Dungeon World - Strom's Six (Inactive)

Game Master Infernal Zero

Crap, that long? Sorry, combination of tiredness and having to fill out some more blanks in order to be able to handle what you're doing. I'm close, don't worry! I was working on the post now!

So, Herald - how's this as a first introduction to your abilities? I am so glad you said what the suits are earlier. I think this one best fits what's going on at the moment.

This is something we could probably do with a proper dialogue about, but yeah - happy? Or, you know, suitably curious/panicky?

Oh yes. Oh dear me yes.

Like I said, we'll have plenty of time to tweak and adjust, but this is just the sort of thing I was looking for. Thank you. I know it's not a simple thing, but I hope it's fun.

Believe me, once the process of "Right, how am I supposed to do this" got truly underway, I was grinning like a maniac. Glad to see you're pleased too. This is going to be tricky, but I will get the hang of it. Time to get my Igor on. Or at least learn a suitably good impression.

I think we might have just made talking pants Gromroir.

I think we might have just made talking pants Gromroir.

Should there be a comma in there? also, Huh?

Gromroir, I asked you a few questions in gameplay. Would you mind answering them?

CAN you integrate it at this moment? How does it work? How could you improve it so that it works better?

No, can't right now, too messy, would have to have a few hours to properly alter the Myrmidon.

It works as a conduit between this world, and one of the elemental planes of magic, and drawing it through by basic diffusion, naturally reactive to the draw upon it. very elegant design, actually.

If i incorporated it into the Myrmidon with a double redundant bypass, I could maybe use the extra vortex power to support additional systems... maybe

Sounds good to me! I'll give you details when you try anything, based on what your suit could handle.

The Herald sees the thing that was grinding up the golems earlier.

Edit: and it has fifty eight eyes. (The number of eyes in winter tarot)

Waiting for Gromroir?

I was, but they've had to drop out now.
How do we handle his existence?

NPC until his presence isn't integral to our actions? If it seems like they might come back, let the character fade into the background, but if he's gone for good, give him a valiant death?

Gotcha.

I'll try to get the an update done when I can...just don't think I'm in the proper frame of mind for it right now. Bunch of bad stuff happened, and I get the feeling it'll affect the way I handle things if I try and get the update done now.

I want to do this as soon as possible. Just not now.

...on a side note, I'm kinda disappointed that there's only one guess as to that awful idea I had. Come on, is nobody interested?

Hope you feel better soon, and not just because you're in, like, all my games. You don't have to rush things.

Thanks.

Not ALL your games. Only, like, half of them roughly.

Not trying to rush. I just enjoy doing this.

I'm still here, by the way, and ready to continue. I've had an absolute blast so far. This is a fun group.

I hope you find strength in dealing with stuff.

:(

Sorry times are rough

Well, this is fun.

Laptop's acting up. Beeping and shutdown. Suspect it's clogged up and the fan isn't going, but in any case that needs sorting, and I can't really write things up practically on mobile.

Guess that means more delays. Sorry about that.

That's rough.

There we go! Feeling much better than I was now. Sorry for the wait!

Terestria? Elena? You there?

I've waited enough. Update coming soon.

Hi all -

DM Loopy contacted me via PM, letting me know that your group has lost its Mechanic, and would I like to join/fill in.

I've never played in DW before, but I'm very familiar with PF, so I have at least some points of reference. As it turns out, this will be the third DW PbP game I've petitioned to join within the last week (still waiting to hear about the first two), so I expect/hope to be getting some experience with it soon.

After looking over the group's current classes, I originally suggested to DM Loopy that I'd like to try either a Barbarian or a Thief (and I was leaning more toward Thief because you already had a Fighter). But he informed me that the Druid of the group is essentially a thief, and asked me why I chose those. So, I chose the Thief because I thought the group might need such skills (not knowing about the Druid), and I chose the Barbarian because I saw the group was magic-heavy. Also, in the other two games I've petitioned to be in, I chose a Cleric and a Psion, so I wanted to do something different than those.

So, may I join the group? Does anyone have any other suggestions for useful classes?

Cheers!

Hellote!

Hard to be Strom's Six with five players.

If you're avoiding magic, there are a few classes from a book called Grim World which may interest you: Battlemaster (like a warrior-bard, or a Marshal) Skirmisher (a bit like a spear-welding Monk) and Slayer (like a Dark Knight)

We're in an area with golems, so you could conceivably play that class from the Inverse World book. Although. that one might be a bit more complicated than the others. I don't know if that's good or bad, considering you're used to Pathfinder. It's a really cool book I've wanted to play. You get to pick what you're made of and that determines your core stat.

