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Pathfinder Society Member. 515 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 4 Pathfinder Society characters.


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do the sneak attack dice you get from slayer and rogue stack?


a) a tube arrow shooter is made out of metal
b) a tube arrow shooter shoots bamboo shaft arrows
c) weirdly, a pack of bamboo shaft arrows comes in a different tube made out of a larger hunk of bamboo
d) Uh, bamboo is a kind of grass, but it's kinda like wood, I guess

Can you make a bamboo shaft arrow out of darkwood? The price for 10 would be...66gp.

e) a bamboo shaft arrow is a foot long, and deals damage in melee as an improvised spiked gauntlet

Is a darkwood bamboo shaft arrow equivalent to a wooden stake?

I had an idea for a kapenia dancer (magus archetype)/shadowdancer build.

Hmm, maybe just go with kapenia dancer/bladebound for a magic talking scarf...

I saw someone had posted a sweet paladin/shadowdancer. No sneak attack there!

hmm, let's build him out

race: half-elf
1st slayer ???
2nd slayer ---
3rd slayer ???
4th snakebite striker brawler Improved Unarmed Strike, ---
5th rogue Multitalented Mastery
6th sleepless detective ---
7th inner sea pirate Dastardly Finish
8th master of many styles monk Stunning Fist, Mantis Style
9th master of many styles monk Mantis Wisdom, Merciless Butchery

at this point your BaB is +5, yuck, better finish with a full-BaB class

10 slayer -- (I checked if Stunning Fist is anywhere useful in the lists of combat styles, it isn't: 10th level for faithful combat (Irori))
11th slayer Killing Flourish (walk up to a guy, kill him, and spray bits on all his friends!)
12th rogue strong impression talent, I guess??

bottom line: there isn't a way to get Stunning Fist and a high-enough sneak attack at a low enough level for this to be a thing. ah well.

and no, not profession (oldest), sheesh!

If I'm in a big town, I can contract with a wizard to cast some spell. Great. Here's what I'd like to do.

1. I have a kerambit.

Ultimate Equipment wrote:
kerambit:This small, curved pull dagger has a metal loop at the base of its handle, allowing it to be secured with a pinky or worn on a string tied in the hair. While relatively small, the curved blade can create brutal wounds. Easily concealed (you gain a +2 bonus on Sleight of Hand checks made to conceal a kerambit on your body), it is a favorite weapon of ninja and assassins.

2. I would like to conceal it in my hair (or in a wig that I then attach to my scalp with alchemical glue), like as a ring on the end of a braid that's secretly a slip knot. Tug the little ring on the end (standard action), ta~da, I'm armed. I've no idea if there's any sort of scenario where my standard 'covered in weapons' clothing would be disallowed or inappropriate, I just believe in preparing for any eventuality.

3. The thing is, I haven't trained in Sleight of Hand at all, so presumably I can't conceal any weapons if I tried. I'd probably just end up stabbing myself in the eye. That's no good.

a) Can I buy the services of an expert (presumably a 'hairdresser of Norgorber') to hide the kerambit for me?
b) I could spend a prestige point and get '+4 on any skill check'. Presumably the two guys who are aiding me on my Sleight of Hand check have Sleight of Hand themselves. Couldn't they just braid it into my wig for me (and they make the check, or take 10, rather than me)?

Ultimate Equipment wrote:
tube arrow shooter:This weapon consists of a small metal tube hidden within a sleeve; the tube holds a short, spring-loaded bamboo shaft. You gain a +2 bonus on Sleight of Hand checks made to conceal a tube arrow shooter on your body. Releasing the fastener allows the spring to force the arrow out. Once a shaft is fired, the tube must be reloaded before it can be used again. Reloading a tube is a full-round action, or a standard action if the wielder has the Rapid Reload feat.

If I conceal a tube arrow shooter (that is, if I declare that the weapon is 'hidden'), do I have to draw it as a standard action? And then, holding this tube in my hand, fire it with another standard action?

Or, as the text implies, can I conceal it merely by draping the sleeve of some poor wizard's robe over the underside of my wrist, and thus I could fire it from that position?

why I ask

Ultimate Combat wrote:
Underhanded* (Ex): A rogue with this talent gains a +4 circumstance bonus on all Sleight of Hand checks made to conceal a weapon. Furthermore, if she makes a sneak attack during the surprise round using a concealed weapon that her opponent didn't know about, she does not have to roll sneak attack damage, and the sneak attack deals maximum damage. A rogue can only use the underhanded talent a number of times per day equal to her Charisma modifier (minimum 0).

