OrochiFuror's page

Organized Play Member. 234 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 1 Organized Play character.


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I think on the mechanical side they are a bit weak, all ranged weapons are, and they suffer from not working well with the highest optimal dpr of attacking twice per round. It's very strange even at lower levels of hitting for 9 damage one round then critting for 32 the next.

As for the theme, we don't actually have cowboys at all. Maybe in a future book, but Alkenstar is all steampunk/clockwork and has no wild West themes. Otherwise I think they fit in, we perhaps have too much guy with gun takes on an army in modern media and not enough guy gets shot and cleaves the shooter with a greatsword. Because nearly everyone seems to think one bullet will always take someone out. That should only be true if your making one of those bad action flicks where one kick takes someone out of a fight for a minute so you can take on the rest of the goon horde.

Skalgrim recently did a video on guns in fantasy and part of his conclusion was he would rather be hit by a lever action rifle then a battleax. In that regard I agree, but considering how much movement everyone in PF2 has to make the best of ranged weapons you need to actually fight at long range, 100+ feet at least.
Longer engagements and more flying/wall crawling enemies would help. Ranged combat is situational and having your whole shtick be a situation that doesn't shine often can be a drag.

I have a wrestler barbarian I want to play sometime.
It will always have nice damage, but it's highest damage feat setup doesn't finish until 20. Starts using the fighting style I prefer at 5.
It's resist all physical doesn't start until 9.
Auto hit grab at 4 with less then great chance of success, upgrading to much better at 12.
Thrash at 8 and collateral at 16.

So generic Dragon barb until 4 or 5, then steadily layering on upgrades to smash and grab and smash more fighting.
I want to play this to see if it's fun or if too much is waiting for certain levels to shine.

My dragon druid I put through FotRP would have failed my concept until 12, that's much worse IMO. I really want more 11-20 APs because of things like this, it's just more enjoyable.

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Wrap up all four limbs, feet and hands, the magic goes through the body to connect all four(maybe five of you want to include the head with a headband or similar) and thus connects with all your chakras to infuse your body with magic. That's how I see it working with all the non fist attacks we have.

If someone looks at you with detect magic you might even look like you have "the glow" from The Last Dragon. Magic coats your whole body to make your hits land better and stronger.

My first read through was good. Now that I'm doing a more in-depth read for the videos I'm making, I'm failing to keep them shorter videos even while skipping lots of things to give people reason to buy it. So much interesting stuff to talk about.

Depends on your group. If you can damage things down, CC or mitigate well then just baseline medicine with feats is fine for most fights. Maybe have the group all take godless healing for more reliable in combat healing.
Spell healing is a crutch that is only really useful for when things go wrong. Casting healing instead of CC and force multiplying effects is often a waste of time and resources, but it's great to have when you come up against something that your group will struggle with.

No matter what you do don't try to be a healbot, make sure you are doing other things first and try to get a feel for how much healing you might need to pick up. Too much is better then not enough, but having been in a powerhouse group with a cleric who did nothing half the time waiting to heal (he did attack and get some amazing crit kills, but chance to hit was so low) that it can often extend fights that are otherwise too quick to use slots on.

One thing to keep in mind is how long Every exploration activity takes. 10 minutes. You walk into a room, win the encounter, then take ten minutes. You medicine, refocus, search, identify, etc. The game almost tells you to take ten in every room, do your most important thing unless your all set and then you help search.

Personally I think if you need to collapse fights that might not otherwise come together to make a challenge, you might need to think on why those fights are there in the first place. Fights should either be challenging in one way or another or they need to be set pieces that tie into the story. I know there's a fair amount of AP fights that are just cakewalks with the idea it makes players feel good to get a victory. That's fine once in a great while, otherwise if those fights aren't setting up story hooks or fun interesting situations then they are just wasting your players time.

You can't hyper focus a character in to focus spell spam so it's fine if you miss a refocus once every few fights, but only getting it once in a while can make things like a wildshape or clinging shadows initiate build feel kinda terrible.

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In my homebrew I already add on some cultural and biological traits to make kobolds more interesting.

I've never used the alignment system since even as a child I saw how bad it was for anything other then actual beings made of good/evil, so I've never seen kobolds as evil, even in 3rd edition. They are considered evil because they exemplify some bad human quolities, greed and xenophobia. People call them cowardly because they are afraid of creatures three times(often much more) then their own size that often want to kill them, go figure.