If you want to go that route, I will say the golems here are predominantly made of clay. That said, who knows what surprises are here? Don't let that constrict you.
Inverse World also has the Rainlord. It's...a bit strange, admittedly, but you are in the Mage's Quarter. There's probably a few experiments that could have led to a being like that. You're made of liquid, basically. Liquid fire, metal, light or shadow, but liquid.
Don't worry if you don't have Grim World or Inverse World. We can always work something out.

As for other mundane options, there's always the Templar. Not Grim World's, but the one from here. While still having some divine links as with the cleric (which really, can be edited out - we can just claim you're associated with some major power, which would be fun), it's less about that than being the scariest thing in the local vicinity and refusing to die. Ever.

Those are all interesting ideas, but I'm not interested in the Templar, nor the Battlemaster, Skirmisher, or Slayer, from what I could read of them from Grim World's web page (but thanks for the ideas).

I don't know enough about the tradeoffs of being a golem or a liquid creature, and I don't want to have to pay for more books (I'm currently unemployed due to health issues).

What about the Initiate from HERE (page 9)? Basically a hand-to-hand fighter - are there any disadvantages to having a weapon range of "Hand"??? Now that I compare them, I rather like Initiate over Barbarian...

Not really fond of the initiate. It's...very much the fighter in a decent amount of ways. Signature Style = Signature Weapon, Master's Pearls of Wisdom = Heirloom, Forging the Temple Body = Blacksmith, etc. I don't feel it's even that great overall. No thanks.

As for having a range of hand, the disadvantage is well...most things have better range than you. It's going to be harder to get in range to deal damage against a reasonably competent opponent with a weapon.

Mechanically, with a Hand weapon you will generally have to Defy Danger (generally with Dex) in order to get into range to Hack and Slash. You generally want to get the jump on enemies with a Hand weapon.

Aw Loopy, I love the Initiate.

I only said what honesty demands.

But yeah, not fond of it. It's not quite so similar as I may have made out, but too close for taste to other things in some ways and generally unappealing to me in others. Idea's well enough, but it's the execution I don't like. There's plenty of other playbooks in this style of they're willing to look. A few by the same name, even. Maybe one of them is more agreeable for me.

Why do you like it so much, may I ask?

The writer demonstrates some good knowledge of wushu fiction (the upgraded armor move Testicle Eight Outstanding Techniques may have a bizarre name, but that's a literal translation from an Iron Body manual), it gets the idea of a monk across without aping d20 concepts like some others I've seen, and there's a G Gundam reference in one of the moves and I love that show.

Yeah, it's about 50% reskinned fighter, but that is essentially what a monk is. There are a few moves I dislike in it, which is why I rewrote them for my personal use. Mostly the training others moves, I wasn't a fan of the +1 bonuses.

Not reusing concepts from d20 is probably the biggest reason I prefer it. That's the same reason I love the Barbarian. I've seen a couple playbooks that got hung up on making a Rage move work, when I think it's more important to get the flavor across instead. That's also why I prefer the Mage and Priest books, the originals have too much in common with d20 Vancian magic for my taste.

I have to say I'm loving the Artificer, but I've noticed that Charge is a massively limiting factor. Especially when Volleying, since it's one Charge to use Int and another to spend as Ammo.

I see. That's fair enough then. I'd just rather not have something that is for a significant part a reskinned fighter when we already have a fighter. There's bleed there that I'd rather not have. Also, I have issues with the fact it near-directly copies signature weapon just on principle. I mean...get your own key move! I don't even particularly get Weapon-Using. +2 weight? Your signature style has a weight? Additional ranges too and damage. It might just be that they're bristling with weapons, but that sounds like it should be more gear than style. How is that explained, really? Why would this be style over gear? Gaaaah.

Even if it fills a similar role, I feel like a playbook should at least have its own mechanics that differentiate it from others in its field, unless if it's meant to be a replacement, like the Mage and Priest.

I don't really have that d20 experience anyway. I wouldn't recognise what was brought over. I just want different playbooks to feel more like different playbooks.

On another note, I am so happy to have activity here again.

Huh, I like Signature Style. To each their own I guess.\

On a side note, I think I have a surprised planned for Bikke when I level, assuming Loopy lets me.

I have to say I'm loving the Artificer, but I've noticed that Charge is a massively limiting factor. Especially when Volleying, since it's one Charge to use Int and another to spend as Ammo.

I don't really think it's meant to be thrown about so much. Your stuff still works without Charge, you just can't pick the option to use it up without any. Like with the Mage, it's really meant to encourage more complications.

I wasn't aware, but for future reference, I'll point something out:

you don't need to use Field Test to use one of these Gadgets for its listed movement method.

I don't know how much this would have affected things with your glove, but there you go.

Also...PM me. I can't choose to say yes or no if I don't know what it is!

