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Pathfinder Society Member. 905 posts (906 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 5 Pathfinder Society characters.


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uh, for the boozy koan-gnome: don't you still suffer the normal effects of drinking alcohol?

GameMastery Guide wrote:
Drunkenness: Just like drugs, alcohol can be abused and have significant negative effects. In general, a character can consume a number of alcoholic beverages equal to 1 plus double his Constitution modifier. Drinks consumed in excess of this total cause the character to become sickened for 1 hour per drink above this maximum. Particularly exotic or strong forms of alcohol might be treated as normal drugs. Those who regularly abuse alcohol might eventually develop a moderate addiction.

Huh. Looks like you only ever get sickened. I guess you can koan all you like while feeling slightly queasy. I always thought this was the normal limiting power of drunken masters, that you couldn't keep on drinking.

Don't you also need to use a potion sponge to drink underwater?


I think a clever mesmerist would looove to put a chain of eyes or an unwitting messenger onto someone who wasn't, perhaps, 100% clear on what they were getting into. It's one thing to walk up to a mesmerist and say, 'I am willing to wear a chain of eyes.', and clearly using Sleight of Hand to touch a stranger to implant the trick wouldn't work. But there's an area in the middle there that has the potential for exploitation.

To put it simply, how much does the target need to know to be willing, and how much can you lie to them?

Unconscious targets are always willing...hmmm...that's got potential too. No wonder Meligaster is evil!


Okay, let's try putting something together

race: Kitsune
traits: Adopted (Varisian Tattoo), Mutant Eye
class: mesmerist 11
abilities
Str 6, Dex 16, Con 12, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 18

Feats
1 Divine Fighting Technique (Desna) (+1 atk/+6 dmg over Weapon Finesse is too good to pass up)
3 Improved Feint
5 Deceitful
7 Conceal Spell (trying for PFS legal, I know)
9 toss up between Greater Feint (for the team) or Mesmerizing Feint (to feint weird critters). probably Greater Feint
11 toss up between Excoriating Stare (for another -2) or Improved Conceal Spell (to make that better). Probably Excoriating Stare

Stares
3 Disorientation
7 Infiltration
11 Susceptibility

Tricks
1 Fearsome guise (so, I can disguise myself as joe schmoe while secretly being a tattooed Varisian while secretly being a 3-eyed fox person)
2,4,6,8,10 no idea!

So, I can have all kinds of roguey things to do in combat (feinting, stare damage, star damage), I've got loads of magic disguises and I can always try to cast charm person or detect thoughts on the sly, and I can try for a nasty lockdown with disorientation/shaken/sickened.

How's that? What other mesmerist tricks would be good? I'd focus on tricks to give other teammates, because I'd usually want a fearsome guise on myself.


How about last year's April and the Extraordinary World? Or this one featuring CG puppet people: Kaena. Or, oh, any animated film that gets coverage on rogerebert.com or themarysue.com but only plays in one art house in LA and one in New York the bastards!

Uh...I'm super fond of Paprika. Muppet Babies meets Akira. sorta.


say you're a typical half-orc rogue with a greataxe walking around, ho-hum, got my axe in my hand, one hand is wearing a cold iron spiked gauntlet, and the other is cloaked by a stupid-looking sleeve from a wizard's robe, ready for action.

Suddenly, a whatsit! appears. What do you do during the surprise round?

a) Partial charge the critter and sneak attack it: No! That's just what they want you to do! Never charge into melee by yourself on the first round of combat. Your AC is still terrible!
b) activate a spring-loaded wrist sheath from your robe hand to grab a dart and throw it at the whatsit: maybe. You get +Str to damage, but the range is only 20ft. If you're a charismatic type, you could also use the underhanded rogue talent at this point
c) fire a bolt from your wrist crossbow: yes! no +Str to damage, but the range is higher than a dart, so you'll hit more often. plus you can use underhanded if you've got it, and you can use funky bolts if needed.


My least-favorite: the invisiwizard.

a) all their spells are geared towards making themselves safe from everything
b) ranged combat? too risky, what if an enemy ::gasp:: sees me?
c) does this barrel contain the secret to ultimate cosmic power? No? How about this one?


'swhat I get for not reading...


Anyone ever tried out a fighter 7/Stalwart Defender? You don't really care about the downside of the defensive stance...

