89... posts... I was gone for ONE day, guys. Geez. Speaking of which, sorry for the absence. I had a mountain of homework to do and very little help with my small human for the day.
Kevin O'Rourke and Abalia (I haven't looked up your non-alias screen name yet), shall we set up a message to collaborate about the Kerenskys?
This is Abalia, or well mine, non-alias name. But yeah that sounds fine if you want to set that up!
It figures the Abadar man and the money-loving dwarf would go for the plains immediately. And since the Capital doesn't increase it's control DC, they're very attractive. More land = More money from buildings and whatnot. Like some sort of Blitzkrieg of a kingdom.
In character, Varden doesn't care. Out of character, I would build smack dab in the middle of that nest of rivers real world. Game wise, I actually agree with the priest and the dwarf it seems.
For me, i have come to associate marsh with bad things. Its hard to build on, not much clean water, etc. Roleplay wise I would probably pick that plains/forest area north of the river, just south of the little peninsula, but the hills would definitely be attractive. Metagame wise, The hills is by far the best. In the end, with a combination of everything i think hills works best for me.
When I first came here, this was all swamp. Everyone said I was daft to build a castle on a swamp, but I built in all the same, just to show them. It sank into the swamp. So I built a second one. That sank into the swamp. So I built a third. That burned down, fell over, then sank into the swamp. But the fourth one stayed up. And that's what you're going to get, Lad, the strongest castle in all of Varas.
I'm sorry but no, there is no way we're building our homes in a swamp! XD
I'm sorry but no, there is no way we're building our homes in a swamp! XD
That's basically what New Orleans is!
A swamp poses some unique problems though, and since we are close to the tropics disease would be a big issue, at least theoretically.
It figures the Abadar man and the money-loving dwarf would go for the plains immediately. And since the Capital doesn't increase it's control DC...
FYI settlements do increase your control DC by the number of districts they possess. Which at the start will be +1.
I'm surprised the money-loving dwarf doesn't like the mining town idea though! :)
I'm sorry but no, there is no way we're building our homes in a swamp! XDThat's basically what New Orleans is!
Yeah, and is flooded during a terrible storm! I rest my case! XD
It seems we're starting off in the hills, as the map has been updated. In character, my dwarf is perfectly fine with this slow and steady foundation. Out of character, I wanna put on my helmet and storm the land, yelling out, "Blitzkrieg!"
All the other settlements won't even know, building their economy up in hilly areas, having their three or four armies, thinking they're very secure. Then all of a sudden wild plainsmen come in and slaughter everything with 15 armies, take the city, and move on to the next.
That houserule of 1 consumption a month really helps larger armies, more than smaller ones.
I believe our little 50-man force consumes 4 BP per month.
I vaguely remember there being something said about the consumption rate of armies moving from 1/week to 1/month. But I could be wrong; I have battle on the brain.
I vaguely remember there being something said about the consumption rate of armies moving from 1/week to 1/month. But I could be wrong; I have battle on the brain.
I believe it was switching from 1/week to 4/month, for the sake of simplicity.
That's what it was! I just found it. So one army per 2 farms.
And so we don't die from starvation just by feeding the army.
Okay since Samuel has put his towards Loyalty, I shall put mine to Economy.
Also GM, since Abalia is no longer the Grand Diplomat my I redo her skills?
I don't really know how the kingdom building mechanics work yet, so I'll be spectating for a while rather than giving input.
Things happen on monthly turns, except exploration. Maybe a few other things. It's like playing Pathfinder Civilization, where you realize that Japan's research level is always way too high and they nuke all your cities.
And so we don't die from starvation just by feeding the army.
It is amusing that a fully developed district has a population of 9000 and requires 1 BP per month, but 50 soldiers requires 4 BP. :)
And so we don't die from starvation just by feeding the army.It is amusing that a fully developed district has a population of 9000 and requires 1 BP per month, but 50 soldiers requires 4 BP. :)
Them growing boys and all! Eating twice as much! >_<
Districts are somewhat autonomous. The merchants make their own money, the workers make their own wages, and people generally build and maintain of their own volition. It only costs a small amount to police the area. Plus it pays taxes.
On the other hand, all 50 of those soldiers require a salary paid by the government. Their supplies, training, housing, etc. are all provided at the government's expense. While policing a district might cost a little, taxes from the policed district can pay for that. Maintaining a military doesn't pay unless you have to quell an uprising, go to war, or conquer. In which case, you're creating even more expense in the short term.
So it does make sense.
