End Of Discussions: An epic fight between martials and casters

Game Master ElMustacho

Stop arguing about power difference between classes and prove it in this arena!


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Happy Christmas to everybody!


1 person marked this as a favorite.

And happy holidays too. After all, what better time is there to plot desperate battles to the death?


All we need to start is Gobo Horde with his Alex Armstrong (caster).
Also, the caster team may bring a companion.


We may bring a companion means they gained one through a feat, not a class feature, so that it counts as an additional player? I'm just checking I understand the rules. What are our options if I don't want to change my build for a leadership type feat?


My understanding is that each character can have one companion, and everything is considered equally - animal companions, eidolons, creatures summoned during the preparation time, whatever. Leadership and similar features are definitely not PFS-legal.

Oh, and a quick question: Do non-combatant familiars count against this limit, if they're kept in a familiar satchel and used solely for the bonuses they provide?


Goddity wrote:
We may bring a companion means they gained one through a feat, not a class feature, so that it counts as an additional player? I'm just checking I understand the rules. What are our options if I don't want to change my build for a leadership type feat?

Yes.

Scroll of Summon *stuff* I think. Familiar bond or Animal Ally are also options. But anything, if legal, is allowed.

Avoron wrote:

My understanding is that each character can have one companion, and everything is considered equally - animal companions, eidolons, creatures summoned during the preparation time, whatever. Leadership and similar features are definitely not PFS-legal.

Oh, and a quick question: Do non-combatant familiars count against this limit, if they're kept in a familiar satchel and used solely for the bonuses they provide?

No. They will be with you, but they cannot act, cannot be targeted by effects, and are eliminated when the master is eliminated.


I'll PM Gobo, and might make a few small changes to my equipment and prep then.


I guess he didn't answered.


He hasn't yet. Should we consider finding someone else if he doesn't show up in a few more days?


We have a lot of people unsuccessfully arguing about Caster/Martial disparity on the "Seriously now, how do you fix martial / caster disparity and still have the same game?" thread. Perhaps we can find someone there.


Alternatively, Goddity and I could just have a quick battle now. We're all here and we're all ready.

Gobo Horde hasn't shown up and we've already seen Terylinlara in action. And if either of them would like, they can just not look at the spoilers and we can have a team battle later on.


Could be Gobbo is busy with traveling and such. I'd say let's wait another 24 hours for a response. If there isn't one by then, then I'd say Goddity and Avoron could have their duel. That's my 2 cp anyway. :)


Sounds good to me.


I'm good with that.


Well, unless Gobo Horde has responded, I think we're ready to duel.

CMDDM, care to start us off?


I am sick of the debate. But generally speaking in a fight between the two I give it to the martial. But the caster has the advantage of options.


Korak The Boisterous wrote:
I am sick of the debate. But generally speaking in a fight between the two I give it to the martial. But the caster has the advantage of options.

We don't do debating here. Only combat!

If you have an opinion, make a character and put it to the test!

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Korak The Boisterous wrote:
But generally speaking in a fight between the two I give it to the martial.

Did you read the gameplay thread, where my wizard and MendedWall's fighter had a duel (complete with the extra restrictions I placed on myself)?


We can start the fight. Just 10 minutes.

Korak The Boisterous, you didn't even read the FAQ.
Be constructive or ignore this thread. It's not that difficult.


Jiggy wrote:
Korak The Boisterous wrote:
But generally speaking in a fight between the two I give it to the martial.
Did you read the gameplay thread, where my wizard and MendedWall's fighter had a duel (complete with the extra restrictions I placed on myself)?

I don't know that you can rightfully call that a duel. A duel has a certain amount of back and forth. That was just forth, like, you used the forth on me.


Bump.


I'm going to bump this again. We've had two great matches so far, but we'd love to actually fill up a multiple character arena bout! The great thing about this arena is the quickness with which things get resolved. If you have a week to dedicate to posting regularly, you can get a character made and in battle. Come on down and join the fun!!! No experience necessary, and no one will be turned away!!!

Liberty's Edge

Dotting. Might be a few days, but i would submit something. Sounds fun.

Are we looking for a martial or a caster at this point? Or either!?


Either.


