I'm looking for options (preferably gear) that will allow me to draw items as a free action.
What's out there besides retrieval belts and retrieval prisms?
Does action compression of Draw and Strike also qualify?
Such as Android: Internal Compartment.
Or are you only wanting options that draw arbitrary items as a free action?
My goal is to be able draw out a pair of fans (which may or may not be weapons*) as a free action at the end of my kineticist's turn, so that I can benefit from Fan Dancer's defensive feats (which require a fan in each hand). However, since a kineticist requires at least one hand free to use their impulses, I will need to drop at least one fan at the start of every turn in which I want to activate an impulse, then draw out a new one (hopefully as a free action) at the end of my next turn.
Drawing and attacking isn't really the goal, as kineticists are not proficient in weaponized fans (martial weapons).
Juggler Archtype, but I think you already considered that judging from your other thread about juggler archtype.
Indeed. Sadly, it doesn't work with abilities that require two weapons, one in each hand.
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Weapon Harness makes it so you can free action drop a weapon and still have it retrievable with the same actions as drawing it. It's not an improvement to actions, but it's less silly than leaving half a dozen fans on the ground.
There are a few elemental magic item fans. You would have an easier time asking a GM to count that hand as free for Kineticist purposes.
If you're a 7th level weapon Inventor, you can have a free-hand fighting fan. That solves the issue. It's either a really rough multiclass archetype build with the Kineticist archetype, or else dual-class.
RD are you multiposting under two different aliases? Because Moosher12 is asking for exactly the same advice about exactly the same build on another thread.
Nope. Moosher12 is not me. What's more, they came up with the concept first. I just liked it so much that I've been trying to find a way to bring it together ever since.
Edit 1: After reading some more about Moosher12's concept, it seems our character goals have diverged somewhat.
They want a pair of physical non-weapon fans in hand at all times, even when using impulses. They also appear to be open to house rules.
I don't care whether the fans are weapons or not, nor do I need them both in hand at all times. I really just want to be able to use Sweeping Fan Block. I, and no one I play with, really go for house rules either, so I'm trying to bring a viable build together as close to RAW/RAI as possible.
EDIT 2: Here is my build thus far.
Right now, I'm facing a conflict with magical item slots. I would like to get a +2 item bonus to Performance (preferably dance if I have to pick a subskill). However, the two chief items are Jathoom's scarf and the dancing scarf, both take up the belt slot. That gets in the way of my having a greater retrieval belt with which to draw three fans. The only workaround I've found for now is to use gloves of storing instead, which limits me to one free draw (plus one more with a retrieval prism). That's...not a lot for someone who will probably want to be drawing at least one fan nearly every round of combat. Nor is it ideal for games that are actively avoiding legacy content.
Why they're considered "belts" but the masquerade scarf is not is a complete mystery to me. And that's just the latest headache. I'm getting the impression the developers really didn't want such a concept to work.
Right now, I'm facing a conflict with magical item slots. I would like to get a +2 item bonus to Performance (preferably dance if I have to pick a subskill). However, the two chief items are Jathoom's scarf and the dancing scarf, both take up the belt slot. That gets in the way of my having a greater retrieval belt with which to draw three fans. The only workaround I've found for now is to use gloves of storing instead, which limits me to one free draw (plus one more with a retrieval prism). That's...not a lot for someone who will probably want to be drawing at least one fan nearly every round of combat. Nor is it ideal for games that are actively avoiding legacy content.
Well, there is some good news. Despite being labeled a "belt", Retrieval Belt is "usage worn", not "usage worn belt", so you can wear either of the performance belts alongside it with no issue. The rules are pretty clear that the restriction is only for things that share a worn usage description, so in practical terms it's just wearing the Retrieval Belt as a bandolier. That's two free draws per combat from the gloves and belt, plus a prism makes three total with a little cost.
And that's just the latest headache. I'm getting the impression the developers really didn't want such a concept to work.
In a roundabout way, yeah. Fan Dancer requires two fans on some stuff to prevent using another weapon, and Kineticist requires a free hand so that impulses functionally takes the place of a weapon.
The retrieval belt was errata'd last month into "worn belt" so that you couldn't have more than one being used at the same time.
