GM Aldizog's PF1 Core 5-02 Wardstone Patrol (3-7) (Gameday IX) (Inactive)

Game Master Aldizog

Opening the Discussion thread.

Okay everybody, we will start on Monday. Please make sure you have the relevant character info in your profile and also in the status line. That way, if I do have to bot you, I know the statistics.

Ithindar - don't see any profile.
Pau - looks good.
Silgil - looks good. My Dwarven EK has played with Silgil. I trust you have direct or indirect Chronicle sheet access for all of your non-Core spells (some of which were shared by my EK).
Ny'a - looks good, but I do not believe Fashionable is a Core trait (that is, just the Web Enhancement and the Guide to Organized Play) unless you have some other way to access it.
Jack Malcolm Thorpe Churchill - don't see any profile.
Wraith - Another familiar face. Profile looks good.

Our APL looks like (3+6+6+4+6+4)/6 = 29/6 = 4.83, rounds to 5. Given the party size, that means we play the high tier with the 4-player adjustment. You may want to stock up on some consumables.

Sorry about that - somehow, his profile was deleted :-/

I have re-uploaded it now :-)

Silgil - looks good. My Dwarven EK has played with Silgil. I trust you have direct or indirect Chronicle sheet access for all of your non-Core spells (some of which were shared by my EK).

Scratches head. Well, I did cite the chronicle he got the non-core spells in (the Jarlsburg Witch Saga), and all of his adventures were through this forum, so I always assumed I could just go back and cite the post where they were provided. They were NOT included on the chronicle by the GM unfortunately, so that is the best I can do.

@Silgil, sorry, I meant to imply that I do trust you on that and don't need to check. I know you were diligent about following the rules on access to non-Core spells when I played with you before.

Just for full disclosure, I have played this in Standard many years ago. I don't remember much, but I will take a back seat when it comes to making decisions.

@Silgil, sorry, I meant to imply that I do trust you on that and don't need to check. I know you were diligent about following the rules on access to non-Core spells when I played with you before.

No offense taken. It would have been fine if you needed to check.

And, though I have good intentions, I have made core vs. standard mistakes a number of times to the point where I sometimes include a non-core item in my inventory, put in a strike-through, and then add a note to the side telling myself that it is not a core item.

Ny'a - looks good, but I do not believe Fashionable is a Core trait (that is, just the Web Enhancement and the Guide to Organized Play) unless you have some other way to access it.

Fashionable is a Faction trait from the Guide to Organized Play. It was published at least as early as the Season 8 version of that document, which is when Ny'a was created, and is still published in the Season 10 Guide as well.

@Ny'a, thanks, I missed that. There is a very similar Equipment trait that I had it mixed up with.

Will get started in a bit.

Upgrading my elven curve blade to +1

I recognize that it may seem that I am having the enemies be unusually well-coordinated, but they have Blindsense, Telepathy, and 16 Int. They are designed with abilities that synergize well, and they are not given intentionally sub-optimal tactics as some PFS enemies are.

This is a CR8 fight (would be CR9 but for the four-player adjustment).

And Ny'a still thinks she's trying to subdue unruly villagers.

Yep, they have that special thing too.

Fingers crossed we start dropping these guys. I would have rather gone for the flank on BLACK as the positioning would have been more difficult for them to put me in a flank. I hope this doesn't hurt too much.

Sorry, Wraith. You did drop one, at least.

I imagine they probably would still have dropped you with the two full attacks even if it hadn't been for the crit. I did not have Black continue to attack after you fell (even though he had no other targets) but it doesn't look good.

If you have any boons that might negate a crit, this would be the time to let me know.

sorry i had the kid with a cold and dont let me any time to write ill hope to post more fluently on next days

I just have to ask why Jack hasn’t made a move to come help at all in this scrum. Two members of the team down, one paralyzed, and your Longstrider spell could have you zipping right over lickety split...

I’m just not understanding.

Because I am an archer, and I can only see them if I am adjacent, thanks to the obscuring mist, which would result in me provoking every time I took a shot?

