Please note I'll be away from Friday to Monday.
It occurs to me that I would be better fighting with my daggers :(
Short swords only do piercing... which is a bit retarded but whatever :)
I think that they are modeled after the short swords that the Romans used, which were stabbing weapons.
You still bring it down.
I was under the impression that they could do either...
Sword, short 10 gp 1d4 1d6 19–20/×2 — 2 lbs. P —
Nope, piercing only. Longswords are slashing, not piercing. Daggers are piercing or slashing. *shrug*
That's... counterintuitive!
My vacation plans are pretty much settled.
Approximately, I'll be away:
June 14-17, no access
June 23 to July 24, no access
July 28 to August 5, spotty access
That's... counterintuitive!
sooooo do I get DM fiat working for me here? :)
Always thought of zombies as meh after 3rd level... but I've the AC of a level 1 character and all of a sudden these things are a real threat
That's... counterintuitive!sooooo do I get DM fiat working for me here? :)
Yes, you have the fiat! We can revise if need be.
Sorry... does anyone have the map link?
I believe this is the latest map.
Thanks! Ok... so 4D I am assuming is the curtain...
Damn thats a lot of Zombies. I gotta state my admiration for the low magic set up and feel here. I've known 5th level parties that would smash through this without a thought but we aren't one of those. I genuinely feel a bit of trepidation here.
And I believe we are fresh out of channel energies too.
So I am tempted to charge down but want to make sure that the map is updated with our apocrathy
I think I MAY have a solution to my AC against Zombies... Defensive fighting... it will screw with my attack (-4) but gives me 2 more AC with an ADDITIONAL 1 AC for having 3 ranks of acrobatics.
So I can, vs these zombies, get my AC to 22. Its not 100% safe but the odds are a bit better.
So I am tempted to charge down but want to make sure that the map is updated with our apocrathy
Yeah, which stairs is Valiard moving to? The ones at d8? And where exactly is the curtain Grigor saw someone behind?
Curtains runs from C5 to C8. I'll update the map on my next post.
Keep meaning to bring it up, but I assume Valiard went ahead and put on the cloak of resistance, as discussed here? One of us ought to be wearing it.
Is everything ok Deimus?
Yes, thanks. Busy busy!
Also, I'm off tomorrow until Monday night or Tuesday. Then I leave for about a month on Saturday. If all are ok, we'll put the game on hold then.
Just so I am clear here... its no game for a month?
You got it, boss. From June 23th to July 24th. About 10 or so posts up, Warforged has a listing of time off.
Yeah, I'm off for a month, away from computers and phones. It will be quite a challenge...
wow - cool... looking forward to seeing a post on the experience.
Ok - I take it we are in the Black out period?
Yeah it won't be until mid-July before Warforged posts again. And that's only for a few days before he's gone for another week.
Gonna be a bit of a black out time.
If we don't bump one of the threads regularly, we won't get updates on our Campaigns tab when the DM's back. I'm in another game that recently took about a two-week break while the DM was on vacation, and when he started up the game again, there had been so many days of inactivity we didn't get an (x new) notification on our Campaigns tabs.
good tip that... will try to post every 5-7 days unless u guys want to talk board games or something?
I'll be around for a few days before leaving for the longer period.
I'll PM everyone, so no real need to bump.
Also, things are brewing IRL and my plans might change completely.
Rodger. We will keep our eyes and ears open.
I am away on Business atm so I'm semi out atm for 1-2 days. I will check the thread and see whats happening
Dispel magic, I'm guessing. Should have taken the deafness option and given him a 20% chance of spell failure, in hindsight. But, yeah, that spell constituted basically all of Mireza's offensive abilities she had prepared. She's done for the day.
Only one of us with a clear enough view of Myre IC is Valiard, and I don't know if he has Spellcraft. Usually, a ray has a to-hit roll, and most spells have either an attack roll or a save, not both.
I am seriously considering running.
Where is it written that we need to win or even can win every battle?
12 Zombies is a handful on their own - a few ghouls burned through ALL the channels we had and was a near TPK. 12 Zombies as a roadblock to a BBEG caster is nasty. 12 Zombies as roadblock, a BBEG caster AND non optimised characters? Its not gonna end well.
And we are non optimised.
Grigor isn't made to be a brick/meatshield. His AC is low, his attacks non optimised (doesn't have 18 dex even to get the best out of his weapon finese). What Grigor is, is an RP concept Skill Monkey (which I LOVE).
Mizera? She's burned her offensive capabilities. Witches ROCK for RP (and love the Character RP as well). She is not a combat blow em up caster (hell, she isn't even combat capable against undead) however, she's built for RP too.
Iozef? Hardly your standard adventuring Cleric - he's not carrying a sodding huge Mace and dressed in Chainmail. Hes a guy in robes with a staff? Good RP concept and good RP so far too.