Yeah, you don't need to roll to use a Gadget, but you do need to roll to get out of a tight spot. The only times I've used it so far have been to walk through a hail of arrows and drag the Herald through a wall before being squished.

I see. That's fair enough then. I'd just rather not have something that is for a significant part a reskinned fighter when we already have a fighter. There's bleed there that I'd rather not have. Also, I have issues with the fact it near-directly copies signature weapon just on principle. I mean...get your own key move! I don't even particularly get Weapon-Using. +2 weight? Your signature style has a weight? Additional ranges too and damage. It might just be that they're bristling with weapons, but that sounds like it should be more gear than style. How is that explained, really? Why would this be style over gear? Gaaaah.

Even if it fills a similar role, I feel like a playbook should at least have its own mechanics that differentiate it from others in its field, unless if it's meant to be a replacement, like the Mage and Priest.

I don't really have that d20 experience anyway. I wouldn't recognise what was brought over. I just want different playbooks to feel more like different playbooks.

On another note, I am so happy to have activity here again.

My 2cp.

I'm enjoying Bikke in the style of beer-and-pretzels; ie. the mechanics are second to the roleplaying. It's definitely not how I usually play in RPGs, but it's working for me here. I've never had this much fun playing a martial... but that's saying something about martials. Anyway, it's a nice, refreshing change of style, stepping out of my comfort zone.

So theoretically I wouldn't feel too aggrieved if there was a "fighter-monk 2.0" or something in the table.

I might ask for some homebrewed special pirate-y moves to compensate though. (wink) I promised myself to never use smileys.

On a side note, I think I have a surprised planned for Bikke when I level, assuming Loopy lets me.

It better not explode in me hands, lass.

So, DM Loopy, are you ok with the Initiate now, or not? Don't really care, just want to know if that's still on the table. Altho if I have to Defy Danger each and every time I want to strike, I'm not so sure if that's a viable class...are y'all sure about that? The SRD only says Hand means "It’s useful for attacking something within your reach, no further" - I would interpret that to mean I'd just need to be in the same square/hex as my target...???

And FWIW, I think "Weapon-Using. +1 damage and choose one additional range, but +2 Weight" means that instead of using their body parts (hands, feet), they instead have a single weapon (nunchucks, etc.) that they use to deal damage (hence the reach and weight).

I'll spend today thinking about being a golem or liquid creature, and get back to you...

OTOH, it looks like I might not get into the game with my Dwarven Psion, so would that be an option? Same file as before, page 32.

The SRD only says Hand means "It’s useful for attacking something within your reach, no further" - I would interpret that to mean I'd just need to be in the same square/hex as my target...???

No tactical combat (squares, hexes) in DW.

Conceptually, then - standing right next to them.

I can't find any rules in the SRD about *how reach works*, other than "you can’t deal damage to an attacker who you can’t reach with your weapon"...

That's because that's all there is to it. Dungeon World is fiction first - in this case, if you don't have a weapon that can match or beat their range, you're going to have a harder time getting in close enough to deal damage. A spear, or even a sword, is going to have better range than your fists. If your opponent is competent enough to make use of that extra range, you need to find a way to overcome it.
It works the other way though. They have a spear, and you're right next to them? They're going to have one hell of a time trying to use it against you. As long as you keep close, you're pretty safe from their weapon in this case.

In order to do things in Dungeon World, you do them. You want to beat someone up? Describe for me how you intend to use your martial prowess to deliver that beat-down. Trying to deal with a spear? Describe for me how you attempt to dodge their strikes and slip past for example, or maybe grab the thing and tear it out of their hands, leaving them weaponless. I might call for a roll, but that's the basics of it. What you can do is limited only by what you can think of as a possible action and what your character is fictionally capable of. The puny wizard might not be able to move that boulder no matter how hard they push, but the fighter or anyone else that's pretty strong might have a chance.

I can give examples, if you like.

Oh, still not that fond of the Initiate. I mean, I guess I might allow it, but I'd prefer something else.
And access to Elena's rewrites, if it turns out that way.

Ok, thanks for the explanation, I think I've got it.

It's a shame you don't like the Initiate, that's my favorite so far. But the Golem and Rainlord are looking interesting...

Oh, BTW, could you please take a look at the Psion in the document I referred you to the Initiate in? Just in case I don't end up playing the Psion in the other game...

Oh, Psion is fine. Don't worry about that. If it turned out that way, I'd have been fine taking Tublat.

I *really* like the Monk you found - it seems well thought-out, and modified over the years by player feedback.

But, it doesn't specify the range of the Monk's attacks - I assume they'd be Hand?