By the way, how would you get Point Blank Master on a ranger or a slayer? I thought you needed Weapon Specialization first?


okay, this idea is reeeaallly half-formed in my head, and it could use a lot of minds looking at it to help out.

I want to use the mesmerist class to make a 'magic spy', someone who can

* steal something undetected
* cast spells unnoticed
* hide their true identity
* do sneaky things to help in combat

Things I've thought about so far

* race: kitsune, because they get a nice DC boost and the feat Realistic Likeness
* the mesmerist trick fearsome guise for an unlimited duration disguise self
* the feat Conceal Spell, along with spells like charm person or detect thoughts

What I need help with

* any way to boost the trapfinding of a mesmerist. I'm sure that'll be important if I'm sneaking around somewhere invisible
* ways to help with Conceal Spell. I'm already ahead of the game because my spells don't have verbal or somatic components, but any Bluff skill boosts won't help. Bold stares allure or infiltration can help vs. Perception, but susceptibility won't help vs. Sense Motive (Conceal Spell's check isn't an opposed check, unless it is), but I don't know of a bold stare or other sneaky thing to knock down a target's Spellcraft checks
* some way to contribute during combat that's sufficiently 'sneaky'. For instance, good as it is, Divine Fighting Technique (Desna) is out, because the first thing someone's going to ask is, 'Why does that adventuring party have so many different people who fight with starknives so prettily?'
* anything else! archetypes, different races, fun spells, interesting feat combinations, dirty tricks, the works. PFS-compatible would be nice, but not required.

Pathfinder is clearly not optimized to make this character (compared to a high DPR barbarian). If it wasn't hard, I wouldn't be thinking about it!


huh. you learn something every day. There's an oblique mention of what Blood of Dragons does in the Core Rulebook FAQ. Oh well, one less bloodline feat, I'd probably live without Improved Initiative.

@BadBird that is a nice looking sword. I'd be worried about a stealth penalty if I had it unsheathed tho...


BadBird wrote:
I don't believe you get the Sorcerer bonus feats connected to your bloodline; Dragon Disciple and Blood of Dragons grants you the Powers as if you were going up levels in Sorcerer, but not the feats.
Core Rulebook wrote:
Blood of Dragons: A dragon disciple adds his level to his sorcerer levels when determining the powers gained from his bloodline. If the dragon disciple does not have levels of sorcerer, he instead gains bloodline powers of the draconic bloodline, using his dragon disciple level as his sorcerer level to determine the bonuses gained. He must choose a dragon type upon gaining his first level in this class and that type must be the same as his sorcerer type. This ability does not grant bonus spells to a sorcerer unless he possesses spell slots of an appropriate level. Such bonus spells are automatically granted if the sorcerer gains spell slots of the spell's level.

If Blood of Dragons only stacked with sorcerer levels viz a viz abilities called 'bloodline powers', then why does it also reference bonus spells?

You know what's neat? A Sor4/DD1 is still only a 4th level caster, but (s)he does get the 5th level bloodline spell from the draconic bloodline (ehh, resist energy?). Sure it's not an extra spellcaster level, but it does mean you get your bonus spells 'early'.


Okay, let's re-iterate, this time optimizing for damage goodies, rather than ephemerals or one-spell ponies (much as I love acid + grease + Dazing Spell, or the flaming shuriken combo mentioned above). I'm sure this can be optimized further by spell selection, better traits, or by selecting a dragon energy type other than fire.

Race: Draconic Heritage Human
Class: Scaled Fist UMonk 1/Draconic Sorcerer 4 (Red Dragon)/Dragon Disciple 6
Abilities (20-pt buy) Str 16, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 14
Traits: Arcane Temper, Fury of the Red
Bloodline Arcana: mutation: blood havoc
Feats
H: Weapon Focus (temple sword) (all of the high-damage monk weapons look kooky, I guess the temple sword is the least kooky)
1M: Improved Unarmed Strike, Stunning Fist, Dodge
1: Favored Prestige Class (dragon disciple, choosing Perception)
3: Arcane Strike (getting to +3 by level 11)
5: Spell Focus (evocation) (for the occasional 4d6+8 scorching ray, also if you have blood havoc and no bloodline damaging spells, Spell Focus (evocation) seems an obvious choice)
7: Prestigious Spellcaster
7B: Power Attack
8B: Improved Initiative
9: Spell Penetration (or Varisian Tattoo (evocation), haven't decided)
10B: Toughness
11: Prestigious Spellcaster

How's that?


