On top of it, reprinting sold out volumes of Pathfinder causes competition for current APs, which we DO have stock of.I entirely understand that if something doesn't make financial sense, you just don't do it, but not reprinting in order to reduce competition for your current products I find annoying and a littel wrong-minded. Thematically, each of your AP's have been very different. What attracts me to RotRL has not quite been reproduced in any of the other APs. There may well be some people who will choose between RotRL and your current AP... but there are going to be more people who are choosing between Pathfinder and other RPG material.
I agree with you on the reprint issue.
As a sort of aside, I was interested in getting the AP Subscription last month, because I wanted both Printed and PDF. After inquiring if I could get past issues of the current AP with PDF with the same deal as receiving the current one, I was told I couldn't do that. As much as I love the APs, I am not paying $35 each for both AP and PDF (After Shipping costs)
So basically I will skip Legacy of Fire and wait for the new AP coming in Aug. It just doesn't make sense to me why they wouldn't want my money.
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Hello! I am a latecomer into the Pathfinder series (much to my chagrin) but I have decided to run Rise of the RuneLords for my group. I have had some luck finding print editions of PF 2,4-6, but went ahead and bought 1 and 3 in PDF format since they are impossible to find at a reasonable price anywhere. I'm not complaining about having to do that, as these products are over 2 years old and I understand completely about keeping new product out and in the limelight.
I have only one complaint. The dpi quality of PF1 is quite poor, looking like simply a medium reolution jpeg scan as opposed to the crisp clean lines of PF 3. It really makes the maps difficult to read, and that honks me off since they are a central part of running the game.
Is there any reason that the resolution is so poor in comparison to PF 3? Are the original files that your printing company used for the initial print run gone? It's just frustrating that I spent the same amount for a mediocre quality scan of a fine fine adventure as I spent for the clean and high res file of PF3.
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I recommend checking *Here* for higher res maps, battlemaps, drawings, and a ton of other excellent community created content. I too am running the RotRL AP a couple years late, which means the dead tree versions are harder to find, but it also means that the user community has been working on supplemental material for 2 years.
Chief Technical Officer
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I have only one complaint. The dpi quality of PF1 is quite poor, looking like simply a medium reolution jpeg scan as opposed to the crisp clean lines of PF 3. It really makes the maps difficult to read, and that honks me off since they are a central part of running the game.
Are you talking specifically about *just* the map tags? For the first two volumes, our cartographer provided us with flattened maps—that is, images and text labels were already combined into a single object that was placed into the layout; effectively, that means the map tags are locked to the same resolution as the maps. We soon began requiring our cartographers to instead send us layered maps, which allows us to leave the tags as separate scalable text, meaning that as you zoom in, the text will scale effectively infinitely—or at least well beyond the point where the images they're placed on no longer look good.
Aside from the map tags, you shouldn't see any other differences between volumes 1 and 3. Both PDFs were made from the original electronic files, and to largely the same spec as all of our PDFs. (I'm looking at pages at 200% and higher, and not seeing anything unusual.)
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@redcelt: Thank you for the link! Those are some nice suppliments for the game.
@Vic: Yes, I am specifically talking about the maps. The text for the pdf is fine and I have no trouble reading it, but the maps are difficult primarily because of the size, serifs and pixilation. If you print or zoom to 200% on the map of Sandpoint in the PF1 for example, you see a fair amount of pixilation on the numbers of the identified buildings. In comparison, the same map from the Rise of Runelords Player's Guide is much crisper and the numbers are easier to read.
Since the Player's Guide has a better version of the Sandpoint map, I simply am using that map instead. The Sandpoint Glassworks and the map of the Hinterlands from PF1 are just difficult to read, in my opinion. The others I am muddling through, if I squint enough. If there are higher rez versions available for download anywhere, I'd be happy to dl and reprint them.
I understand that it is simply the fact of PF1 maps are flattened images as opposed to having the text/numbers on a seperate layer. I know I am being kind of picky, but as I stated before, the price is the same, but the print-ready quality between the two is not.
How long does it take to play through each chapter in an Adventure path? Does each chapter only take a single session (meaning the entire adventure path can be played out in 6 sessions) or does each chapter take 2-3 sessions to play through?
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How long does it take to play through each chapter in an Adventure path? Does each chapter only take a single session (meaning the entire adventure path can be played out in 6 sessions) or does each chapter take 2-3 sessions to play through?
It's completely a function of, a) what pace your group plays at, and b) how long your sessions are.
If your group is slow-paced (maybe lots of RP or side-tracks), it'll take alot longer than if they are encounter machines (jumping from one combat/encounter to the next with minimum downtime).