I am not sure on Sergi and Valiards builds but I am pretty sure they are built for utility and not dungeon grinding combats.
Having said ALL this? I am LOVING this! Its meant to be Hard, with the capital H. Its Lovecraftian to be fighting up hill AND against timelines both known and unknown. The odds are stacked against the hero's... winning isn't beating the bad guys a lot of the time. Winning is SURVIVING.
So far this is fantastic. Depending on how round 5 plays out? I recommend we beat feet and get out... and I recommend that Valiard starts this round.
I am expecting this to go down in madness and horror and failure. Just as Lovecraft intended :)
Valiard rolled crappy and missed, and I rolled great and hit. That's all. The dice are not with you so far...
Did you make the required offerings?
Unoptimized characters are fine, but they have to be careful about tactics. So far, your characters are all over the map.
Mireza's spell worked by the way, and it cost Myre a round and a good spell to barely get rid of it, which is good.
Hang in there.
That said? We've shot our bolt.
Valiards sneak attack is gone, the Cleric has nothing to throw in there (that I know of... maybe there is a Hold Person up his sleeve) and the witches big offensive spell is gone... best she can do is hex him. Not sure if our Inquisitor has another bane up his sleeve and I need 2 rounds per Zombie.
the witches big offensive spell is gone... best she can do is hex him.
Worse than that, actually. Due to the hexes I chose, she can give him scars with no mechanical effect, make him take 1 point of Con damage, or cure moderate wounds him. All of which require a melee touch attack and thus not being on the other side of a herd of zombies from him.
The real issue is that we're going to need to rest, and from what we've learned IC, I'm assuming waiting until tomorrow is not a viable option; this seems to be a ticking-clock module where if we wait to recover our resources, at least half the town will be in ruins if we aren't all crushed in our beds. We've still got the asylum and some sort of horrible beast from the void which is getting stronger while we're getting weaker; at this rate, we're going to have used up all our resources long before we get to the actual BBEG. Fairly certain Myre's not the worst thing we're going to face today.
But, yeah, regarding tactics, spending several rounds shouting and beating the door down probably isn't the best way to ensure the bad guy's not ready for us. RP-wise, however, is the Crow going to learn to be willing to take the sneakier path of least resistance rather than battering himself against the front door in a righteous and aboveboard fashion? Announcing ourselves to every evil spellcaster we run across so they can get their buffs pre-cast and arrange their minions advantageously is probably not going to be a path to victory. ;)
In his defense, he did try to pick the door first...he just only tried one door before giving up. If we had tried the other door first, look how close to Myre we would have been.
I think that people have been doing a fine job playing their characters.
Aaaand. I don't expend a sneak attack. As soon as I am out of sight, I can hide and try again. Then right back in to the fray.
And he did expend his highest level spell on me, not on a fighter. I plan to hide, find a good vantage, perhaps climb up the wall or something, then do some ranged attacks on the muck lord....after I barricade this exit. He isn't getting away that easily.
If you can, why not try pushing the zombies into the pits? They are zombies, so their CMD can't be that great.
But, yeah, regarding tactics, spending several rounds shouting and beating the door down probably isn't the best way to ensure the bad guy's not ready for us. RP-wise, however, is the Crow going to learn to be willing to take the sneakier path of least resistance rather than battering himself against the front door in a righteous and aboveboard fashion? Announcing ourselves to every evil spellcaster we run across so they can get their buffs pre-cast and arrange their minions advantageously is probably not going to be a path to victory. ;)
Its all in the RP... Grigor CAN be a sneaky bastard but he's upset by the death of the Commander, he's upset about being dragged back into this all again and lastly he BADLY wants to crawl inside a bottle - he knows he just can't... not for now at least.
He did try to pick the lock... and the other door sort of eluded my attention all together. Had I thought to take 10 instead of trusting the dice I think we'd have been in... He's not all 'Halt in the Name of the LAW' and 'I'm watching you' - he's BEEN an investigator. He knows the score but he's not what he used to be and time is not on his side.
He's still also getting used to his new companions - we aren't exactly a well oiled team simply because we are the best that can be thrown together in the hope we can 'fix' this situation without regard to any other factor. Heck, Valiard can't feel free to pick locks in front of Grigor for fear of questions (at this point of the RP at any rate).
I'd like to think while my RP isn't optimal (like the character :D) my RP has hopefully been consistent with his background as written and consistent from his first post to the latest one.
But yeah, we'll get better at this... if we survive. I still think we need to do a runner but we'll see where we are at.
If you can, why not try pushing the zombies into the pits? They are zombies, so their CMD can't be that great.
I actually thought of that a few days back... and decided I didn't know how deep the pits are and if they aren't that deep, that I didn't the Zombies pulling me IN and grappling/slamming me in the crap down there.
One more round of bane, which Windle is saving for Myre. With perfect hindsight, I should have been using bane and arrows against the ghouls and saving Iozef the channels, because piercing weapons aren't exactly optimal vs. zombies. Windle also has precise strike for a little extra damage, which he hasn't been able to maneuver into using yet.