Bumpity bump bump.. There has got to be people on the boards that have time enough and creative spirit enough to throw together a martial or caster for an arena bout? In the immortal words of Pink Floyd. "Hello, hello, hello, is there anybody in [here], just not if you can hear me. Is there anyone home?"


Updated rules
Asterisks marks new or modified rules.

1) Teams are composed by an equal amount of characters.
2) The arena is a cylinder with a radius of 200 foot. It prolongs 200 feet over the sky and 200 feet in the ground. Limits are made of adamantine walls, except for the higher circle, which is just air. There's natural, bright light. You are in the material plane.
3) If you somehow get outside the boundaries, you are considered eliminated until you return into the arena.
4) If the sum of the remaining teammates can't free a character from a crippling condition (such as flesh to stone or death), that character is removed from the arena. Its belonging vanishes and he's considered eliminated.
5)* You have no foreknowledge of any of your opponents. You are informed about the beginning of the fight 3 rounds before the fight starts. Your character doesn't know about this arena until he's informed. You are otherwise ready for adventuring (weapons wielded, spells prepared, class features prepared etc.). 6) You can use these 3 rounds to prepare yourself. You can't abuse this limit to gain an additional amount of preparation time.
6) Standard WBL. In PRD and Master, 1 crafting feat increase it by 25%, 2 by 50%, and 3 or more have no other effect.
7)* Custom items are allowed (in pfs this is limited to its limits). You have to follow the rules of the kind of fight. You may not duplicate a magic item outside of your kind of fight.
8) You can spawn in the arena from 30 feet to 50 feet from the center. You spawn at least 60 feet from every other opponent.
9) There is a surprise round only if none of your opponents can act in the surprise round. In 1 against 1 there's never a surprise round.
10) A team wins if all of its opponents are eliminated for at least one round.
11)* There's not such thing as cheese or broken combo. As long it's not a loophole or a very unintended effect (such as being dead but still able to fight because it doesn't say you can't, throwing shields as a free action while drawing them as a free action or a nature oracle which exploits his capstone ability to arbitrary raise his charisma and then abuse that unlimited score) feel free to push every character to the maximum possible. You are still limited by rules.
12) Teammates are by default able to recognize other teammates.
13)* You can bring a companion with you for free if it's a class feature. You may only bring one companion, regardless your build. If you gain a companion through a feat, then it counts as an additional teammate. A single, summoned creature counts as a free companion.
14)* You may choose to make not count a companion you have. It may remain with you, but he can't act, affect the battlefield and is considered eliminated. Your companion spawns adjacent, but not in front of you, and behind you if it's not specified.
15)* Builds must respect this criteria: 20 PB, any 0hd race from the bestiaries but Drow Noble. They must still respect the kind of play they belong. Hit points are the max at first level, then they are the upper value of the half of your HD.
16)* When your character is ready, you'll pm him to me to ensure that it's a legal build. I'll only check that, then I'll answer you if it works or it doesn't. The first time I told Jiggy that the first version of the character had no pants; it won't happen again. While it didn't really changed nothing, as he was invisible all the time, it's your responsibility to build a character that makes sense. If you forget to buy food, you'll be starving in the arena.
17)* During the fight, you can't read a spoiler which doesn't have your name as its title. You have to state your actions in a spoiler named with my name, but you have to declare outside your spoilers what you explicitly, clearly do.
18)* If an effect implies a roll, but the result never changes (as targeting an undead with a charm person or trying to attack an illusion), I'll still pretend that the result was actually uncertain.

List of suggestions:
Cover your defense. A low initiative may, and probably will, ruin your character almost instantly.
Get creative. This is an arena, your enemy will develop a tactic that covers a great amount of situations. Your first move it's to be outside that set of situations. Your second move it's to put your enemy into your set of situations of working tactics. Avoron used Bewildering Koan, which is very difficult to stop.
Don't allow your enemy to play his game. He'll win in his game.

5) Clearer on the limits of the 3 preparation rounds.
7) It's explicit that pfs have restrictions.
11) Clearer on what is defined legal.
13 and 14) Details on companions.
15) After pondering a bit, I decided that the point buy had to be increased, as it punishes MAD class choices but doesn't really penalizes SAD ones.
16) Clearer on the nature of the response and validating routine.
17) Details on the running of the fight.
18) It's explicit on the nature of the unnecessary rolls.

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