What Books Do You Want?

[Xenocrat]

Neither the TM nor Mechanic were “better at tech” in any meaningful way in the SF1 CRB (hi, Operative) so no change.

[Ares04]

I’d love a lore line, even if it were soft covers like the old PF1 line. Would be cool to have a flow of ideas.

FallenDabus wrote:

Pretty straight forwards... what books do you want to see after Starfinder 2e launches? Both as an interesting thing to talk about and in hopes that the 2e team sees your list and thinks its a good idea.

1) Planar book. I've heard this one was planned for 1e before the OGL/ORC debacle pushed it in favour of 2e. Starfinder is a very planar-heavy setting including FTL that takes you through planes other than the Drift, so it really feels like we need this one.

2) Pact World Species. Oppertunity to get plenty of new species into the game, as well as flesh out the core species that never got the spotlight in 1e.

3) Pact World Gods. Galatic Magic is a thing, but I would really love to have a deeper dive on the gods and faiths of Startfinder. Ideally something like Inner Sea Gods rather than LO Gods & Magic (which is great, but I love those in depth summaries)

4) Some sort of lore line analagous to the Lost Omens line for Pathfinder. We do have the Pact World and Near Space books, but it feels like there is a lot more to explore on every planet. Plus, it would give use an oppertunity to go deep on other planets and systems outside the big two.

5) Azlanti Star Empire. Think this one is pretty obvious. They are big recurring villans and we've seen some glimpses inside the Empire, but I'd love to see more.

[QuidEst]

Metaphysician wrote:

Milo v3 wrote:

Pagan priest wrote:

People keep mentioning technomancer and mechanic, but those both need to be in the 1st book released.

As far as we are aware, those two classes aren't core for 2e.

Yes, which is a major design flaw for 2e. Its like making a D&D edition where "Fighter" does not exist in the core rules. "Character who is good with tech" is as core a part of the science fiction premise as "Character who is good with swords" is for a fantasy premise. Leaving it out as if its something unimportant is. . . not promising.

I can get where this is coming from, but wow do I disagree. "Character who is good with tech" needs tech first.

I want a Technomancer that feels like a Technomancer. They put the class in the first book for SF1, and it was a bit bland as a result, with very limited ability to actually interact with tech until later books. The spell list picked up a lot of the slack there, of course, and we got more options later. Now that casters don't have custom spell lists to lean on, the class really needs some time to cook, because almost all of its technomancy flavor needs to come from class features and feats. Technomancer needed an enhanced version, and Alchemist needed a remaster- I think that putting the gear-interaction class in core has a poor track record for a reason.

Mechanic has some of the same thing going on. You could put something like the Inventor together now, sure. But if weapon balance changes, then weapon Mechanic will be getting released without the proper playtesting, which usually means skewing weak out of caution. Plus, a big chunk of sci-fi Mechanics, and some of the most famous, are the ones who keep starships running. Having vehicles and ships in place, orat least developed alongside, will avoid those options needing to be tacked on.

In short, until we actually get more tech ironed out, the best you can reliably have is classes with skill bonuses and tricks. That's more Envoy and Operative specialization territory. I'd rather have SF2 take longer and do better than SF1, than have it put out quick tech classes that get overshadowed.

[Zoken44]

So this might seem like a hairsplitting question but... do we know they won't be core?

I mean we know they won't be in the play test material, but all of that is PLAYTEST. It's all subject to change after the playtest runs it's course. Like, I don't know about anyone else, but I don't expect the 6 classes they're play testing to keep their Key ability scores as all six different attribute modifiers after play test. I wasn't around for the PF2e playtest, but did they release all the available options in there?

[Xenocrat]

We don't know, but it would be very odd to playtest the tech as used by other classes but not actually tech-interacting class features for Techno and Mechanic.

They seem to want to have hybrid books of lore, mechanics, and with every book having some new ancestries, so I'd expect the first unique release (not an Alien Archive) after the CRB drops to be some combination of Tech Revolution/Armory/and Guns and Gears: Techno/Mechanic classes and archetypes, tech lore, new gear, and some robotic/tech related ancestries.

[Sanityfaerie]

Zoken44 wrote:

So this might seem like a hairsplitting question but... do we know they won't be core?

I mean we know they won't be in the play test material, but all of that is PLAYTEST. It's all subject to change after the playtest runs it's course. Like, I don't know about anyone else, but I don't expect the 6 classes they're play testing to keep their Key ability scores as all six different attribute modifiers after play test. I wasn't around for the PF2e playtest, but did they release all the available options in there?

They're not going to add a class without playtesting it. They've learned that lesson.