That answer probably isn't as helpful as you'd like, but it really does vary from group to group.
-Skeld
EDIT: For example, my group played Savage Tide AP (12 chapters, levels 1-20) in about 16 months. Since RotRL goes to level 15-ish across 6 chapters, I estimate it would take my group abut a year to play the AP and about 2 months to play a chapter, which makes it about 4 or 5 6-8 hour sessions. Granted low-level play goes faster than higher-level play, so I can skew the results to slightly shorter early chapters and slightly longer later chapters.
How long does it take to play through each chapter in an Adventure path? Does each chapter only take a single session (meaning the entire adventure path can be played out in 6 sessions) or does each chapter take 2-3 sessions to play through?
It varies by AP, and play style of the group to be sure.
I've been running RotRL since March '09 and we're about halfway through the 4th installment. Our play has been somewhat sporadic though, and probably only breaks down to about 18~24 play sessions during that time (usually for 5-6 hours). Burnt Offerings actually had a lot of meat to it, and IIRC it took us a little over 4 full sessions to make it completely through it.
BTW, so far this one is my favorite out of all of the AP issues in terms of story and background.
I am a latecomer to Pathfinder, and would like to run Rise of the Runelords. I have noticed that Burnt Offerings is only available in pdf. Is there any chance of it being reprinted so those of us who are new could get hard copies?
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Creative Director
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I am a latecomer to Pathfinder, and would like to run Rise of the Runelords. I have noticed that Burnt Offerings is only available in pdf. Is there any chance of it being reprinted so those of us who are new could get hard copies?
We have no plans at this point of reprinting Burnt Offerings or the other installments in Rise of the Runelords that are out of print or getting very close to being out of print. I wouldn't be surprised to see us eventually do some sort of reprint or repackaging of Rise of the Runelords, but that's not something we'll be doing soon. The best bet would probably be to check used bookstores (perhaps Amazon.com's used book section?) or eBay or to scour FLGSs in the area.
I am a latecomer to Pathfinder, and would like to run Rise of the Runelords. I have noticed that Burnt Offerings is only available in pdf. Is there any chance of it being reprinted so those of us who are new could get hard copies?We have no plans at this point of reprinting Burnt Offerings or the other installments in Rise of the Runelords that are out of print or getting very close to being out of print. I wouldn't be surprised to see us eventually do some sort of reprint or repackaging of Rise of the Runelords, but that's not something we'll be doing soon. The best bet would probably be to check used bookstores (perhaps Amazon.com's used book section?) or eBay or to scour FLGSs in the area.
Thank you for your prompt reply to my inquiry. Normally your advice would be good, but in the past few years (at least to my knowledge), certain unscrupulous speculators have jumped on the opportunity that certain out of print gaming books/materials provide by offering them for outragous prices. Only one copy of Burnt Offerings is offered on Amazon right now for $999.00. Of course, no one will buy at that price, but it has the effect of encouraging others to either hoard unused copies or to jack up their prices as well. Normal supply and demand, it seems, and I can't really say that there is anything wrong with that. However, it does discourage those of us who would like to participate in the Pathfinder Adventure Path from the beginning, and will affect your sales of these adventures to people who are completest. Why purchase this adventure path when there is little hope of ever obtaining all of them?. To some, it might even disuade them from trying Pathfinder altogether. I realize that there is probably little that you can do to alleviate this situation, and I certainly mean no disrespect to you or Paizo, but am offering this response in the slight hope that Paizo may consider a reprint.
... Only one copy of Burnt Offerings is offered on Amazon right now for $999.00.
Was surprised to see this! Finally a retirement plan I can get behind :)
Took a quick look on ebay and found someone selling* the complete AP plus a few Chronicles books for about 30$.... but no individual listings of Burnt Offerings!
Impressive work for Paizo indeed.
* Edit: 30 for shipping too, but still 60 bucks ain't bad.
... Only one copy of Burnt Offerings is offered on Amazon right now for $999.00.Was surprised to see this! Finally a retirement plan I can get behind :)
Took a quick look on ebay and found someone selling* the complete AP plus a few Chronicles books for about 30$.... but no individual listings of Burnt Offerings!
Impressive work for Paizo indeed.
* Edit: 30 for shipping too, but still 60 bucks ain't bad.
Well, the bidding is up to $60.00 now, not including shipping, and there are still almost 5 days to go. I am betting that the ending bid for these will be nowhere near $60.00 when the dust settles.
