Chained Spirit

Adun's page

Organized Play Member. 45 posts (128 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist. 3 Organized Play characters. 2 aliases.


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My next character will have two named weapons:

Arienne, his Carbine (basically a shorter ranged rifle meant to be fired on the move or from horseback), and Relina, his Dragon Pistol. Named after his late wife and daughter. He's a gunslinger, if you didn't know.

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Three Ideas:

Android Spellslinger (An android who just woke up a couple weeks ago, knows very little about the world, and knows that there is something called a "Disc Drive" that it's looking for to fill in the gap in it's data logs.)

Lizardfolk Bloodrager/Dragon Disciple (Basically playing the Chewbacca to someone's Han Solo. Big, beefy, mostly friendly, and only speaks Draconic)

Human Alchemist (A low ranking member of the Technic League who left to find a cure for his ravenous addiction to the fluids seeping from the silver mount.)

Edit: Actually a fourth...

Powered Armor dude. Probably a Gun-Tank gunslinger, but with TECHNOLOGY!

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I think I'll start by saying this:

A minor annoyance:
I asked people to not bring up the "argument from mechanics" flawed argument when trying to get me to change the ruling. Some of you didn't, and I thank you for it. Some of you did, and I'm a little annoyed.

The argument from mechanics states that if thing x does something functionally equivalent to thing y, then there is no difference between thing x and thing y. However, in Pathfinder, and DnD for that matter, this has never been the case. If thing x is a spell, lets say, Hold Person, and thing y is a paralysis poison, they are functionally the same, however they are not mechanically the same. The flaw in the argument is that many of you have been arguing that because poison has similar functionality to other things, that it thus is mechanically equivalent and therefore should not be restricted. It's a flawed argument, and it's kind of annoying.

I'm going to allow the summoner to summon creatures with natural poison. It seems unfair to cut some of the utility of the class as well as to punish creatures that really had no say.

I just don't know how I can get over how poison use feels. It feels dirty, evil, and cheap. It feels wrong to use poison.

Mostly I want a ruling that I can be happy about, but also know that my players wont abuse. Something everyone can be pleased with. I don't know what that is. If someone can give me a ruling that will make everyone happy, myself included, then I'll change my mind. But so far, I've only been getting people telling me I should change it because I'm being dumb.

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I am the GM in question. Thanks Watre for your commentary on the matter. Now that you know what my name is on the messageboards, I'd kindly ask that you refrain from searching for my posts, as you may learn things about my campaigns that are not intended for your eyes.

So here's my reason, and I realize it may seem stubborn:

I am trying to remain consistent. A long time ago, in 2e, I was met with a player who was determined to be as evil as possible in a campaign I was helping to run. I laid the issue to rest, by declaring that he could no longer be good if he continued to use poison. This was fairly early in my gm experience, but the problem I'm running into is that it seems unfair to all the players I had then, and have had since if I don't remain consistent with my prior ruling. It also makes things easier for me, because then there isn't the issue of messy moralistic inconsistencies every time one of my players uses poison.

I recognize that it's overly restrictive, and I don't like it. But I don't see many ways around it, and it just feels evil to me, even if it's non-lethal.

Regarding Alignment shifts, the character in question was Lawful Neutral, but the player in question has been playing his character closer to my interpretation of Chaotic Neutral. In the instance that caused his alignment to shift, I was going to shift it to True Neutral, but the player was offended by my implication that poison use is evil, so decided to write LE on the alignment line. I have yet to tell him that it's an unnecessary thing to do, since his character's actions do not warrant that descriptor.

An alignment shift was headed his way regardless because I don't see alignment as prescriptive, but rather as a descriptor. It describes your character, it doesn't determine anything about them, neither what they do, how they think, or why they do what they do. It simply is a tool for me and my players to use in describing the general direction an individuals actions fall on the chart. If I had it my way, there would be no mechanical implications to alignment, but it's something hard-coded into the system and I can't easily remove it without upsetting a TON of things.

Anyway, I am not particularly closed to changing my view on Poison. If I'm given a really good reason to change my mind, I will, but I want to remain consistent in my rulings if I can, when I can, and when it doesn't hurt anyone's characters. Please refrain from using the "Argument from Mechanics" argument. It's the one that is completely faulty in my mind.

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Not to preform thread necromancy, but I have some built up. I custom made several for my specific party members, and all of them "upgrade" when they reach Mythic Tier 3. I've made 8, not because I think that 8 players is a good Idea, but because I only know three of the players characters yet, and may have up to two more joining, so I wanted something to be available for any new people for me to have a good spot to start from.

Draconic Resevoir:
The Holder of this scale is considered to have absorbed 30 points of cold damage. The Holder of this scale may release the absorbed energy as a swift action, causing their next Melee attack to deal an additional 1d6 cold damage. The scale can do this three times. Upon using the third "charge" the scale gains the ability to cast Draconic Reservior 1/day, choosing an energy type to absorb, and absorbing up to 60 points of damage of the chosen energy type, and releasing the energy uses up it's full "charge" ending the effect. The released energy is always released as Cold damage.)