As such, including a class in core without including that same class in playtest would mean pausing the release of Core while they ran another playtest just for that class. That would be really very expensive in a number of meaningful ways - not just raw money.

Essentially, it would be a significant mistake on their part, one way or the other, and Paizo has learned how to not make mistakes like that.

[QuidEst]

Zoken44 wrote:

So this might seem like a hairsplitting question but... do we know they won't be core?

I mean we know they won't be in the play test material, but all of that is PLAYTEST. It's all subject to change after the playtest runs it's course. Like, I don't know about anyone else, but I don't expect the 6 classes they're play testing to keep their Key ability scores as all six different attribute modifiers after play test. I wasn't around for the PF2e playtest, but did they release all the available options in there?

The classes being tested are the core rulebook classes. There might be more core classes later, like PC2.

[Pagan priest]

Sanityfaerie wrote:

Zoken44 wrote:

So this might seem like a hairsplitting question but... do we know they won't be core?

I mean we know they won't be in the play test material, but all of that is PLAYTEST. It's all subject to change after the playtest runs it's course. Like, I don't know about anyone else, but I don't expect the 6 classes they're play testing to keep their Key ability scores as all six different attribute modifiers after play test. I wasn't around for the PF2e playtest, but did they release all the available options in there?

They're not going to add a class without playtesting it. They've learned that lesson.

As such, including a class in core without including that same class in playtest would mean pausing the release of Core while they ran another playtest just for that class. That would be really very expensive in a number of meaningful ways - not just raw money.

Essentially, it would be a significant mistake on their part, one way or the other, and Paizo has learned how to not make mistakes like that.

Not having those classes in the initial book would also be a huge mistake.

[Sanityfaerie]

Pagan priest wrote:

Not having those classes in the initial book would also be a huge mistake.

You are incorrect.

The core book has enough classes to build a solid adventuring party. You've got a class for tanks, a class for ranged DPR, a class for nonmagical support, a class for melee DPR, a heal/buff caster class and a "mess with the enemy" caster class. That's enough to set up and run a game. The game at that point is viable.

Rushing the Mechanic and Technomancer before they're ready would damage those two classes. It would make them worse overall, and the damage that it would do is not the kind that's easy to fix with errata. Letting them wait has a lot of benefits. It means that they can get a bit more focus, it means that there's more feedback about how SF2 plays, it means that they get their own playtest period to work with, and it means that there will be time for the designers to set more bricks in place to support them properly. Letting them show up a year or so later than the rest will mean that we have a better Technomancer and a better Mechanic for the entire rest of SF2's lifespan. That has value.

Now, you crave these classes? Okay. Sure. Fine. You won't play the game without them? Also fine. SF1 is still there, and it has gobs of stuff written for it. It's entirely reasonable to say "I'm not going to make the switch until they bring back my favorite class. There's nothing wrong with that.

...and when they do bring them back, the fact that that extra time was taken is going to mean that those classes will be more satisfying to play.

[Zoken44]

Given the similarities to the other classes, i can see why they might want to focus down on these two. Need to make sure the Mechanic doesn't play like the inventor. Need to make sure the Technomancer doesn't play like the wizard (as it was kind of designed to in sf1e) make sure it lives up to his own lore mechanically.

But, there are 6 classes that look like a lot of fun. I can't WAIT to see the playtest.

[Judan Vos]

One of my favourite parts of any Sci Fi RPG has been shipbuilding. I would love to see books on Ships, Shipbuilding, and an idea I hope might be considered, the kind of modularity to shipbuilding that one might find in Starfield. That is sensible. It can change the shape, components, or name of a ship fairly fast and fairly easily. Off the top of my head I don't know the mechanics of it, but I certainly have some ideas.

[Zoken44]

A Ship Core book would be a good idea two, perhaps even including heritages for holograms or SRO's meant to be used as part of the ship.

Also, to justify the difference, lorewise, between a Druid and a Terraformer. A druid maintains a planet's natural ecosystem and flora and fauna.

A Terraformer is there to Create an ecosystem, or an environment conducive to one. But yeah, I agree with someone else that this is just a primal using witchwarper.

[moosher12]

On the note of a Ship Core book, I want to see at least an attempt at implementing pricing for ships as an optional rule. At the very least, even if it's free in 90% of games as a cause of being a discovered vehicle, giften by a benefactor, or other means, it's good to know what kind of value a ship has in comparison to others beyond just a stat block.

Ideally I'd like to see individual components having costs (that can be ignored as an optional rule), but as a simpler method, if the Build Point system was used, it could simply be said that each Build Point is worth X amount of credits on average.

