Literally Raising the Dead


Rules Questions


Okay, so skeletons can fly if their base creature has supernatural flight. But here is the issue: what creatures...

A) have a skeleton
B) can be affected by animate dead
C) have constant supernatural flight

I have looked on the forum and on giant in the playground as well as browsing Google documents on animating dead, but not only can I not find a list, I only know one thing that's not an outsider that flies supernaturally, and that's a damn linworm, which I doubt will ever be in our campaign. There has to be more than that, correct? And is there an issue with animating outsiders as long as they are called and not some and is there an issue with animating outsiders as long as they are called and not summoned? Obviously, Undead and constructs don't count since they are destroyed when they hit zero. I am magic there has to be some form of fey that it will work on. The biggest problem is the fighting what things have skeletal structures as well. While a air elemental may have supernatural flight, it doesn't have any bones.

Honestly, I would just really like a list. Hopefully I just glossed over it, and someone can link it for me.

Thanks in advance


I don't have such a list, but I'm pretty sure it's a small one.

Why not use zombies instead? They can fly with wings (clumsy, but at least they can do it).


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My personal favorite.

Easy to bind, fast, (su).
Also already a mount.

Just as an FYI as well, nothing in animate dead prevents it from being used on outsiders.

Just whip up a quick lesser planar binding and have at it.

Note that the nightmare also has garbage cha and will for its' level.


9th level Sylphs can have supernatural fly speeds. Though they're Outsiders, but they're Native outsiders.

As long as your enemies' corpses don't dissolve into boneless jelly when they die, you should be able to use any sort of creature.


Kapman wrote:

Okay, so skeletons can fly if their base creature has supernatural flight. But here is the issue: what creatures...

A) have a skeleton
B) can be affected by animate dead
C) have constant supernatural flight

I have looked on the forum and on giant in the playground as well as browsing Google documents on animating dead, but not only can I not find a list, I only know one thing that's not an outsider that flies supernaturally, and that's a damn linworm, which I doubt will ever be in our campaign. There has to be more than that, correct? And is there an issue with animating outsiders as long as they are called and not some and is there an issue with animating outsiders as long as they are called and not summoned? Obviously, Undead and constructs don't count since they are destroyed when they hit zero. I am magic there has to be some form of fey that it will work on. The biggest problem is the fighting what things have skeletal structures as well. While a air elemental may have supernatural flight, it doesn't have any bones.

Honestly, I would just really like a list. Hopefully I just glossed over it, and someone can link it for me.

Thanks in advance

Are you sure elementals don't have "bones". How do you know elementals have supernatural flight? I don't se any test saying so.

Battle Imps have fly like the spell constant so they should work.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/fey/battle-imp


Those were assumptions based off of whether they have wings/if they are translucent and you cannot see bones/are made of air. But the rule mention magical flight as being transferred, and none of the entries so far state what kind of ability each fly speed is.

Thanks Sangerine! That's excellent. I'm sure there must be more though.

Blake, I hadn't considered that.


I don't think the Skeleton template says "supernatural flight" anywhere.

It does say creatures that fly with wings lose their fly speed. It also says "if the base creature flew magically then so does the skeleton."

So the key here is "magical flight". That's not really a game term. The simplest ruling is that any creature with a fly speed that is based upon mechanical wings cannot fly as a skeleton while any creature with a fly speed that is NOT based on mechanical wings is assumed to have "magical flight" and retains it as a skeleton.


If Hiccup could engineer a wood-and-canvas stabilizer for Toothless, then maybe a clever character with a few ranks in Knowledge(Engineering) could rig up some canvas sheets to those wing bones on his favorite animated pet and then it could fly again? Some really good stitching or even some sovereign glue.

I doubt this is RAW, but I see no reason why it couldn't be done. If the skeleton can move its arms and or jaws well enough to make fully-damaging attacks, that means it doesn't need muscles to move those bones and joints at full speed (swinging claws or a sword at less than full speed would reduce damage so full speed is implied). And if it can move those joints and bones at full speed, then why not also move its wings at full speed?

The problem, of course, is that bone wings with nothing between the bones to catch the air would provide no lift - that's where the engineered canvas "wings" enter the equation. Canvas is strong enough to move a sailing ship, so it should be able to move a skeletal flier, too.

So, no, casting Animate Dead on a skeletal dragon corpse won't let it get up and fly, but then you might spend a few hours rigging its wings so that it can fly.

If your GM likes you, of course.


Imperial Dragons would work as they fly with no wings. I think gold dragons use to be able to fly with out wings also, but I think that has been changed in pathfinder.


From the title, I thought this thread was about a zombie nursery or something.


Also a fun concept to be sure, Rub


Unfortunately skeletons also lose any knowledges and skills, so even if you made canvas wings they wouldn't know how to use them.

Make a fast zombie out of the dead dragon instead, it's also much more comfortable to sit on.


Gilarius wrote:
Unfortunately skeletons also lose any knowledges and skills, so even if you made canvas wings they wouldn't know how to use them.

I wholeheartedly disagree.

Does this mean that if you give a skeleton a sword it doesn't know how to use it?

I would agree that the skeleton doesn't get the Fly skill of the base creature, but you don't need ANY ranks in Fly to actually fly. It definitely would not be a very skilled flier, for sure, but being undead does not mean it forgot how to move its wings up and down - at least any more than it forgot how to move its legs to walk or its arms to attack.

Obviously none of this is RAW either way; I'm just not convinced that losing skills means forgetting how to fly, and I support this by the simple fact that the Zombie template says the base creature loses all skills but they can still use wings to fly - a skeleton creature with modified wings (to replace the lost skin mechanically) should be treated the same way.


Creatures with a fly speed get a racial bonus to fly, the skill can also be done untrained. So yes, skeletal beholde--- flying eyeballs with skeletons, would still know and be able to fly. There would be issues performing any maneuvers that require a skill check, but yes by raw they can still fly.


A Pegasus shouldn't be able to fly, so...magic.
It's up to the GM what creatures fly by virtue of their wings alone.


Genies can fly. Can be summoned by Planar Binding too.


Neat. Undead skeletal genie.

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