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Rysky wrote:
Steve Geddes wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Except for people who want to play a White-Haired Witch.
I'm at a loss at why you wouldn't take the hex rather than the archetype post clarification.
It may be suboptimal as a PC option, but a DM could still use it to build an unusual adversary.
*nods*

I dunno, I designed a tiefling ex-UMonk 1/WHW 4/Evangelist of Calistria X that I've managed to play in 2 PFS sessions so far. Looks good to me, but yeah Weapon Finesse (and Feral Combat Training) are feat taxes.


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I use a house rule where instead of 25 words you get 140 characters. It's an update to the protocol, is all.


Questions involving the interactions of two feats from two different player companion books! I'm sure this will end well.

Bladed Brush:
Paths of the Righteous wrote:

Bladed Brush: You can use the Weapon Finesse feat to apply your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with a glaive sized for you, even though it isn’t a light weapon. When wielding a glaive, you can treat it as a one-handed piercing or slashing melee weapon and as if you were not making attacks with your off-hand for all feats and class abilities that require such a weapon (such as a duelist’s or swashbuckler’s precise strike).

As a move action, you can shorten your grip on the glaive, treating it as though it lacked the reach weapon property. You can adjust your grip to grant the weapon the reach property as a move action.

So, okay, I know there's a rather sprawling thread about using Bladed Brush with Slashing Grace or the magus's spell combat class feature. And so I don't really want to get into that because after the first page or so the thread kind of goes off the rails. Let me assume for these questions that a brush wielder uses two hands to paint with. (This means that while you can select a glaive as your Slashing Grace weapon, you can never actually use it. A gelatinous cube falls prone.)

Spear Dancing Style:
Weapon Master's Handbook wrote:

Spear Dancing Style: Choose one weapon from the polearm or spear fighter weapon groups. While using this style, you grant the chosen weapon the double special weapon feature, using the weapon's normal statistics for its main-hand end and the statistics of a light mace for its off-hand end.

A weapon wielded in this way loses the brace and reach special weapon features.

Precise Strike deed:
Advanced Class Guide wrote:
Precise Strike (Ex): At 3rd level, while she has at least 1 panache point, a swashbuckler gains the ability to strike precisely with a light or one-handed piercing melee weapon (though not natural weapon attacks), adding her swashbuckler level to the damage dealt. To use this deed, a swashbuckler cannot attack with a weapon in her other hand or use a shield other than a buckler. She can even use this ability with thrown light or one-handed piercing melee weapons, so long as the target is within 30 feet of her. Any creature that is immune to sneak attacks is immune to the additional damage granted by precise strike, and any item or ability that protects a creature from critical hits also protects a creature from the additional damage of a precise strike. This additional damage is precision damage, and isn't multiplied on a critical hit. As a swift action, a swashbuckler can spend 1 panache point to double her precise strike's damage bonus on the next attack. This benefit must be used before the end of her turn, or it is lost. This deed's cost cannot be reduced by any ability or effect that reduces the amount of panache points a deed costs (such as the Signature Deed feat).

Question #1: Can a character with Bladed Brush use both Spear Dancing Style and a swashbuckler's/devoted muse's precise strike?

Question #2: Can you use the 'light mace' side of a Dancing Bladed Brush as a 'light piercing weapon' for the purposes of precise strike?

Question #3: If you wield an enchanted glaive with Spear Dancing Style, does the 'light mace' side keep the glaive's enchantment bonus? Or is this one of those 'you can't enchant the shield bonus granted by Two-Weapon Defense' sorts of deals?

Question #4: Can you use Bladed Brush's move action to restore the reach property of a glaive being wielded in the Spear Dancing Style?

buckler shield:
Core Rulebook wrote:
Buckler: This small metal shield is worn strapped to your forearm. You can use a bow or crossbow without penalty while carrying it. You can also use your shield arm to wield a weapon (whether you are using an off-hand weapon or using your off hand to help wield a two-handed weapon), but you take a –1 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. This penalty stacks with those that may apply for fighting with your off hand and for fighting with two weapons. In any case, if you use a weapon in your off hand, you lose the buckler's AC bonus until your next turn. You can cast a spell with somatic components using your shield arm, but you lose the buckler's AC bonus until your next turn. You can't make a shield bash with a buckler.