In my experiences, players like to ask GMs questions like, "How much does it cost," and are often not satisfied with a handwaved "it doesn't matter matter how much it costs." Even if it's free, they like to know things like this. Some other tables in a sandbox game might want to genuinely save up for one, too, and sometimes aren't satisfied with the "impress a benefactor to get a free one approach." Especially those that are wary of a catch, and want to genuinely own one.

TLDR: it's probably best to keep ships free for most games, but please make a guideline for ship costs in credits.

[Justnobodyfqwl]

I applauded the galaxy guide for breaking up the book into sections based on theme and content, instead of just geographic location. I'd love to see that approach for other kinds of books as well.

I would love a book about the Veskarium: not just "a day in the life" and "here's the term limits of senators", but sections written from the perspective of "what are these guys about, what kinds of stories do you tell with them, and why".

For instance, i'd love a breakdown of chapters like

1) Veskarium Propaganda: Talk about the good Veskarium do in the conflict with Azlanti and The Swarm. Talk about veskarium pop culture, companies, and diplomatic missions in the pact worlds. Character options include the fierce propagandist ancestry Ijtikri.

2) Anti-Veskarium Propaganda: Talk about the resistance fights on Pulonis, the prison colonies mining Shimmerstone, and their dubious claim over Skittermanders. Character options include an Archetype dedicated towards Pahtra battle-dancing.

3) Veskarium War Stories: Talk about historic conflicts with the pact worlds, miscellaneous skirmishes, and private militaries. A whole guide to the Pahtra Coming Of Age Games and their various competitions. Character options include armor that electronically lists all of your honor duels in real time, military standard-issue Veskarium laser rifles, and lots of Ceremonial Doshkos.

4) Veskarium Superstitions. The religious creeds of the Vesk Saints, the warring factions of Meyel's worshipers, the strange effects that Shimmerstone has been having on people, and the many ways that the hatching of The Newborn has changed the Veskarium. Character options include Aucturnite gun silencers, Stridermander-tooth necklaces, and the Militarized Action Figure poppet heritage. (A toy store full of Captain Veskarium action figures have gone haywire and declared the store the first colony of the new Veskarium Toy Empire!)

[HolyFlamingo!]

I'd take what justnobodyfqwl suggested and apply to the Azlanti Star Empire as well. The glimpses we've gotten of it in APs have been fascinating so far, and I'd love to get to know the aliens living under their rule a little better. What are their lives actually like on a day-to-day basis? I know colonialism is a touchy subject, but like... I want to explore touchy subjects, y'know?

[moosher12]

Honestly an Azlanti Star Empire book would be great. I've been reading through the Starfinder 1E books, and from Alien Archive 3, there are some interesting azlanti star empire races to touch on. The Dessamars, Hortuses, and the shatoris are all very neat!

[Justnobodyfqwl]

Honestly, I'd be very curious to the difference in the kinds of stories you tell with the Veskarium vs the Azlanti

I'm still very new to Starfinder, so forgive me if this is oversimplifying:

But when I started reading the books, introducing the Vesk as a core species made sense. They're lizard Klingons, your archetypical Proud Warrior Culture Alien.

They seemed very stock characters, but I found that their dynamic with their colonies very interesting- both the rebellion of Pulonis and the "occupation" of the Skittermander home world added a LOT of depth to all three cultures!

It also, not coincidentally, "softens" the image of the Vesk a lot. Emphasizing the new relationship with the Pact Worlds, showing a lot more resistance against their occupation than you'd think, and most importantly: driving in the entire that the Vesk are mostly spending their Warfare Energy on the "BIG objective bad guys"- mindless space bugs, and superracist fascists.

Reading 1e adventures and stories, I can kind of tell that the authors suffered a little under introducing the Vesk as a core species, but not any of their colonies. It lead to some kind baffling writing choices, like the adventures where you keep having to STOP Pulonis Independence movements. (Because, well, y'know, you're more likely to have a Vesk at the table than a Pahtra)

So now, the Vesk/Pahta/Skittermander dynamic triangle has been the most captivating part of 2e to me, and some of my players as well! It's a gold mine, and a rich vein to tap. But now, what do you do with the Azlanti?

The Azlanti seem to have been written as the much more Archetypical End Game Boss Bad Guys. While the Vesk are Space Colonizers, the Azlanti are portrayed as Space Fascist Racial Supremacists. They're great antagonists! While the Veskarium is so big that you have plenty of Vesk that might have complicated feelings about colonial occupation, the Azlanti seem to be just Space Nazis You Can Happily Blow Up.

