Dedwrekka's page

Seems very Harry Dresden to me. Sounds like a cool item.

Course, it's also useful for a class that doesn't have immediate access to the proficiency with shields.

Quote:

Creating and throwing a bomb requires a standard

action that provokes an attack of opportunity. Thrown
bombs have a range of 20 feet and use the “Throw Splash
Weapon” special attack (see page 202 of the Pathfinder RPG
Core Rulebook). Bombs are considered a weapon and can be
selected using feats such as Point Blank Shot and Weapon
Focus.

I think that's pretty specific. It doesn't say anything about MIXING. It says CREATING. So, you could do it with 1 hand. It also counts as a weapon, so it counts for weapon feats. I would rule that TWF or Rapid shot would work, but their effects wouldn't stack. Treat the bombs just like you would throwing daggers. Many shot would also work, just throw 2 in one hand.

I guess I don't picture these as the old school ball and fuse bombs. I picture them as little capsules that you activate and throw.

Considering that in order to even create and throw bombs at your normal BAB you have to have an specific infusion, I don't see how rapid shot or many shot would work, much less two weapon fighting (which doesn't work for ranged weapons). I don't think that, outside of using that one infusion, you can even make a full attack action with bombs.

One thing nobody has mentioned, not sure if anyone has realized it, but with the HD changes, a summoner is just about shut out of multiclassing, you pretty much have to be a summoner and nothing but a summoner. Unless they have a feat or something that lets you stack AC with Eidelon levels. Before someone jumps on that, I don't think it would be a big game breaker, say druid/summoner or ranger/summoner or paladin/summoner (whew, wouldn't that be nice, a paladin on a summoned mount, egads images of Odin summon from Final Fantasy).

They'd not gain their SLA or spells obviously (and honestly the SLA is a major power now that they nerfed the Eidelon and boosted the SLA back to it's starting position).

Similar could be said of every other class. The feats that combine class abilities that benefit multiclassers don't exist in pathfinder (outside of 3.5 books) at present. Druids/rangers/clerics don't get better animal companions, spell slingers don't get better spells, about the only people that benefit from it at current are melee combatants. So it's not really a Summoner issue.

Ah, i read it as you make the catalyst which is the bomb, at any time before hand since the catalyst remains usable for years. Then infuse it with magic to actually make it active therefor you would only require one hand.

Guess your right, there does need to be a ruling.

As creating and throwing the bomb is a standard action now, there's not too terrible an issue. You can either move then make and throw the bomb, or you can stand still, make and throw the bomb then draw your weapon.

Dedwrekka wrote:

So I coat my dagger with a healing potion and it becomes a healing shiv?

That's not really an effective delivery system as potions are all watery and would just run off the blade, not allowing you to administer the concoction... I've seen DMs allow weirder stuff, though. Oh, and sarcasm doesn't help you make your point.

Just pointing out that if you can just stick a needle in anywhere and push the potion in quick as you like, and have it be believable, that you could just pour it into cuts and have it be believable (Last Crusade style healing potion), or just force it down their throats (not that hard to do).

...or you could just say you make the potion a little thick and stick it on a sword. Same dif.

Dedwrekka wrote:

I think the effect and usage of the syringe is too nonsensical even for my amount of suspension of disbelief.

Half the time I get a nurse at the doctors office who couldn't find the right place to put a needle if they had a road map and two hours on their hands. This is not only saying that they could do it in the amount of time it takes to swing a sword, but that they could do it and the injectee wouldn't be able to do anything about it.

Well he could DODGE. :P

Also this isn't Gurps we're playing, it's Pathfinder. The rules are already a little lax when magic comes into the equation so I don't see a problem with getting creative with medical utensils.

So I coat my dagger with a healing potion and it becomes a healing shiv?

I think the effect and usage of the syringe is too nonsensical even for my amount of suspension of disbelief.

Half the time I get a nurse at the doctors office who couldn't find the right place to put a needle if they had a road map and two hours on their hands. This is not only saying that they could do it in the amount of time it takes to swing a sword, but that they could do it and the injectee wouldn't be able to do anything about it.

@Spacelard
I like the Lovecraft idea, but I think it might be a little too complicated. Make it more like a ritual (with the alchemist changing the levels of chemicals to fit the body) than a simple tap on the arm and it might work better.

dedwrekka wrote:

One handed or two handed doesn't seem to matter much.

it does if you don't have quickdraw and decide not to throw bombs in the second round and unleash multiple arrows instead since you don't have to draw the bow.

Ahem...see the rest of my post.

However, since the description talks about both mixing the bomb just before throwing it, I would assume that you're using two hands at some point.

To be fair, Abe, a Summoner is using spell-like abilities to do so, not spells per day.

So, you want it to be worse?

So, the new build for the Alchemist has vastly improved a class that I was already really excited to play. My one true problem, because most of them can be fixed with new discoveries, is that the class doesnt really have any class features with true alchemical items. They may get to add their int to damage, and get significant bonuses to making them, but nothing to really use them more effectively. First through twentieth alchemists fire will still do 1d6+int damage and have the same saves, rendering them pretty much useless early on. It just seems like more concentration should have been put into these items that the Alchemist specializes in.