I think there's plenty of room to keep all that and putting a better spin on it. Hoarders who don't value personal ownership of things, everything they take is for their tribe. They see themselves as heirs to draconic power, thus other creatures are lesser and they tend to only get along with like minded people so often keep to their own little groups.
Add in a bit more and you can really make it your own. Like having them act similar to Minions.
Hope to see that sometime, kobolds #1.

Fairly sure a wild elf or lizardfolk run kingdom would be right up a druids ally. Living in trees or under water, using the environment instead of replacing it.
Even if you are the odd one out and everyone else wants ye old standard stone wall kingdom, you could be the Merlin to your groups Arthur, there to give advice on the off times and assistance during trouble.

Likely a hold over from D&D where economy and money have never been well thought out, so people often think it's ok to talk merchants down.
Tell them that stores set prices, if you want to haggle, go to the market, but don't expect to be able to find everything you want from small sellers.

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Frozen sea, level 3 earth/water lizardfolk.
Flexible blasts, winters clutch, stone shield, tidal hands.

4 encounters so far. First was spent just trying not to hit friendlies with my aura, two round fight so I did nothing.

Second was over before I entered the room, I was last in almost every fight.

Third was rough, a little ranged damage in a small space, failed to judge when to stone block(second enemy didn't attack me), standing still and trying to block to avoid AoO, finally tidal hands and enemy rolled a one so felt great. With nearly any other roll it would have been much less enjoyable I think.

Fourth(boss) fight was brutal, put up aura then was downed before second turn. Group basically TPKd if not for GM allowing sly player idea to work, so poorly made fight that doesn't really reflect anything.

I like the things I can do, but so far feels like I'm fighting against handcuffs to do them. I can't start with my aura or an aoe and then raise shield, so I'm rather squishy as a con/str based character. Hard to decide to block first attack that hits you and thus lose the shield protection that might deflect other attacks.
Battles to short right now to get my kit rolling.

In a mostly ranged group, so my damage shouldn't feel low, but with at least one gun user critting per combat or the ranger swapping to a reach weapon, it does feel a bit underwhelming so far.
Hopefully some better fights next time.

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If those actions are the normal hostile actions they would take, ie getting in your face and flanking you, or taking cover, then no you are not posing any additional threat that any other ranged character wouldn't do better.

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Aoe only matters of you are reducing the number of hits your martials need to kill things. If your Martials need 4 strikes to down something before and after your aoe, then you did nothing.
Let's also not forget that getting more then one aoe off per combat is tricky, if enemies aren't rushing at you or spreading out so you can keep hitting them without hitting friendlies, then your GM might be going easy on you.

WatersLethe wrote:

1. Martial Sorcerer that isn't a Bloodrager. Focus on using the physical abilities, attacks, and themes of a type of creature without being a spellcaster. Good fit for anyone that wants to lean into a more monstrous ancestry as well as shapeshifters. See: Draconic Ravager

Using your bloodline to make you stronger. Martial power with casting options if the creature tends to cast spells. Feats that gradually turn you into the creature of your bloodline by taking on similar features. Awakening the blood to eventually have all the monstrous qualities of that creature. Go from lightly resembling the creature, to being a half breed and finally full on being one of those creatures.

I've wanted this since sorcerers first showed up, the idea has always been part of the class, just so little has been done with it.

Having gone against a creature before it was fixed to target multiple enemies, yes, it's way too strong to multi flurry with no MAP increase to a single target.
Combining double slice with FoB in an activity with all the upsides and none of the downsides is crazy powerful. Almost downed a blocking champion in one round, that was a bad fight.

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Answer is ask your GM.

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Darksol the Painbringer wrote:
Fumarole wrote:
Being able to take a shielded tome into a situation where a shield would be suspect is not useless. Combine this with spirit sheath and your magus is fully prepared for combat while not appearing to be.
This is a pretty niche benefit and feels more like for GM tools than anything. Players aren't very likely to build towards always looking like they are helpless just to trick hapless fools or infiltrate neutral zones undetected.

Unless that's the flavor of your adventure, or you get captured, that's a trope that happens a lot. Or your blending into a high society event, or trying to avoid suspicion, or doing a diplomatic mission, etc.