Evin has a point. I figured it was all going to food, I didn't even think about anything else honestly.
Oh, believe me, I understand the principle! The BP we are spending is really only the cost to maintain the government, not the populace.
Still, that being said, a city of 9000 people probably has more than 50 government employees.
GM: I understand we will be able to build at an accelerated rate at the beginning. How will this work? Will we be considered to have a larger size than our actual size for a few turns? If so, how big?
Heads up, I have to travel for a memorial service today. I probably won't post after the morning post I'm about to do.
There will be no limit to the number of buildings and improvements you can build the first two months (except as otherwise limited by space and money).
The caveat to this is that you can't build upgraded forms of buildings...
Okay, that's great. But... guys:
FYI it is easy to go crazy and build things out of control and find yourself with no money. We should concentrate on building things with a low price tag right at the start.
We have 45 BP but will have to deal with 12 consumption in the first two turns. Minus another 2 BP for the first feast. So that's really only 31 BP, and we don't want to spend all the way to zero.
My suggestions:
Turn 1
Terrain Improvements:
Claim Hex 1 BP
Prepare town site 2 BP
Farm 4 BP -2 consumption
Fishery 4 BP -1 consumption (if we can claim a second hex on turn 2 then a second farm on turn 2 would be better)
COST: 11 BP
Turn 2
Terrain Improvements:
None
City Improvements:
Tenement 1 BP (+2 Unrest)
Shrine 8 BP (+1 LOY, -1 Unrest)
Barracks 6 BP (-1 Unrest)
COST: 15 BP
And maybe (if the fishery starts producing right away):
Mill 6 BP (+1 ECO, +1 STA) though this would leave us at 0 BP
GM: Will we be able to claim a second hex on the second turn?
Also, GM: I know a farm won't produce right away but how about fisheries?
Also, you guys have 60 BP
I thought we had 70 BP at the start but converted 25 BP of that to gold?
If I am wrong then that gives us some more wiggle room.
I'd be keen to spend the 1d4bp in the first month to send out a group to do the exploration side. Lets us identify threats and opportunities but yeah a few consumption reducing upgrades and minor items. I'd rather a house than a tenement seeing as we might have a smidge more cash than you realised.
I think a farm and fishery are a very good idea. Maybe help offset the cattle we put down for the feast. Give the cattle some to recover and only eat off of the fish and fields.
Plus, we're allowed to build a few more things each round correct? Can we not build more than one house at a time?
Hmm, then maybe we should build one tenement, then next turn build another while upgrading the first?
Hmm, then maybe we should build one tenement, then next turn build another while upgrading the first?
For the record building tenements is really good if you can also build things that offset the unrest that a tenement causes. Unrest can never fall below zero. So if you get the unrest down to zero then a tenement doesn't cause any problems and serves as a residential tile to connect to things.
The great thing is that later on if you do have unrest you can upgrade a tenement to a house for only 2 BP and reduce unrest by 1.
So your plan is not a bad one.
I PM'd Kurhat because converting 25 BP to gold seemed like an awful lot. He revised his decision after a clarified a couple things.
Okay, great!
I'd be keen to spend the 1d4bp in the first month to send out a group to do the exploration side.
Absolutely! This is what we would send our party of adventurers to deal with, yes?
We can also break up our 50-man army into two units of 25 each and send one of those to explore. That is probably a good idea for turn 1 at least.
Is there going to be a promotion edict to attract settlers?
If the addition building that we make each round reduce unrest by 1, we can keep it at one. Plus if I'm correct, doesn't the royal enforcer also have the ability to remove unrest by one?
Also maybe we should think about making a Monument? Something that, in away, marks this as our new home. It could even just be the local bell tower that we use to signal danger or such?
Plus if I'm correct, doesn't the royal enforcer also have the ability to remove unrest by one?
Unrest is managed in the Upkeep phase.
You will first make a Stability check (at the beginning of Upkeep). Success will reduce unrest by 1. So often you won't need the Enforcer's ability anyway. But you want to have 0 unrest at this point if possible, because if this roll would reduce unrest below zero, you instead get a bonus BP as income. Later in the game this 1 BP won't mean much but right now it will be quite handy.
After you've made that roll you can use the Royal Enforcer. But using the Royal Enforcer to reduce unrest is dangerous, because it can lead to permanent loyalty loss on a failed roll.
Then there's your Edict Phase, where the building happens, and your income phase. Then there are events. Sometimes events generate unrest also, and you have no way of reducing the unrest by building things (since from there you go straight to Upkeep again). Obviously you could build things later on.
