Hmm’s True Dragons of Absalom (Inactive)

Game Master Hmm

So... I know Zin is gone this weekend, and gameplay is hinging on what Engashez does here. So this seems a good time to ask questions, no matter how dumb.

Here’s one of mine. What have you learned so far? Is there anything that has been done here that you would want to steal?

Also:

Ask me questions! Please, for the love of Shelyn, ask me questions!

One thing I have already borrowed from this is using the red text box as a more guidelines of what to narrate to the players. I still make sure to say what needs to be said but try and twist it to fit into PbP forum use. Being more descriptive in my narrative helps me to paint a picture in my mind that I hope my players can see as well.

I have not used the favorite option very much but am thinking I will begin using it more for multiple things including the list function.

My question for you is how often do you find yourself deleting what you have written before you submit your GM post to move the party along because you have felt it wasn't good enough?

The reason I ask is because I find myself deleting more often than not and spending more time rewriting.

I liked the conversation about changing the text box. This is something that sometimes gets over looked, and is a free hook to engage your players. Granted this is something I was already doing, but it is still something that needs more attention. Cut and paste is a great tool.. but its not the only tool that should be used for GMing.

Pepper: I rewrite a lot. I will write a post out, decide I don't like the way something is phrased, and then my rewrite means I have to change something else.. it can be a tiresome ordeal. What I do to mitigate some of this is I will keep a word document open and read the posts that I am responding to several times and take notes. Phrases that pop into my head or things that I need to address. If there is anything I need to look up, I can do so without losing my train of thought. Then I will write out the post and cut/paste over to my Paizo window.

I do copy and paste, but I always edit lightly, and sometimes replace whole chunks with other things. I find that starting out with copy/paste helps me not leave out any important facts.

Forgot my Kobold mask last timed

I copy and paste a bit. I end up using Google Docs as I tend to be everywhere and many times without a full fledged computer in front of me.

I end up GMing and playing from my phone more often than not as well.

Converting the Pregens to BB code with a phone is a pain lol

I post from mobile all the time — though it is an iPad with a bluetooth keyboard — so google docs are my friends. Do I rewrite? Yes, all the time.

One thing that I tried to do is also show stuff in action. So you had a very active Hats tossing hats in on his prisoner and shoving hats on to party members. I like to break up blocks of text with dialogue and bits of wild action!

Poblano, I hate BB Code without a bluetooth keyboard. It is such a pain to do PBP on the phone!

Oh my mistake, I've got a metamagic rod of REACH not extend. That sounds much more useful hehe.

As much as Vanarog wouldn't let others share in his limelight, I will restrain him until others can respond!

Another question for all of you:

What do you see as the role of the GM in Play-by-Post? What special duties do we have that may be missing in face-to-face games?

BB Code
This is why I don't play much from my mobile devices. Formatting with a touchscreen keyboard is a nightmare. When Paizo considers upgrades to the message boards, better formatting tools would be a godsend for mobile gaming.

GM's Role
I think one of the major differences for the GM in PbP is keeping the game moving. In person, that's not too much of a challenge. If the player's aren't getting something in the game, it's easy to see through their body language and general table confusion, you can step in and nudge them the right way. In PbP, you don't have those in-person cues, so what seems to happen more often is they just drift away. So being able to recognize when the table has hit a roadblock, and find a way to nudge the players around that, is key to online play, I think.

Mobile gaming for me was easier with BB Codes when Wayfinder Worked. But since the big site crash a month or so ago I cannot get logged into the app now. Seems like it has lost all hope.

The GMs role in PbP when compared to keeping your players entertained more. Giving them something that makes them want to check back daily to see what new Hijinx has happened and maybe even want to add to it.

I also feel that as a Player it is my duty to help my GMs out by giving them a worthwhile post as well.

I'm Thinking GM Karma Points the more I try and surpass what i have written previously can help me to be a better GM later.

And now for a moment of high drama!

I'm back from my trip and rested up! Sorry for not getting a post in during then, I never got sat down in front of a computer until yesterday and I was pretty tired yesterday! But all of the busy important things should be done, so I can get back to posting regularly!