It might not be your groups kinda thing, but I always prefer my characters to either look threatening even without gear, or to look like a commoner who can Shazam.

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Only Eidolons get to make skill checks or do anything outside of combat at the same time as their summoner because of Act Together, minions take your action to do a thing so it's either you go or they do.

Kobold traps. Companion items, more then twice what we have hopefully. Mid and high level items that are interesting and do fun things. Ways to scale items up yet still have higher level versions be worth the price. More relic options. More niche options, like spellhearts, tomes, monk weapons, beastguns, etc. Higher level versions of items that are mid tier, like druid vestments and gorget of the primal roar, not being able to upgrade to a +3 version when my other items are feels bad when I love the effects these items do.

Depends on your group. Ranging from just summarize the chat and how those characters feel to play act using two different voices. As always don't hog the spotlight or waste people's time, just do things that will show each is their own distinct character with different views.
If your group is fine with the latter then your arguments or conversations should be inviting, leave room for other players to join in and help steer where that story beat is going. It's an opportunity for other characters to get to know yours and help them grow. If you take the spotlight, make sure it's with good reason, that your offering something new and engaging to the group. If your demon(tiefling)/angel(aasimar) characters are arguing about the nature of good and evil for the tenth time, best make it a two or three second side comment at most.
You can communicate telepathically with your Eidolon, so anything said out loud should be of significance.

keftiu wrote:
OrochiFuror wrote:
Cool character… but what Dark Archive options are they using?

Someone mentioned lich, and I had an idea for that. Otherwise, I got lost, wrong thread.

Haven't figured a name yet. But when the new Kingmaker comes out, I plan on playing a time dragon.
Was exploring Sarkoris with his mate when the world wound opened, getting caught up in the invasion and captured. Tortured and experimented on for a hundred years, watched his mate die, and was left diseased and dying when the fifth crusade started to cause a stir. Used the aeternal ritual to cure the demonic disease and aid in his escape. Carefully making his way to the south east, as he knew soon enough a new kingdom would rise. He would use this opportunity to grow strong, support the leaders of this kingdom to get the resources he would need to accomplish his one goal, to find the remains of his mate, in Sarkoris or even in the abyss.
The Dominic disease stole his immortality, so now he secretly delves into necromancy to make his own trustworthy servants and pawns, though still holding his own as a magus. Researching the only way he knows to get his immortality back, all just to ensure he has the time to finish his quest, no matter the cost.
Dragon magus, ravager and mage, pickup reanimator and lich for that dark flavor.

Party composition can make or break a group. You have to know what your group can and can't do and devise tactics that work for your group.
Champion +fighter in the group, you can tank and spank like olden times.
Monk +some other martial, you might need to invest the group in speed to skirmish, do hit and run, use control spells and manuevers.

You need to figure out what an optimal setup for your group looks like, and that might not be easy. Different classes bring different tools, you might even have a combo that doesn't work well together or a character didn't choose certain options that would work well with the current group.
Luckily if it's just pure number problems, your GM can just put the weakened effect on things to even the numbers out if everyone is having a problem. Or do that yourself, have intimidate on a couple characters, build to demoralize as it gives a negative to all rolls and DCs an enemy has. Figure out the ways to stick or reapply frightened to creatures to keep that negative on them.

A split diamond turned into a locket. Perhaps keep some pictures in it. Throw in with other valuable items in what ever murder hole hidaway. Keep it durable but simple, plan for it to be taken at some point but do your best to prevent that.

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Like everything, we just ground it down with brute force, was very frustrating and not fun to be told you have to roll a 20 in a specific skill (only one of us had trained or above in) or damage keeps incoming.

Would love to hear how your battles go, we just finished book 2 last night. Thought we had a challenge with a rather large enemy but a fighter crit followed by rogue critting disintegrate put that hope down.

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Ever since AD&D I always start on page one and go to the end, paying less attention to less interesting parts or power/feat lists that I will go over when making a character that uses such things. I've always had the mindset of, I paid money for this, I best get the most use out of it by at least letting it inspire my creativity even if I don't ever get to use it in a game.