:(
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A compiled RotRL would be awesome, particularly if it were updated for PFRPG. It'd also be cool if the adventures were split into one volume and the flavour and rules and monsters ended up in other compilations. It wouldn't stop me buying the AP sub, either, so long as there was a lag between the AP release and the eventual compilation.
I also particularly think that rules stuff, like traits from various supplements, need periodic compilation. Hopefully the wikis will do it, but a volume would also be cool. Mind you, it doesn't have to be a volume produced by Paizo, I guess, as that stuff is OGL.
Only one copy of Burnt Offerings is offered on Amazon right now for $999.00.
Funny, I'm seeing it offered through amazon for $68.42. See? I wouldn't pay THAT much for it either... or even a third of that. But I could conceive of some fanatic trying to complete a collection, maybe...
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Chief Technical Officer
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...but am offering this response in the slight hope that Paizo may consider a reprint.
We actually gave reprints a try once, with the first AP volume that sold out (#2). The economics of printing are based heavily on volume, so in order to have a similar cover price, you need to print a similar quantity, and the demand for the reprinted volume wasn't as big as we'd hoped, so straight reprints are off the table for now.
Have you considered having the PDF printed and bound locally?
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My [unsolicited] advice: Buy the PDF, print out the relevant pages in black & white, clamp it together with a bullbog clip. I do this for pretty much every thing I run (Pathfinder, Star Wars, and others) and it works great. This nice thing is you can go through it with a highliter (yellow for skills, green for rewards, red for enemies/threats, and blue for information) and make notes on it without fear. Then... chuck it in the shredder when you're done!
Alternatively, you might try starting a thread asking fellow Paizoans if they have seen a copy at their local book/game stores. People here are generally pretty helpful when it comes to spreading the Paizo-love. (I wouldn't be at all surprised if someone was willing to buy it and send it to you at cost; just because we're friendly folk.)
-Skeld
...but am offering this response in the slight hope that Paizo may consider a reprint.We actually gave reprints a try once, with the first AP volume that sold out (#2). The economics of printing are based heavily on volume, so in order to have a similar cover price, you need to print a similar quantity, and the demand for the reprinted volume wasn't as big as we'd hoped, so straight reprints are off the table for now.
Have you considered having the PDF printed and bound locally?
Wow, I am super impressed at the level of customer support that I am experiencing here. Thanks for taking the time to respond, Vic. It would seem that there would be some risk in reprinting the AP, then. I accept your reasoning, but would posit that reprinting the first AP would be a little different from reprinting subsequent APs. Most people trying out Pathfinder for the first time will likely want to start at the beginning. By keeping a stock of at least the first and possibly the second AP, you would allow those coming into the Pathfinder fold to experience it as others have. Some might change their mind after trying the first path and move on, while others will keep going, but everyone would have the opportunity to start from the beginning. It would seem that Paizo is poised to really take off with Pathfinder, and keeping the door open for those who were not in from the beginning doesn't seem like that large of a risk. But then I have never ran a company, nor had a book published, printed, or distributed, so my reasoning may be woefully off the mark.
...My [unsolicited] advice: Buy the PDF, print out the relevant pages in black & white, clamp it together with a bullbog clip. I do this for pretty much every thing I run (Pathfinder, Star Wars, and others) and it works great. This nice thing is you can go through it with a highliter (yellow for skills, green for rewards, red for enemies/threats, and blue for information) and make notes on it without fear. Then... chuck it in the shredder when you're done!
Alternatively, you might try starting a thread asking fellow Paizoans if they have seen a copy at their local book/game stores. People here are generally pretty helpful when it comes to spreading the Paizo-love. (I wouldn't be at all surprised if someone was willing to buy it and send it to you at cost; just because we're friendly folk.)
-Skeld
Thanks for the tips, Skeld. From what I have seen so far, I don't doubt that the Paizo folks are a friendly lot. I have tried printing a couple of pdfs out before, but for me they are not the same as an original copy. I think that I will take you up on your suggestion to ask if anyone has access to a copy of Burnt Offerings and Hook Mountain for a reasonable price. I have experienced the generosity of the gaming community in the past and have shared myself on a few occasions. Maybe I will come across someone here who can help me out.
:)
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Director of Brand Strategy
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I think my FLGS has Hook Mountain Massacre though I am positive they don't have Burnt Offerings. That one is particularly rare because it is not only the first one (and thus might have had a smaller print run), and because new converts to Pathfinder have had longer to buy it than any other edition.
Thanks, guys! I'll keep my fingers crossed!
:)
... Only one copy of Burnt Offerings is offered on Amazon right now for $999.00.Was surprised to see this! Finally a retirement plan I can get behind :)
Took a quick look on ebay and found someone selling* the complete AP plus a few Chronicles books for about 30$.... but no individual listings of Burnt Offerings!