As for the role of a GM in PBP, I think a lot of what people have said here is true, being the one who moves the game along, or makes it interesting is important, but I also think a PBP GM needs to also set a good example and facilitator of roleplay. This is important for a face to face game, but I think it's even more so here, as the format allows for lots of interaction and development than you might find in a game at a table. If the GM gives a good chances and examples it is very helpful for spurring the players into engaging with at least the NPC's if not other players.

I also feel that as a Player it is my duty to help my GMs out by giving them a worthwhile post as well.

All of what's been said is very true, but I personally haven't yet stepped into the PbP GM world, so I find a personal connection to what Pepper said. There is a lot on the plate as a GM, and as players we bear a responsibility to make things easier for them however we can. Putting up thoughtful posts, posts that help drive the game forward, and posts that help spur RP between NPCs and PCs alike.

I can't imagine anything more deflating as a GM than putting in the effort to run a game to be greeted by a bunch of players that consistently put in almost no 'work' with what I mentioned above.

Jumping in here:

Don't feel pressure to make each post professionally publishable. There are a handful of times when it really is okay to be super succinct:

1. The game can't progress without your post, but you're too busy. Know your group; if they want progress, a short post now is better than an artful post later.

2. When you're with a group you're extremely comfortable with. Often times if you talk outside the game, or just need a bit of info, it can be fine to make something quick.

I try to give at least one deep, quality post a day to games I GM, and then feel no guilt about the other posts being very short, just to answer player questions and keep things moving.

Finally peeking in a bit from the other True Dragons table - hi! For what it's worth, here's my thoughts on some of the stuff that's already been discussed/is being discussed:

If someone amuses me in anyway at all, I favorite them.

This is basically what I do and is in fact a habit I picked up very early on from Hmm in the Mummy's Mask game we share. If it's funny, I favorite. If it's moving or thought-provoking, I favorite. If it's useful, I favorite.

One thing I have already borrowed from this is using the red text box as a more guidelines of what to narrate to the players. I still make sure to say what needs to be said but try and twist it to fit into PbP forum use. Being more descriptive in my narrative helps me to paint a picture in my mind that I hope my players can see as well.

The setup and what the group has already asked about or is doing tends to determine how much I'll rephrase or alter box text. Sometimes I *do* just copy it when I feel that there's not much I can do to improve on it and other times I might rephrase certain parts. It can be fun to put your own 'spin' on such things but I also wouldn't feel bad about copying it verbatim - after all, the box text is in the scenario for a reason and in my experience most GMs do read the box text directly when playing F2F.

My question for you is how often do you find yourself deleting what you have written before you submit your GM post to move the party along because you have felt it wasn't good enough?

I write and rewrite and edit quite a bit (if I have the time) before making a GM post. Most of the time my edits are less a matter of 'Oh man this post is crap' and more 'Oh man, I almost forgot to include <X> or acknowledge <Y>!' But sometimes I make edits because I realize that my original phrasing was clunky or I might come up with a more interesting or engaging way to present something.

What do you see as the role of the GM in Play-by-Post? What special duties do we have that may be missing in face-to-face games?

Everyone's largely already summed up my own feelings on this one. I feel that it's my duty as GM to keep things moving but also to allow players to have fun with the setting and stretch their wings a bit as well. That sort of segues into this great point made by Sedoriku:

As for the role of a GM in PBP, I think a lot of what people have said here is true, being the one who moves the game along, or makes it interesting is important, but I also think a PBP GM needs to also set a good example and facilitator of roleplay. This is important for a face to face game, but I think it's even more so here, as the format allows for lots of interaction and development than you might find in a game at a table. If the GM gives a good chances and examples it is very helpful for spurring the players into engaging with at least the NPC's if not other players.