There is also a world of difference between being proficient with something, and being of any use with it - I mean, with a dagger, I do 1d4+2 damage...

Frankly, if they are demons, they will undoubtedly have DR, which would severely limit my usefulness in melee even further...

It is not my job to tell the PCs what to do.

I will say that retreat is a possibility. For a number of reasons (adventure design, luck, PC tactics or choices), this fight has become very difficult to win, and I would say almost impossible to win without some PC deaths. I am not looking to kill PCs but I will also not have the enemies act stupid to throw the fight.

Thanks to Silgil's Knowledge check, I can tell you that both Vermleks have 2 uses of their Mass Inflict Light Wounds SLA left, which heals them and hurts you. Given how low Pau, Wraith, and Ny'a are, that could be lethal.

Also, nobody is adjacent to the demons at the moment, so they can't get AOOs on you for standing from prone for example.

If fighting these things to the end is what your characters would do, then that is a choice you can make.

Low tier would have been 3 ordinary Vermlek demons (AC 15, 30 HP, a few SLAs).
High tier with 4-player adjustment was 3 Vermlek demons each with 4 levels of witch (AC 17, HP 72, the iterative attack, and various spells and hexes).

Well, you COULD stop rolling 20's on everyone. That would be a great help.

LOL!

Ith, just so it’s clear, I think the group is trying to retreat here. Don’t want you to get stuck there by yourself.

Summoning 1d4 Dretches (with 50% chance of success) is something that all Vermleks can do, not just these ones with Witch levels.

That would have been a pretty strong opening move, given that Dretches can each use Stinking Cloud 1/day.

*shrugs*

Frankly, you're the GM, so I trust you to be reasonable.

For what it is worth, I made my peace with the fact that Jack will be perma-dead from this encounter a long time ago :-P

With Jack and Ithindar down, and Pau and Silgil in retreat, it comes down to Wraith and Ny'a.

Do you go into the fog to try to save one or both of your allies, or retreat?

There will be no alignment implications to either decision. You are both badly wounded and the enemy is very dangerous. You don't
even know if your allies still live.

The imperative to "cooperate" only goes so far. It is your choice.

For my part, feel free to leave Jack; he will suicide if rescued, so there isn't any point.

I *have* been steadily murdering all of my PCs since I became disillusioned with Paizo (and gaming in general), and this seems like a suitably horrible way for him to go out (presumably, as a new skin-suit for a demon).

This whole situation sucks.

We might have been able to take them with better tactics, but tactics took a back seat to role-play. Which is OK, I'm thinking, if it is OK with the fallen.

I am not supposed to change the APL mid-game even if PCs die or players quit.
But the rest of the scenario just became much more challenging.

You were just barely in high tier but have now lost Jack and maybe Ithindar as well.
Silgil has used many of his best spells.

We could call this one a loss and end the mission.
Or you could try to press on in high tier, though that would likely be a TPK.
Or I could decide that there were extenuating circumstances and do what I am not supposed to do and shift you into the low tier.

I really thought that Ithindar and Jack would retreat with the unconscious Wraith and Ny'a, rather than continuing to press the attack. Players surprise you. We are where we are.

I enjoy Core and do not want any of our fairly small player community to be discouraged. This scenario may be too far gone to save, or bending the rules may lead to an enjoyable outcome for those left. I am a longtime player but new PFS GM, so I am hesitant to tell players what they "should" choose to do. I'm also hesitant to bend the rules, but this might be a time for it.

Thoughts?

I *have* been steadily murdering all of my PCs since I became disillusioned with Paizo

Given that it could be argued that not every one came to the table with the 'Cooperate' in mind, it is not beyond reason to reassess the APL (and it was the first encounter).

Granted, at this point, by RAW, we could either walk into the probably TPK or walk away with nothing to show for our efforts.

Jack, if this is really how you feel, why play at all? Your act of defiance only serves to hurt your fellow players, not Paizo in the least. I understand you are no longer a fan of the company, so why not just walk away?