Upgrade: Upon reaching Mythic Teir 3, the Scale casts Mythic Draconic Reservoir 1/day instead

One of the characters is Terendelev's offspring. He loves dragons, and when he read in Dragons of Golarion that Terendelev is a Silver (his favorite type of dragon) and that She is in Mendev, he was like "Whoa! Awesome lore!" then several months later I told him that the WotR AP happens in Mendev and he was like: "My character is an offspring of Terendelev, it's cannon!" and I thought... Oh god. How is he going to handle this AP? Also, just between you and me, I couldn't help it. He's in for a shock and then, an even bigger shock at the end of the path. I need Him in the campaign, so I'm letting him do it.

Sacred Weaponry:
Three times per day as a standard action, this scale can be used to cast Bless Weapon, except that ammunition loaded into a weapon that fires projectiles receive the benefit of this spell. Unlike a normal Bless Weapon spell, this effect can be cast on an unarmed strike or natural weapon.

Upgrade: Upon Reaching Mythic Teir 3, this scale instead allows you to cast Mythic Daybreak Arrow 1/day, except that all instances
of "undead" are replaced by "evil outsiders".

I realize that Sacred Weaponry is already a scale ability, however, I don't like Align Weapon, so I chose Bless Weapon instead. The Character receiving this scale is a Divine Hunter of Sarenrae, so that should make the changes and upgrade make sense.

Blood of the Martyr:
Three times per day as a standard action, this scale can be used to cast Blood of the Martyr as if Terendelev had cast it upon herself. Doing this allows the bearer of this scale to
drink the Positive-energy infused blood to regain 2d6 hp, as a swift action. It continues to bleed for the full duration of the spell (18 more rounds) or until it's bearer is at full HP. If the bearer of this scale does not sup on the blood, it drips to the ground uselessly.
Drinking the blood in this way does not constitute an evil action, and if the bearer would be harmed by positive energy, as long as their alignment is non-evil, it does not harm them and still heals them.

Upgrade: Upon reaching Mythic Teir 3, the blood heals 4d6 hp per round or until it's bearer is at full HP. In addition, if you are a Dhampir,
you gain the Life-Dominant Soul feat while the Scale bleeds.

I really liked Blood of the Martyr, but it would be ludicrously powerful or stupid depending on the direction I took it in. So I decided to basically say "screw the rules, I'll make this awesome anyway!" The Player is playing a Dhampir Inquisitor of Ragathiel, and I thought this would be an appropriate way of getting them healed, since it's hard to heal a Dhampir when your allies channel Positive Energy and have Lay on Hands.

Three times per day as a standard action, this scale can be used to cast Protection from Evil on it's bearer.

Upgrade:Upon reaching Mythic Teir 3, the bearer is also affected by a Dispel Evil spell. The Protection from Evil effect remains
for it's full duration, even if the Dispel Evil effect is discharged.

Three times per day as a standard action, this scale can be used to cast Consecrate as a standard action. It counts any of the crusader faiths as "in pantheon" and Consecrates the area for both the bearer's deity and Iomedae. The DC to resist positive channeled energy within it's area gains an additional +1 bonus if channeled by this Scale's bearer)

Upgrade: Upon reaching Mythic Teir 3, the Scale instead casts Mythic Consecrate 1/day and The DC to resist positive channeled energy
within it's area gains an additional +4 bonus if channeled by this Scale's bearer

as per the AP

Upgrade: Upon reaching Mythic Teir 3, The Holder of this scale instead can cast Fly 2/day. The affected creature is covered
in a mist that appears as silvery draconic wings, and has concealment (20% miss chance) for the duration of the effect

Three times per day as a standard action, this scale can be used to cast alter self. While disguised, the target gains a +5 bonus on all Charisma based skill checks made against evil creatures.

Upgrade: Upon reaching Mythic Teir 3, the bearer can additionally treat a roll of 2-10 on a single Charisma based skill check as if it were an 11 3/day

This one was hard. I changed it to be "Charisma based skill checks against evil outsiders" because limiting to bluff seemed... wrong.

Chill Metal:
Three times per day as a standard action, this scale can be used to cast Chill Metal. The dice used to determine damage from this spell are d6's rather than d4's.

Upgrade: Upon reaching Mythic Teir 3, the Scale may be used to cast Heat Metal as well. In addition, the target of the spell is Entangled for it's duration, and the number of dice rolled to determine damage dealt are doubled. This damage is not reduced by elemental resistances, but elemental immunity and elemental absorption still affect the damage dealt by this ability.

I wanted something that acted sort of like the aura of cold that Silver's have. so I figured this would work nicely.

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Party so far:

Half-Elf Divine Hunter Paladin of Sarenrae (Champion Path) - Eager to prove to her father that she is worth something to Kyonin and to Golarion, she seeks her destiny by joining the crusaders and fighting the horrors of the abyss (this player has changed their backstory several times, but all generally the same kind of theme)

Pitborn Teifling (Reincarnated Silver Dragon) Warpriest of Iomedae (Guardian Path) - One of Terendelev's children, was slain as a hatchling and reincarnated. The Worldwound's chaotic energies affected the casting, bringing him back as a Teifling.