Impressive work for Paizo indeed.
* Edit: 30 for shipping too, but still 60 bucks ain't bad.
Well, the bidding is up to $60.00 now, not including shipping, and there are still almost 5 days to go. I am betting that the ending bid for these will be nowhere near $60.00 when the dust settles.
:(
Well, the bidding ended up at $130.85 (shipping included), which is not a bad price for everything included (worked out to about $14.00 per book). However, it is rather a steep price to plunk down on a game system/setting that I have never played. I am guessing at this point that I will have little luck in finding the beginning of this adventure path and should just let it go. Maybe it just wasn't meant to be :( Thanks for everyone's help and responses, though. Happy gaming!
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I have looked around here is Australia and found an internet store which still has the following, one copy of both 1 and 2 and two copies of 3, 4, 5, & 6. They are AUD25 (about USD23) each for a brand new copy, but postage could possibly be expensive, you can but try.
They are Defiant Gaming
Well, the bidding ended up at $130.85 (shipping included), which is not a bad price for everything included (worked out to about $14.00 per book). However, it is rather a steep price to plunk down on a game system/setting that I have never played.
You know, Rise of the Runelords is written for 3.5e, not the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game. While Pathfinder RPG is generally "compatible" and "easy conversion" with 3.5e, the first Pathfinder Adventure Path that uses Pathfinder RPG rules is Council of Thieves.
Also worth mentioning with all the talk about "getting in at the beginning," each adventure path starts at level 1 so the main advantage of "getting in at the beginning" of the line is the back-up materials in the back of the book.
Council of Thieves is the first Pathfinder Adventure Path to use Pathfinder RPG rules.
Rise of the Runelords, Curse of the Crimson Throne, Second Darkness, and Legacy of fire are all for D&D 3.5e rules.
All of the adventure paths are in the Pathfinder Chronicles Campaign Setting regardless of whether they're 3.5e rules or Pathfinder RPG rules, but since the players always start at level 1 for each set, having all the sets isn't strictly necessary except for the supplemental content at the back of the books.
This just seemed like it needed clarified.
This just seemed like it needed clarified.I think it's the completionist, "there are numbers on the spines and I don't have them all!" impulse at play more than one relating to a rules set or specific individual AP. And I can completely relate to that ;-)
Well, I started my subscription at Second Darkness (#13) and went back and bought all of Rise of the Runelords and Curse of the Crimson Throne, but that's because I was buying up 3.5e material left and right like it was going out of style. (We all know it wasn't really going out of style.) Even a year ago, I had trouble getting some of Rise of the Runelords. Actually, I got book 1 & 3 from Amazon but after a month they still hadn't shipped book 2 so I got it from Paizo.
I still wanted to clarify though for people who don't make the distinction between Pathfinder the roleplaying game and Pathfinder the adventure path line and Pathfinder the campaign setting. It -CAN- be confusing, not just because there are three product lines named Pathfinder (or, well, more than three, but those are the big ones), but also because some of Pathfinder is for the Pathfinder game system and some of it isn't.
I think it's the completionist, "there are numbers on the spines and I don't have them all!" impulse at play more than one relating to a rules set or specific individual AP. And I can completely relate to that ;-)
I think there's a little more to it than that. Sometimes, a passage in a book / module / supplement might make a vague reference because the author might assume, without even thinking of it, that the reader is familiar with it because the author is. A module might refer to some Deity, kingdom, or historical event without explaining some detail about that Deity, kingdom, or historical event that's crucial to the current module. Sure, the reader could look it up in the Gazetteer, the Campaign Setting book, or the wiki. But an encyclopedia-like entry might not bring that detail to LIFE the way a story can. (And a module is very much like a story.)
And even if that detail isn't explained in older sources, the reader will never know that for sure unless (s)he has read those older sources.
That's why I dislike reading a sequel before its preceding volumes, and why I plan to get a bunch of old Golarion books - at least, some of them, which cover topics that intrigue me - before moving on to the newer ones. It's not feasible for me to read ALL the past Golarion books, but I feel that getting SOME of them will give me a better feel for the setting.
I'm going to be starting this adventure path soon, but my group consists of 7 players, not 4. What should I do to increase the difficulty of the adventure path to suit such a large group? Should I just double the number of monsters and throw in a bunch of minions into each boss fight? Or should I just max out everything's HP? Or should work out just fine as they are? My main worry is that the characters aren't going to be earning enough xp to keep their level equal to the level of the campaign, but with nearly twice the normal number of players, is that really going to be a problem?