So overall you want to have zero unrest going into the event phase.
Also maybe we should think about making a Monument?
Sure! We have more money than I thought.
BTW, if the holiday on Day 1 of our new calendar is "the Landfall Festival" then perhaps on day 61 (the start of month 3) we can have "Coronation Day" and the monument is revealed on that day? If we then switch to having 6 holidays per year then that fits the calendar since we would have them every two months.
Right, but if we have only 1 unrest from building then it's a lot easier for the Royal Enforcer no? Allowing us to keep it at 0?
However, if we keep to the round 2 of:
Tenement 1 BP (+2 Unrest)
Shrine 8 BP (+1 LOY, -1 Unrest)
Barracks 6 BP (-1 Unrest)
That would keep us at 0 with no roll.
As for the Coronation Day, that can only be held after all spots are assigned in character. Right now those we have are just doing what they know. Qazag is the one with the most military training so it makes sense to put him in the General role. We the players know that this is his place to be, but the characters are just learning that. Even if they may of had an idea at the beginning.
We could put off the barracks for later. Soldiers are used to living in tents. And I figure two months in would be a good time to form an official "Colonial Council."
So... my updated suggestions:
Our current Edicts seem to be:
Taxation: None (+0 ECO, +1 LOY)
Holidays: 1/year (+1 LOY, +1 Consumption)
Promotion: None (-1 STA, +0 Consumption)
We have 45 60 BP but will have to deal with 12 14 consumption in the first two turns. So that's really only 46 BP.
My suggestions:
Turn 1
Special:
Feast 2 BP (+1 LOY)
Terrain Improvements:
Claim Hex 1 BP
Prepare town site 2 BP
Farm 4 BP (-2 consumption)
Fishery 4 BP (-1 consumption)
Mine 6 BP (+1 ECO, +1 BP Income)
COST: 17 BP
Consumption: 7 BP
INCOME: 0 BP (If mines produce right away we get +1 income here)
TREASURY: 36 BP
Turn 2
Terrain Improvements:
Claim Hex 1 BP
Farm 4 BP (-2 consumption)
Fishery 4 BP (-1 consumption)
Mine 6 BP (+1 ECO, +1 BP Income)
City Improvements:
Tenement 1 BP (+2 Unrest)
Shrine 8 BP (+1 LOY, -1 Unrest)
Monument 6 BP (+1 LOY, -1 Unrest)
COST: 30 BP
Consumption: 5 BP
INCOME: 1 BP
TREASURY: 2 BP
This doesn't really give us any money to build much in turn 3 but most everything we built in turn 2 will pay off in income. Alternately we could hold off on the second mine and fishery, or maybe both mines.
For purely character reasons, I'm going to push for a library.
Varden: FYI a library is a really good low cost building, so we can build one fairly soon.
Piers are more expensive. At 16 BP we may not be able to afford one for a little bit. But ships at anchor can offload things with their longboats for a little while.
There's no "Lighthouse" per se but a Watchtower on the coast would probably also be a lighthouse.
Yes, but I had to phrase in character things in character.
Also, for purposes, I am not going to officially push for a spymaster position. For all Varden cares, you could promote an Npc to the "official spymaster position" if your characters feel the need to create such a thing. I am working with our gracious DM to work behind the scenes and hopefully never actually be thought of as anything more than the grumpy but helpful sage and keeper of esoteric lore.
When Evin grows up a little and stops being such a little s@*+, I expect that he will come to Varden for help and information in his eventual duties of keeping the colony safe. Unfortunately, I'll have to come up with a way for him to get that idea.
Once the taxation starts on the 3rd turn, I suggest we build a bank. That's +4 economy for 28 BP and has no building requirements needed. Then the next biggest building I can see that's reasonably priced is the mint, at +3 economy, Loyalty +3, Stability +1; Fame +1. 1 lot and 30 BP. Also no building requirements. If we build a mint, we can have normal taxation levels with a +1 loyalty! Tax the peasants and make them like it. That'll put our first, and subsequent taxes with a mint alone at +5 economy, with a +1 Loyalty, +3 stability, +1 fame bonus.
Hills also require a turn to prepare, so we can claim one on turn 2, but can't build anything there until turn 3. We'd have to wait on the farm, fishery, and mine on our second claimed hex.
While building a shrine and monument would be a good idea, could we not just build a city wall for only 2 BP instead of shrine and monument for 14? Sorry if this is a bad idea, i am rather new to the kingdom building rules.