The retrieval belt was errata'd last month into "worn belt" so that you couldn't have more than one being used at the same time.
Ah, thanks, I had forgotten about that.
About the only thing I can think of to allow for something like this is the (PF2 compatible) Starfinder Second Edition Playtest ancestries: barathu (1st level ancestry feat Grasping Tendrils), kasatha, or skittermander. These ancestries have more than one pair of arms and can switch between which pair is "active" as a single action; basically hold the fans in one pair of arms and have another pair "free" to use impulses.
Both kasatha and skittermander have a 5th level ancestry feat Double Draw (single action to "Interact twice to draw and stow one object from up to two of your pairs of arms") and a 9th level ancestry feat All Hands on Deck (once per day as a free action "Until the beginning of your next turn, you count one [two for skittermander] additional pair of hands as your active hands. At the beginning of your next turn, choose which set of active hands remains your active hands."). Barathu have a 9th level ancestry feat Convergent Evolution that allows them to select three (!) other ancestries from which to select ancestry feats and gain a 1st or 5th level ancestry feat immediately (which can be retrained during daily preparations).
Well, since it's a reaction you only need to have them both in hand by the end of your first turn. So I'd recommend the same solution i did to moosher: walk around having them both in one hand, do your blast, then spend a manipulate action putting them in separate hands. Now during the enemies' turn, you can use the reaction. Then during your next turn, free action drop a fan, attack, spend an action to re-equip.
Thanks, but if I was willing to use an action every round on defense, I would just play a shield carrier.
Besides the Juggler stuff to auto-draw and auto-sustain the juggle, the archetype has one more source of "Free Draws" via the overlooked Reaction, Reflexive Catch.
If an item falls within your reach, you can React to grab/juggle it.
This is being used by my Stolen Fate Alchemist, who has a familiar. There is a Juggler fate card that grants that reaction. Completely RaW, my familiar can Draw + Drop an item every single turn via Independent, and my PC can burn their Reaction to snatch it. Because Alchemist has basically 0 Reaction options, this has become such a good "free draw" option, that I've taken off my Retrieval Belt.
For a PC with the actual archetype, Focused Juggler is pretty much mandatory. This leaves R Catch harder to justify for the feat slot, but it can be your 3rd feat to end lockout. Main pain point about this feat is that it does *not* add 1 to your juggle max like the others do. You pick this one only if you make a plan to use it, likely involving another creature, like a familiar or Disarm-PC.
(super cheese note: it is fully RaW that you can catch your own missed bomb strikes to re-use them, but it makes no RaI sense to be able to do that)
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One other note about Juggling is that you can also add unattended items within reach to the juggle. This means that odd edge cases can gain more value, most notably the Disarm action. You can delay *when* you sustain the Juggle to after a Disarm attempt, and snatch their fallen item if you knocked it to the ground.
Other examples are the "dump items to the ground" weird features, but those are generally still very bad and not worth it, imo.
Sadly, juggling says "Juggling two or more weapons with one hand doesn’t allow you to use feats that require two weapons each held in a different hand."
EDIT: Although I now find myself wondering if that restriction can be completely ignored when using non-weapon fans.
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Sadly, juggling says "Juggling two or more weapons with one hand doesn’t allow you to use feats that require two weapons each held in a different hand."
EDIT: Although I now find myself wondering if that restriction can be completely ignored when using non-weapon fans.
I think you're doubly good, because Fan Dancer doesn't require weapons, it requires fans, and separately, even if it did require juggling a weapon, you could juggle just one fighting fan. So I guess that means the answer (visually) is tossing one fan in the air, blasting somebody with air impulses, and then catching the fan to defend yourself? That sounds pretty cool, honestly.
EDIT: Okay, Fan Dancer requires wielding fans requires them wielded as improvised weapons, but all you have to do is only juggle one fan in each hand, giving you a free hand still. The juggling restriction is on trying to juggle two weapons in one hand- not a problem. The Kineticist restriction is needing a free hand- which Juggler gives you.
Another potential hiccup is that we also don't have any statistical information on normal fans. No price, bulk, or anything; just a few magical items which all have their own unique properties. So short of house ruling, we kinda' have to use fighting fans.