Dhamphir Cold Iron Warden Inquisitor of Ragathiel (Heirophant or Trickster Path) - From Ustalav, wants to prove that he isn't a monster

Waiting on one or two others, but it's turning out to be an interesting party.

EDIT: Forgot my DM PCs (ish. They're there because I want to play the path as much as I want to run it, but they wont be permanent fixtures)

Valera Wintrish, Shackleborn Paladin of Aroden/Hellknight (Non-Mythic) - Valera is a disgraced noble from the Wintrish line of Chelish nobility. Her family stuck close to revering Aroden until her late teens, when public profession of Asmodean worship was "encouraged" by House Thrune and their proponents. When she spoke out against her father for bowing down to the Lord of Hell, she was sent away and was denounced. Since then, She spent her time before aiding the crusaders of Kenebres in Westcrown during the events of the Council of Theives AP; learning of her Tiefling heritage and becoming a Hellknight of the Order of the Scourge. She still reveres Aroden, and reminds those who scoff at her that not even Pharasma knows Aroden's true fate.

Alaric Kordsson, Kellid Magus (Archmage, in the wings, just in case no-one goes arcane) - Alaric sees himself as a "true" Kellid of Sarkoris. His whole family traces their lineage back to the tribal cheifs long before Sarkoris was an empire, and his father, his father's father, and his grandfather's father all fought in the crusades, ether as crusaders or along side them, and his blood burns for the day that their deaths and sacrifices may be avenged and Sarkoris reclaimed by Kellid hands.

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Lots of great Ideas!

I'd like to put a shout out to Set, Mikaze, The Morphling, Marc Radle, Baron Ulfhamr, The Shaman, and Lamontius for great ideas and discussion. If there was a way to give y'all rep, I would. I'll be playing Vayne in about two weeks. :D

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Thanks for the ideas, everyone! I'm going to spill some of my ideas because Flintas is also having the idea, so he might like some of the bits I've come up with.

Vayne Anubane comes from a long line of necromancers. His family originated from what is now Ustalav, where they were gravediggers and morticians. During these times, the Whispering Tyrant, Tar-Baphon, was ravaging the world; The Anubane family dusted off ancient tomes and learned the arts of necromancy to combat the Whispering Way, earning the ire of both the necromancers under The Tyrant's command, as well as the priesthood of Pharasma. When opposition to their earnest fight became too great, they fled to the deserts of Osiron, both to escape persecution, and to study the magics those people used in preserving their corpses and creating their guardians.

Vayne sees the body as sacred only so long as a soul resides within it. As soon as the soul has left it, the body is an object: It is no different to animate a corpse than to animate a statue. The methods he and his family use to obtain their corpses is a very tame and open one: Some of them own graveyards and tombs, others buy them legally from whomever 'owns' the corpse after burial or funeral, and those who are adventurers typically use their painstakingly researched "Speak with Dead" spell to obtain permission directly from the soul the corpse once belonged to, usually initiating a verbal contract. When they are done with the corpse, they ritually destroy the undead they create, as they have only been created for a specific purpose, and when that purpose is completed, it would be wrong of him to keep them around, and in some cases, a violation of a contract.

The Anubanes have various views on intelligent undead, but Vayne is of a more liberal cast: If the soul desires to return in his service, it should be allowed to, but otherwise, it is evil and vile to force a soul back into a corpse against it's soul's will. He views the Whispering Way as abhorrent and worthy of destruction. In fact, the Anubanes have made it their duty and goal to seek out and destroy the Whispering Way and all of it's adherents. They see their desire to destroy all life and force all beings into unwilling servitude as the most disgusting of goals, and that only those who want undeath should obtain it.

He doesn't explain himself to those who do not want to understand. He holds no ill will against Pharasma or Sarenrae, nor their clergy, as he well knows what he is doing is profane in their sight, but the best way to destroy the Tyrant and his servants is to use their own resources against them, and to uphold justice and righteousness in any way that one can, even a way that must necessarily dip into the realm of "evil" to bring about what is good for all.

The Morphling has a good grasp on what I was going for, as well. Hope this gives some people ideas, as well as something to think about! Thanks again for the responses.

I will also be attempting to create new spells via Ultimate Campaign guidelines such that he will essentially be "converting" Divine spells into Arcane ones: The Cure Line, several of the resurrection spells, and speak with dead, to be sure.

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I like good character concepts. One thing that has always intrigued me is that in 3.5/Pathfinder, almost universally, Necromancy is seen as evil. It isn't hard to understand why: Years of Necromantic villains, Vecna, Tar-Baphon, 99% of undead being evil, etc. However, it isn't the case that Necromancy itself is evil. Casting a spell with the "evil" descriptor is not inherently evil unless the spell requires something (material component, ritual action, etc.) that is an evil act. The spell "Animate Dead" doesn't require anything more than a decently expensive material component, and an availability of suitable corpses (Which, let's be honest, is the easiest resource to come by when being an adventurer, even a Good-aligned one). Also, the variants created for "White Necromancers" have been horrible at best, and downright broken in the worst. The "Life" Necromancy specialization is terribad. I understand where they were trying to go, but they could have at least given them access to the "Cure" spell line... geez.