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Sanityfaerie wrote:

Something that I'd *like* to see but am almost certain I never will is the old 3.x transformational class concept, but as full classes rather than archetypes. Like, oozemorph - you're slowly becoming more and more of an ooze, but it's a full-on class (probably martial). Dragon Disciple - you're slowly becoming more and more dragon, but it's a full class (probably a wave caster). Give me some sort of full-class aberrant thing that would let me sink deep into the weird and grappling people with enormously long tentacles while their minds shatter under the exposure and whatnot.


This to me is what the sorcerer should be. Not just other wizard that's spontaneous with a little other flavor, I've always hated that.

Really go deep into the awakening your blood aspect of it. You should get the associated heritage feat (if one exists) for your type and gain access to those feats (perhaps even earlier) and eventually end up becoming as close to a full blooded version of that creature as you can. Fiend, celestial, azata, dragon, ooze, aberration, fey, etc.
All the options we have for such now, archetypes and heritages, are significantly hampered by the fact you can pair them with any class.

There's lots of different transformation tropes to be filled, I prefer one that focuses on one creature and permanently becoming that thing. Hopefully some day we could see something that focuses on that.

All martials can get status bonus to damage with dread martial stance.
It's in an easy to get archetype just like heaven's thunder.
It gives 1 damage per weapon die.
Monastic weapons monk who wants damage, especially with free archetype, could get both the +1-4 from dread martial and +1(or +2)-+4(or +8) with heaven's thunder.

Fighters already double dip this way though with fearsome brute, so...

I once put fire resist on a character before entering a field of explosive fire flowers because I knew our bard was going to somehow screw everything up and get us killed. Low and behold he gets eaten by a plant and panic casts fireball. I was the only one to walk away with single digit damage. The group was very unhappy with him but after we tongue lashed him for a while we continued on.
If your group expects that sort of thing from a character, then let it go. If it's either repeated constantly, ruining others fun, or seems malicious, then put a stop to it.

To play a wild shape druid you need to talk with your GM and make sure your on the same page.
Discuss when you can use the +2 status bonus to hit, if you use your property runes, if you use your weapon specialization, if you can do anything other then the attacks listed on the forms, etc.

If you can use the +2 bonus anytime you wild shape, then 16 STR is going to be needed to hit.
Picking up monk for FoB at 10 is often good.
Dex is always good for reflex as casters have bad saves.
Temp HP from forms is very small so CON is very important along side more of those bad saves.
WIS might be important if you blast, something primal has a lot of, or plan to do counteract for bad effects. If no one in your group can undo bad effects then it will be part of your job, or any thing that might effect an enemy because even with max WIS success rates are usually 50/50ish.
Reactive transformation at 14 can save you from wasting turns on wild shape.
If you blast, overwhelming energy at 10 can help getting through resistances if those tend to be a problem in your game.

Overall don't expect too much from it, and get a good feeling of what your party can do so you know when you want to save spell slots and use two actions (often making the turn a waste if you didn't position properly) to become a martial-light character.

From what I've played and seen played.
Summoner, fighter, barbarian, rogue and monk.
Least favorite is alchemist, wizard, sorcerer, witch, swashbuckler.

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I love FA. I think talking about what might be too powerful is rather subjective. Nothing really breaks the system other then some extreme edge cases, and even then there's only so much you can do. There's several layers of power prevention, so even if you dual class and FA there's still a limit on what you can do. The combos that become too much are obvious things you can avoid.
I've never made a FA character where I could get everything I wanted, so saying that playing without it makes you have harder choices makes no sense to me.
My group uses a slightly different ruling that you can't use multiclass archetypes with FA, maybe that makes a difference.

Take inspiration from older editions, you need to be "this" smart to even start figuring out wizardry, you want to actually make it into spell levels, you need to be exceptionally gifted.
Wizardry is like getting your doctorate, even if you drop out early after 6 years and just have a cantrip or two, is that going to benefit you enough to make a career in your life? Are others going to want to make that attempt if they aren't sure they can manage it? Looking at cost, opportunity, capability and the drive/ambition to get through it, I think it's easy to see why even those who could benefit from some wizardry don't bother, especially when you look at all the other ways cantrips are available.

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AoA was rough because there were custom made or upleveled creatures that just broke every sense of balance that you suddenly get punched in the face. Six attacks at -2, two action aoe damage every round in confined spaces, regen that's turned off by a rather rare damage type, they aren't bosses either so they come in packs.