Please note that a buckler is not a feat nor a class ability.

Question #5: This one's a bonus question: What the heck is this lady doing with a buckler (or possibly a spiked light shield) on her arm? If Bladed Brush doesn't let her use a glaive one-handed, then what, is she taking the -1 to attack rolls (and gaining no shield bonus btw) for the lulz?


Llyr the Scoundrel wrote:
Arbane the Terrible wrote:
Cu Chulainn
I would argue that Cú Chulainn with his berserking style of fighting would fall under Barbarian.

Wasn't Cu Chulainn's signature move something like?

a) hide your favorite spear in a river
b) go fight a duel with some dork at the river
c) when things are going badly, kick the spear at the bad guy, which either kills them or just sunders their weapon, armor, and shield

I would love for a 'kick a spear in a river' combat feat. I'd take it.


I talked about this here, but, basically, the movie Inception.

a) almost every spell you might want to cast involving dreams has unlimited range, except for the dreamspun sorcerer's 9th level bloodline power
b) there's no such thing as 'perform: dreamcrafting' or similar
c) it's way easier to just force Joan of Arc to become a paladin with a geas or a curse than by appearing in her dreams as a burning bush.


oo~ooh, that's pretty neat. For my build I'd probably yoink Enforcer and an Imperial dragon bloodline arcana. That's an impressive synergy right there.

yeah, I'm really not into claws/Feral Combat Training with a DD. FCT is an amazing feat with the right build, but I hate to turn into something 'x/day'.

Huh, if I went with Eldritch Scrapper, I could ditch the claws (I'd rather be punching), the breath weapon (which the prestige class gives back), and the wings (ditto). Dragon Style + Arcane Strike + martial flexibility ::rrrowwwrr:: Well, that's certainly worth considering, although I'm not sure if I'd get the 9th and 15th level powers at all without being a Sorc9 or a Sorc15


Well, see, that's the rub: trying to pull off both. Let's say that the 3 bloodline feats are Improved Initiative, Power Attack, and Toughness.

A Monk1/Sorc4 has a BaB of +3
A Monk3/Sorc2 has a BaB of +4

Is +1 to BaB (plus other goodies, granted, an extra monk feat, evasion, +10ft movement) worth the -2 spellcaster levels?

Put it another way: could a Monk1/Sorc4 stand on the front lines and contribute as a primary melee character?

I think the Prestigious Spellcaster feat really nails the cake here: now you don't have to give up so much spellcasting to be a good dragon disciple, because no other prestige class gains so much from losing spellcasting levels.


can you tell I really like the Scaled Fist archetype for UMonks?

Race: Draconic Heritage Human
Class: Scaled Fist UMonk 1/Draconic Sorcerer 4/Dragon Disciple 6
Abilities (20-pt buy) Str 16, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 14
Traits: Blood of Dragons (+2 saves vs. sleep and paralysis), Fury of the Red
Feats:
H: ??? Weapon Focus (unarmed)?
1: Favored Prestige Class (dragon disciple)
Monk Bonus: Improved Unarmed Strike, Stunning Fist, Dodge
3: Dragon Style
5: Dragon Ferocity
7: Prestigious Spellcaster
9: Dragon Roar
11: Prestigious Spellcaster

Lessee...
10th-level sorcerer (1 off from full), +7 BaB (1 off from 3/4), flurry of blows with a high Strength mod + Dragon Style, + oodles of dragon bloodline goodies (3 bloodline feats I didn't even bother to pick).

So, this is decent. Can it be made better?


before a Worldscape article beats me to it.

yes, I know the Iroran paladin exists. How about an unarmored paladin with a giant sword? going for a cross between a smashy paladin and a healy paladin

Race: Human
Class: Scaled Fist Monk 1/Paladin of Smiad X

(Smiad is a minor empyreal lord whose favored weapon is greatsword)

Feats:
H: Noble Scion (War)
1: Weapon Focus (greatsword)
3: Greater Mercy
4: Improved Unarmed Strike, Stunning Fist, Dodge
5: Crusader's Flurry
7: Power Attack
9: Ultimate Mercy (you'd need a +Cha buff like eagle's splendor at this level, but it's manageable)
11: Shield of Swings

Starting Abilities (20 pt buy)
Str 17, Dex 12, Con 12, Int 8, Wis 8, Cha 17

+Cha to saves, AC, Init, and CMD, and flurrying greatswords. Grab a +UMD trait and a wand of mage armor, maybe a winged helmet and a greatsword made of blood crystal, and go to town. What do you think? What would you change?