So, my ideation is thus: I've wanted to play a Lawful Good Necromancer since 3.5: In the Unearthed Arcana book, there was a variant that gave a simple swap of the Necro's familiar for a human skeleton that advanced with the wizard and was cheaper to replace. I never got a chance to put the idea out there, and never got the chance to throw it into one of my campaigns either. Now, I'm playing in a Pathfinder game set in Golarion and have been given the okay to play a LG Necromancer.

I have my own ideas about how to build the character, what relationships they have to organizations like the Whispering Way, how they feel about Vampires, and other things, but I'd like to hear ideas and challenges from the Paizo community, since I get a lot of good ideas from these forums. Mechanical things are not the focus, but are appreciated. So, how would you build Him? How would you play Him? What ways would you have Him explain to people why his chosen school is not "black magic" and "evil" despite the overwhelming tendency to view them as such?

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Vod Canockers wrote:

117. The PCs find a small pouch with 20 silver pieces in it. The writing on the silver pieces is in some unknown language. A successful translation reveals the coins to be from Germany a bit less than a third of the way into the fifteenth century.

I've searched the internet for quite a while now, but I don't know what this trope is. Could you clarify why this is funny?

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The way I started, and continue to, is by determining who I am. I have a fairly good idea of who I am, and if I ask some outside opinions, I get an even better look at myself.

Then, I change one or two things about me. For example, I'm a fairly pious person and I'm a poor white american. So, (in a modern setting) if I make a character that is a falsely pious, wealthy Russian with ties to the mafia and the KGB, that character will be quite different from me.

Next, using the above example, what is the campaign about? Is it an A Team style "gather a team to stop a global crisis" kind of game? Is it an espionage/spy games kind of game? Is it a horror roleplaying experience like Chill or Call of Cthulhu?

Then, what is my character's motives? How did they get into this situation? Were they nominated? Elected? Volunteered? Black-mailed? What's in it for them if the campaign's goals are reached? How does this character get things done? What is the accomplishment that shot them into "Player Character" status over the rest of human kind?

From there, you get a good idea of who that character is, and how to play them. The key is to change one or two things about yourself, and then play those up. As you get more comfortable doing this, you change a couple more things and a couple more things, until you have someone totally alien to you, and with a completely different outlook and motivation, and even philosophy or ideology. Don't be afraid to go overboard with one or two things, it's how you start, and it can be really fun to be a less than 3d character.

Hope it helps!

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62) The Steel Dragons
A large travelling mercenary company led by a party of retired adventurers. The pathfinders utilize their manpower on occasion. Rumor has it that the founder is a tarnished silver dragon.
63) The Black Sheep
A courier service run by the orphans of Korvosa, and sometimes a front for theivery. But only sometimes!

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Oh and the party composition is as follows:

Archery Ranger (Douchey and proud of it)
Summoner of Eldritch Abominations (Ia! Yog Sothoth!)
Magic Item Crafting Wizard (Combat spells? Why would I prepare those?)
Cleric of Sarenrae (Why is she even here?)
Paladin of Torag (Half-orc. Not stupid, and not Lawful Stupid either.)

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First off, if any of my players read this, I will have rocks fall on your character. You have been warned! (JK... mostly)

For background:

I am running a homebrew campaign set in Golarion. The timeline is a bit different, but mostly the same between this version and cannon. The players are mercs hired with their company by the pathfinders to hunt down a group of Orcs that raided the lodge, stole several thassilonian artifacts, and then torched the place. Most of the pathfinders made it out, but while the majority of the lodge relocates to inform the other lodges of what happened, a few have hired and are travelling with the merc company.

So they go into Belkzen, encounter some unusually intelligent Orcs, and have some interesting combats where tactics are used to great effect to harass the party. Some stuff happened, and they wind up in some dwarven vaults under Urgir.

So my first problem is that I've mapped the small dungeon out, but apart from some traps, I haven't really populated it. I have an idea about some dwarven ghosts, but the party is level 4 and don't yet have funds/opportunity to get magic weapons, so I don't know how well they'd fare against incorporeal creatures. Another thing is that I want them to have to figure out a puzzle involving the four vaults on this level of the dungeon before they can descend to the final area and reach their goal, but I'm running out of ideas.


I plan on running Curse of the Crimson Throne after this campaign, as a follow up story-wise. I even intend on their merc characters showing up to help in Book 6. This isn't so much a problem as it is asking for opinions on storycrafting. I plan on replacing the BBEG of Curse with the BBEG from my homebrew, a Thassilonophile Teifling Enchanter who seeks to become the vessel for Sorshen's resurrection. The timeline between the first campaign and the second is a matter of months, with the Enchanter using her considerable abilities to weasel into Illeosa's court and then kill and replace her with a thralled Illusionist puppet. I guess I'm asking if this messes the story up in serious ways from what is written in the path?

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The Cleric of Asmodeus I'm playing in WotR is a heretic (i think that's the archetype...) taking Iomedae's Glory Domain and the Devil subdomain. Basically the concept was a Paladin of Iomedae who was rejected (not fallen) by Iomedae due to demonic taint on his soul for backstory reasons... he used to be a great hero, but was perma-drained down to level 1 and left Iomedae's service by making a bargain with Asmodeus himself and became a cleric thereof, vowing to bring Asmodeus the glory of a sealed Worldwound. Asmodeus accepted, and granted him mental ability scores at the price of never having higher than 12 (even by magic) in any physical ability score.

