What Ancestries are you still craving?

[moosher12]

Huh, I went to check Sky King's Tomb for info on the Caligni and to see who else would be appropriate. I never knew that Drow actually did get a replacement in the form of ayindilar elves, colloqually known as cavern elves.

[Ravingdork]

moosher12 wrote:

Huh, I went to check Sky King's Tomb for info on the Caligni and to see who else would be appropriate. I never knew that Drow actually did get a replacement in the form of ayindilar elves, colloqually known as cavern elves.

I don'tunderstand. Perhaps you could elaborate? Neither "ayindilar" or "cavern elves" appear in HighHelm even once. The former doesn't appear on Archives of Nethys either.

[PossibleCabbage]

moosher12 wrote:

Huh, I went to check Sky King's Tomb for info on the Caligni and to see who else would be appropriate. I never knew that Drow actually did get a replacement in the form of ayindilar elves, colloqually known as cavern elves.

N.B. that the Ayindilar are a "replacement for Drow" in that "this is the name for the elves who live in the Darklands". They aren't really similar to the Drow in any other way (they're not a cruel matriarchal empire with a thing about spiders and poison, say.) I think part of the pivot is that the Ayindilar are supposed to be some of the nicest people you're liable to meet in the Darklands.

[moosher12]

Ravingdork wrote:

moosher12 wrote:

Huh, I went to check Sky King's Tomb for info on the Caligni and to see who else would be appropriate. I never knew that Drow actually did get a replacement in the form of ayindilar elves, colloqually known as cavern elves.

I don'tunderstand. Perhaps you could elaborate? Neither "ayindilar" or "cavern elves" appear in HighHelm even once. The former doesn't appear on Archives of Nethys either.

Heavy is the Crown pg. 69 wrote:

Ayindilar elves are descended from those who sought the Darklands as shelter from Earthfall. They maintain small, isolated, and self-sufficient settlements throughout Nar-Voth and Sekamina that often serve as safe havens for explorers. Known to some above as “cavern elves,” the Ayindilar elves may have once built larger, more grandiose cities deeper in Sekamina, but today those cities are lost or abandoned. Intriguing architectural similarities between smaller-scale Ayindilar structures in Nar-Voth and the more elaborate ruins in haunted Zirnakaynin do exist, however.

They do appear in AoN in the form of Cavern Elf heritage. The same way that Drathnelar (formmerly svirfneblin), appears as the umbral gnome heritage.

To Possible Cabbage: Don't know if they go into it in other books, but they are wiped pretty clean at the moment. Probably room to make some of them pretty mean. But regardless, yeah, they definitely have the drow's origin story minus the demon corruption.

[JiCi]

Kobold Catgirl wrote:

I've been fiddling with a thriae-like ancestry for a while now, it's gonna be embarrassing if Paizo gets to it before I do.

The Thriaes themselves have yet to return in P2E.

Still, before complaining about them being female-exclusive...
1) Changelings were reworked into multiple genders.

2) Real-life bees have males (d'uh).

3) The Age of Lost Omens could have signaled the arrival of male larvae.

4) Thriaes have been known to compel male humanoids to reproduce... and to eat them in their sleep when they're about to die of old age, be natural or accelerated. Male thriaes would essentially allow them to stop their practices.

5) Male thriaes could still be important in hives as generals, but I would keep the matriarchy. Bees are loyal, so I wouldn't imagine coups d'etat and such betrayal within their ranks.

6) Heritages could follow the same classes as P1E and bees: worker, soldier, seer, dancer, constructor (Large, but NOT mindless) and queen/embassador.

[NoxiousMiasma]

I wouldn't say bees are loyal, actually - if a queen bee sucks at her job the hive will raise a replacement and kill her. For IRL bees, the queen isn't actually in charge, she's just the gonads. Having some opportunities for intra-hive scheming would make thriae a lot more distinct from generic fantasy/sci-fi hive insectoids - adding politics certainly made Starfinder Formorians more interesting!

I'd also like to see a solitary bee heritage - most real-life bee species are actually solitary, so it'd be a fun little nod.

[Zoken44]

I will just repeat a previous one: Figments. Beings born of the realm of dreaming where the minds of those in the Universe interacted with their realm. Due to the upheaval of the Godsrain, or any number of other things, they've been shunted into the Universe, where they are forced into a corporeal form. They range form small to large, their skin is irridescent with apparently featureless faces and humanoid bodies.

They have four heritages:
The Respite: born of pleasant dreams where minds from the Universe touched the dreaming realm while recuperating. They become trained in medicine check and gain a +1 status bonus to medicine checks on unconscious beings.