I talked with my dm and we were thinking about making a new feature that would allow the Alchemist to use his extracts to make alchemical items more effective. The Alchemist can prepare an alk item like one of his extracts and for the day that alchemical item would have a DC equal to 10 plus half his level and his int modifier. It also adds one extra die of damage per extract level given up and one round to the duration of the alcehmical item.
We were thinking about this more as a flavor kind of thing, but I dont know how effective it will be. Just wondering what you guys thought and any other rules you guys had maybe?

I would still keep alchemist fire handy because your use of bombs is limited. If you're put up against a few tough enemies in a day, it might not matter, but if you fight a lot of low level enemies, alchemist fire (or Ebberon's Alchemist Frost, ect) can still be useful.

seekerofshadowlight wrote:

To me it reads as you can not use the feat with it. As vital strike does increase or multiply damage by default.

I think that's the intent, but as written it looks a lot like VS and subsequent imp, and greater VS would add another d6.

To clarify it might just be easier to write a line like "Bombs cannot be used to apply precision based effects (eg VS, sneak attack damage, or critical feat effects other than deafening or blinding)

(Which would open an interesting discovery: Shaped Charge... which sacrifices splash damage and effects for precision basd damage.)

That's already written into the base rules for splash weapons.

the great paizo wrote:

The alchemist can prepare and throw additional bombs as a full-round action if his base attack bonus is high enough to grant him additional attacks. This functions just like a full-attack with ranged weapon.

This states IF his base attack bonus is high enough to grant him extra attacks, not if he has more than one attack through feats or other abilities.

But i would still assume right now it takes 1 hand, so you can hold a bow or other weapon in the other hand while charging and lobbing bombs.

Throwing a splash weapon is a full round action. You wouldn't be able to use another weapon in that time.

Draeke Raefel wrote:

Correct. Also an increase in hit % directly corresponds to an increase in damage/round. And the increase in Dex provided by the mutagen ability increases your hit % with bombs. So would the dex increase from the Cat's Grace extract. While the above wouldn't help much if you already had a high dex and targeted a grid intersection, they would help you target specific individuals and drastically increase your chance of hitting( by 20% using the base mutagen ability ). This would increase your damage on the initial target as well as allowing you to hit the 8 adjacent squares with splash damage.

Like I said, I like how the new alchemist works (his abilities show great synergy, I was just disspointed in how dull mutagens wound up.

I think a large problem comes from the fact that bombs scale quite well on their own without the need for discoveries to improve them (though they help), while the mutagens only scale through scaling discoveries and later a greater discovery that doesn't require the others to get.

However, if those were to be added to the class, I'm not sure it would continue to be balanced, with automatically scaling mutagens in addition to the already scaling bombs and extracts. It would certainly be one of the few classes to have three special abilities that scale that well (another being the monk).

However, a couple different mutagens would be helpful. Feral mutagen giving an additional +2 to melee attacks (not damage), a speed boost, or something else would also be nice.

The summoner and his eidolon are not equal to...

...a cleric with the animal domain and his animal companion...
...a druid and his animal companion...
...a paladin and his mount...
...a ranger with his animal companion...
...a wizard with summon and calling spells...

...so one must wonder why the class exists at all. It has weaker spellcasting than most other classes, weaker combat ability, and a an eidolon which is roughly on par with animal companions (the latter of which have more HD, but not as many cool abilities).

I imagine, the way its going, most people won't want to play the class very often because they aren't playing the summoner so much as they are playing the eidolon itself. The summoner ends up just being there in a support role (and we all know how support roles, such as the cleric, are often looked over in favor of "an action class").

So you're saying you can't find a way to enjoy a caster that has a nice buff spell selection, an awesomely powerful pet, and can always summon the equivalent or better than the ranger/paladin/druid/cleric animal companion in addition to to Eidolon?

Essentially when you play the summoner, you get two characters instead of one. One is a good buffer, the other can be an awesome combat monster, with open access to all the bestiary feats.

As far as the changes go, all I can say is: Congratulations, you're no longer overpowered!

Alright, monks have an increase to the effect of their unarmed attacks, but how does this effect a monk with natural weapons?
I would imagine that their ability to fight with nothing but their body's natural defenses (fists, knees, elbows, ect.) would also effect their natural weapons, but I can't find rules to support this.
This is mostly in regards to powerful NPC monsters with class levels and characters who through advancement can gain natural weapons (Such as Alchemists, certain half-races and dragon disciples).

(a)Free Brew Potion feet at 1st done similar to the Ebberon Artificer, using an appropriate Use Magic Device (or Craft: Alchemy) check to emulate the spell completion component to make a potion. Limits the Alchemist from making too massive a spell in a potion at too early a level.

(b)Faster discoveries: once every 2-3 levels maybe. To scale, just behind, the effects of wizards and other blasters.

(c)Mutagen effects scale without the need of discoveries (Greater, grand, and true mutagen work into the class)

(d)Swift and Instant alchemy explained to effect the creation of bombs as well. It can be implied from the text that it does already "It takes the alchemist half the amount of time to create alchemical items" (Bombs are alchemical items), but it's not explicit.

As it is, I see the alchemist as something of a, slightly lessened, combat class. Their ability to throw bombs in the opening stages of a fight, then chug a feral mutagen and run into the fray is pretty good. They don't require a lot of feats to make their class great. A few combat feats (plus Improved Natural Attack), can make them a nice swift damage dealer when combined with their extracts and poisons.