Sorry about gushing my character concept... I'm gonna do a bit more. Hope all goes well with your Asmodean!

I hope my fellow players don't read this!:
For now, the party is grateful to have someone who can alignment channel the baddies to death, even if it meant signing contracts with him for healing and whatnot. He's not been particularly evil, but my plans are, at the climax of the ending, turn to the party and demand that Asmodeus get all the glory for their deeds, otherwise he's prepared to sabotage the whole operation. My fellows don't get on here, so it's not a big deal.

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Very cool that this is getting a new run. I've been searching for ages and haven't found one anywhere, even the six LGS in my area. I even chanced B&N and Amazon, although Amazon has people selling them for more than a grand, which makes absolutely no sense to me.

Still, I'd like to have a deck, it's kinda sad that I apparently waited a month too long to get my hands on one.

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Odraude wrote:
I use a Kindle and it's fairly fast. I don't get a lot of lag except for the Inner Sea World Guide, but I don't have the E-Reader Friendly version of it. The E-Reader PDFs that Paizo has run beautifully on my Fire.

E-Reader PDF's? I didn't know they made those specifically?

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As the title says, I'm looking for an e-reader/tablet that will allow me to utilize the 30 or so PDF files I've gotten from Paizo for easy reading/reference. I know I could just use a laptop and herolab, but that costs bozo ammounts of mulah that I just don't have, and I would like to not break my back carrying the over 60lbs of books to the various places I game.

So does anyone have suggestions for what brand/model/etc. would work the best for this endevour? Thanks!

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My players (5-6* depending on the week...) are as follows:

Half-Elf Magus
Elf Cleric of Shelyn
Aasimar Paladin
Gnome Druid
Teifling (Beast-Brood) Sorceror (Abyssal Bloodline)
Teifling (Beast-Brood) Gunslinger*

I feel that between the Magus and the Sorceror, they'll have little trouble with anything in book 5. It will take a little modding, but I'm certain they'll rise to the challenge, especially since both the Magus and the Sorceror are interested in Thassilon. How's the rest of the party's composition to you guys?

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<Shameless Self-Promoting Bump>
Thoughts, thoughts? Anyone?

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So I am running a game with 5 players starting tomorrow. I knew I wanted to run them through the Beginner's Box, since 4/5 are newbs to Tabletop Roleplaying, and the material is super good from all that I've read and seen (it's in front of me as I type).

The question comes up in that I want to also run them through Rise of the Rune Lords, because it's a super iconic and fairly "pathfindery" AP, not to mention the bargain you get in buying the hardcover. But... I want them to be able to keep their characters from the Beginner's Box (somewhat updated) going into the AP.

Is there anyone else who has done this, or can give me some advice as to handle non-first level PC's starting an adventure path? I Figure it would give them a better reason to be in Sandpoint, as they're from there (According to the Beginner's Box) and they're local heroes to boot, but I still don't know how having a large boost in Equipment and XP will mess with the AP.

Thanks, and I appreciate it!

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Can a Pearls of Power be my bonded Item? I see no reason why not.

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PCs are not normal folk... after about 4th level. At around 4th level they are the equivalents of modern day sports stars or war heroes, world champion athletes and the like. At 5th level, they're about once in a generation people, and the world will start to recognize them as such. At around 6th to 12th level, they're the stuff of legends, Conan and Sephiroth and Beowulf all fit into this category. At 13th level and beyond, they are ready for extra-planar adventures, and the God and denizens of those realms will start to take notice of them. Finally, at 20th level, PCs are veritable demi-gods, able to take out whole armies by themselves.

So no, most PCs after 4th level are not "normal folk" but between 1st and 4th, they are, just cream of the crop kind of normal folk.

If you look into the way the mechanics work for things like jumping and crafting, most people we know can be represented by 1st level characters, with almost no exceptions. We will be lucky if we know someone that equivocates to 2nd level. Very fortunate if we know a 3rd level somebody, and so on.

There's a fun article on some website that describes this stuff, done much better than I.

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This one would work perfectly. Both Christianity and Islam are supposed to be LG religions (follow these rules and live a good life and you'll get into heaven), but look at the anger, violence, and destruction that gets perpetuated in the name of "destroying the infidels" (from both sides).

Take it you haven't read the Bible anytime recently, sonny?

Not to start a religious spamtastic debate, but seriously... say things about groups of people when you know what you're talking about. It's vulgar to say "black people like fried chicken" it's vulgar to say "Wicca is devil worship" and it's vulgar and inaccurate to say "Christianity is all about rules, etc, etc."

People get pissed when you just say things and don't know what you're talking about,even if it's done in innocent ignorance, so take this as a warning.

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Yeah, Rule 0 is something GMs should never forget. Like the 5th of November.

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LazarX, true. The point though, is for me to post my ideas, and see if anyone cares enough to help me make it more feasible. Right now, I don't have any critique of the different Aasimar abilities, or of how I should handle the Stat Bonuses, because I'm not sure they should all be +2 Wis, +2 Cha.