Also, if you really want to perma-death all your characters, I would be willing to help. I am serious. With the recent ruling that you can have a table of three (3) players {A GM and two players, each with an Pre-gen}, if you can find a like minded individual, I could run games for them all, allowing you to die and recording them officially 'dead'. Again, this is a totally serious offer. This way you can take the path you would like and there would be no fallout for other players.

I’m for whatever the GM decides. I’d be fine with shifting to low tier if the group agrees, or I could lick my wounds and take the scenario sheet as ugly as it might be!

I'm glad you brought this up as I was thinking about how to have Silgil respond. I'm totally OK with calling this one a loss and retreating with our lives intact. What I'm not going to do is send Silgil on with an understaffed party at high tier, and even at lower tier, I'm not sending him on with no spells. A wizard without spells is pointless. He would only go on if he had a chance to regain spells.

@Wraith: I appreciate the offer, but if you look at my alias profile, you will see that it isn't necessary; I don't have that many left to worry about (and a few of those aren't played any more, for sentimental reasons).

As for why? Frankly, recently, personal suffering is the only thing that has made me feel *anything*, and it has skewed my PC choices - for example, the last PF1 PCs that I built were an emotionless shell of a half-orc, 'possessed' by the ectoplasmic weapon that he had summoned, which was a fragment of Nyarlathotep, and a Tortured Crusader of Kerkamoth, who *knows* the world will end, and there is nothing that can be done to stop it. In PF2, the last PCs that I built were a pain-obsessed Champion of Vildeis, and a Barbarian based on Goblinslayer.

The reason that I don't walk away, is that I GM a lot - watching my monsters get torn apart is *almost* like seeing the same happen to one of my PCs.

I see gaming as a largely useless/pointless activity, used to distract oneself from the 'real' world, and in so doing, actively harming one's ability to function in the 'real' world (assuming that you do it enough), making it another form of self-punishment; hence my heavy investment in it.

@All, take any follow-up to Jack's post to PM.

@Silgil, on my phone now, but when I cam check the scenario I will let you know. My recollection is that there is no opportunity to rest so we should call it here. I will double-check.

I'm really sad to hear you are in such a dark place, Jack/Luke. I have had two of my kids go though phases of their life like that and it was terrifying to me as a parent. I've been through, by proxy, cutting, eating disorder, suicide attempts, drug abuse, schizophrenia and mental institutions, nihilism, satanism ... Ugh, I'm past the verge of tears thinking about it all.

They both came out of it in the end, and are leading much happier lives now, but they were both close things. And by close I mean I am blessed that they are still alive. I don't know your situation for sure or whether you are talking about an equally dark place, but my heart goes out to you. I hope, and pray, you get through this and your life turns around too. Life takes surprising turns so don't give up hope. Please.

Sorry folks, I'm pretty absent on weekends, and wow; it seems like I missed a lot. There are still 12 unread in Gameplay as I'm writing this.

Since we haven't completed the first encounter yet, I think we can just call this a wash and not even issue Chronicles, right? If that's the case, that's how I move to proceed. Especially since it sounds like we had a player kind of misrepresenting why they were playing. If there's a reasonable (and PFS-legal) way to continue in a reasonable tier, then I would also have no objection to that, but if @GM's assessment earlier that we can't change APL mid-scenario, that's probably not a reasonable solution.

I too have parented my kids through some dark times. Many of the same issues as Sigil. So, Jack, I feel for you as you go through this. I can only hope that you are not on your journey alone. It is important to find others to lean on, even if it is just to talk. Thank you for sharing your story with us. Let us know how we can help.

There is not an opportunity to rest.

However, there is not a lot of combat left in this scenario either.
There are several RP encounters, an environmental hazard, and one combat that will be much less difficult than this one (because you'll be in the low subtier).

There is an optional encounter that I was going to waive anyway because it was a swarm.

Silgil still has some spells left (including, I believe, an open 3rd-level slot that he can fill), as well as a wand and some scrolls. I do honestly believe that he could make a meaningful contribution at the low tier. But if he does not wish to proceed, then I will issue Chronicles.