I try really, really hard to give people chances to interact with the setting and with the NPCs and in order to do that I think it's really important to try and respond to even the littlest things that the PCs do - even if it's something outside the scope of the scenario or is something that won't lead to anything 'important'. I feel that by acknowledging the things the players do you make them more likely to continue engaging in the game and in bigger ways. Feeling like you're being ignored is one of the worst things ever and it would make me inclined to mentally check out of a game very quickly. This sort of thing also helps because I think it shows that the GM is involved and having fun in the game and people tend to feed off of each other's enthusiasm (or lack thereof) - I know I certainly do!

On a humorous note related to the game, if any of you have Runscars #1 comic or can borrow it for a few minutes, you might want to reread the encounter right near the center of the comic.

Crazy Wednesday. It'll be a while before I can get out a post. Sorry!

Hmm

Alright, it’ll be Friday morning when I update you. My nutty Wednesday rolled into a nutty Thursday with a whole bunch of deadlines coming in at my paying job. Sheesh. They wanted me to actually, you know, work.

So... This is supposed to be a GM Mentoring Game, so let’s talk about those times when you get crunched or wind up too brain dead to compose anything. How do you handle those?

For me, I think that it’s important to let your players know, so they don’t wonder what happened with you. But I’d like to hear your thoughts and ideas too. Oh and questions! More questions!

Hmm

LIFTING UP THE CURTAIN A BIT

So... As a GM, you have to know that player choices make a huge difference to how scenarios go. Engashez here had a very interesting dilemma that the scenario presents to her that has consequences down the road.

On the one hand, she’s got ONE really awesome magic item that the scenario has given her. It’s a Hat of Disguise, and she knows that there are human invaders in the Sewer Dragons lands. For a bard character with a really nice bluff, the plot possibilities that arise from hanging on to that hat are amazing.

On the other hand, she’s got a very important and somewhat eccentric Otugh Ally to appease — Hats. Hats wants his tribute, and is trying to get it from her. He won’t steal the hat outright, but he’ll happily forget to give it back. In order to highlight this issue, I played up Hats’s obsession with the ‘hattiest hat’ and added the makeshift puppet show* and side conversations with Awesome Cowl and Strident Commodore, his two favorite hats.

Back to the dilemma!

What to do? Skyrahk and Engashez came up with a lovely solution to this dilemma, and if this were a normal game, I would let them bask in it. Players want to be clever, and proud of their solutions. I would never tell them what happens if the hat is freely given as tribute. Let the players be heroes, no matter what path they take! Hearing about alternate paths will detract from their victory. Don’t do it!

However, in a GM Mentorship Game, I think it’s important to lift the curtain and show the path not taken.

It’s been an interesting turning point here! Aside to Engashez.... When I played the kobold bard, I totally kept the hat of disguise. No way was that overgrown mutant otugh taking it from me!

And we did fine in the adventure!

Looking forward to seeing what happens next for all of you,
Hmm

___
*I think that when I need to GM this live, I will totally need to make sock puppets for Awesome Cowl and Strident Commodore.

Thanks for putting in the other fork in the road for us to see. That brings up a question on my end:

How much information is too much to push or educate the PCs on what will happen if they make decision A vs B?

Without looking back, I never got the impression Hats would come along with us if he was allowed to keep the new 'tribute'. Only that it was required to speak with the prisoner, and then to avoid an all out desertion or fight. Maybe I didn't read it carefully enough or forgot a key piece of info. But how much of that info do you share with the PCs so they can make a more informed decision. A otugh meat shield seems pretty nice, especially as a bunch of small kobolds (and even more as a sorcerer personally!)

PS, you definitely should make those sock puppets.

Wow; thanks for sharing that.

As a player, I was beginning to get concerned that I was spending too much time on something that wasn't essential to our main quest. Here we're supposed to be learning plot details from Dreng, and I'm arguing with an otyugh about a hat.

(Yes, that's a thing I can now say I've done. I've argued with an otyugh about a hat.)

In no way did I suspect that the scenario might want me to give away the most valuable item on my character sheet. When a pregen carries an item like that, your only assumption is that it will be necessary somewhere down the line.