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^ Absolutely!

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No love for Ixion?

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Anyone have any suggestions for the stuff I posted?

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I'm still working on getting the document on my computer prepped for putting it on the site, with some clarification and whatnot.

I will consider the rolling above thing, and further suggestions on how that would be done?

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Here's my interpretations, and I'd like feedback if any of you like or hate them, and help on making them better. This is only my first draft, and I didn't include the Agathions because I don't know where to find the info for them... anyway, here's the stuff!


Aasimar Characters

Aasimars are defined by class levels—they do not possess racial Hit Dice. All Aasimars have the following racial traits.

  • Normal Speed: Aasimars have a base speed of 30 feet.
  • Darkvision: Aasimars can see in the dark up to 60 feet.
  • Skilled: Aasimars have a +2 racial bonus on Diplomacy and Perception checks.
  • Celestial Resistance: Aasimars have acid resistance 5, cold resistance 5, and electricity resistance 5.
  • Truespeech (Su): All Aasimars can speak with any creature that has a language, as though using a tongues spell (caster level 14th). This ability is always active.

When creating an Aasimar character, choose one of the following Ancestries. Since each of these three contain several subtypes, you Aasimar character can be descended from any of those subtypes, and the appearance of your character should match. For example, a Lillend descendant could have scales running down her legs, or a Hound Archon descendant could have a slightly elongated face and a hatred for Evil Canine outsiders. How this is done is up to you and your GM.


+2 (STR/DEX/CON), +2 Charisma

Radiance (Su): An Aasimar of Angelic descent can sheath their bodies or their weapon in divine luminescence, causing them to be hard to look directly at. This grants them either a +4 dodge bonus to AC or gives their in hand weapon a +3 divine bonus to hit and damage. This effect lasts for a number of rounds equal to their charisma modifier. The rounds do not need to be consecutive. At 7th level, the Aasimar may opt to instead grow wings of resplendent light, granting them a fly speed of 60' and good maneuverability.


+2 (STR/DEX/CON), +2 Charisma

Menacing Glare (Su): An Archon descended Aasimar can, once per day, make a gaze attack (DC 10 +1/2 character level + charisma modifier), to inflict the Shaken status on a hostile creature within 20ft that can see the Aasimar when she uses this ability. The effected creature is Shaken for 24 hours, or until it lands a successful hit against the Aasimar. A creature who has resisted or broken the effect of this ability is immune to this particular Aasimar's Menace effect for 24 hours. At 9th level, the DC of this effect increases to 15 + ½ Character level + charisma modifier, and may be used an additional time per day.


+2 (STR/DEX/CON), +2 Charisma

Insubstantial Form (Su): An Azata descended Aasimar can, for a number of rounds equal to their Charisma modifier, shift between their native (humanoid) form and that of something insubstantial, such as light, wind, mist, etc. While in this Insubstantial form, they gain the incorporeal quality. It cannot attack or cast spells, but spell like abilities, and class features that do not require physicality (GM's Discretion) are still usable while in this form. At 7th level, the Aasimar can fly with average maneuverability at their base land speed while Insubstantial. In addition, they can add the Ghost Touch ability to any weapon they use as a swift action that lasts for a number of rounds equal to ½ character level.

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So, I like Final Fantasy Tactics, and I also liked the Brave/Faith System inherent within it. In FFXII, Square-Enix re-hashed this mechanic within the Spells "Faith" and "Bravery" and my attempts here are an attempt to re-create these in a way that makes sense in 3.5 and PF. Also, this is going to be written in parts, so here is part one:

[u]PART ONE: The Basics.[/u]

So, to start off, what is Faith and Bravery?

Under this system, Faith is a measure of belief in something that your character has devoted themselves to. This is not necessarily divine, your character could be a rogue with high Faith that believes in the quickness of their fingers, or a fighter who believes in his training, the object of the Faith is not important. It is somehow tied more with Spellcasting and saving throws than with physical combat, however, and reflects this in how it's base score is derived.

Bravery, is a measure of Moral, Intellectual, Spiritual, and Social courage that inspires others and yourself to great acts. Bravery is more tied in with Physical actions, as is seen in how it's base score is derived.

How are Faith and Bravery defined?

They are defined best as a Percentile score, with a minimum of 1 and maximum of 99. A 1 rolled on Percentile is always a success and a 100 rolled on percentile is always a failure. When rolling Bravery or Faith, you are rolling under your score, to determine success or failure.

The base score for Faith is 20 + the combined ability score modifier of the mental ability scores. (For Example, a Wizard with Int 18, Wis 10, and Cha 14 would have a combined total of 42, which has a modifier of 16) According to the above example, the wizard's base faith is 36.

Bravery is calculated similarly, but using the Physical ability scores.

In addition, a Character's Class adds a small modifier to their base Bravery and Faith. Every two class levels, the character gains a +2% increase to their class' Base Faith or Bravery Bonus. If a character multiclasses, they do not gain the class bonus of their new class, this is a bonus accrued at character creation. One may, if their class has a bonus of "of Choice" change the focus of that bonus from Faith to Bravery and vice versa upon gaining a class level in that class, however, any bonus increase due to class level remains in that focus, while the base 5% is changed to the new focus.