Another potential hiccup is that we also don't have any statistical information on normal fans. No price, bulk, or anything; just a few magical items which all have their own unique properties. So short of house ruling, we kinda' have to use fighting fans.
Fortunately, that's what short tool is for. One-handed, light bulk, 4sp.
Alright, I think I've got it figured out now.
I stumbled upon the greater bracers of arrow deflection, which are better than my Sweeping Fan Block feat in every way save for the fact that (1) it can only be used every 10 minutes and (2) it doesn't allow me to recover the ammunition.
What it does do is allow me to get by with a single fan (and a free hand) until someone hits me with ranged ammunition. Then, after knowing I've been hit, I can use my reaction to attempt to deflect it. If it looks like they're going to keep shooting at me, then I can whip out a second fan as a non-action using my greater retrieval belt as a free action, then continue to benefit from Sweeping Fan Block to keep my anti-ranged defense real high. I can then drop one fan at the start of my turn to free up my hand for impulses, then draw out another fan before the end of my turn from the belt. I can sustain that loop for up to three rounds, or even longer if I don't use an impulse or if it doesn't look like I'm likely to be shot at.
Another potential hiccup is that we also don't have any statistical information on normal fans. No price, bulk, or anything; just a few magical items which all have their own unique properties. So short of house ruling, we kinda' have to use fighting fans.Fortunately, that's what short tool is for. One-handed, light bulk, 4sp.
Elegant solution!
Sadly, juggling says "Juggling two or more weapons with one hand doesn’t allow you to use feats that require two weapons each held in a different hand."
I agree with QuidEst on this.
The restriction prevents having both fans being juggled by one hand and having that qualify for Fan Dancer requirements of having the fans in two different hands.
But that isn't what you are trying to do. You do have one fan in each hand. You can use Juggle to have one of your hands be both free and wielding the fan. Then you can cast Impulses with the free hand.
Alright, I think I've got it figured out now.
I stumbled upon the greater bracers of arrow deflection, which are better than my Sweeping Fan Block feat in every way save for the fact that (1) it can only be used every 10 minutes and (2) it doesn't allow me to recover the ammunition.
What it does do is allow me to get by with a single fan (and a free hand) until someone hits me with ranged ammunition. Then, after knowing I've been hit, I can use my reaction to attempt to deflect it. If it looks like they're going to keep shooting at me, then I can whip out a second fan as a non-action using my greater retrieval belt as a free action, then continue to benefit from Sweeping Fan Block to keep my anti-ranged defense real high. I can then drop one fan at the start of my turn to free up my hand for impulses, then draw out another fan before the end of my turn from the belt. I can sustain that loop for up to three rounds, or even longer if I don't use an impulse or if it doesn't look like I'm likely to be shot at.
Elegant solution!Another potential hiccup is that we also don't have any statistical information on normal fans. No price, bulk, or anything; just a few magical items which all have their own unique properties. So short of house ruling, we kinda' have to use fighting fans.Fortunately, that's what short tool is for. One-handed, light bulk, 4sp.
Greater Retrieval Belt doesn't let you retrieve three rounds in a row, though?
"Neither Store Item nor Retrieve Item can be activated again for 1 minute."
It just gives you three options for your 1/minute retrieval.
Greater Retrieval Belt doesn't let you retrieve three rounds in a row, though?
"Neither Store Item nor Retrieve Item can be activated again for 1 minute."
It just gives you three options for your 1/minute retrieval.
>XC
2 rounds then, one with the belt and another with a retrieval prism.
I also just realized today that Sweeping Fan Block provides a Circumstance bonus, the same as cover or a shield.
Raising a shield takes an action each round, rather than a reaction, so it isn't all that ideal for someone trying to maximize their action economy. However, if there's cover about, I'll have to consider using it and reserving Sweeping Fan Block/bracers of missile deflection for when I'm caught out in the open (as flyers often find themselves). It still costs an action rather than a reaction (either to Stride to it or to Take Cover), but at least I don't have to renew it round after round like a shield (unless the enemy wastes their own actions to get around the cover).
That means, in a great many encounters, I might not need to be juggling fans. I can simply rely on one unless I somehow get caught out in the open, at which point I can whip out my second fan and get the AC bonus anyways.
That ought to cut down on any necessary action cycling each round.