AV was alright, not a fan of dungeons and didn't enjoy my character.

FotRP is great so far, a bit easy but fun if you like making friends by fighting them.

Grankless wrote:
Does the ROgue have Opportune Backstab? That's probably pound for pound the best reaction attack in the game. PLus Gang Up exists.

Rogue uses a bow, so none of that applies.

Just did the day 2 event last night. I think our GM put elite on everything, not sure. For the first two thirds of the event, my Dragon form standing in the open surrounded was the only thing taking any damage, but with champion backup it wasn't anything to note. The last section though, the rogue got low from being ranged focused and I got very low from being piled on, but then

a thing happens:
massive heal bomb from the statue
and so overall felt like there was barely any danger.

Our GM concluded last night that it was made this way to ensure the PCs get into the tournament proper no matter what. But I feel that being handed a victory diminishes its value.
I do wonder how these fights turn out for other groups though.

SuperBidi wrote:

Also, I just showed this build to illustrate how the combination of Summoner + Eidolon can pull out skill tricks that no other class can do. It's clearly not the only trick the Summoner can do, it may be interesting to make a list. But definitely the Summoner class has a lot of tricks, and even if it looks like small exploits and super specialized things, I think it's very important to the class as a whole.

For me, the Summoner is a bit like the Alchemist: They require quite some system mastery to get the best out of them.

Presuming your GM allows Eidolons to hold/wear mundane items.

Double battle medicine on themselves every hour.
Having summoner and Eidolon with battle medicine and godless healing. Lots of healing potential and flexibility, heal your front line and your backline.
Sometimes neat tricks are all you need to have fun and/or be more effective.

I'm very disappointed in myself that I didn't keep up with the updates and missed the playtest. Now I shall wait with high levels of hype induced anxiety.

Pirate Rob wrote:
Why do you think your fighter is so far above the expected power curve?

He can usually keep everything he targets with frightened 2 and flat footed. Same with the paladin. Paladin also gives a reaction attack so they both have attack chains of -0, -0, -5 and then shield/parry. Each have a bonus reaction AoO/shield block, as well. So they work together amazingly well. Fighter also has Your next to keep the fear chain going. Add in dread marshal for damage and more frightened in the off chance the other options don't stick.

As for the comments on team size, I said we had 5 people in AV, and we had trouble there when it wasn't scaled up for 5 people, we lost the cleric and so we're down to a group of four. But the rogue and I (druid) could just stay out of most of the fights and it wouldn't matter. The fighter and paladin took out both the boss fights I mentioned before we could engage.

Good to hear the fights in book 2 might be better. Even with increasing team sizes and giving elite templates our GM is a little frustrated that we just bulldoze everything. He's also starting to come around to the idea of making enemy teams ambush and use better tactics on us I think, heh. More teams need obvious tactics or gimicks, we went against a team that did trips and had bonus damage to prone so that was interesting.

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I'm wondering if anyone else is finding danger island far too easy? My group started with 5 people going through AV and we lost one fight and nearly died 2 other times. We lost our cleric and I swapped from swashbuckler to a druid for FotRP. For most of these fights, our fighter and paladin could handle them without the rogue and I.

I accept that our fighters build puts him way above the power most are going to have but is that enough to just break these encounters? We went up against both a Dragon and legendary reptile, these were both four or five levels above us and neither lasted 2 whole rounds. First one I cast haste on the rogue, who missed all his attacks, so neither of us did anything for that fight, the second I wild shaped and moved and that's it.

Our GM has started adding in extra enemies but it doesn't really seem to matter, against two 8 enemy groups that were level -1 or -2 I was able to do some nice aoe damage but still the only damage done to the group was against the rogue and I, the fighter and paladin just cut through everything that comes up to them and they mitigate nearly all damage to them.

So I'm wondering if most of these fights are soft ball stuff compared to things like AV and AoA? Or is having martials that can easily keep frightened 2 and flat footed on their targets just force multipliers that trivialize most encounters? Are the other books more difficult or should I let my GM know he's going to have to scale every fight we do up? On that note won't we eventually level faster if we are fighting harder/more opponents and thus run into more trouble?