Bard +5% of Choice
Barbarian +5% Bravery
Cleric +5% Faith
Druid +5% of Choice
Fighter +5% Bravery
Monk +5% Faith
Paladin +5% of Choice
Ranger +5% Bravery
Rogue +5% of Choice
Sorcerer +5% Bravery
Wizard +5% Faith

Cavalier +5% Bravery
Oracle +5% Faith
Witch +5% Faith
Summoner +5% of Choice
Alchemist +5% of Choice
Inquisitor +5% Faith

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I might just write something up myself... it wouldn't be Golarion specific, but it would be Pathfinder specific. I can see making several "bloodlines" of Aasimar, sort of determining bonus stuff based on what kind of Celestial they are descended from.

IMHO, think Hound Archon descendants should look and play differently than an Astral Deva descended Aasimar, but that's just my opinion.

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Where's the Aasimar love in Golarion? We've seen Teiflings, which is understandable, and actually quite fitting for Celiax, but what about Aasimars? I've heard on other sites and from friends that they're just boring. And, Honestly... I have to agree. Why are they so boring? they're the descendants of Angels and other Celestials, how can that be Boring? Where do they fit into Golarion?

Just some musings.

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I don't see why not. I mean, you CAN increase the Eidolon's intelligence score. and as far as I know, the charisma score isn't too bad. I'd rule to a player who wanted to play one that their Eidolon speaks the same languages as the Summoner, due to the "link" and that they can interact with the other party members in an equally efficient manner. I mean, the main gimmick of the class is the Eidolon, so it really should be sort of like a "Cohort" thing.

I'd actually ask my DM to make the Eidolon have a scaling intelligence score, that increases as it's bond increases to it's summoner. The reason is because I don't see the low intelligence as a "sub-human" level of reason and thinking. I see it as a clinical detachment from the Prime Material Plane that is slowly remedied as they grow used to being with their summoner. As for what the scaling is? I'd say 1 point every 2 HD, so that the base intelligence is 7, but it starts as 8. then at 3rd level, it becomes 9, etc.

Hope that helped!

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Since you're large size, I'd go with a Giant Mercurial War Pick, Which I believe does something in the range of 4d8 damage. If you take the Monkey Grip Feat, you can use it one handed at a -3 penalty (-2 for the awkwardness from monkey grip and -1 from Mercurial). Also, you have to take Exotic Wep. Prof (Giant War Pick) to use it with monkey grip anyhow.

So, I believe that would be the best weapon, because 4d8 with a x4 crit is amazing, and if you're large sized, you should have a large strength modifier, which makes things much, much better.

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Thanks, both of you. It's put me on track with this undergoing!

Any more suggestions? Do you think the idea is a feasible one for an introduction to the D&D (Pathfinder) rules set? As the start to a campaign?

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Probably not the right place for this, but we'll see.

The idea is a group of 4-6 1st level characters thrown into a mega-dungeon that they must fight their way to the end of in order to graduate from their academy. The Dungeon consists of 20 tiers and will take them to 5th level.

I've designed dungeons before, but this is a scale I haven't dreamed of until I got the Idea that it would be awesome to have this Academy that selects the most promising academs for a rigorous final training where no holds are barred, and they have to fight for their lives to succeed. Those who don't, die. Those who emerge victorious are heralded as elite agents of the crown or some other thing.

Part of the reason I wanted to do this is by simply looking at D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder stuff it is easy to say that 5th level Characters, especially PC's, are near legendary in stature. Once in a generation, that kind of power level. Most people the Character's meet will be 1st-2nd level, just like in our world, most people you meet will be only at most a 3rd level character (and that's pushing it).

I want the campaign to be about what they do after they emerge, totally changed from their experiences in the dungeon, and I have a few ideas they can run with, but the main trouble I'm having is in even thinking of how to design a dungeon with 20 floors that has the necessary challenges for the players, without totally killing them. In game this dungeon is supposed to take about seven to twenty days, so how do I design a dungeon where the players can rest? Do I design "safe zones" or do I just force them to be vigilant in the night? Do I roll up random encounters for the floor they're on, or do I design the encounters? Same question with loot.

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The only question I have to all of this is how the Improved Familiar and other such feats work with the witch? I have heard talk of trying to figure out the bonus spells they give, but I personally think that to be merely a Player to GM discussion. So, would using the Improved Familiar feat to get, say, a dire wolf familiar change the vulnerability of the thing? I believe that the Familair for the witch is similar to the Wizard's familiar, meaning that the feat that improves it gives it different HD, thus different HP, and different stats.

Am I just wrong or what? I mean, the description for Improved Familiar says something about how vulnerable familair's are and how some spellcasters want more durability in their companions. I don't see how this is any different.

Also, on the point of stealing a spellbook or bonded Item, I once created a rogue that had, at 2nd level, a +19 to sleight of hand. His combat tactics where to, with the help of the bard, steal the opposing spellcaster's spellbook or whatever and then flank them for a sneak attack. It worked wonders, and I even had the chance by level 4 to disarm a fighter in much the same way, so it can be done if a player puts their minds to it.