So I was kind of shocked to try read more about them in SF2E, and they're... Kind of just also Vesk? One of the playtest adventures is about trying to help the Veskarium sign a peace treaty with them and help everyone get along in a new colony. They're racial supremacists in a way that the Vesk aren't, but have just as many off-world colonies of different species that consider themselves part of the Azlanti Star Empire.

And none of this is BAD inherently. But whenever I try to read about the Azlanti as they are now, they feel like every attempt to flesh them out comes off as narratively redundant with what the Vesk already are.

I'd absolutely love an Azlanti book that makes a major case for what makes these guys different! I feel like the Vesk take up a lot of narrative room in "objectively morally wrong colonial empire that is still sympathetic"- and I haven't seen anything from the Azlanti that's nearly that interesting.

Frankly, I like the idea that the Azlanti aren't sympathetic at all! I think they can be complex, fully fleshed out, and three dimensional- and still be distinct, unsympathetic, space-fascists that you blow up by the dozen. I also think that it would make them stand out from the Veskarium to lean away from the idea that they're colonists too- the distinction between a Veskarium military unit of pahtras and skittermanders vs an all-human Azlanti platoon feels very striking to me.

[HolyFlamingo!]

Continuing with the ASE and the Veskarium, one thing I really appreciate about Starfinder in general is that even the "bad guy" factions are allowed to have nuance. There's no shortage of campy mustache twirlers, but there are plenty of intra-factional conflicts and normal people as well. Empires Devoured illustrated this marveously well, but so do the evil-but-fun factions like Zo! Media and the Free Captains. There were even sympathetic Kuthites in Signal of Screams!

[Zoken44]

So, a thought I had for if they ever do a starship Core book.

Someone pointed out that the Galaxy Guide wasn't broken up by regions and astrometry. It was broken up by vibes, by the genre of story you wanted to tell. So I was thinking for ships. They could come up with something similar.

suggested prebuilts or build suggestions based on the kind of ship you want your party to have.

A Grimy grungy industrial thing that seems to work against the players as much as the villains. (most ships on the Expanse)

A sweet, if tempermental, ship that the party can form a caring relationship with (Millenium Falcon or Serenity)

A sleek tech/bio/arcano marvel meant to give hope for the future (almost any ship from Star Trek)

LIterally has a mind of it's own and actively interacting with the crew (the ship in Farscape)
And how to create a ship that has a super power or secret (like a lot of ships in anime, or the Heart of Gold from HHG2G)

[Justnobodyfqwl]

HolyFlamingo! wrote:

Continuing with the ASE and the Veskarium, one thing I really appreciate about Starfinder in general is that even the "bad guy" factions are allowed to have nuance. There's no shortage of campy mustache twirlers, but there are plenty of intra-factional conflicts and normal people as well. Empires Devoured illustrated this marveously well, but so do the evil-but-fun factions like Zo! Media and the Free Captains. There were even sympathetic Kuthites in Signal of Screams!

Yeah, I think that the existence of B-Tier threat "recurring baddies of the week" like Free Captains, Dreadfleet, and Zo! Media are just SO much fun.

I would love a book that leans into that, actually! Take a grab-bag handful of everyone from the "minor factions" of the Galaxy Guide. Give them a write-up, a page of adventure hooks, a new ancestry you'd find associated with them, an archetype, and some thematic items/skill feats/etc.

I also just found out that Desna's "Star Singers" exist, so I absolutely want them to be included as well.

[keftiu]

Distant Shores is one of my all-time favorite PF1 books, and I've really struggled to ever feel hooked reading SF1's Pact Worlds by comparison. A do-over would be a lot of fun, as an overview of the setting's core and an excuse to flesh out a bunch of the locals as Ancestries.

[Xenocrat]

Distant Worlds. Distant Shores was a Golarion book that included regions like Iobaria.

[keftiu]

Xenocrat wrote:

Distant Worlds. Distant Shores was a Golarion book that included regions like Iobaria.

Exactly right! I mix up their titles all the time.

[Driftbourne]

keftiu wrote:

Distant Shores is one of my all-time favorite PF1 books, and I've really struggled to ever feel hooked reading SF1's Pact Worlds by comparison. A do-over would be a lot of fun, as an overview of the setting's core and an excuse to flesh out a bunch of the locals as Ancestries.

What interests me about using Distant Worlds in SF2e is using it as a source of archaeological sites and pre-Gap history.

[Tim Emrick]

I read Distant Wolds a few years after reading Pact Worlds, and it was fascinating to see what had changed dramatically in the time between the PF and SF eras, and what was still largely the same.

[The Block Knight]

I'll add to the names asking for a planar book and a more detailed god book!