I don't know about that, but I have a slayer 2/rogue 4 who has both combat trick and a combat style. great way to get a lot of feats in a hurry


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cooool language business...

is there any funky money as well? like, copper/silver/gold/crystallized genie tears? solidarii to the drachm?


Boomerang Nebula wrote:

In the real world the sun is so far away that the shadow cast by a flying object or creature stays roughly the same size regardless of altitude.

Really? I did not know that. So, while it would be easy to spot a shadow of a flying rogue on the ground (thus negating stealth), actually responding to the attack would be hard because you'd be looking at the sun (either blinded or dazzled).


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This is instead of those silly threads about using Perception to see the sun...

Imagine a flat plain, and a clear, bright day. Stealth without invisibility is more or less impossible. ... Or is it?

Could a flying rogue figure out their position with regards to a prospective ground-based target and the sun, and thus use the sun to conceal themselves from their target?

Further, could the rogue get to within 30 ft. of their target, and thus pull off a sneak attack with a ranged weapon? How close can you get to someone via this method and not appreciably shade them?


ah, so, you're saying that if a demagogue bard used his incite violence power against a dwarf paladin of Ragathiel (who fell for it) against 'all orcs', that paladin would be in trouble. However, if the group of dwarves who were originally incited kept up the tradition of violence against orcs for thousands of years and taught all their kids how to smoosh orcs better than they normally would as a result, that's okay then.

yeah, right.

a) yeah, so, 'does a paladin fall if' threads tend not to go anywhere, I'm cool with that.
b) you notice there's no such thing as 'hatred' for orcs, right? orcs and half-orcs may get all kinds of rage powers and feats and whatnot, but never anything specific against dwarves...


Divine Anthology wrote:
Ragathiel's Paladin Code: Redemption finds hearts from even the cruelest origins. I will strive not to act upon prejudice against fellow mortals based on race or origin.
Core Rulebook wrote:
Hatred: Dwarves receive a +1 bonus on attack rolls against humanoid creatures of the orc and goblinoid subtypes due to special training against these hated foes.

Would a dwarf paladin of Ragathiel be in danger of falling if they used their racial Hatred ability?


Can I cast raise dead on my own thread?

In the intervening two years there's been some developments, I guess. Now I'm trying to nail down an unarmored paladin with a big sword before the archetype appears in Worldscape!

Violence Princess take 2
Race: Human
20-pt buy
Str 16, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 7, Wis 10, Cha 17
Classes:
3 Warrior of the Holy Light Paladin of Ragathiel (there's a code now!)/1 Scaled Fist Monk/8 Paladin
Feats:
1 Noble Scion (War)
H Weapon Focus (bastard sword)
M Improved Unarmed Strike, Stunning Fist, Dodge
3 Greater Mercy
5 Crusader's Flurry
7 Power Attack
9 Ultimate Mercy
11 Shield of Swings
Traits: ??? no idea

19 Cha (by level 8): 4 LoH
8 levels of Paladin: 4 LoH
8 levels of Warrior of the Holy Light: 2 LoH

(I keep wanting to write 'scaled fish' monk...)

Ultimate Mercy 2 levels later, but +Cha to AC from the Scaled Fist monk at level 4, flurry of blows with a divine-bonded bastard sword, 2 skill ranks a level, and the not-that-great Shield of Swings as a defensive topper.

Here's a question: You get +Cha to AC from Scaled Fist monk (when unarmored). Do you also get the +Cha (as deflection) to AC during your smite attack? Or does that break the 'same stat bonus twice' faq-rrata?

Also: what would some good traits be?


Secret Wizard wrote:


Also, I see nothing in Evangelist (either PrC or Cleric archetype) that would grant versatile performances back.

The 2nd evangelist boon for Shelyn gives 1 versatile performance, and if you already had the feature, then you get an extra +2 to the check.


I don't have the original sources to read, but here goes.

In order to get Desna's Divine Fighting Technique, one must either

a) worship Desna and take a feat
or
b) be a cleric, inquisitor, or warpriest of Desna, and give up a 1st level domain power
or
c) be a chaotic good bard, and give up a versatile performance

Is this correct?

