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It’s a really complex class with a lot of flavour. The implements enable a lot of different styles. There are two guides out there
John R's Thaumaturge Guide and VampByDay’s Thamaturge Guide. But they are obviously early days. I’m seeking feedback on some suggestions I'm putting together. How would you build a Thaumaturge?
My thoughts:
The Thaumaturge is built on a solid martial chassis but it is an odd, build your own, character class. It looks a little bit like a Striker that uses weakness as its schtick, but you can build almost anything with it by selecting different implements. It pays for this flexibility by having a low for a martial d8 hit dice. Your main mechanic is Esoteric Lore, a special Charisma based Lore and annoyingly you need to make lore checks not Recall Knowledge to get it to work - so your item bonuses are limited to things like Wardrobe Stone and Cognitive Mutagen. Guidance and Heroism are particularly good for you. It suffers from Multiple Attribute Dependency. Strength is useful as melee is favoured, but you also have other Recall Knowledge abilities so you do want Intelligence as well. Obviously you can't do everything.
You get three implements in total. The second at 5th level the 3rd at 15th. You get the Initiate and Intensify benefits from all three, the Adept benefit from two (levels 7 and 11, a feat at level 18 can get a third), and the Paragon benefit from one at level 17.
You should get one of the good reactions on offer early: Amulet, Bell, are very reliable and you will use them almost every round. Weapon is OK.
Tome, Weapon get very nice attack effects from level 9. These help to overcome the fact that you are a martial class attacking with your secondary ability score. Importantly they work together.
Wand is Ok as an offensive option which combines well with a weapon attack. Its real cost is the actions required.
Regalia gives you a strong bonus to some great skills
Chalice is healing, Lantern is good utility, Mirror is just odd and its purpose seems to be dangerously exposing yourself for a flanking bonus, or a complex short range teleport.
Here are three build outlines I’ve pushed strongly into a role. A more equalised build might be better in play.
Slayer
The slayer really leans into the offence to slay evil with the best chance of landing critical blows.
Str 16 Dex 12 Con 12 Int 10 Wis 10 Cha 18
Basic equipment: Breastplate, WarHammer or Pick
General Feats: Toughness
Implements: Weapon, Tome, Wand.
Class Feats: Level 1: Scroll Thaumaturgy, Level 2: Talisman Esoterica, Level 4: Breached Defenses, Level 6: Scroll Esoterica, Level 8: Cursed Effigy, Level 10: Share Weakness, Level 12: Elaborate Scroll Esoterica, Level 14: Trespass Teleportation, Level 16: Implement's Flight, Level 18: Grand Scroll Esoterica, Level 20: Ubiquitous Weakness
Skills: Athletics, Intimidation, Deception
Protector
A cautious warrior and healer, the protector concentrates on keeping his flock alive.
Str 12 Dex 16 Con 12 Int 10 Wis 10 Cha 18
Basic equipment: Studded Leather, Rapier and Hand Crossbow
Implements: Amulet, Chalice, Lantern
Class Feats: Level 1: Ammunition Thaumaturgy, Level 2: Esoteric Warden, Level 4: Breached Defenses, Level 6: Scroll Esoterica, Level 8: Cursed Effigy, Level 10: Share Weakness, Level 12: Shared Warding, Level 14: Esoteric Reflexes, Level 16: Sever Magic, Level 18: Intense Implement, Level 20: Ubiquitous Weakness
Skills: Intimidation, Diplomacy
Wily Leader
An experienced leader, quick to seize any opening, your team trusts you to have a plan.
Str 10 Dex 16 Con 12 Int 12 Wis 10 Cha 18
Basic equipment: Studded Leather, Rapier and Hand Crossbow
Implements: Regalia, Bell, Weapon
Class Feats: Level 1: Diverse Lore, but you want Ammunition Thaumaturgy as well, Level 2: Marshal Dedication, Level 4: Inspiring Marshal Stance or Dread Marshal Stance, Level 6: Sympathetic Vulnerabilities, Level 8: To Battle, Level 10: Share Weakness, Level 12: Thaumaturge's Demesne, Level 14: Esoteric Reflexes, Level 16: Target of Opportunity, Level 18: Intense Implement, Level 20: Wonder Worker
Skills: Diplomacy, Intimidation, Deception, various knowledges
Unmistakable Lore is worth picking up with Esoteric Lore
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The builds look solid but I'd like to point out that you can pick diverse lore at level 1 so you can use esoteric lore to recall knowledge about anything at a -2 penalty which is somewhat negligible as your proficiency goes up and it's based on charisma which should be way higher than your int or wis
Also don't forget dubious knowledge... Even if you fail you get a piece of info, the thaumaturge is a recall knowledge machine.