In other words, if you can use a concealed weapon without having to, you know, actually draw the thing before you use it (and you have this furshlugginer talent and are suave enough to use that in conjunction and your target fails his Perception challenge), then you could actually deal max sneak damage.


So, uh...

a) It looks like I discovered a new rogue talent

Make Rogues Sad, Part XXVIII
Once per day, instead of dealing sneak attack damage, you can make a free sunder attempt against an opponent's held weapon. If this manuever succeeds, you may add 1 point of damage per die of sneak attack dice you would otherwise have rolled had you decided to stab your opponent in the kidney. If this manuever fails, you become prone, and, oh, covered in grease.

RPG Superstar, here I come!

b) you can sneak attack swarms of any size if you're wearing a swarmbane clasp. Go for the (thousands of) eyes, Boo!

DethBySquirl wrote:

A one level dip in Swashbuckler would let you Finesse both of them, though dual wielding isn't the best for a pure Swashbuckler.

Wazikashi is a decent offhand, since it's basically a short sword with a higher crit range.

Oh, I see. Use Slashing Grace to make sawtooth sabres count as piercing, and then Swashbuckler Finesse lets you use Weapon Finesse with them.

That other way to Weapon Finesse sawtooth sabres, man, I could cut tomatoes with the rules sliced like that (or something).

wakizashi is good, yeah.

While it's not defensive, a sica woulld be good for my concept (+1 to hit dudes with's situational, but I'll still take it).

The reason I'm going with TWF with a dueling sword in the main hand is for Improved Two-Weapon Feint and Dueling Cloak Adept: basically, a dueling sword is the best weapon to feint with. If there was such a thing as a 'double dueling sword' I'd use that. But, there isn't.

Here's the setup

a) a rogue two-weapon-wielding an aldori dueling sword and a swordbreaker dagger steps up to a bad guy with a sword.
b) the rogue knows what she's doing, and executes a Two-Weapon Feint on the bad guy using the dueling sword (and a cloak). The bad guy is now going to take a sneak attack from the swordbreaker dagger
c) the rogue tries to sunder the bad guy's sword

1. The bad guy is denied his Dex to AC. Can he take an AoO if the rogue does not have Improved Sunder?
2. The rogue can deal sneak attack damage to the bad guy. Can she also deal sneak attack damage to his sword as well?

So, I have this idea in my head of a tengu dual-wielding an aldori dueling sword and a sawtooth sabre...that seems neat, but the sabre can't benefit from Weapon Finesse, which I would kinda want, what with a big Dex investment to pull off TWF!

Are there any weapons that give you a bonus for wielding it in the off-hand, or if you happen to be using Combat Expertise or fighting defensively or what have you? A light weapon would be best, and something esoteric that happens to be sword-like or dagger-like would be even better.

Some kind of parrying dagger or main gauche?

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Sword cane pistol does B and P.

Not a valid option for Blackblade.

Now, a Dagger pistol, may, or may not.

Ultimate Magic wrote:
A black blade is always a one-handed slashing weapon, a rapier, or a sword cane.

I did check, you know!

You know, I also checked, and it looks like you can combine bladebound with myrmidarch, and shoot shocking grasps at bad guys with your gunblade.


hmm, so, okay, an axe musket black blade is weird, because it's either sometimes a two-handed firearm and a one-handed melee weapon.

how about a sword cane pistol black blade? A sword cane can be a black blade no problem, and it's always a one-handed weapon. seems fine to me: the black blade is intelligent and gets enchanted, etc, and the gun part isn't and doesn't (unless you pour money into it)

is there an archetype or power that lets you put spell storing on bullets?