Does this mean that a chaotic good bard can get +Cha to atk and dmg and worship Shelyn? And can take, say, levels of Evangelist and get one or two versatile performances back?


yeah, it works. I have an ex-UMonk/white-haired witch/evangelist of Calistria with FCT and Boar Style so she can drill holes in bad guys with her hair.


okay, so Cha to AC isn't as interesting as light armor? really?

Sorcerer 6/Fighter 1/EK 5

use the extra feat to grab Arcane Armor Training, and the extra feats from EK to nab Arcane Strike. Two levels off from spellcasting though.

another option would be

Sorcerer 6/Evangelist 6

which is 1 level down but nets you medium BaB (in exchange for +nothing to AC)


Socerer is a class that doesn't mind maximizing Charisma at the expense of other stats. Bard is probably the natural choice for Startoss, but bard isn't naturally SAD like sorcerer is. I like Startoss here because it's damage without being magic missile.


trying to a take a bite at the Charisma-tron again

Race: Human
Traits: Varisian Tattoo, ???
Class: Sorcerer 11/Scaled Fist UMonk 1
Feats
H: Divine Fighting Technique (Desna)
1st: Noble Scion (War)
3rd: Point-Blank Shot
5th: Weapon Focus (starknife)
7th: Startoss Style
9th: Startoss Comet
11th: Startoss Shower

1. You get mostly a sorcerer with +Cha to Init, hit, damage, and AC. Startoss for +6 to damage, and a circlet of persuasion (maybe) for +3 to hit and init.
2. Haven't decided on archetypes or bloodlines for Sorcerer. Possible choices would be Tattooed Sorcerer (for extra tattoo action) or the starsoul bloodline (the stars! they're everywhere!) or both.
3. There's a spare trait in there. Any ideas?
4. Evangelist and/or EK. Worth it?


I think you should throw the biggest things you can get your hands on. (Well, maybe just spears) And rather than focus on iteratives, you should go Vital Strike.

Ever read Nifft the Lean stories? Like in the A'rak, Nifft chucks a spear into a big spider demon thingy and kills it in one hit. He does that a bunch of times, and there's lots of mention of 'sinews' and what-not. That's kind of neat.

I bet you could make a really cool Vital Strike hurler using the Slayer class (because sneak attack and weapon styles and other to-hit goodies), and make a really good 'I throw death at it' build.


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I just got finished reading The Farthest Shore again, and one thing is obvious, at least in that universe: wizard < dragon

So, that got me thinking: what would be a good class build (martial or caster) be that could do something, by him/her/itself, about a dragon? Like, you know, a big scary one. Offense, defense, special abilities, you name it, please consider it.

I already know how to explore a dungeon. Not really sure what to do if it came to a fight with a dragon, however.


Hmm, not sure I buy the 'you're protected if you know it's coming' defense. A half-orc with Surprise Follow-Through will still 'surprise' foes when using Cleave, even if the surprise is spoilered. In this case, making your opponent's head explode with acid splash only works during the surprise round, so that's a limiting factor.


Here goes nothing

Ultimate Combat wrote:
Underhanded* (Ex): A rogue with this talent gains a +4 circumstance bonus on all Sleight of Hand checks made to conceal a weapon. Furthermore, if she makes a sneak attack during the surprise round using a concealed weapon that her opponent didn't know about, she does not have to roll sneak attack damage, and the sneak attack deals maximum damage. A rogue can only use the underhanded talent a number of times per day equal to her Charisma modifier (minimum 0).

The key line here is 'concealed weapon that her opponent didn't know about'. I've always thought this meant that the rogue can't initiate the surprise round by drawing a concealed weapon (as a standard action), or brandishing an obvious natural weapon, or sniping. Instead, the rogue has to 'unconceal' a hidden weapon as a free action somehow (spring-loaded wrist sheath or a heavy wrist launcher), and then do the deed.

