The changes being forced on Pathfinder


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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Bluemagetim wrote:
If I remember right the old rules for making drow had an increased level penalty but got magic resistance and innate spells and weapon proficiency. plus other stuff i dont remember.
3.5 Drow As Characters wrote:


  • +2 Dexterity, –2 Constitution, +2 Intelligence, +2 Charisma.
    Medium size.
  • A drow’s base land speed is 30 feet.
  • Immunity to sleep spells and effects, and a +2 racial saving throw bonus against enchantment spells or effects. (Not reflected in the saving throw modifiers given here.)
    Darkvision out to 120 feet.
  • Spell-Like Abilities: Drow can use the following spell-like abilities once per day: dancing lights, darkness, faerie fire. Caster level equals the drow’s class levels.
  • Weapon Proficiency: A drow is automatically proficient with the hand crossbow, the rapier, and the short sword.
  • Spell resistance equal to 11 + class levels.
  • +2 racial bonus on Will saves against spells and spell-like abilities.
  • +2 racial bonus on Listen, Search, and Spot checks. A drow who merely passes within 5 feet of a secret or concealed door is entitled to a Search check to notice it as if she were actively looking for it.
  • Automatic Languages: Common, Elven, Undercommon. Bonus Languages: Abyssal, Aquan, Draconic, Drow Sign Language, Gnome, Goblin.
  • Light Blindness: Abrupt exposure to bright light (such as sunlight or a daylight spell) blinds drow for 1 round. On subsequent rounds, they are dazzled as long as they remain in the affected area.
  • Favored Class: Wizard (male) or cleric (female).
  • Level adjustment +2.
  • Drows are powerful race in 3.5 but I always questioned its efficiency due its drawbacks also you pay for things that you usually don't use like +2 Intelligence and +2 Charisma (you usually only need only one of them).

    Light Blindness are pretty problematic for surface adventures (but a player always can try to circumvent it only trying to play at night as possible) but you can try to circumvent it focusing into playing as spellcaster and focusing in save spells/support spells. Bit the main problem always was the Level adjustment that basically force the player to only able to play with them in lvl 3 or more adventures and this also costs a top level spell slot.
    Honestly I never considered it a good option in 3.5. I don't thing that was the basis for drows popularity.
    PF1 - Drow Race wrote:
  • +2 Dexterity, +2 Charisma, –2 Constitution: Drow are nimble and manipulative.
  • Elf: Drow are humanoids with the elf subtype.
  • Medium: Drow are Medium creatures and receive no bonuses or penalties due to their size.
  • Normal Speed: Drow have a base speed of 30 feet.
  • Darkvision: Drow can see in the dark up to 120 feet.
  • Drow Immunities: Drow are immune to magic sleep effects and gain a +2 racial bonus on saving throws against enchantment spells and effects.
  • Keen Senses: Drow gain a +2 racial bonus on Perception checks.
  • Poison Use: Drow are skilled in the use of poison and never risk accidentally poisoning themselves.
  • Spell Resistance: A drow possesses an amount of spell resistance equal to 6 + her character level.
  • Spell-Like Abilities: A drow can cast dancing lights, darkness, and faerie fire, each once per day, using her total character level as her caster level.
  • Light Blindness: Abrupt exposure to bright light blinds drow for 1 round; on subsequent rounds, they are dazzled as long as they remain in the affected area.
  • Weapon Familiarity: Drow are proficient with the hand crossbow, rapier, and short sword.
  • Languages: Drow begin play speaking Elven and Undercommon. Drow with high Intelligence scores can choose from the following: Abyssal, Aklo, Aquan, Common, Draconic, Gnome, Goblin, and Sakvroth.
  • PF1 drows are way more interesting simply because the PF1 don't uses Level adjustment. They don't get the extra +2 into Int but at same time if you are making a Cha focused char you don't care about this because you are paying a Level adjustment, the main advantage of PF1 drows are the Spell Resistance that give some extra chance to avoid spells. But for other side the Light Blindness affect the char equally like in 3.5 making a non-caster drow pretty bad to play in a day light.

    5e drows are pretty similar to PF1 (with a bit worse Cha) and Sunlight Sensitivity may be a less problematic (because in 5e if may find ways to compensate the disadvantage) yet still there restricting to support/save spells but different from PF1 you don't get a clear benefit here once there's no Spell Resistance in 5e.

    So I have my doubts if it's because the Drows power gaming that attracted the players to play as drows.

    Grand Lodge

    Ravingdork wrote:

    I'd like to say that I stopped spending money on Hasbro/WotC products due to this whole OGL fiasco, but the truth is that I pretty much stopped doing that years ago.

    Due to their products being overly hyped and lacking substance, they've been on the outs with me for a long time, while Paizo just keeps crushing it.

    Yeah, I picked up the 5E core to test it out and we quit after the digital support kerfuffle when it was obvious they wouldn't be offering PDFs.


    "Debate bro". My new favorite perjorative. Followed by "Hoss". Going to stat up a new homebrewed debate-bro class and make a character called Hoss. brb.

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