Okay, here's a human rogue who tries to abuse Shatter Defenses, all while being ~~scary~~

race: human
traits: Shoanti Tattoo, Veteran of Battle
stats: Str 18, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 8
class thug/scout rogue
human bonus: Bludgeoner
1st: Enforcer
rogue 2: minor magic (acid splash)
3rd Sap Adept
rogue 4: major magic (vanish)
5th: Sap Master
rogue 6: weapon training (earthbreaker)
7th Intimidating Prowess
rogue 8: weapon trick (Dazzling Display)
9th: Shatter Defenses
rogue 10: hunter's surprise (again!)
11th: ??I dunno, Improved Critical (earthbreaker)??
rogue 12: skill mastery (probably Acrobatics, Intimidate, and two others)

If you don't beat someone to death doing nonlethal damage using an earthbreaker, then you either shake them for a whole combat, or inflict the frightened condition a ton of times, or just pull of Shatter Defenses a whole lot.

Hmm, I should make a 'ohako's guide to the melee rogue' or some such. That'll be fun.

it lets you dodge the damage from that high-level thundercaller who's throwing around 3 sound bursts a round...

Zathyr wrote:
ohako wrote:


1st Weapon Finesse
2nd combat trick (Two-Weapon Fighting)
3rd Combat Expertise
4th combat trick (Two-Weapon Feint)
A rogue cannot select an individual talent more than once. You could, however, grab the Finesse Rogue talent for weapon finesse. Makes level 1 rougher, but it's only level 1.
Advanced Player's Guide wrote:


A paragon of mobile swordplay, the swashbuckler is a rogue who focuses almost exclusively on honing her skill at arms and perfecting daring acrobatic moves and elaborate flourishes that border on performance.

Martial Training (Ex): At 1st level, the swashbuckler may select one martial weapon to add to her list of weapon proficiencies. In addition, she may take the combat trick rogue talent up to two times. This ability replaces trapfinding.

Daring (Ex): At 3rd level, a swashbuckler gains a +1 morale bonus on Acrobatics checks and saving throws against fear. This bonus increases by +1 for every 3 levels beyond 3rd. This ability replaces trap sense.[/b]


Actually, a couple of edits to that build

a) go half-elf. then your traits can be Dueling Cloak Adept and Elven Reflexes (and you don't really need Improved Initiative, which you're not going to ge anyway)
b) tactics-wise, take the scout archetype as well. Then when you move (and sneak attack), you use Combat Expertise, and when you don't move (and sneak attack via a feint), you use Two-Weapon Fighting (you'll still get a +1 to AC if your feint goes off)

Now I have to go gin up that Shatter Defenses build using the trait that gets you proficiency with an earthbreaker. hmm....

Hmm, okay, so I have my strength rogue concept. Let's see about building this Dex rogue concept, yeah? A two-weapon Dex fighter using a cloak, an aldori dueling sword, and a, oh, I don't know, a dagger in the off-hand. Let's make her a swashbuckler rogue, for the bonus martial weapon and taking extra combat tricks for stuff

race: human or half-elf
traits: dueling cloak adept, inspired (helps with feinting Bluff)
bonus feat: exotic weapon proficiency (aldori dueling sword)
bonus martial weapon: tube arrow shooter
1st Weapon Finesse
2nd combat trick (Two-Weapon Fighting)
3rd Combat Expertise
4th combat trick (Two-Weapon Feint)
5th Gang Up
6th weapon training (Aldori dueling sword)
7th Slashing Grace (Aldori dueling sword)
8th underhanded (deal maximum sneak damage when sneak attacking using the tube arrow shooter)
9th Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
10th hunter's surprise (surprise! you're screwed...)
11th Improved Two-Weapon Feint
12th opportunist? offensive defense?

the basic routine is that you feint with the sword, then sneak attack like crazy with your other 3 attacks, plus you've got Gang Up and underhanded for more nasty tricks. this is pretty nice, I must say, although the feat list is super-tight. Let's see about stats

Str 10, Dex 18, Con 14, Int 13, Wis 10, Cha 12

That's not bad. Get some light armor on that, maybe boost Cha with a headband to be underhanded twice a day. Plus a human gets 10 skills a level is nice. Get your Dex to attacks, AC, damage, Initiative, etc.

How about a tube arrow shooter?

Ultimate Equipment wrote:
tube arrow shooter:This weapon consists of a small metal tube hidden within a sleeve; the tube holds a short, spring-loaded bamboo shaft. You gain a +2 bonus on Sleight of Hand checks made to conceal a tube arrow shooter on your body. Releasing the fastener allows the spring to force the arrow out. Once a shaft is fired, the tube must be reloaded before it can be used again. Reloading a tube is a full-round action, or a standard action if the wielder has the Rapid Reload feat.

a) the weapon is naturally concealed (clearly a rogue has one arm with a cold iron spiked gauntlet lashed to it, and the other has a long sleeve tied to your shoulder)

b) you can fire it as a regular attack without having to draw it
c) as a downside, this doesn't work so good for a knife master, and you still need a high Cha to get this to work (nor can you spend ki or panache or anything else to recharge your uses).