Also, if I may, there is a door now open on the side of the building...
As for the time pressure, there is one and it requires planning and using resources (all, not just character powers) in a careful way.
Character growth comes from the challenges they faces; their successes and their failures.
Great discussion!
Aaaand. I don't expend a sneak attack. As soon as I am out of sight, I can hide and try again. Then right back in to the fray.
And he did expend his highest level spell on me, not on a fighter. I plan to hide, find a good vantage, perhaps climb up the wall or something, then do some ranged attacks on the muck lord....after I barricade this exit. He isn't getting away that easily.
Don't forget, you're taking a -3 on every roll you make on top of the -2 from sickened if that condition's still active, including those Acrobatics checks you just made to avoid AoOs. Also, you're down almost half your hp, and I believe sneak attack dice are a level-dependent variable, which means you went from 3d6 to 1d6 sneak attack. Negative levels stink. :P
As far as non-character-power resources, Grigor has already nixed getting the Crows involved to help us cover the city. I don't know if Iozef and/or Windle could requisition any help from the temple or not. Apart from that, I'm not sure what resources we have access to. Mireza's only useful quasi-ally in Carrion Hill is already dead.
Remember, we have the luxury of making plans in character via message. If someone wants to coordinate tactics, we have the option of doing so without being overheard and tipping our hand.
Grigor HAD earlier nixed it... now? I think he's not above screaming at the Major he had better back him to the hilt or risk getting hung with his 'friends'.
I have 2 channels left. I can use 'em if y'all think it's absolutely necessary, but I hate to use one and only encompass 4 of them. That's a waste. I'd like to find a way to hit all of 'em if I can.
But as I said, I only have 2 left. We may need them for ourselves.
I believe sneak attack dice are a level-dependent variable, which means you went from 3d6 to 1d6 sneak attack.
From what I've been able to find, turns out that although the negative level description refers to level-dependent variables such as spellcasting, they're never actually defined except as in regard to spellcasting. So, RAW, it seems no one but spellcasters is affected by that particular clause. Still taking the -3 and loss of 15 hp, though.
But RAI, you lose the abilities regardless, or am I missing something?
I ... don't know, honestly. There's no description of what a "level-dependent variable" is that I can find except in relation to spellcasting. Is sneak attack progression a level-dependent variable? Is a bard's inspire courage bonus? Are channel dice?
Without an explicit definition, it's up to the DM to determine, as far as I can tell. I posed the question in the Ask James Jacobs thread, so we'll see if he gets around to answering it.
Answer from James Jacobs:
For each negative level a creature has, it takes a cumulative –1 penalty on all ability checks, attack rolls, combat maneuver checks, Combat Maneuver Defense, saving throws, and skill checks. In addition, the creature reduces its current and total hit points by 5 for each negative level it possesses. The creature is also treated as one level lower for the purpose of level-dependent variables (such as spellcasting) for each negative level possessed. Spellcasters do not lose any prepared spells or slots as a result of negative levels. If a creature's negative levels equal or exceed its total Hit Dice, it dies."Level-dependent variables" are defined in the book in regard to spellcasting (saving throws, duration, range, etc.), but what else counts as a "level-dependent variable?" Sneak attack progression? Inspire courage bonus? Channel dice? Anything?
To be specific, our 5th-level rogue just took 3 negative levels from enervation. Does his sneak attack damage drop from 3d6 to 1d6 until his levels return? The only specifics we can find in the rulebook refer to spellcating, but it seems odd that negative levels would affect casters to a greater degree than any other class.
The whole point of the revision to how level drain works in Pathifnder was to streamline it and to minimize the "Oh, you lost a level, so now you have to rebuild your entire character in the middle of combat... oh you got hit again, so start over!" element that the previous edition of the game caused.
As such, you should err on the side of simplicity.
The "level-dependant variables" more or less only talks about durations and areas and ranges and the like. It does NOT actually remove things you gain at higher levels, such as extra sneak attack dice. A rogue with 3 negative levels suffers a –3 on his sneak attacks–that's pretty much all that happens to that attack. The damage dice don't change.
And it's not that level drain affects casters to a greater degree than any other class at all... it's just that casters are more complicated. They're not making a lot of attacks and skill checks, after all—it's pretty easy to sum up a "take a penalty to all attack rolls and saves and skill checks equal to your negative levels" thing for classes like fighters and rogues who are all about attack rolls and skill checks. Those penalties are largely irrelevant to casters—if we didn't have negative levels reduce the caster level of a spellcaster... it'd actually result in a case where level drain affects non-casters to a greater degree. The way it is, it actually affects all classes pretty equally—they all take penalties to their focus—be that attacks, skills, caster level, or whatever.
Thanks! Ok, so Valiard keeps his 3d6.