I'd be very interested to see how the various outsider races have evolved post-Gap. We've had glimpses of angels, devils, velstracs, aeons, and many more, but only snippets. Some haven't made appearances at all yet, such as asuras and rakshasas. It looks like the oni have found places across the galaxy to carve out their own little empires, I'd like to see more for them and the other native outsiders especially. Whether these would fit into a planar book or a god book, or a mix of both, I'd like to see the outsiders get more covereage. They're just as important in terms of galactic trade and influence as any interplanetary species, IMO.

Getting a book on the Azlanti Star Empire also makes sense, as others have said. I could see it as a book that covers the Vast similar to how the Veskarium was in the Near Space book.

Obviously, there will be the books that round out the 1st edition material and updates big chunks of it. Armory and tech and magic and all that. I like the idea of splitting tech into a hardtech book and a biotech book.

My big wishlist ask would be a book on the Dominion of the Black, and possibly other major aberrant antagonists. Sort of a Lords of Madness for Starfinder 2nd. Could include things like the Dycepskians or the Swarm, or leave those to other books and keep it just as weird, creepy aberrations.

[kaid]

The Block Knight wrote:

I'll add to the names asking for a planar book and a more detailed god book!

I'd be very interested to see how the various outsider races have evolved post-Gap. We've had glimpses of angels, devils, velstracs, aeons, and many more, but only snippets. Some haven't made appearances at all yet, such as asuras and rakshasas. It looks like the oni have found places across the galaxy to carve out their own little empires, I'd like to see more for them and the other native outsiders especially. Whether these would fit into a planar book or a god book, or a mix of both, I'd like to see the outsiders get more covereage. They're just as important in terms of galactic trade and influence as any interplanetary species, IMO.

Getting a book on the Azlanti Star Empire also makes sense, as others have said. I could see it as a book that covers the Vast similar to how the Veskarium was in the Near Space book.

Obviously, there will be the books that round out the 1st edition material and updates big chunks of it. Armory and tech and magic and all that. I like the idea of splitting tech into a hardtech book and a biotech book.

My big wishlist ask would be a book on the Dominion of the Black, and possibly other major aberrant antagonists. Sort of a Lords of Madness for Starfinder 2nd. Could include things like the Dycepskians or the Swarm, or leave those to other books and keep it just as weird, creepy aberrations.

A dominion of the black book would be interesting. Their whole deal is the eldritch things beyond the edge of the solar system. With the newborn um being born I would hope we get some more information about these things. Just seems like with regular traffic between star systems if these things live in the places between there should be a fair amount of encounters with them now.

[Perpdepog]

I'd love a Dominion of the Black book, or rather, I'd love for them to show up in a big way in a book. I'm not sure there'd be enough different things to talk about just with the Dominion of the Black for an entire book, and to be honest having that much explanation would start impinging on their creepy sense of unknowable-ness for me. Having them be a nice, meaty chapter in a book all about aberrations and cosmic weirdness, or a book with different sections involving baddy organizations, however, would be awesome.

[The Block Knight]

Oh yeah, I wouldn't expect them to do a whole book just on the Dominion but I feel it's about time they got an actual feature in some sort of supplement.

What I'd really, really like to see would be a Starfinder AP that features them as the main threat. 3 issues or a full 6, I'll take what I can get, though I think they'd work best as a mid- to high-tier villain group. So at the minimum, if they only get a 3 part AP, it should be one that starts at 7th level and goes to 13th or thereabouts. I'd hate to see a cop-out adventure featuring the Dominion where it fafs about at the low-levels with the bigger, meaner Dominion threats sitting in the background.

My true wish, if I could have anything, would be something like The Devastation Ark; a high-end 3-part AP that goes all the way to 20th and featuring the absolute worst terrors the Dominion has to offer.

[moosher12]

I can see dominion being included in a book on The Vast. 1E only seems to have dedicated books to the Pact Worlds and Near Space, but not one for the Vast.

Though while the Galaxy Guide is nice, I do still hope we'd get a more dedicated 2E Near Space and Pact Worlds books.

I hope Starfinder gets a Divine Mysteries style book that sums up gods and goddesses. (Genuine question, which books in Starfinder 1E actually show what the gods look like, if any? I'm only up to Near Space among the core books, and haven't seen any imagery of the gods yet.)

I want to see a book dedicated to esotericists and other practitioners of the old ways. But in practical purposes, Starfinder expansions to Pathfinder classes. The Esotericist archetype from the Character Operations Manual shows us that practitioners of the old ways very much are around in Starfinder, and would likely be represented with Pathfinder classes in 2E (except for the Druid, which apparently lost its powers as wildsong was somehow lost to the Gap). But either way, this book would focus on bringing Pathfinder classes up to speed with either feat options to help them take advantage of the Starfinder options where available.