So far I think I love these bigger fights against larger groups, I don't know how many my GM is adding to these fights, but they are far more enjoyable then anything in AV or the later half of AoA that I played.
I'm interested in others experience with the fights they have run into. We just finished day 2, so there is likely still more interesting things to come.

I would rather only play 11-20 games. When you take on the fact that the majority of games die out before even reaching mid levels, it makes more sense to make a character that has lots of options to work how you want and play them instead of starting at level 1 and never getting anywhere.

The answer to what do you do for the earlier levels is what ever you want. Treat it as more backstory.

My current druid would have been boring to play until near mid levels. Her whole story is that her Dragon shape is her true form that she can only take for short periods due to a curse, as she gets stronger she over comes the limitations. I get great new options every level while my earlier levels are kinda mismatched setup to make the end result better.

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Eoran wrote:

Hmm... The AC bonus is still increased with character level. And the attack bonus is a minimum. When my own unarmed attack bonus is higher I would still use that. The damage is fixed and unchanging which is unfortunate but not a critical problem.

But I will have a lot of time between now and level 10 to decide.

The AC doesn't include proficiency or magic items as you level, so it will just keep getting farther and farther behind. Also the damage is a big deal as every time the rest of the group gets better striking runes, you fall behind, as well as weapon specialization. So forms don't scale well offensively or defensively without being heightened.

Wind to thy wings.
I expect greater and greater things (AKA more Dragon stuff). See how you push the boundaries of the system. I've only been following Paizo stuff since PF2 released and I've gotten the impression many of your interests are similar to mine, so I'm eager to see what you continue to make.
Hopefully a better work environment will stimulate more creativity, if not then that's fine too, enjoy it.

Pulling out two wands is no different then two weapons, weapon + shield or a two handed weapon so at worst it's a non issue at best you have the option of not pulling out your wands and doing other things, having more options to deal with situations is always good.

Summoner damage is roughly the same as a two handed fighter attacking twice, spending more actions most likely but you have more options of things to do.

To an earlier question though, the things I don't like about summoner.
1: the Eidolon doesn't interact with anything. Depending on how you read the rules, they can't use any or most items, don't interact with weapon and armor choices, don't interact with a lot of your own gear and don't interact with archetypes. These are all things that are inherent customization options for PC's, Eidolon's getting none of it is rough, especially archetypes, there's no interesting ways to combo abilities with your Eidolon so as more options are released for martial characters, there will be more niches they could fill while your Eidolon is still doing what it's always done.

2: support. There's hardly any item support for Eidolon's, I think we could fix the issue of them not working with a lot of your gear by making some for them.
There's not a lot of feats specific to each type of Eidolon. Devotion is the only one I think, why aren't there 2 or 3 for each type to let you really help emphasize the creature your Eidolon is.

3: Eidolon abilities. Most types have one good ability and then maybe one alright and one rather poor ability overall. Just feels strange that many aren't just a bit better.

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Most of those negatives are actually positives.
What other martial can go down in melee and have their body be up to 100 feet away, likely safe from aoe damage that could kill you.
When you and your Eidolon get hit by aoe, no matter what you roll one of you gets a crit save.

I got to level 18 with the updated playtest, it was good but had some issues.
Really want to play with the final version.
PBAoE Fireball -1d6 for a focus spell.
Fast healing as a focus spell.
Good size and reach increases.
Elemental damage choices.
Free exploration activity.
Extra lower level spells.

With free archetype bard you are almost a better bard in every way. Better economy to inspire/dirge while still being a capable martial.
Always keep a haste wand at the ready and what ever your other favorite spell might be. Sneak into combat for a good chance of winning innitiative, cast haste and protect companion/Reinforce or Eidolon cast shield, move into combat or get a better position to flank. If you get attacked unexpected transposition to put your tank right in combat and move up/time jump/blink charge on your turn into flanking, then buff/debuff and make attacks. Then buff/debuff, boost and make 3+ attacks/add in free knockdown to make the last attack better and give you and your martial a free aoa.
Or sneak in, wrath and any of those defense options, transpose if you get swarmed, then get back to buff/debuff and attack.
Or chain lightning/eclipse burst as an opening and then start in with the usual.
Blink charge/dimension door/time jump to an out of reach/backline ranged enemy.