But, it's clear to see that the trade-off is valuable. An otyugh ally is formidable indeed, and the social encounters could likely be completed through other strategies than disguise. Without some kind of hint, though, I find it hard to imagine that someone would give it away. I wonder what percentage of runs end up earning Hats' assistance?

It’s a really good question. As a GM, I tried not to tip my hand too much other than noting how much Hats loves tribute and considers that a prerequisite to being an ally.

“Destroy my HATS!?! I am nice ally to Sewer Dragons! You bring me tribute, I protect clan! BUT I NOT PROTECT CLAN OF DRAGONS THAT MIGHT HURT HATS’ HATS!”

I did do my best to try to pry that hat from Engashez though! The sniffling without a nose bit was particularly manipulative as a GM. (I’m quite proud of it, actually.)

If she had wavered more, I considered having Hats offer the protection as an inducement or bribe, but Zin’s Engashez was as firm as my own. There was no prying that hat away!

In this case, I think that the two paths have some balance here. The ‘hattiest hat’ is useful, but so is the eccentric otugh. When the paths are not as well balanced, I try harder as a GM to make the one most beneficial to the players to be an attractive choice.

Interestingly enough, we should be seeing the ramifications of the road not taken in Dungeon Master S’s game. Ladile’s Engashez has a generous spirit, so Hats will be accompanying that group for part of their adventure!

Hmm

ANOTHER GM TOPIC: PLAYER - GM TRUST

As a player, I was beginning to get concerned that I was spending too much time on something that wasn't essential to our main quest. Here we're supposed to be learning plot details from Dreng, and I'm arguing with an otyugh about a hat.

Ooh, this brings up another conversation — Actual pacing, perceived pacing, and the trust between Players and GMs.

The whole Hats - Engashez conversation is every bit as critical to plot as the mission briefing from Drandle Dreng, but it looks to the players like a flighty little side conflict.

Because this is a Five Star reward special (only allowed to me because of the VL star bump) it is generally only going to be run by the most experienced GMs in PFS. So there is some hope that the players are going to trust that you as a GM are not wasting their time here with this bit.

I tried to mitigate potential player impatience by really bringing out Hat’s eccentricities with his beloved headwear and making sure that you were all entertained, while continuing to dole out mission briefing bits from Dreng. But I know that I was heavily relying on our unspoken social contract — you trust me, I give you a good game where even some of the perceived tangents are fun.

★ --- ★ --- ★ --- ★

So here’s my next question for all of you: how do you establish that GM-Player trust?

What builds it? What erodes it?

Looking forward to seeing your thoughts and theories,
Hmm

Poblano begins to cast Wall of text

Roll your will Saves

When real life kits me like a freight train I believe the best policy, in general, is honesty and communication with everyone. When it comes to it I will make a post to at least keep my players in the know. Such as Wednesday I had a sick child she will be 1 on Monday!!! OMG who needed me. Rather than blow off posting I still took a moment to make a little post to my table letting them know the situation and also giving a time when I plan to post again.

Now seeing how you wrote the protection speech bubble I can see that the inflection was there but I did not notice as I was reading rather than 'listening' to the words. I read the statement out loud and was shocked to hear it when I said it.

The Sock puppets would be amazing! I would love to see how they turn out.

In no way did I suspect that the scenario might want me to give away the most valuable item on my character sheet. When a pregen carries an item like that, your only assumption is that it will be necessary somewhere down the line.

I felt the same way when it comes to pregens before this game. But now I see that Paizo and the contributors might build the Pregens a certain way for just these situations.

Because this is a Five Star reward special (only allowed to me because of the VL star bump) it is generally only going to be run by the most experienced GMs in PFS. So there is some hope that the players are going to trust that you as a GM are not wasting their time here with this bit.

This is a very valid point I never thought about.

So here’s my next question for all of you: how do you establish that GM-Player trust?

What builds it? What erodes it?

First and foremost to build trust you should setup an expectation. Not to sound contractual here but when both persons involved in a mutual team effort, responsibility must be clarified and quantified.

