Using Terrain Stalker without difficult terrain?


Rules Discussion


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Can you use Terrain Stalker without difficult terrain? It says to choose a difficult terrain from "the list" but says nothing about the chosen terrain actually needing to be difficult terrain in order to use the feat.

So can I use Terrain Stalker in brush, rubble, and/or snowy terrain even if it does not also qualify as difficult terrain or, through the use of abilities, doesn't count as difficult terrain for me?

Seems like it would be nearly useless if it also had to be difficult terrain. In 30 years of roleplaying, I can count on one hand how many times I've had such difficult terrain right next to an unaware enemy that I wanted to ambush.


yea its a bit wierd, or(jokingly) paiso's definition of difficult terrain is anything directly outside the deer path, paved road, flat dungeon tiles :p


Ravingdork wrote:
Can you use Terrain Stalker without difficult terrain?

Yes. It's not a game term in this case.


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Terrain Stalker wrote:
Select one type of difficult terrain from the following list: rubble, snow, or underbrush. While undetected by all non-allies in that type of terrain, you can Sneak without attempting a Stealth check

"that type of terrain" is referring to "one type of difficult terrain" chosen earlier in the sentence. So yes, it does have to be difficult terrain.

The only other argument is that the wording is unclear and it is the non-allies that need to be in the chosen type of difficult terrain, rather than you.

But that doesn't make nearly as much sense.


I will also note that the rules don't say that you have to be affected by the difficult terrain. Just that it is designated as such generally.

So if you have some ability to ignore difficult terrain of that type, then you could still use Terrain Stalker in that terrain without having your movement speed impacted or being prevented from using Step.


Finoan wrote:
Terrain Stalker wrote:
Select one type of difficult terrain from the following list: rubble, snow, or underbrush. While undetected by all non-allies in that type of terrain, you can Sneak without attempting a Stealth check

"that type of terrain" is referring to "one type of difficult terrain" chosen earlier in the sentence. So yes, it does have to be difficult terrain.

The only other argument is that the wording is unclear and it is the non-allies that need to be in the chosen type of difficult terrain, rather than you.

But that doesn't make nearly as much sense.

Very much so. It's the hiding in deep snow, heavy bushes, stone rubble feat. There needs to be obstacles in the way that are passable but require effort to get through, you know how to put those obstacles to use by moving ever so slowly through them.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

So if it's necessary...then how often does it actually come in play?

I'm not sure I've ever seen it happen when run that strictly.


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It is mostly an exploration mode type of ability. Since exploration mode often doesn't have a tactical map to use...

Yeah, this ability is very GM dependent on how often it will be able to be used.

Does furniture in a room count as 'rubble'? Does boxes and barrels on a wharf?


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
OrochiFuror wrote:


Very much so. It's the hiding in deep snow, heavy bushes

Minor quibble, but the feat doesn't use words like 'deep' or 'heavy' ... adding those adjectives makes them sound rarer or more specific than they're written to be.


It's as rare as you make it. Difficult terrain, how ever you want to describe it, is a tool for the GM to use. I'd say most GMs likely don't bother often because it wouldn't be a positive time investment to the story, but it shouldn't be that rare. If you've ever gone hiking you likely know how often you come across stuff you'd rather just go around. If your not on a path of some sort, it should be fairly common, both as tiny spots and small to modest areas.


Ravingdork wrote:

Can you use Terrain Stalker without difficult terrain? If there are bushes, snow or rubble, you can use the ability. Even if the terrain is not considered difficult due to other effects, the ability works. The main thing is to be in the selected environment. In any case, I have not played Starfinder for a long time. The interest has disappeared, and the campaigns are over. Lately, I have become interested in other things. I started reading about games and bonuses here and nothing else attracts me. Even the fact that Starfinder continues to be updated, this will not make me start playing again. Even if the game is good, it is difficult to return without a team and inspiration. So for me, Starfinder is a thing of the past.

You only need to select a terrain type from the list. The rule does not require that the terrain you select be actually difficult.

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