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Wow, SmiloDan, I like the literary reference there at the end of your post...

I may just have to make an "assistant pig keeper" character... hmmmm...

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Here's what I'm thinking for Half-Eidolon:

The Half-Eidolon is the offspring of a Summoner and their Eidolon. Most of these unions are made by consensual partners, the Eidolon and Summoner not viewing their relationship as Master and Servitor, but rather seeing each other as partners and sharing their love for one another often times, if the Summoner is skilled enough, leads to the birth of a Half-breed. Unlike most Half-breeds, the Half-Eidolon is usually brought up in a caring environment, a physical seal of the Eidolon's commitment to it's summoner. The Half-Eidolon also bears a measure of it's Otherworldly parent's power, able to take on a limited number of evolutions and the ability to change it's form from the standard Bipedal form it was born in, to a form it chooses to practice from a young age.

Type: Outsider (Native)

+2 to STR or CHA, -2 to CON or INT

+2 bonus to Disguise skill checks

Alter Form (Su) 1/day: The Half-Eidolon gains the ability to shift it's base form from Bipedal to either Serpentine or Quadrupedal (Chosen at first level). The Half-Eidolon's Ability scores are not altered while in this altered form, but gains natural attacks and evolutions as an eidolon of their size and form. They may change back to the base Bipedal form at any time, but must wait until the next day to change into their chosen alternate form. This is a Supernatural Ability

Size: Small or Medium (If small, it gets all appropriate modifiers)

Evolutions: The Half-Eidolon chooses any 1 point Evolution from the Summoner class features list. At 6th level, increase the number of evolution points available to 2 plus 1 for every three levels thereafter. A Half-Eidolon cannot choose the Large or Huge size increase, or any evolution that requires a feature that the Half-Eidolon does not possess. Every time the Half-Eidolon gains a level, they may "respend" their evolution points to change their options.

Alignment: Most Half-Eidolon's are born to a Summoner and their Eidolon, and the resulting half-breed is usually a little wild and adventurous, seeking answers to questions they cannot express. Half-Eidolon's thus tend to be Chaotic, but may be Lawful, seeking some sort of solidity to their existance.

Favored Class: Summoner or Bard. The Half-Eidolon was raised with love and care, unlike most half breeds, and thus finds no opposition to finding their own strength of will suitable to the art of the Summoner. The few who came from more carnal relationships find the life of a wandering bard more to their liking.

Sample first level Half-Eidolon Fighter::

Adun, Half-Eidolon (Outsider, Native) Fighter 1, Chaotic Good

+STR: 16 +3
DEX: 14 +2
CON: 13 +1
-INT: 9 -1
WIS: 11 +0
CHA: 15 +2

FORT: +3
REF: +2
WILL: +0

BAB: +1
AC: 18
T: 12 FF: 16

CMB: +1
CMD: +1

Spell Like Ability: True Strike 1/day, Bipedal

Alter Form: Serpentine 1/day

Outsider Traits

Size: Medium

+2 to Disguise Skill Checks

Intimidate: +6 (Class, Trained)
Disguise: +4

(1) Power Attack
(F) Cleave

Greatsword: +4, 2d6 +4, x2
Claws: +4, 1d6 +3, x2

Breastplate: +6 AC, etc.

Other Gear:
Flint and Steel
3 Sunrods
10 days trail rations

Dark Archive

So basically a beholder pet?

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I love these boards!

I consider myself a pretty sick puppy and then I realize that there are whole realms of depravity that I've yet to consider.

Welcome to life in general, dude. As the Apostle Paul said "Brothers, be knowledgeable of what is good, and be as babes in evil..."

So I find that statement is quite applicable most of the days of my life. To be quite bold, I only recently found out what the word "Sodomy" meant. (And I'm not that young, nor sheltered, I just choose not to pay much attention to everything that comes my way.)

Back on topic, I think this is an excellent Idea. I don't think it would be an issue in any campaign I ran, nor would I think it to be an issue of the Eidolon necessarily hating or needing their master. In fact, I don't see why you can't just increase the Eidolon's Intelligence Score as you gain levels.

I don't see this as being an issue of perversion either, because the two entities could very much love each other, their relationships being borne out of affection and friendship rather than carnality. If one of my players was just doing this to be horny at the gaming table, I'd not allow it, but if the player built the Eidolon right, I don't see any issues, especially if they increased it's Intelligence score.

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My proposition:

Starting Statistics: Size Small; Speed 10 ft., Fly 30
ft.; AC +2 natural armor; Saves Fort (bad), Ref (good), Will (good); Attack bite (1d4), Claw (1d3); Ability Scores Str
8, Dex 18, Con 11, Int 7, Wis 13, Cha 11; Free Evolutions
bite, wings, limbs (legs), claws.

Because as it is, the Eidolon doesn't represent all the archtypical life forms, it's got Biped, Quadruped, and Serpentine, but not Bird-like. So, unlike the others, it's starts out small, and can get bigger, but only as big as large.

I know this isn't perfect, but I think the wings benefit is outweighed by the small size.