Breaking that trust and understanding can easily happen if you do follow through, even if you have a hang up such as a sick child Cough Cough letting people know what is going on with you can build the GM-Player Trust more because you are letting someone know a personal thing about you as well instead of ignoring.

Sick kid brownie points work too :p

Continuing to uphold your own expectations can further build.

Also involving your players by noting a few things about there character such as with my A case of missing persons one of my players back story is the drive to create a union for the Pathfinders. So they can get a fair deal on many of the expenses incurred while "Exploring, reporting and cooperating."

If you're still building trust with your players, then sometimes it's possible to post something like 'I know this is weird, but trust me guys, it will all make sense later' in the discussion thread.

Hum...I think GM-Player trust comes from a lot of different things, both big and small. A big one is communication of course and has already been mentioned - letting people know about upcoming absences, checking in really quick if something is wrong, etc. Good communication also means a willingness to actually listen to your players (or GM) with an open mind when things like discussions about rules or what's appropriate at the table come up.

I think another thing that can help build some trust is if you've already built a reputation as being a good player. It's amazing just how much goodwill a person can garner with others by posting on a halfway consistent basis, doing their best to RP and participate in the game, and being a fun and cheery presence. I'm more likely to try and jump in on a game when I recognize the GM as being someone that I've had good interactions with in the past as a player.

What do you see as the role of the GM in Play-by-Post? What special duties do we have that may be missing in face-to-face games?

I think that due to the medium, we have a greater duty to accuracy. In a f2f game and under a time crunch, a lot can be hand waved or "I Think"ed, but since we have the luxury of time in our posting, we need to be precise with the rules.
I also think that we have more of a story teller mode that we need to bring to liven up the words on the screen. I cannot play ambient music or make creepy in character voices during PbP, so I have to resort to youtube links, interesting pictures on the maps, and more involved descriptions to bring the ambiance of the fantasy to my players and to liven up the game.
You may also find yourself rolling things for your characters and giving nudges or removing extraneous options for the sake of expediency. For instance.. two doors on a hall, and one of them is an empty store room. In F2F, I would let the table do their thing. Its just a matter of a couple of seconds to take care of it. In PbP, I may have the store room door open so as not to waste a day of posting just for them to see an empty room.

Our role here is to tell a story and to make it as involved and immersive as we can, but to still keep the story on track and moving. To find a balance between the story and the characters that everyone can live with.

So... This is supposed to be a GM Mentoring Game, so let’s talk about those times when you get crunched or wind up too brain dead to compose anything. How do you handle those?
So here’s my next question for all of you: how do you establish that GM-Player trust?

I think that this goes hand in hand. Trust is built through experience. I try to pop in and say "hey.. this is going on" and give a timeframe. I also try to give a heads up if I know something is going on in the future.. for instance my wife has a lot of health problems that precipitate trips across the state for surgeries and doctor visits. I will give a heads up a few days in advance that my posting may be erratic, and give a deadline for when things will return to normal.

The trust is built up by offering quality games and by doing what you say when you say you are going to do them. As L.L. points out right above me.. it is built along with your reputation. If you are known as a good poster with great RP and for holding certain standards, then the players will trust that is what you will deliver as both a player and as a GM. If you are known for getting side tracked then players will ignore the bait of alternative choices in favor of driving the story and getting it over with.

How much information is too much to push or educate the PCs on what will happen if they make decision A vs B?
This is a slippery slope and it depends entirely on circumstantial context. If its the beginning of the scenario briefing and the party looks like they are making decisions that are going to harm the outcome, perhaps the VC can make a few choice comments to steer the team back on track.
In the case of Hats.. GM Hmm did an amazing job of making it clear that the creature wanted the hat, and leaving the choice up to us. She tried sympathy and aggression both. However, even I missed the line about tribute. Knowing both sides of the coin now, perhaps I would have included a bit more of a hint.. but who knows.

Ooh, great discussion so far!!!