I'd take this and shoot ghosts in the eye with it, but my rogue has a Cha of 8, and you need at least a 12.

the build I'm using is actually a multi-class slayer/scout rogue.

a) I like what the slayer does, but
b) I want more sneak attack

feats to start

1 Improved Initiative
3 Shadow Strike
5 Surprise Follow-Through (pulling Power Attack and Cleave through my first rogue talent and slayer talent)
7 ???
9 ???
11 ???

I'm not exactly looking for build advice in terms of class levels, or even for this specific build. I'm looking for feats that would help any melee rogue do their job better.

Zaythr, Gang Up is the kind of thing I'm looking for. Nice find! Although I can't use it for my specific build (going the Power Attack route, with an Int of 8), it's still something that's up the right alley. That +1 flanking trait is nice too.

...probably one of the feats I'm going to end up taking is Iron Will...

I'm looking for feats that help with positioning, help with flanking, help enable more and better chances for sneak attack, help with putting a rogue in the right place at the right time.

Some suggestions already

Improved Initiative
Shadow Strike
Improved Feint
Step Up (I don't like the chain because Following Step is so weird)
Nimble Moves
Friendly Switch - This one is from Seekers of Secrets, and it lets you 5-foot step into an ally's square (as long as the ally switches places with you). Perfect for tight fighting conditions.

What others would you suggest?

I've had a build kicking around for a loooong time for a Strength-based 2-handed rogue. Basically, a rebuttal of the D&D 4th Edition rogue.

race: half-orc (my favorite)
class: scout rogue 12

1st Improved Initiative
3rd Cleave
5th Surprise Follow-Through
7th Furious Focus
9th Vital Strike
11th All-Consuming Swing (these last two are new, but I like them for what they do)

rogue talents
2nd combat trick (Power Attack)
4th offensive defense
6th iron guts
8th weapon training (greataxe)
10th hunter's surprise
12th opportunist

So, a good (for a certain value of good) melee strength rogue, who can sneak attack with a greataxe while moving, charging, or just plain saying so.

Now that the slayer is out there, it's clearly something to make doing rogue-y combat things better. You get better attacks, better hit points, better saves...and less sneak attack.

Color me weird, but I like sneak attack. I like the idea of being in the right place or doing the right kinds of things, and getting a massive damage payoff in melee.

So, while I really like the gifts the slayer gets, I kinda want more rogue stuff added to that mix. Here's a variant of my dearly beloved axe murderer that goes slayer/rogue straight down the middle

1 slayer Improved Initiative
2 rogue sneak attack +1d6
3 slayer ranger combat style (two-handed: Power Attack), Shadow Strike
4 rogue combat trick (Cleave)
5 slayer sneak attack +2d6, Surprise Follow-Through
6 rogue sneak attack +3d6
7 slayer Vital Strike, unknown slayer trick???
8 rogue offensive defense
9 slayer All-Consuming Swing
10 rogue sneak attack +4d6
11 slayer sneak attack +5d6, ranger combat style (Furious Focus), unknown feat???
12 rogue unknown rogue talent???

I get better saves, more BaB, more weapon proficiencies (hooray tube arrow shooter!), the feat Shadow Strike made it in early (always a plus), and I give up some skill points, +1d6 sneak attack, the scout's grab-bag of extra sneak attack powers, and hunter's surprise. not a bad trade by any means.

Some questions

a) I haven't slotted in a slayer talent at 7th, a feat at 11th, and a rogue talent at 12th. Any suggestions?
b) I don't have to take my ucky class skill traits to get Heal and Survival anymore. What are some good traits for this build? (except Reactionary, thanks)
c) another option, I guess, is to forgo tranfinding entirely and go with the skulking slayer rogue archetype. There's a smorgasbord of powers here, but the ones I care about are underhanded manuevers and bold charge (combine with scout). So, if I'm flanking already, what does a dirty trick get me that plain old sneak attack damage doesn't? It's possible also to take the faithful combat (Besmara) combat style and get Improved Dirty Trick without needing Combat Expertise first. Is this any good in a straight multiclass?

oh, here's another question: can you apply a dose of holy weapon balm to a flask of holy water?