Text for the Conceal Spell feat, because it's looong:

Ultimate Intrigue wrote:

Conceal Spell: When you cast a spell or use a spell-like ability, you can attempt to conceal verbal and somatic components among other speech and gestures, and to conceal the manifestation of casting the spell, so others don't realize you're casting a spell or using a spell-like ability until it is too late. The attempt to hide the spell slows your casting slightly, such that spells that normally take a standard action to cast now take a full-round action, and spells that normally take longer than a standard action take twice as long. (Swift action spells still take a swift action.) To discover your ruse, a creature must succeed at a Perception, Sense Motive, or Spellcraft check (the creature receives an automatic check with whichever of those skills has the highest bonus) against a DC equal to 15 + your number of ranks in Bluff or Disguise (whichever is higher) + your Charisma modifier; the creature gains a bonus on its check equal to the level of the spell or spell-like ability you are concealing.

If your spell has a somatic component, any creature that can see you receives a Perception or Spellcraft check (whichever has the highest bonus) against a DC equal to 15 + your number of ranks in Sleight of Hand + your Dexterity modifier; the creature gains a bonus on its check equal to the level of the spell or spell-like ability you are concealing.

Since you are concealing the spell's manifestation through other actions, others observing you realize you're doing something, even if they don't realize you're casting a spell. If there is a verbal component, they still hear your loud, clear voice but don't notice the spell woven within.

If an opponent fails its check, your casting also does not provoke attacks of opportunity, and an opponent that fails its check can't use readied actions that depend on realizing that you're casting a spell or using a spell-like ability, or readied actions such as counterspelling that require identifying the spell you're casting. Spells such as fireball that create an additional obvious effect (aside from the manifestation of casting that all spells and spell-like abilities share) still create that effect, though it might not be obvious who cast the spell unless it emanates from you.

If a character interacts with you long enough to attempt a Sense Motive check without realizing you have been casting spells, that character can use Sense Motive to gain a hunch that you're behaving unusually.

So. Let's say a Cha 16 rogue has the minor magic rogue talent, selecting acid splash. And the rogue also has the underhanded talent, and the Conceal Spell feat.

1) Underhanded grants a +4 on the check to conceal a weapon. I know it's not a check, but would underhanded grant +4 to the DC to notice the somatic components of a concealed weapon-like spell?

2) If this rogue successfully conceals a casting of acid splash, does this satisfy underhanded's condition of 'a concealed weapon the opponent didn't know about'? In other words, is it 'too late'?

3) Not a rules question: good gravy is underhanded circumscribed. A talent from Ultimate Combat only works with something from Ultimate Intrigue or the Adventurers' Armory? Plus, a rogue with a low Charisma can take the talent and have it literally do nothing. Is there any other ability where 'minimum 0' is a thing? Plus, only pretty rogues get to be underhanded? What does Charisma even have to do with it?


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You could make a masterwork backpack out of darkleaf cloth. Sure, it's 3/4 as expensive as a handy haversack, but it will help Strength-dumped characters, gosh darnit!


Imbicatus wrote:
You could do the same thing with four less feats by just using a weighted spear and singing.

Geez, now they just need to come out with a 'weighted elven branch totem longspear', and I'd be all set.


Here's the outline of a...well, it's not optimal

Race: Human (or Half-Elf)
Class: Bard
Feats
H: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (totem spear)
1: Weapon Focus (totem spear)
3: Two-Weapon Fighting
5: Spear Dancer Style
7: Weapon Finesse
9: Spear Dancer Spiral
11: Spear Dancer Torrent

So, something of a standard bard, but you can sing, dance, and play the spear! How you can play an aeolian spear when the holes are jammed into someone's guts is best left unanswered. The question is: what next?

a) what traits would you pick?
b) human or half-elf? Or some other way to cadge EWP for the totem spear?
c) any bard archetype call out to combine with this? I would kind of like to keep versatile performance,but other than that I'm open.
d) Spear Dancer Style I know has some problems where you take feats that don't do you any good, and then the style unlocks them for you (+Dex to hit at level 9...). Would it be a good idea, or, uh, let's stay away from 'good' and use 'better'. Would it be better to multiclass fighter in there somewhere? Maybe 2 levels?


Varisia, Birthplace of Legends wrote:
Totem Spear:Favored by the Shoanti of the Sklar-Quah, totem spears combine deadly weapons with the mournful music of Varisia’s displaced natives. The shovel-like heads of these broad spears are decorated with variously oriented hollows. In addition to its use as a weapon, a totem spear can be played using the Perform (wind instrument) skill.

Very simply: If you have a masterwork totem spear, do you get +2 to Perform (wind instrument) checks?


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so you're saying modern cows are masterwork.