In the case of Hats.. GM Hmm did an amazing job of making it clear that the creature wanted the hat, and leaving the choice up to us. She tried sympathy and aggression both. However, even I missed the line about tribute. Knowing both sides of the coin now, perhaps I would have included a bit more of a hint.. but who knows.

Let me also note that I could have easily included in all of Hat’s tactics outright wheedling. I could have had Hats come up to Engashez and say:

The many eyes of Hats look longingly at the hattiest hat. “Dragons want to go after foes in tunnels? Perhaps Hats could help... if Hats get tribute!”

Not surprisingly, the puppet chorus agrees with hats. Strident Commodore harrumphs, “Do they not know that Generals deserve compensation?”

“Brave, brave hats could protect squishy dragons in sewers?”Awesom Caul squeaks hopefully.

This would have given the whole group a sense of the trade-off. Ultimately, I did not, because:

A) Engashez had come up with an amazing solution to her dilemma. By the point that she was cleaning Hats’s collection, we were at what I felt to be the story point of no return. If you plan as a GM to push this, make Hat’s bribe come earlier before Engashez has a chance to offer up a solution.

B) No chronicle boons were at stake.

C) The Group is at full strength. What do I mean by full strength? I mean that we have six wily and competent players that I trust. Things that would change this equation up for me:

B) No chronicle boons were at stake.

This is a point that I wanted to touch on earlier, but forgot. After peeking behind the curtain and seeing what was at stake, I'm very happy about the way that this worked out. If, however, I'd received a chronicle and a boon had been crossed out because I didn't give up the hattiest hat, I would have been a little sore.

When it comes to Chronicle boons, I think it's important for the GM to push those hints pretty hard. If a player ignores good hints and doesn't earn the boon, that's one thing. If the player can't see how they could have known, that's entirely different.

(Aside, but slightly related... I think it's really important when advertising a scenario to point out if there is specific Faction-related content. I've played a scenario before and halfway through realized I should have brought an entirely different PC, but now I'll never be able to earn that Faction content unless I use a replay.)

Gm Pushing about chronicle related stuff is definitely a must. This to can bring about positive GM/Player trust.

For example here is what I wrote for my A case of Missing Persons game.

Every game I run both f2f and PbP I inform my players before the game starts if it has a faction associated with it because there is nothing worse than you finding out you should have played a different character.

GM consistency can also be a big factor in player trust, I think. I have noticed that when a GM seems to go for a day or two making every judgement call in the favor of players and then for a few days making every call against them, the players are left not knowing what to expect, and can't trust the GM to be reasonable and fair. They are left some combination of guilty for times they got benefits they shouldn't, angry over times they were denied things they should have, and confused about which to expect in the future.

GM Hmm.. You bring up some great points about when to push and why, as well as GM fiat in decision making.

Redelia also brings this up from a different angle, and both are very valid points.

When making table rulings, there are a few things that I try to do in my games:
1) Be timely in your responses. Often times, your decision is going to impact actions and posts for the entire combat round or even the entire fight. Do not spend days dithering over this or that.. Do your research and then make your ruling and move on, for good or ill.

2) Do your research. Look at both sides of the coin, and go with what feels right and is in the best interest of the game. Don't hesitate to reach out to fellow GM's and throw them a basic synopsis and get their opinion. What do the message boards say? It is doubtful that you are the only one that has ever faced the situation, and there is good information out there in the advice and the rules threads.

3) Something that I do on corner cases or where the ruling goes against the player is I try to justify my ruling. Link in excerpts from the rule books or discussion threads, and explain your reasoning. I have found that this serves two purposes: It keeps your decision making transparent so that no one can say "You just wanted to kill me", and it provides an opportunity for discussion and learning on both sides of the screen.
Do this in the discussion thread so that it does not clog up gameplay, and encourage opinions from the players. Most of the time, there is going to be at least one other GM sitting at your table as a player, and they may have insight that you would find useful.

Sorry guys, I'm not going to be able to post tonight. I'm just getting over a bad cold, and I've got a headache.

Hope you feel better soon!

Its that time of year, its making its way through our house too. Hopefully I can keep it at bay with a stick or maybe an old slipper.