Only the wily leader makes use of this and is something that, IMO every thaumaturge should do, perhaps picking diverse lore with human's natural ambition in case of needed ammunition thaumaturgy, I personally prefer to go melee for that reason, reloading is a pain x.x
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Knowledge Build
Ancestry: half-elf
10(8)/16/12(14)/10(8)/12/18
Ancestry feats
Ageless patience
Class feats
1 Diverse Lore
2 non-archetype
4 sleepwalker dedication
6 vision of foresight
8 know it all
Skill feats
Unmistakable lore
Gear
Pendant of the occult
**uncommon** brooch of inspiration
Implements
Any, but tome is recommended for paragon
A build that I found online soon after the book came out. Ageless patience gives a circumstance bonus, pendant gives guidance for a status bonus and the brooch gives an item bonus to lore for recall knowledge. Vision of foresight from the sleepwalker archetype lets us roll twice and take the better result. Diverse Lore lets us recall anything. Unmistakable lore prevents crit failure. Taken all together, you are a self-contained and entirely unmatched recall knowledge machine.
The builds look solid but I'd like to point out that you can pick diverse lore at level 1 so you can use esoteric lore to recall knowledge about anything at a -2 penalty which is somewhat negligible as your proficiency goes up and it's based on charisma which should be way higher than your int or wis
Also don't forget dubious knowledge... Even if you fail you get a piece of info, the thaumaturge is a recall knowledge machine.
Only the wily leader makes use of this and is something that, IMO every thaumaturge should do, perhaps picking diverse lore with human's natural ambition in case of needed ammunition thaumaturgy, I personally prefer to go melee for that reason, reloading is a pain x.x
I'm just trying to give some options so deliberately not choosing all the same thing with each build. There are so many combinations that work.
Dubious Knowledge is free with the class and works with Unmistakable Lore which is why I didn't mention it. But Scroll Thaumaturgy is good too.
Knowledge Build
** spoiler omitted **
Nice. I still haven't gotten into all the new archetypes. Vision of Weakness allowing double rolls on skill checks is very strong. Though I'm suddenly concerned about SleepWalking grapplers now.
Its a strong archetype. The Waking Dream is a good focus spell, and picking up a level 4 Sleep is another good choice.
The thing with the thaumaturge, as I mentioned in vamp's thread, is that you have a lot of leeway with archetypes which makes them very build friendly.
Esoteric Champion
Ancestry: Human (aasimar)
16/10/14/10/12/16
Ancestry feats
1 unconventional weaponry
9 Celestial wings
17 Eternal wings
Class feats
1 Diverse Lore
2 Champion dedication
4 lay on hands
6 champion reaction
8
10 sentinel
12 mighty bulwark
14 esoteric reflexes
16
18
20 wonder worker
Implements
Weapon (paragon) + any except tome
Tome (paragon) + weapon
A straightforward Champion archetype setup. We take a hit to cha to give us some extra con. Gives us heavy armor, a reaction that can be used against enemies other than our marked target and a decent focus spell. Sympathetic vulnerabilities can give us some action economy leeway in a pinch and potentially lets our Champion reaction benefit from our damage amp. Sentinel is needed before 11 to scale heavy armor into later levels. Human is for the flickmace and Aasimar frees up our level 16 class feat by giving us permanent flight through our Ancestry. Human also opens multitalented options at 13 if you'd like to fill the 16 and/or 18 feat slots with something from a multiclass.
Weapon implement is great always, of course even without paragon. Tome's extra skills preserve your skill-monkey niche.
If you don't want the cheesy yoyo, it's not a big loss. Not going aasimar pushes you into Implement's Flight at 16 though so keep that in mind.
The thing with the thaumaturge, as I mentioned in vamp's thread, is that you have a lot of leeway with archetypes which makes them very build friendly.
Esoteric Champion
** spoiler omitted **
Nice to see.
I didn't try this because the effect of the healing focus spell, the reaction are avaiable in class with chalice and amulet. I've got that build above. Heavy armour via sentinel is an easy add if you want it. But you have ignored those and picked up equivalents out of champion. Which means you can take the offensive powers from tome and weapon instead.
So, the Tengu Feather Fan feats lets a Tengu cast cantrips & certain spells they get by activating a magic item. Doing so uses your Class DC, which means Tengu innate spells cast through a Feather Fan can benefit from the effect of the Cursed Effigy feat.
Of course, the problem with this idea is that the Tengu Feather Fan isn't an implement, esoterica, or a weapon.
So, the Tengu Feather Fan feats lets a Tengu cast cantrips & certain spells they get by activating a magic item. Doing so uses your Class DC, which means Tengu innate spells cast through a Feather Fan can benefit from the effect of the Cursed Effigy feat.
Of course, the problem with this idea is that the Tengu Feather Fan isn't an implement, esoterica, or a weapon.
Note that
While you're holding an implement in one hand, you can quickly switch it with another implement you're wearing to use an action from the implement you're switching to. To do so, you can Interact as a free action immediately before executing the implement's action. This allows you to meet requirements of having an implement in hand to use its action. For example, if you had your lantern implement in one hand, a weapon in the other, and a chalice implement you were wearing, you could swap your lantern for your chalice to use its reaction.
If you have a weapon implement that hand is esoterica, implement and weapon. So you can free action swap every action until your GM gets dizzy and says no. All the while your other hand free for something else like a Feather Fan.