If all your doing is trying to be a bulldozer, then I can see how it's less effective then a fighter, but then so is just about everything else. You can build to have interesting and effective options for when you need them.
Since you can have two wands out and still do well in melee, coupled with the action economy advantage, I feel summoner does the best for being a gish compared to other options.

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Ed Reppert wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
TBH I never liked halflings since I don't know what a ling is.
Well, as someone said upthread, a type of fish is one meaning of the word "ling", but the suffix "-ling" is a diminutive, so a halfling is a small half. :-)

So, like a quarter then? Or a 5/12ths sort of situation?

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The number of Kobold characters I play might drop significantly once dragons come out, but going from 60% down to 30% and still being in second place says a lot.
Also once I play a Dragon I might need a party of Kobold minnio- I mean compatriots for gold gathering commission's.

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More defenders.
Better options for full casters(feats and new classes/archetypes).
Martial focus powers, we already have dailies and once per hour type stuff, just give some super flourishes.
Fixes to core issues, like wildshape.

Deflecting shot is the best add AC on reaction abilities in the game, it only triggers when you would turn a hit into a miss. If you can work around a shoot then reload routine every round, it can come in handy.

Mark Seifter wrote:

I could see those five dragons in a party and it would be fractious, but interesting. In my head, they probably all let the red say she is the leader while the blue is manipulating things behind the scenes, the sea is going around assisting in really grandiose ways that build the group's renown, the silver is making sure they stick to their cause, and the magma is kind of rushing into things.

What a dynamic! :D

When I ran Council of Wyrms oh so long ago we had a red, gold, amethyst and copper the group. The red and gold players were half brothers. The copper just looked for ways to brighten the mood and explore to find fun things, the amethyst tried to either keep the peace or keep out of the way, the red declared himself the group leader and tried to use the group as his own work force for increasing his hoard, the gold undermined the red constantly and humored him like you would a child so they got into arguments often. It was very enjoyable, but like all games when I was young it didn't last long. Eventually one of the brothers did something foolish, as he was prone to do, and it caused things to spiral out of control, the argument turned into a fight the amethyst and copper had to break up and so I said the council broke the group up as it seems they could not work together.

Would love to have another all Dragon game sometime.
My favorite is always going to be silver dragons, I can't wait to read more about elemental and planer dragons though.

Having the ritual so that you can fit these options into the rules is all fine, I'm just saying it doesn't fit into my 3.5 Dragon I played at all, there's no place for such a thing in his story. That's the first character I plan on playing with these rules, then my AD&D character. Just not a fan of hard coded rules that leave little room for stories. That's why the summoner was so great, your story is what ever you want it to be. It's why I hate necromancy always being evil just because of the way souls work, when one of my favorite characters (that as usual I didn't get to play long) was a cleric/wizard who worshipped a goddess who had a portfolio of love and undeath.
If I had a steady group of friends to play with, it likely wouldn't be a problem, but presenting ideas that are just shut down by certain rules or lore to random groups you join tends to be a nonstarter.
Hopefully it's presented as the usual way Dragon progression is quickened, not the only way.

Karmagator wrote:

Age categories being largely irrelevant is something that is actually baked into the "adventuring dragon" variant we will be playing! To become an adventuring dragon, they perform a ritual that transforms their magic and the inherent "potential" that usually comes with a dragon's age. All of that goes straight into their veins (sort of) and allows them to powerlevel like normal adventurers. So you can absolutely have a 50 year old youngster that can easily dunk on adults or even ancients. That messes with some stuff that needs said magic, though, so you will be weaker initially and maybe not get everything a regular dragon gets, especially immunities.

The hoard mechanics we don't know a lot about, but on the kickstarter it says they will be guidelines for advancing your dragon's power by building a hoard, rather than buying equipment. So probably something like a combination of the monster part system's imbuing and refining tables, but purely based on how much exactly your bling is worth. Can't wait for that ^^

We'll see how it turns out in the final version, but my first impression of having a ritual that any Dragon can do to fast track their power, even with what ever negatives or side effects it might have, is very poor. It doesn't sound like something that fits into any of my ideas of dragons or how they function.

Would that I could find a group of like minded players, as my draconic fanaticism borders on pushing "I only play human" type players away. Council of Wyrms was the best setting.

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