Which brings me back to my biggest problem with hand-to-hand type PC's in DW - they are on uneven footing with the normal Close weapon users. I fully understand there's a tradeoff, in that once the Monk gets within Hand range, the Close weapon user is at a disadvantage to hit them. But with the theater-of-the-mind in DW, what's to prevent the Close user from taking a step back *every move*, thus forcing the Hand user to roll Defy Danger again? Well, ok, I can see that maybe the step back would trigger a Defy Danger for the Close user (sort of like an Attack of Opportunity), but then combat devolves into Defy Danger/Hack&Slash, Defy Danger/Hack&Slash, for each combatant!

In Pathfinder/D&D, at least the Monks have the same reach as the most common weapon-users, so there's no disadvantage...

And to top it off, *every one* of the DW SRD's monsters with claw attacks are Close! I mean, give me a break! How is a claw on a limb any different than a fist on a limb???

...I guess what I'm asking is, could the Monk's attacks be Close? That would solve all the problems I'm having with it...

Ok, first: You're on about this, right? If that's the case...

First, look at Deadly Grace.

In addition, you don’t need to defy danger to bypass an enemy’s superior reach.

That's one concern dealt with right there. Highly competent enemies may still give you trouble enough to force a DD, but it's fine generally.

Second - moves? What moves? PCs are the ones taking initiative here. It's not "You go, They go" it's "Hey, Zen, whatcha doing right now?" whenever I feel it's the appropriate moment.
At least in live play, things are a lot more conversational. It's the GM's job to make sure everyone gets involved, but everything that occurs in play is in response to PC actions. Given that this is PbP, normal technique doesn't quite work out, so I like to have everyone say what they're doing and then narrate what happens next after.

As a general rule, everything I can do is in response to players. Your opponent's trying to break away from you? If that's all there is to it, you can just keep trying to press in after them. Dungeon World isn't turn based.

Can someone step in to better articulate this? Because if this isn't clear, that would be nice!

===============================================

Let's get into your range. The range of your attack depends primarily on what weapon you're using. See your gear? Your attacks will have the range of whatever weapon you're using. Fist wraps/Gloves? Hand. Whatever pair of exotic weapons you'd pick? Close. Whatever longer weapon you pick? Reach. Depending on your weapon choice, you'll be working with a different range.

Do remember that the range tags will be relative to more human proportions. The difference between Close and Hand is only about a foot or so - it's not hard for some proportional differences, for example, to give a different range relative to that of a standard humanoid that most people would play. It's perhaps not the best idea to compare yourself with a monster.

With matching ranges, every H&S has a straightforward outcome. Either you do damage, you (probably) trade damage, or you (probably) take damage.

In combat against a character with superior range, you "get into" range with one roll (or get the drop on them) then do damage repeatedly until you roll a 9- and rather than trade damage, the target takes your hit, and moves into their range, meaning you have to slip back into range somehow or disengage. In this way, you have a buffer between yourself and damage, which is why you would pick a hand weapon IRL.. ideally, they don't survive your two attacks and there's nothing to worry about.

It's the oposite with reach. You start off in range, and they have to "spend your failure" getting into their range, and then you have a chance to do something to get away before they hurt you.

First, look at Deadly Grace.

Deadly Grace wrote:

In addition, you don’t need to defy danger to bypass an enemy’s superior reach.

That's one concern dealt with right there. Highly competent enemies may still give you trouble enough to force a DD, but it's fine generally.

D'oh! *How* did I miss that? Please ignore everything in my previous post...<embarrassed>. But I do appreciate BastianQuinn's explanation - it would be nice if that was somewhere in the SRD (as well as needing to Defy Danger to get inside someone's reach in the first place).

So, I'm good with the Monk. I'll start putting together a PC today.

Heh, I looked at the Prisoner Monk and I guess it's my turn to sniff at a playbook. I don't like Meditation. +1s are the worst thing to write into a DW class in my opinion. But I'm not the one running it, so no big deal to me.

Heh. Maybe so, maybe not. There's a place for them, and I'm not sure what would work better for that anyway. Not as if it isn't an investment to use it.

I'm just happy for the more different feel of it, myself.

Question - mainly to Zen, but I there's room for everyone else to chime in. Would you prefer your character to be someone the other PCs know at least as well as they know each other, or would you prefer someone who's lesser known to Strom's...five, right now, be you someone they've only seen briefly, someone heard of in passing/as a rumour, or utterly unfamiliar to them altogether.

I'd personally prefer you didn't know each other so well, but that's just me. Easier to handle, and it means we can concoct a secret background for who you are and why you're here. You'd have no bonds to start, logically, but you'd be able to develop those during gameplay.

Whatcha thinking? What do you want to do?

Hope this isn't too bad, phone writing is a pain as I'm finding out.