[Perpdepog]

The Block Knight wrote:

Oh yeah, I wouldn't expect them to do a whole book just on the Dominion but I feel it's about time they got an actual feature in some sort of supplement.

What I'd really, really like to see would be a Starfinder AP that features them as the main threat. 3 issues or a full 6, I'll take what I can get, though I think they'd work best as a mid- to high-tier villain group. So at the minimum, if they only get a 3 part AP, it should be one that starts at 7th level and goes to 13th or thereabouts. I'd hate to see a cop-out adventure featuring the Dominion where it fafs about at the low-levels with the bigger, meaner Dominion threats sitting in the background.

My true wish, if I could have anything, would be something like The Devastation Ark; a high-end 3-part AP that goes all the way to 20th and featuring the absolute worst terrors the Dominion has to offer.

We are much more likely to get a three-part AP for them than a six-part. I know Pathfinder has switched over more or less entirely to a three-part system because it lets them tell more stories to appeal to more kinds of people. A high-level campaign is super doable for them, I agree. I could see something like 5 to 16, or an 11 to 20 campaign working well.

[Perses13]

Starfinder has also ditched the multi-volume approach to APs entirely and gone with single hardcover books, so I doubt there will be a three or 6 part anything in Starfinder 2e. Although there will probably be adventures equivalent to a 3-part AP. (6 part seems largely impractical as a single book).

[The Block Knight]

I figured as much, which is why I'm couching my Dominion wishes within a 3 AP format. Though, as Perpdepog noted, if 2nd edition Starfinder has leveling similar to PF2 Revised, with expanded level ranges for APs (see Spore War going from 11 to 20 in 3 issues), then a single hardcover could basically cover the same amount of levels as the old 6-issue APs. Whether that's a 1 to 13, 5 to 16, or 11 to 20 spread - a single hardcover can cover a big range thanks to modern formatting and design principles.

But yeah, framed in the context of how they release books now, allow me to revise my suggestion to one of the following: a hardcover book of aberrant villains including a chapter on the Dominion, or a hardcover AP featuring the Dominion as the villains with a backmatter appendix/chapter on the Dominion as a whole.

To moosher12's point, they could put the Dominion in a Vast book as well. I still think such a book should feature the Azlanti Star Empire, but it could have a chapter for each if that's the only place Paizo can find to put both of these groups.

moosher12 said wrote:

I hope Starfinder gets a Divine Mysteries style book that sums up gods and goddesses. (Genuine question, which books in Starfinder 1E actually show what the gods look like, if any? I'm only up to Near Space among the core books, and haven't seen any imagery of the gods yet.)

That would be Galactic Magic. Desna's embraced her cosmic identity and is just a moth now (a really cool looking moth, mind you). Rovagug, er, I mean, "The Devourer", is still shown to be formless. Pharasma's gone all Professor X with her hover chair. Urgathoa, hilariously, is shown wearing a space helmet - to let you know, she's in SPACE now! I'm pretty sure no gods need helmets (though several are depicted wearing them), but the undead god definitely doesn't need one. I'll give it style points but it does strike me as funny. Zon-Kuthon also got the Hellraiser in space glow-up, but I expect their image to change pretty radically in 2nd edition given ongoing events. As for the new gods, many of them look pretty rad - Oras is probably my favorite, though I love the idea that Damoritosh has a halo, despite his 1st edition alignment, given how the Vesk see him as saintly by their cultural standards.

[keftiu]

The Dominion are my favorite Pathfinder villains, and their absence from Starfinder is really strange to me. I'd love to see them invade both settings!

[Perpdepog]

The Block Knight wrote:

That would be Galactic Magic. Desna's embraced her cosmic identity and is just a moth now (a really cool looking moth, mind you). Rovagug, er, I mean, "The Devourer", is still shown to be formless.

Small note, and spoiler for the War of Immortals event in PF1E,

Spoiler:

The Devourer isn't Rovagug, but its own entity. It started its existence as a divine parasite living inside the void of Gorum's armor, some taint left behind from when he battled Rovagug, and is potentially one of the reasons Gorum wanted to be felled in battle.

[The Block Knight]

Perpdepog wrote:

Some wild s***

Whaaaaat?! Huh. You know, I still haven't sat down to read War of Immortals - I've been deep into catching up on my Starfinder backlog before diving into PF2E Revised - so thanks for the info! That's what I get for making assumptions I suppose.