So, holy weapon balm can be applied (as a standard action) to 10 pieces of ammunition. The balm lasts for 1 minute. Any undead or evil outsider takes an extra 2d4 (possibly an extra 1d4 on top of that) if it gets hit.

So, it's sort of like holy water that you can grease your weapons with. Okay...holy water you can use once (5 times in theory with a battle aspergillum), and you deal 2d4 damage. A stack of arrows that you balm up can be used by other party members and you get that +2d4 damage chance 10 times.

My question: really?

Oh! Here's a real rules question. This stuff makes nonmagical arrows act as magic vs. incorporeal undead, but it also makes magical arrows act as ghost touch arrows. If you balm up nonmagical arrows, and fire them with a magical bow, do they gain ghost touch?

Pupsocket wrote:

what does this mean?

Pupsocket wrote:
The archetype specifically requires you to be able to sneak attack the target in the first place. Swarms are immune to sneak attack, as are creatures with the incorporeal subtype (if you're not using a ghost touch weapon).

1. If the chemist wears a swarmbane clasp, and is somehow invisible, then

1a. can he sneak attack a swarm with an alchemist's fire?
1b. Does the swarm's vulnerability multiply the sneak attack damage?

2. If the chemist melts a ghost salt weapon blanch over a holy water (it counts as a weapon), can he then
2a. throw the holy water at the wraith and have it hit?
2b. sneak attack with it?

So, the underground chemist is a rogue archetype (WAT?) from the ACG, and I have a few questions about the archetype, and I suspect that most of the 'PFS-strict' answers here are 'no'. But, I'll ask anyway...

The underground chemist gets three interesting powers, and while I would quote the rules, they're not anywhere online yet-ish, so I'll summarize.

At level 2, instead of evasion, the chemist can draw alchemical items like they were weapons (so you can use Quick Draw, draw while moving, etc). Also they get to add their Int modifier to splash damage.

At level 4, instead of a rogue talent, they can sneak attack with a splash weapon, but only once per round.


1. Can an underground chemist draw any sort of bottle with Quick Draw, or just an alchemical item? Like, a potion of cure light wounds maybe?
1a. What if there was an zombie nearby, and I was thinking of maybe throwing a cure potion at it, could I Quick Draw it?
1b. What if I pour out the water in a flask of holy water (which is a thing you can do), fill the empty flask with a cure potion, could I Quick Draw that?

2. So, with Quick Draw, I can throw as many alchemist's fires as I have iterative attacks in a round. Fine. What about alchemical weapons that you don't throw, such as bottled lightning? Can I draw and use two of those in a full attack?

3. Can I sneak attack any creature with a splash weapon? Like,
3a. a swarm with an alchemist's fire,
3b. or a fire elemental with a liquid ice,
3c. or a wraith with a holy water?

4. Is there any way to use a non-melee alchemical weapon at mêlée range without provoking an AoO? Like, could I glue an alchemist's fire onto the end of a longspear and flank someone with that?

5. What about magic items that mimic splash weapons, such as a necklace of fireballs or a successfully used haunt siphon? Can I draw those quickly and/or sneak attack with them?

6. Is there any way of setting the timer on a fuse grenade? Or perhaps knowing what the timer is, so I can time my throw just right? I just love the thought of sneak attacking someone with a grenade...

EDIT: I remembered it as 'unlicensed chemist'. It's really 'underground chemist'. This explains why my search-fu was poor

huh. is this for RotRL? well, it doesn't have to be, I guess.

I thought about putting a two-horse carriage into a run with chase cards, but I couldn't think of a way to accurately model a skill challenge undertaken by two creatures tied together.

Here's what I did recently in RotRL

spoilers, I guess:

1. The PCs have parked their horses-and-carriage in the ruins of the servants quarters.
2. One of the PCs goes outside to find the horses surrounded by dozens of evil ravens. At that moment, the horses bolt
(at this point, I ditched the carriage and made the game one of rescuing horses from the carrionstorms)
3. I used the chase cards from packs 1 and 2 to make a somewhat convincing chase where the PCs could either run after the horses or fight/get pecked by carrionstorms (who could move freely). Trouble was I randomized the cards, and a really difficult one was at the top, so the PCs just fought birds mostly. Also carrionstorms suck.

