of the problem: Why do young men get so detached from life (theirs and especially others)that they run around and kill other people? There is no easy answer to this question, of course. So I won´t even try to give one.
It is easy to say that society has failed, but who constitutes society? All of us! So, if everybody just tries to have his eyes and ears open to his fellow human beings, it would surely not be for the worse. But there seems to be an "every man for himself" attitude prevalent, which counters this concern. And if you have to work your ass off to make a living, you have no energy to spare for these societal concerns. The traditional family values still have their place, they can provide support in a world getting more chaotic every day.
[/rant]
Stefan
I'm glad the little a@~@~## had guns to use. The fact that he knew he could get firearms kept him set on using bullets. Otherwise he would have had to get creative.
And by creative I mean that with 30 minutes in the internet and $75 at home depot and he could have rigged up an IED with enough punch to take out a couple lecture halls.
Fakey I've jumped into brawls before without too much thought but I can't honestly say how I would handle that situation. But I would be very dissapointed in myself if I didn't try to put that little shit on the ground and invert his face. Life is worth fighting for. Shit there are lots of little things worth fighting for.
The constitution has amendments. Root word their is amend. The founding fathers designed the constitution to be a living document capeable of being altered if anything became outdated. They intended for the constitution to evolve (like that anti slavery, and womens sufferage stuff we added).
The right to bear arms was added with the idea that if the government ever started to become oppressive (like the british rule was at the time) the civilians would have a millitia capeable of defending against the army. And with this constant threat the Government would have a very hard time becoming an empire. Is this idea very outdated? Yes, back in the day the only difference between the soldier and the settler was the absence or presence of a rifle. Today a 12gauge is not going to cut it against an Abrams tank. Or tomahawk missle for that matter. Technology has made it impossible for civilians to arm themselves with weapons capeable or resisting the millitary. Therefore their is an extreamly valid argument that the right to bear arms is outdated and does not accomplish its design intent.
Does that mean that allowing civilians to own guns is wrong? No, People will kill people if they want to. Guns aren't even that effecient when you get right down to it, their just dramatic and flashy. Anyone with half a brain could kill plenty of people with any number of poisons, homemade explosives or arson and get a much higher kill count with less chance of being caught.
Now sorry for the derailment and back to the topic at hand.
What a worthless bastard. I don't care what life did to push him over the edge. To me his last deeds proved that life didn't give him near what he deserved.
Kinda makes me wish I believed in hell. Then I might get the chance to kick the shit out of him in person.
CAN'T GET THESE QUOTES RIGHT, WHATEVER. FIZZBAN SAID:
... Non-violence is a good thing to a point and I don't think kids realize that. I also think guns have been evil and forbidden for so long now that most people not realize there power. Yes I'm sure they know they kill, but I don't think they respect the power and how not to use it.
...
Chinese foreign exchange student?
...
ENDQUOTE
I think you hit a good point here. I take it here:
Humankind has always had to face violence, but the difference today is the imbalance between glorifying peace and the idealization of aggressive masculinity, access to violent pastimes and even actual weaponry.
What I am saying is, people once accepted violence more realistically, dealt with it ritually, and helped young men learn to use it appropriately (some people still do this thank God). Today we seem to sweep it under the rug and to our surprise it erupts outs with terrible consequences.
As a foreign teacher in a Chinese University, I am not surprised to hear that it might be a Chinese Exchange student, although that is still just rumour to me here. I have seen no children more repressed than those here in China who are trapped, emotionally isolated, yet forced into hives (70 students per class in HS) of students in a horribly mechanical system. The suicide rate among students is staggeringly high from high school through University.... Parental pressure? Few westerners could conceive in their darkest dreams the way some parents here treat their kids. I've heard of parents locking children in their rooms with their textbooks and nothing else.
God what a f*#kin tragedy. E-mail warnings? Is that true? The utter stupidity. What a sad commentary on modern society this whole thing is.
{deep breaths} Trying not to get started about the rest of the shit going on in the worl these days...
It is sickening to think that someone can decide to take the life of other people. I personaly think that school shootings are the worst type. The people involved, even if you don't know them personaly, are connected to you in some way. Even if they are just someone you pass in the hall everyday they still are connected to you.
The problem is that cases like these are typically sort of external suicide...people who do these are not exactly killing other people, they want to kill themselves...but for some reason end up doing it in this amok style.
It happens, even in countries with tight gun control...though when gun control is tight the scale of these events is usually smaller.Another thing to consider in massacres is scale of punishment. If you are going to be executed or sit in jail for 120 years for one murder, it doesn't matter then if you kill one or thirty people.
I'm Canadian...
I've never held a gun in my life. I wouldn't even know where to get one if I wanted one right now. The fact that you guys can purchase guns at every corner store and get bullets at walmart or even at the barber shop is something that is totally beyond my comprehension.
Gun controls might not solve the problem in the present, but it would be taking a step forward in the right direction. On the long run, I'm sure it would benifit everyone... But these kinds of thing would still happen (as it happened here in Montreal last year).
Ultradan
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -2nd amendment
ya, I can see how this law can be taken both ways.
Not picking a fight, but I don't know if there's sarcasm here or not.
There are many gun control advocates that claim that the right to bear arms is granted only within a well-regulated militia -- that private ownership was not the intent of the nation's founders. On the other hand, others focus on the "right... shall not be infringed" wording, claiming that everyone has an inalienable right to own firearms. Each side believes its own argument to be incontrovertible.
Those who want guns to commit crimes or atrocities will always be able to get them.In theory, but not in fact. Prosperous, industrialized countries which outlaw guns have few gun-related crimes.
Of course, I'm falling into what I wanted to avoid -- a pointless debate that will change no one's opinion.
Sorry all (sort of) :/
Jack
uhm, by definition if you are male 18 to 40 you are in the U.S militia
I'm Canadian...
I'm sorry :P
I've never held a gun in my life. I wouldn't even know where to get one if I wanted one right now. The fact that you guys can purchase guns at every corner store and get bullets at walmart or even at the barber shop is something that is totally beyond my comprehension.
It's not quite as easy as it might seem, but there are few people who can't get a gun within a few days if they set their mind to it.
Gun controls might not solve the problem in the present, but it would be taking a step forward in the right direction...
I agree 1000%. The idea that a gun in the home is one's only means to protect your family is common within certain groups. In truth, those guns are stolen by criminals (when houses are robbed) far more often than they are used in self-defense.
Legal, private firearm ownership supplies guns to criminals far more often than it protects homes.
uhm, by definition if you are male 18 to 40 you are in the U.S militia
?!?
Where is this defined?
If true, it's not well-organized militia (as required by the Constitution) -- I have received neither training nor any information regarding my duties therein.