[Perpdepog]

The Block Knight wrote:

Perpdepog wrote:

Some wild s***

Whaaaaat?! Huh. You know, I still haven't sat down to read War of Immortals - I've been deep into catching up on my Starfinder backlog before diving into PF2E Revised - so thanks for the info! That's what I get for making assumptions I suppose.

Oh yeah; that book is a trip. IMO worth reading for the lore alone!

[moosher12]

The Block Knight wrote:

That would be Galactic Magic. Desna's embraced her cosmic identity and is just a moth now (a really cool looking moth, mind you). Rovagug, er, I mean, "The Devourer", is still shown to be formless. Pharasma's gone all Professor X with her hover chair. Urgathoa, hilariously, is shown wearing a space helmet - to let you know, she's in SPACE now! I'm pretty sure no gods need helmets (though several are depicted wearing them), but the undead god definitely doesn't need one. I'll give it style points but it does strike me as funny. Zon-Kuthon also got the Hellraiser in space glow-up, but I expect their image to change pretty radically in 2nd edition given ongoing events. As for the new gods, many of them look pretty rad - Oras is probably my favorite, though I love the idea that Damoritosh has a halo, despite his 1st edition alignment, given how the Vesk see him as saintly by their cultural standards.

Thank you, very much. To add to the list, why does Iomedae look like Dora the Explora woke up one morning and chose mucha violencia

[Perpdepog]

The more I think about these more space-y depictions of deities, as well as the more technologically advanced kinds of outsider you can run into in SF, the more I hope we eventually learn of some diegetic law or force that might be responsible.

Well, the gods make sense as-is, I suppose. Spacefaring cultures could incorporate more high-tech and astro-traveling iconography into the depiction of a deity as a form of cultural drift.

The outsider thing has me curious though. We know that high-tech weaponry has been around for a long time in the Golarion setting because of Numeria and Silver Mount. We also know that outsiders can use high-tech weapons, because some of them used them in SF1E. So why aren't devils wielding hellfire flamers and summoned angels smiting evil with holy plasma cannons?

[Xenocrat]

It’s the same reason the planar cities don’t have populations in the billions of trillions.

[Justnobodyfqwl]

I don't think there could be any Watsonian explanation that would be as satisfying or sensible as "it's the sci-fi fantasy game, so the formerly only-fantasy characters have stereotypical scifi accoutrements".

[NoxiousMiasma]

I would also love to see a Big Book of Aliens - a lot of the fun of Starfinder is the sheer variety of playable creatures, but 2e Ancestries take more page space than a sidebar in the Alien Archive, so having a book just full of ancestry feats (maybe some ancestry-linked archetypes? Like how Howl of the Wild had the Clawdancer and Thlipit Contestant.) The big advantage of having to take more page space for Ancestries is that you can fit more lore in, which I am excited about!

Also seconding (or like 30th-ing) the requests for a good look at the Planes - considering there's basically an FTL method using each of the Outer Planes to skip real space, there's not really a big breakdown of how they all are in the future. Yes, yes, everyone has sci-fi weapons now, but how have the actual places changed?

[Perpdepog]

Justnobodyfqwl wrote:

I don't think there could be any Watsonian explanation that would be as satisfying or sensible as "it's the sci-fi fantasy game, so the formerly only-fantasy characters have stereotypical scifi accoutrements".

I dunno. I personally think some rationale linking the progression of technology that outsiders can display to the technological level the mortals they interact with are aware of would be cool, even if, or maybe especially if, it's some kind of mysterious constant or cosmic law, like the rules which govern when deities can and cannot interfere in the Universe.

For one thing, introducing such a concept means you also introduce the possibility someone can try breaking it, which could have fun consequences for the setting, or at minimum fun grist for an adventure and possible new toys for the party to play with.

[Zoken44]

*puts on Watsonion profesorial hat* You assume that all the planar being have the same level of technology as the ones you interacted with? despite the fact that you've stated in our own world other technological levels exist at the same time? (Numeria and Starfall and the Androids)

Well, those technologies came from a mind bending distance away in our world. who's to say that planar beings with those levels of technology didn't exist, but at such a distance away in their realm, though that distance may have been in a dimension we cannot measure. I posit as these planes are as expansive and vast as the Universe, yes, outsiders with that technology did exist in Pathfinder times, but their regions did not sync to our part of the universe. Whether this was the will of one or multiple gods, or some greater higher laws of magic or science, who's to say. Same with why we never encountered other gods like Damoritash and Hyla until our scope encompassed more of the Universe.