My inclination is to proceed at the low tier. I could write Campaign Leadership, explain the situation, and ask for permission to change the sub-tier. I don't think I need to:

As a Pathfinder Society Roleplaying Guild GM, you have the right and responsibility to make whatever judgments, within the rules, that you feel are necessary at your table to ensure everyone has a fair and fun experience. This does not mean you can contradict rules or restrictions outlined in this document, a published Pathfinder RPG source, errata document, or official FAQ on paizo.com. What it does mean is that only you can judge what is right for your table during cases not covered in these sources.

This is only my second time GM'ing for PFS, but I do believe that we have such a case, and nothing in the Guide explicitly prohibits what I am proposing. Nor do I see such a prohibition in the official FAQ.

I think GMs are not supposed to change APL mid-scenario, but they can in extraordinary circumstances.

@Silgil, I will leave it to you, since you had the most reservations about continuing on.

You know, you are right. I still have a little less than half of my spells left - more than I thought. If the tier is reduced, I'll stick with it.

@Nya
You have the martyr's shard boon from Solstice Scar which gives a weapon good/cold iron. Sounds like a great fit for this.

It also does not look like you have anything that gives you a bonus to strength. is that correct? If so, you would probably be the best fit for a Bull's Strength spell from Silgil.

Ith, just so it’s clear, I think the group is trying to retreat here. Don’t want you to get stuck there by yourself.

Yeah, Ith, I tried to warn you with this post back from a week or two ago.

After Pau's participation in the loot dispersal, that leaves 2 CMW, 2 Shield of Faith (CL 6th), and 5 flasks of holy water up for grabs. Whatever is left will be stuffed in Silgil's bag of holding.

So... what happens if you do not display empathy towards Sir Ilivan, or towards others in his presence, is that he instead becomes consumed by shame and anger and decides to kill you.

That would have been the final encounter instead of the Brimorak fight.

Those Diplomacy checks that Ny'a made on the villager rescue attempt, and the soldier rescue attempt, and talking to Sir Ilivan after his flashback - those got you this ending. I tried to convey that such efforts were chipping away at his shell, even though they didn't make him flip a switch and start being idealistic.

I will get working on Chronicles.

As I said, I have played this before. However, I did not know there was the possibility for a different outcome.

Coincidentally, the character I played on that game in Standard took a level of Spiritualist afterward and took Sir Ilivan as his spirit companion.

Except for the death in the one battle, I really enjoyed this scenario. Thanks for running for us, GM.

Coincidentally, the character I played on that game in Standard took a level of Spiritualist afterward and took Sir Ilivan as his spirit companion.

That's really cool!

Thanks so much for the game, GM. I have a technical question regarding Ny'a's dead dog. (note to self: no more PCs with apostrophes toward the end of their name, man that makes possessives look weird)

The dog is simply a riding dog purchased for 150 gp after her first chronicle. I assume the proper way to document its death is to "expend" it on her Inventory Tracking Sheet and purchase a new one? She doesn't get her mount as a class ability until next level, which is still two more chronicle sheets away.

@Ny'a, that is correct. Once she gets her mount, it will be far more durable (and will have Evasion).

Boon rolls, everybody! 19 or 20 wins a boon, and if you win one, roll 1d3 to determine which one.

GM roll: 1d20 ⇒ 7

Also, if anybody would like me to record "starting gold," "gold spent," and "total," then please let me know the first two items. Otherwise I will just record "gold earned" and "day job." Similarly for XP and Prestige.

Ithindar, do you have any boons that would enable you to be Raised at lower cost?

It looks to me like it would require 5 PP for the body recovery, and 8 PP plus 2,450 GP for the Raise Dead. I do not imagine that you have these resources, but there could be boons I am not aware of. Otherwise I will mark Ithindar as deceased in the game reporting.

Boony McBoonerson?: 1d20 ⇒ 2

Boon?: 1d20 ⇒ 1