The astute among you will have noticed that there is a small change to SLIDE TWO of the slide show. I am including an overview map, complete with the numbered sections. Why am I doing this, when I would never do this in real life? Because True Dragons is going to be a reverse dungeon. The party is going to be the ones ambushing and setting all the traps, and I realized that having those numbers visible would give all of you a way of discussing each area and where you will lay your devious traps.

In person, parties can just point to where in the dungeon they are messing around. Here in PBP, I am opening up another means of communication. Dungeon crawl scenarios (even reverse dungeon crawl scenarios) can be challenging to GM in PBP. One thing that helps makes this one more doable is that the dungeon is fairly linear with few decision points for the players.

And here is Dungeon Master S's comments on Dungeon Crawls:

Ah the DUNGEON CRAWL The subject of many discussions, and few conclusions. First, full disclosure, I love them. I started playing D&D in the late 80s. The game was very different then, and one of the jobs assigned to a player was mapping. the player literally was expected to draw the map. The player covering the thief job had to balance progress with searching for traps, and every few minutes there was a wandering monster roll....

The game has changed a lot. The game in general has largely left that aspect behind, but it's still clearly there (The Shattered Star AP is a solid return to it.) But on PbP even the smoothest dungeon crawl can become a slog. Here are my first 3 pieces of advice on running them:

1. If it's going to be a long one (book 5 of Curse of the Crimson Throne is a MASSIVE dungeon crawl), then set up a "door protocol" and leave it up top as a "quickpost" so anyone can do it and you don't waste time waiting for everyone to roll.
2. Take note of anyone with Trap Spotter or a Perception check so high that taking 10 produces success most of the time.
3. Empty rooms shouldn't be skipped, but don't be shy about being clear when a room has given up all it can. That being said, if there's block of the same type of empty room, I'll just give it away in the name of game momentum.
4. Whoever opens the door in a post, takes responsibility for the map. So when a fireball trap goes off, the minis are actually in the place they are currently in.

Are there any questions? Comments? Talk with me, folks!

Hmm

I love dungeon crawls, as player and GM, and I have found that good setup makes it go much more smoothly. I roll perception for every player each time they enter a new room, and also use that roll to look for traps before entering. I ask for several different marching orders, based on how wide the corridor is. I don't wait for every player to post in terms of which direction.

Part of why I can do this is that the players trust me. They trust me to roll perception for them at reasonable times, not to just walk them into a trap. They trust me to provide any information they really need when they walk into a room. They trust me to catch any misunderstandings about the room early on.

I also feel like it's ok once or twice during a long dungeon crawl to say something like 'hey, guys, let's go west first, that will make the game flow much better.' They don't have to do as I suggest, but they seem to usually follow the suggestion.

I am normally not this Evil but I felt with the Characters Background he would do this. I hope you dont mind i put a few 'bodies' on the map along with where I intended the Bomb to center.

So a question per the rules for Bombtrap it shows that I can just set the Bomb Trap with no roll required as the DC is set by my Bombs normal DC 15. Is this correct? If not i will make the Craft Trap roll

I don’t mind. I am just courious for your devious plan to get the bodies out... You are also laying a few traps down early, which I am okay with but don’t go nuts yet. Also... Please mark your traps on the map somehow. You can color code them as to type, or record them in some other way. We are NOT at the main trap making section, but I don’t want to curb your early enthusiasm here!

I will accept a take ten in this section if you think your skill is high enough.

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So, back to mentoring and theories. We were talking about GM pushes, and I realize that I really should talk another philosophy of GMing that contradicts it.

There are GMs — many of whom I respect — who believe that one should never coddle players. My friend AJ has repeatedly told me, “Let them fail. It’s a great learning experience.” I’ve also been told to never underestimate my players and their ingenuity when they are challenged.

So here we have two different philosophies at work, and both are really valid ways to play. The problems come when players and GMs have different expectations of the relationship. Is it going to be hardball, where the GM throws one thing after another at the players and challenges them every step of the way? Is it going to be more of a collaboration? Can you be hardball and collaborative?