[kaid]

NoxiousMiasma wrote:

I would also love to see a Big Book of Aliens - a lot of the fun of Starfinder is the sheer variety of playable creatures, but 2e Ancestries take more page space than a sidebar in the Alien Archive, so having a book just full of ancestry feats (maybe some ancestry-linked archetypes? Like how Howl of the Wild had the Clawdancer and Thlipit Contestant.) The big advantage of having to take more page space for Ancestries is that you can fit more lore in, which I am excited about!

Also seconding (or like 30th-ing) the requests for a good look at the Planes - considering there's basically an FTL method using each of the Outer Planes to skip real space, there's not really a big breakdown of how they all are in the future. Yes, yes, everyone has sci-fi weapons now, but how have the actual places changed?

It looks like they are jamming new ancesteries left and right into everything for starfinder 2e but I would be dead shocked if they don't have some alien ancestries book for next year as a big compilation of a bunch of the really popular ones adding options to existing ones.

[Xenocrat]

Perpdepog wrote:

Justnobodyfqwl wrote:

I don't think there could be any Watsonian explanation that would be as satisfying or sensible as "it's the sci-fi fantasy game, so the formerly only-fantasy characters have stereotypical scifi accoutrements".

I dunno. I personally think some rationale linking the progression of technology that outsiders can display to the technological level the mortals they interact with are aware of would be cool, even if, or maybe especially if, it's some kind of mysterious constant or cosmic law, like the rules which govern when deities can and cannot interfere in the Universe.

For one thing, introducing such a concept means you also introduce the possibility someone can try breaking it, which could have fun consequences for the setting, or at minimum fun grist for an adventure and possible new toys for the party to play with.

Yes, I like to think there's some sort of filter for mortals interacting with outsiders and the outersphere that limits them to only seeing those with similar tech/biology/cultural frameworks. Otherwise every planet that ever had a interplanetary teleport capable caster should have been able to send someone to the City of Brass/Dis/Axis and buy some Sivv/Kishalee Empire tech, as well as plans/equipment from their predecessors who died out tens or hundreds of millions of years before that.

[Zoken44]

I would like a book like "Last Omens: Remnants of Lost Golarion" which was all about providing options for original classes and ancestries now in the far flung future.
Ancestry feats that show how each ancestry has adapted to living in the future and what traits influenced their growth or came out of their growth. Maybe some new heritages.

Also new subclasses, class feats, or full on class-archetypes to adapt classes to previously un-foreseen circumstances. A gunslinger way designed with the commonness of capacity weapons.

Champion causes for these new alien concepts that didn't exist before.

Druidic Orders for worlds so far different from our own; the Drift, crystilline life forms, heck the artificial world of Aballon.

an Investigator methodology that centers around using info-spheres.

Oracular mysteries that focus on things like the devourer, the gap, or lost golarion.

A cosmic Eidolon for the summoner.

A swashbuckler style that revolves around low-0 gravity, or flight.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

That would be STELLAR (pun wholly intended)! You could even use the Knights of Golarion as a framing device, since 2e is bringing a lot more focus on their capacity as historians of Lost Golarion and protectors of her scattered children.

[Opsylum]

I'd like to see a book on Mad Science, in the spirit of a hypothetical "Flesh Core" that keeps getting talked about. This book would be all about exploring the weird parts of Starfinder's setting and making them your own. Take a cue from Dark Archive and explore stellar anomalies, cutting-edge prototypes, cryptids rumored across the infosphere, and miraculous superserums and medical marvels - along with accompanying augmentations, spells, equipment, and archetypes. Introduce pets to Starfinder as we explore a menagerie of fascinating alien wildlife, perhaps including an artificial, "Frankenstein's monster" esque creature you can create in a lab from nanites, ooze, or other material, and turn into a superpowered pet. While we're at it, let's have a host of other science-themed downtime activities, from testing experimental formulas on companions to duplicating the effects of rituals with mundane technology. Even more fun, I think, would be to explore Pathfinder's mythic system through the lens of transhumanism in Starfinder - surpassing your body's natural limits through scientific or eldritch modification. Become a fusion of mortal flesh and power armor that lives for battle, or an infosphere-hopping entity whose very mind exists within an uploaded cloud, or an outsider thief who has grafted enough essence from angels or devils or psychopomps into their own body that they have themselves become part outsider.

Such a book would be a great place to reintroduce the Biohacker class, which I'd really love to see make the jump into 2e. Much as I love the starting roster of core classes, I'd love to make some archetypal characters in the vein of Rick Sanchez/Dr. Frankenstein/Leonard McCoy who pursues scientific possibilities outside the boundaries of a silicon chip. Also it would be nice to see what Dr. B's been up to since the time skip.