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Director of Brand Strategy
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Not only will your players be short on XP as written, but economy of actions is going to skew heavily in the party's favor. And that's something that even max villain HP can't account for. You'll need to increase number of monsters and difficulty, I suspect, but the CR mechanic is built around the assumption that a party consists of around 4 players. Balancing for 3 or 5 is one thing, but balancing for 7 is something else entirely. That said, there are threads on this topic in the Rise of the Runelords forum below, and they may provide workable advice.
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I'm going to be starting this adventure path soon, but my group consists of 7 players, not 4. What should I do to increase the difficulty of the adventure path to suit such a large group? Should I just double the number of monsters and throw in a bunch of minions into each boss fight? Or should I just max out everything's HP? Or should work out just fine as they are? My main worry is that the characters aren't going to be earning enough xp to keep their level equal to the level of the campaign, but with nearly twice the normal number of players, is that really going to be a problem?
this thread looks right up your alley.
I've been running my own pbp game for 6-8 players for a while; though it isn't ROTRL, this thread nonetheless gave me some help.
Any chance we will see # 1-6 compiled in one volume for all us late-comers?They have said before that they do not plan doing a compilation like that.
It encourages people to wait for the compilation instead of subscribing.
but it would be nice years later for those who didn't jump on board for this particular path
but it would be nice years later for those who didn't jump on board for this particular pathYou snooze, you lose. The early bird gets the worm. To the winner go the spoils. What goes up must come down.
I'm kind of glad yoda ate your head
jk
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but it would be nice years later for those who didn't jump on board for this particular pathAny chance we will see # 1-6 compiled in one volume for all us late-comers?They have said before that they do not plan doing a compilation like that.
It encourages people to wait for the compilation instead of subscribing.
At this point, I think they'd sooner release an anniversary edition Rise of the Rune Lords compilation with updated Pathfinder RPG rules then they'd ever be to do a reprint and/or a compilation book (without updates) .
And even an anniversary edition compilation would likely be limited quantity.
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Creative Director
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Curious, has anyone encountered any trouble with this one? Outside of the fact that the designer seemed to hate square rooms, just ran into some weird wrinkles playing this out.
The designer hates square rooms because he (me) finds them to be boring to look at, and a little bit unrealistic when it comes to fitting a dungeon into an unusually shaped building or location. Plus: Non-square rooms give more opportunities for tactics and cover and all that.
Rather than start a new thread Let me know the good and the bad elements about the adventure path overall. Please keep it civil. As I might be starting running a Pathfinder game soon.
So far I have run almost the first half of the AP and it has been great and the player's have loved it. Pathfinder #1 is by far the best with #2 coming in a very close second. Sandpoint is a great starting locale with tons to do for the players.
I think some work is required in some areas the AP to either make it make sense or flow better, but the Runelords section on this messageboard has so many good ideas on things to add, you can really flesh out your game without as much work put into it.
I think you can't go wrong if you decide to run this for a group.
Curious, has anyone encountered any trouble with this one? Outside of the fact that the designer seemed to hate square rooms, just ran into some weird wrinkles playing this out.
I didn't have any problems with this and other than making it a little harder to draw out, it is refreshing to see "non perfect" rooms.
I'm kind of glad yoda ate your headYou get what you pay for.
I do not want to know even the least bit of detail about that transaction.
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Not sure where to ask this, so I figured here was as good as anywhere.
I was going through the players guide and noticed some feats, the one dealing with stabilize checks comes to mind. Is there an updated version of feats that no longer apply with PFRPG I can use, since at least with that feat, stabilize doesn't deal in % anymore?
Not sure where to ask this, so I figured here was as good as anywhere.
I was going through the players guide and noticed some feats, the one dealing with stabilize checks comes to mind. Is there an updated version of feats that no longer apply with PFRPG I can use, since at least with that feat, stabilize doesn't deal in % anymore?
I doubt that there's any official answer, but I can tell you this much: When I joined a Rise of the Runelords PBP on these forums, I wanted the Lone Wolf feat. And right here, the GM told me this:
Here's how I'm modifying the Lone Wolf feat: Once a day, the first time your condition is 'dying', you automatically stabilize. After this on the same day, if your condition is 'dying', you must make a DC 6 check to stabilize. You also get a +1 bonus on Fortitude saves.
This strikes me as an artistic decision, not a scientific process. And that's one example of why I feel...
...that the "backwards compatibility" claim is bull.
Cough, cough, just saw this one on Ebay for 380 USD. Madness ? :)
Utter Madness!
Seem to range from $72 upwards to that $380... if I'd had Oracle like powers back then I'd have bought two :(