So, you could have a chase where the PCs are trying to rescue something or someone while also engaging in a running fight with an enemy who has superior mobility. How's that?

Demoyn wrote:
Treantmonk wrote:

Feats like "Cleave" can also be useful since it is usable as a standard action attack (or is there some dumb ruling that it doesn't work with Vital Strike?)

Vital strike and cleave are both standard actions, so they can't be used together.

except with All-Consuming Swing from the Harrow Handbook

Simple question, I guess.

Can a witch take an arcane discovery? Can an eldritch knight or a magus pick up an arcane discovery?

I'm a bit minimalist when it comes to setting up player options. For a given AP it's

Core Rulebook
Advanced Player's Guide (minus the summoner)
one other Player Companion

figuring out the one Player Companion is pretty easy, usually.

Reign of Winter? People of the North
Mummy's Mask? People of the Sands
Iron Gods? People of the River
Jade Regent? Varisia, Birthplace of Legends, and maybe the Dragon Empires Primer for a midseason replacement

What's the tie-in product for Carrion Crown?

Could you, say, load up on tricks like

Hobbling Strike
Distracting Attack
Upending Strike

and get your mantis (or whatever) to do them all at once?

(as I've posted before), I like the idea of riding around on a mantis. The best way to do this (now) is to be a verminous hunter. You get the mantis, some awesome boosts, and 2/3 spellcasting. So here goes

1. Is mindlessness worth it? You need to scrape up 6 tricks (for all of combat riding) from somewhere, and a hunter's mindless mantis will only get 6 tricks by level 9. Still, it's an awesome boost. Are there any other ways to add on bonus tricks without bumping a mantis's Int score?

2. Is being Small worth it? You can (in theory) ride this mantis at level 1 (instead of level 7, Undersized Mount is a trap), but you won't have 6 tricks until at least level 6 (and even then, you bump Int to 1 at level 4). Is there a way to play a Small human? That way, you could take Eye for Talent (and have a mantis with an Int of 2), while being small (and light) enough to ride at level 1.

(caring about encumbrance means realizing that weights for saddles don't change as the size category of the mount changes...sigh...)

(I'm sure these questions are being asked in different places also)

3. What teamwork feats (and spells) are good for a mounted rider?
4. If I've got bonus tricks to spare, can I really have my mount learn 'hunter's tricks' (from the skirmisher archetype) and use them all the time?
5. Can you really give your mount fast healing 1 (from vermin focus: worm) any time you need it?

1 person marked this as a favorite.

that got weird in a hurry.

can a white-haired witch grapple an opponent? yes, if they hit
can a white-haired witch pin an opponent in the grapple? sure thing
can a white-haired witch/rogue sneak attack a pinned target? sure again

the best way to combine an arcane caster (which the white-haired witch is) with a rogue is, funny enough, using the arcane trickster prestige class. You get spellcasting, you get sneak attack, you get half-BaB uh-oh

A better option would be to combine white-haired witch with fighter using the eldritch knight prestige class. You want to bump your damage? Take Weapon Specialization (hair) for a flat +2. Way easier than sneak attacking, I think.


a) this should probably go in the homebrew forum.
b) I don't know what you mean by 'hybrid', like multiclass? or gestalt? A multiclass witch/summoner is eventually going to have problems with both classes (because spell progression and eidolon progression would both be very slow)
c) if a witch familiar dies, you just lost your spellbook. If your eidolon dies, you can bring him back the next day.
d) there's a feat called Evolved Familiar which can give a familiar evolution points. Also there's Improved Familiar at higher level, so you can get some good SLAs

other than that, ???

A while ago I asked if you could 'hide in the sun' and get a sneak attack in broad daylight. And the answer from the rules-y part of the board was no. (Also, there are no rules about getting blinded by the sun, or taking damage by staring at it, etc.)

So, basically, a hawk can't be stealthy in its natural environment. It'd need to use shadows or convenient crates to hide behind in order to get sneak attack. (or be a scout rogue)

So, chase cards! Aren't they fun, sort of 'positioning lite' while using a moving battlefield.

Here's the setup, spoilers for RotRL, by the way.