PbP is a different beast than in person play. As a GM, I like to leave more bread crumbs for my players and give them every opportunity for success, but I still want their choices to be their own. As a GM, I often start my scenario prep by looking at the success conditions, so that I have an idea of what my party might need to achieve. Than I run through the scenario, underlining the clues that my party might need to achieve that success, and make sure that I don’t forget them! I like providing subtle reminders in to help the party keep track over the weeks that a scenario might take.

But you also don’t want to railroad your players... Or rob them of a chance to overcome obstacles and be heroes. Where do you find the balance?

More things to cogitate on.

Tomorrow, tell me where we are going, and I will continue our lovely sewer tour!

A couple of thoughts.

In PFS, there's more at stake than in general gameplay. Players have a PC that they've invested all this time in through an official record-keeping system. They earn Chronicles, that contain various boons and/or equipment. Their success or failure means more than it might in a casual table-top run of an AP. (Even though that might garner as much attention and dedicated roleplay as any PFS gameplay.)

This isn't to say that PFS players need to be coddled, but I think the GM needs to really make sure that if the players fail to find a clue or meet a success condition, it's because the *players* failed to find the clue.

PbP amplifies the difficulty here. When you play a scenario over a matter of hours, sitting around a tabletop, it's not unreasonable to expect that you remember details (clues) that were dropped a couple of hours ago. In PbP, those details were dropped *weeks* ago. It might take a forum search to remember that critical little bit that you need to use now, weeks later.

Again, I think this calls for a little bit more GM attention to make sure that the players are well cared for. I don't want to be coddled. I'm currently playing a different game during which we, the PCs, definitely didn't put some clues together. The GM--a GM I've played with before and really respect--basically hand-waved the solution and gave it to us. While I'm happy that the story progressed, and we certainly won't miss anything on the Chronicle as such, my heart dropped a bit when I realized that we got something we didn't quite earn.

I'm currently playing in an extended game (6 scenarios strung together) with an excellent GM. A recent post illustrates a great way to develop trust between the players and GM. In this post he uses OOC text to kind of talk us through his thought process as he applies the rules to an unexpected player strategy.

I thought this was worth highlighting for our current discussion.

I had a little bit of VC stuff drop into my lap today. If I don’t update today, I will catch you in the morning.

Hmm

My apologies.. I have been violently ill the last few days. I am thankfully on the upswing, but this has been no joke!

Kicking Forward Stalling Games

I never thought that in a GM Mentoring Game, I would be talking about my own game starting to stall! But with Venture planning in the background, I have been a bit more of a distracted GM than usual in this holiday season, and it is showing. When the GM becomes erratic in posting, often so do players. We’re also seeing others dealing with holiday distractions and sick family members, and so we’re starting to have issues stalling.

It does not help that we’re also going through a dungeon crawl, and it has been rather uneventful until now. My plan is to move you through to rooms until you encounter things, so that we’re not pausing over long in any one area.

I debated just throwing you into combat here and rolling initiative. Often times, that works best with dungeon crawls. Roll through the standard procedure for entering new spaces, then trigger the combat! It’s a great way to restart a game that has started stalling. But... I also want to see what strategies you might activate here. So I am taking a risk here.

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What do you all want as your standard room entering procedure?

Stealth and Perception from the lead people? And whom do you want those lead people to be from now on? Normally Fazgyn might be in the lead, but with the player ill, having Pethgun poking forward might not be a bad interim choice.

Oh, and fair warning. I will be rolling you into combat tomorrow afternoon if now alternative plan emerges. That way you know when we’ll move forward with the plot!

I think your suggestion to have Pethjun fill in as the lead. I might suggest as a entering procedure is keep going straight forward.

I could follow in behind Pethjun for trap finding.

So Poblano, your procedure is:

1) keep going forward
2) stealth
3) perception?

With Pethjun and Athrax in the lead until Fazgyn’s player recovers?

Do I hear a second for this plan?

That sounds about right.