Okay, so if a cow is 50gp, then a masterwork cow would be, what, 100gp? Ta~da: modern cow.


stack that sneak attack all you want. This is why the feat Merciless Butchery was switched from a swift action to a standard action. Now it's more like 'take-your-time butchery'.


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There's always Bokrug. You can turn into a typical version of...whatever its species is as early as 13th level, oracle or wizard. Elven and aasimar oracles used to be able to do it faster, but, well, you know...errata...


Oh well, it was worth a shot.


Starglim wrote:
Nefreet wrote:
Starglim wrote:
2) Bonuses to apply to day jobs must be usable for the undefined duration that extends between scenarios and must benefit either all uses of the skill, or specifically the use of the skill to earn cash. No to both.
The "You gain a +4 bonus on Heal checks" is permanent, and applies to the entire skill.
Agreed. The OP's question 2) was whether he could double the day job result by providing long term care to two people at once.

Yep. Actually, Healing Hands lets you provide long-term care to 12 people at once instead of 6. In fact, you get to double the number of people you can do any of the basic Heal check things to: first aid, treating deadly wounds, treating poison, long-term care. The only thing you don't get to double are weird edge-case Heal checks, like implanting ioun stones.

So, I know this is hard: if you have two characters with max ranks in Heal, Skill Focus: Heal, the Caregiver trait, and the Temple vanity, the both of them together earn twice the amount on Day Job checks than a single character with Healing Hands, even though the Healing Hands character can do the work of two people?

Do I have that right?

Also, restful sleep or not, if I was a wizard who wanted to replace one of his teeth with a ioun stone, I am absolutely sure that surgery would go better if the dentist dosed me with a knockout drug first. Pity there aren't rules for using poisons and drugs when practicing medicine. That's gotta make the dentist's chair a little screamy.


In order to use Heal as a Day Job, you have to have either the Temple vanity or the Faith Healer trait (and be an aasimar).

Core Rulebook wrote:
Heal: Providing long-term care requires 8 hours of light activity.

Presumably this is what you're doing when you're performing Heal as a Day Job. I presume this because the Craft and Profession skills also have a per diem use.

Ultimate Equipment wrote:
Healer's Kit: This collection of bandages and herbs provides a +2 circumstance bonus on Heal checks. A healer's kit is exhausted after 10 uses.

So here's the masterwork tool for the Heal skill.

When you use Craft as a Day Job, the cost of the raw materials you consume/purchase while working is abstracted away. When you Craft, you spend gp on raw materials (which is 0), and finished goods come out the other end that you sell for gp. So, when you Heal as a Day Job, the cost of your raw materials (bandages, salves, herbs, etc.) is also abstracted away, and healed bodies come out the other end (and then you, uh, bill their health insurance).

1) If you buy a masterwork tool for Heal (ie a Healer's Kit), do you get a +2 on Day Job checks?

Advanced Player's Guide wrote:
Healing Hands (Ex): You gain a +4 bonus on Heal checks. You may provide first aid to two people or treat two people for poison as a standard action (make a separate Heal check for each creature). When using the Heal skill to treat wounds from caltrops (and so on), treat deadly wounds, treat poison, treat disease, or treat long-term care, you may treat double the normal number of people you may treat at the same time. You may provide long-term care for yourself.

2) If the thing you're doing as a Day Job is providing long-term care, and an oracle with the Healer's Hands revelation can treat twice as many people per day, does the oracle earn twice as much gp for doing their Day Job?

This last one is only kinda a PFS question.

One of the weirder things you can do with a Heal check is to perform surgery (fleshgrafting, implanting ioun stones, etc.). A healer's kit has 'salves' in it, I'm guessing stuff like aloe vera, willow bark, and maybe some soap. For those complicated surgeries, I'd really like something a little stronger.

3) If someone trained in Heal is going to perform surgery, could they buy a dose of drow poison to use on the subject? Or, perhaps you're trying to keep someone mortally wounded from getting worse: a dose of opium to dull the pain perhaps?


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huh. that works. soothsayer's rainment plus a mnemonic vestment plus a scroll of divination. That's not going to let my character light demons on fire with my mind, but it's neat nonetheless.

I like the idea of the pre-asked questions for commune. I've often found that using that spell in a group leads to a whole session being wasted on arguing over which questions to ask.


Huh. Maybe I'll just stick to blessing of fervor.

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