The PCs bought a carriage and two horses. They parked them inside the burned out servants' quarters outside the Misgivings. When they came out again, the hordes of ravens made the horses bolt towards the.,..

woods! yes, I know there aren't any woods around the manor, but those were the chase cards I had.

problem is, the horses are still attached to the carriage. How do I simulate that when running the horses through the chase? In other words, what does the effect of a chariot or carriage have on the horses?

Another one, how do you run a mounted character through the chase? Do the horse and rider both have to make checks?

All hail Xochtli, the Insect Queen!

Seriously, a class that gets to ride a mantis, and doesn't wild into something that doesn't want to ride a mantis, sold!

what I'm doing for a RotRL game is this:

1. The player picks an NPC, who is already all statted up (thanks Paizo for putting Ameiko in a different book wat)
2. If they're evil, the PC has to convince the NPC to not be evil (roleplay only!)
3. After they get the cohort, they get to decide how to level that cohort up.

My PCs aren't level 7 yet, but when they get there, who knows?

If you're grappling, you take a -4 to Dexterity. The only way I know to be a Dex-based grappler is either a Tetori monk with grab (where you use the -20) or a white-haired witch, which can grapple without getting the grappled condition.

Elf Lunar Oracle (or Dark Tapestry)

1. For X levels, take the favored class bonus to boost the revelation Form of the Beast (for Lunar) or Many Forms (for Dark Tapestry)
2. You'll get access to beast shape IV (for Lunar) at 9th level, or greater polymorph (for Dark Tapestry) at 10th level.
3. Turn into Bokrug (see Bestiary 4) (with Lunar Oracle, for 13 hours a day!)

Or, there's always the lovely Galeena

no worries. I was just wondering if making your hair into a weapon was magical enough to overcome damage resistance. Turns out I also need to scrub in some shampoo every now and then to get magic magic hair.

at higher levels, Arcane Strike and AoMF for sure.

EvilPaladin wrote:

Just some food for thought:

The Illusion that Sleeves of Many Garments supposedly create is a Glammer, correct? If so, then it would feel identical to if you were wearing whatever clothing you transformed your clothes into, including the correct temperature, texture, and weight wearing that outfit would produce, because it is a glammer.

Glammer wrote:
A glamer spell changes a subject's sensory qualities, making it look, feel, taste, smell, or sound like something else, or even seem to disappear.
Therefor, could it be possible that wearing cold-weather gear via sleeves you would gain the bonuses because it is still keeping you warm like the actual outfit despite being an illusion? Normally, I'd say no, because most of the time you'd get a saving throw, but with the sleeves, your character doesn't get a save and has no reason to believe it isn't real [if he doesn't try to identify its aura at least, 'cause then he could believe it were Transmutation without it being such], so you would believe you are warm.

That sounds like an awesome way to freeze to death. Like, believing you are warm and actually being warm are two separate things. Or, similarly, that sounds like an awesome way to notice that you are wearing an illusion.

Gee, it feels like I'm wearing a swarm suit, why am I feeling all distracted and nauseated all of a sudden?

So, this is specifically about not having to buy magic fang shampoo as a white-haired witch. Her natural attack is supernatual. It's, you know, animated hair. Is that, by itself, magical enough to bypass DR/magic?

hah! yeah, that was me from a while ago trying to come up with something good. that prestige class really is not so good for an archetype druid. I actually would go with feral child (because I want to ride a mantis, not be a mantis) for this, but

a) Feral Child isn't PFS legal (although the reason why not is silly compared to the legal True Primitive)
b) Feral Child states you have to pick an animal, and I'd rather pick a vermin (which _may_ work by using Vermin Heart), but that's a GM call more than anything.

I think I'll wait for a 'vermin shaman' to get published (people of the stars, who's taking bets?), and roll with that.

oh yeah, I kept on seeing those sixes there. hmm. well, if I ever get that high I'll look into it. In that case maybe a roughrider fighter would be the way to go.

1st Nature Soul
3rd Deific Obedience (Gorum)
5th Animal Ally
7th Monstrous Mount
9th Monstrous Mount Mastery
11th Boon Companion

1st Mounted Combat
2nd Spirited Charge
4th Power Attack
6th Weapon Focus (lance)
8th Weapon Specialization (lance)

that'll work. It's probably a bit wasteful to go fighter over ranger (spending all those feats for class abilities), but hey, it does net you divine mistrust, I guess.

well great, I'm a go mash that up with Cavalier and Evangelist of Gorum and have me a crazy flying awesomesauce.

1st Mounted Combat, Cavalry Formation
3rd Deific Obedience
5th Monstrous Mount
6th...something combat-related...Power Attack?
7th Spirited Charge
9th Monstrous Mount Mastery
11th ??? Weapon Focus?

hmm, a straight cavalier->mammoth rider gets to fly at level 7. Ah well, I guess you can't have everything.

So, a mammoth rider has to have one of a set number of mounts (wolf, mammoth, triceratops, etc.). Kinda like a cavalier in that respect (horse or camel).

However, the Monstrous Mount feat lets you get around the usual restrictions for mounts, yes?

Can you take both options (and Monstrous Mount Mastery) and ride (and fly, sloooowly) around on a Huge griffon?


1. If a human rides a horse, that's a regular saddle.
2. If a human rides a mantis, that's an exotic saddle.
3. If a bear rides a horse, that's what, regular saddle/exotic bridle?

(I guess that's a rules question.)

I suppose for a home game a feral child raised by beetles (and taking Vermin Heart) would be the way to go.

looking at a summoner, I can gin up a mantis mount with the following abilities at 8th level

quadruped eidolon
Str 25, Dex 15, Con 17, nat armor +10
claw claw bite
11 points
1: mount
1: claws
1: climb
2: flight
2: grab (claws)
4: large
3 feats, 24 skills

which is probably better than a comparable mantis

Str 20, Dex 15, Con 14, nat armor +9
lunge sudden strike mandibles
4 feats, 7 skills

ah well. something to file if I ever get to play a home game.

I've always enjoyed riding a giant mantis, you know, whenever the opportunity presents itself.

A druid can take a vermin as an animal companion, giant mantis is on the list, and it becomes large enough to fly at 7th level.

1. Pity there's no such thing as a vermin shaman.
2. After 7 levels of druid, then what? What's next for the insect queen who has everything?
3. Uh, which is better at mantis riding: a 7th level druid, or a 7th level summoner riding a 'fauntis'?

@Mavael The familiar satchel grants full cover. I'm still going to be casting shield companion on it, but I kinda want protection from magic missile and the like

@BretI That is a pretty great belt. I do kinda want to keep my belt slot (for a +Dex belt). What I'd rather do is just cast the spell ant haul at the start of the day. And I would, if I weren't a witch (a witch with the Strength patron, har har).

I got it. I was going to wear a brawling mithral chain shirt and take Arcane Armor Training. Instead, I'll wear a brawling darkleaf silken ceremonial armor, cast mage armor on myself every day (oh look, an abjuration spell on the witch spell list, how did that get in there?), and trade the armor training for Arcane Strike, for extra damage goodness.

The net on that is 10.5 lbs, which I can use to go up to a full 10 bolts, along with 10 lbs of other stuff (belt, headband, wayfinder, bandolier with alchemical toys, etc)

Fake Healer wrote:

I have an awesome suggestion to fix this.

Don't dump strength down to a 7 or 8 just to make sure you eek out 1 more number for your spell DCs. Or accept that you had to have that one more to your DCs and that the cost is that you can't carry crap or have to move slower. Or pay for a magic item to either increase carrying capacity or strength. Building a character to the point where you sacrifice some parts to shore up others and then looking for a way to circumvent the sacrifice is bad character design.

Setting Strength at 10 for this character, actually

mithral chain shirt 12.5
haversack 5
familiar satchel 6
actual familiar 5 (you know, in the satchel)
spell component pouch 2
darkwood light crossbow 2 (I don't think I can fit a crossbow into a haversack)
5 bolts .5

That's 33 lbs exactly, without even wearing any clothes below the chain shirt. All my consumables can go into the sack, fine, but now I'm stuck without a way to wear a headband, or a cloak, or whatever. I'm trying to accomplish weight savings without

a) taking my cloak slot
b) taking a feat
c) spending too much money

I think that if a mithral satchel costs 3000 gp, then I'll just wait to spring for a stone familiar, and my crab can take its chances.

I thought up a deaf seeker oracle of the dark tapestry once. Do stealthy things, cast silently, find traps, fly on wings of night. How's that?

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