The Companions: These acted as friends and companions in the Dreaming to the very young and the very lonely. They gain a status bonus to make an impression and automatically gain the first in a series of polymorph abilities the ancestry has access too (like the Tanuki)

The Challengers: These took the form of nightmares, however despite their fearsome and terrifying appearance, they are actually the most protective. They see their roll as helping those in the Universe face their fears safely. They become proficient in intimidation gain the Intimidating Glare, and they gain a circumstance bonus to the intimidating glare if the target recently struck an ally OR the figment has successfully recalled knowledge on it.

The Lost Lover: There are two ways these Figments are shaped. Either through someone in the Universe pining for another, or by inventing a lover to save face. They get a +1 bonus to perception checks to sense motive, and to deception checks.

[JiCi]

NoxiousMiasma wrote:

I wouldn't say bees are loyal, actually - if a queen bee sucks at her job the hive will raise a replacement and kill her. For IRL bees, the queen isn't actually in charge, she's just the gonads. Having some opportunities for intra-hive scheming would make thriae a lot more distinct from generic fantasy/sci-fi hive insectoids - adding politics certainly made Starfinder Formorians more interesting!

I'd also like to see a solitary bee heritage - most real-life bee species are actually solitary, so it'd be a fun little nod.

I just read about how both ants and bees can overthrow their queens O_o Yikes! For bees specifically, it's more about the queen gradually losing pheromones, as you stated.

I'd say that a "solitary thriae" would simply be "someone not living in a hive". The heritages I've mentioned would be physical adjustments, but being solitary is more of a morale choice.

[Maya Coleman]

JiCi wrote:

I just read about how both ants and bees can overthrow their queens O_o Yikes! For bees specifically, it's more about the queen gradually losing pheromones, as you stated.

I'd say that a "solitary thriae" would simply be "someone not living in a hive". The heritages I've mentioned would be physical adjustments, but being solitary is more of a morale choice.

I only remember this fact because I spent too much time playing Sim Ant.

Still, a playable solitary bee ancestry would be very fun.

[JiCi]

Ok, time out...

What's so special about "solitary bee" to warrant a Thriae heritage again? Isn't a "solitary bee" a worker or a soldier that just... struck on its own?

Worker - good at manual tasks

Soldier - good at combat

Seer - good with divine and primal spells, based on the Thriae Seer

Dancer - good with arcane and occult spells, as well as rallying troops Thriae Dancer

Constructor - Large, but NOT mindless, as I said, based on the Thriae Constructor

Queen/embassador - good at Diplomacy and other social skills

Solitary - ???

[Perpdepog]

Zoken44 wrote:

I will just repeat a previous one: Figments. Beings born of the realm of dreaming where the minds of those in the Universe interacted with their realm. Due to the upheaval of the Godsrain, or any number of other things, they've been shunted into the Universe, where they are forced into a corporeal form. They range form small to large, their skin is irridescent with apparently featureless faces and humanoid bodies.

They have four heritages:
The Respite: born of pleasant dreams where minds from the Universe touched the dreaming realm while recuperating. They become trained in medicine check and gain a +1 status bonus to medicine checks on unconscious beings.

The Companions: These acted as friends and companions in the Dreaming to the very young and the very lonely. They gain a status bonus to make an impression and automatically gain the first in a series of polymorph abilities the ancestry has access too (like the Tanuki)

The Challengers: These took the form of nightmares, however despite their fearsome and terrifying appearance, they are actually the most protective. They see their roll as helping those in the Universe face their fears safely. They become proficient in intimidation gain the Intimidating Glare, and they gain a circumstance bonus to the intimidating glare if the target recently struck an ally OR the figment has successfully recalled knowledge on it.

The Lost Lover: There are two ways these Figments are shaped. Either through someone in the Universe pining for another, or by inventing a lover to save face. They get a +1 bonus to perception checks to sense motive, and to deception checks.

Sorry to keep banging this drum, but Roll for Combat's Year of Titans is going to have a figment ancestry coming out this year, if you want something like that to play and can't wait for Paizo to make something like it.

[PossibleCabbage]

I still want to be able to be a moth-person (so I can play one as a thaumaturge who is extremely happy with their lantern implement).

[Kobold Catgirl]

I think the Battlezoo folks actually might be working on a mothfolk ancestry, which is super exciting. My partner and I are working on our own, too! And a Thriae ancestry, although we named our version "melisae" and are doing a bunch of stuff to play with/break from the original lore. They're more like fallen Thriae than anything.

Oh, also, I'm really bad about finding excuses to bring up this project where it's not relevant, so to be clear--I brought up Thriae because we were talking about Greek mythology, and that's where they're technically sort of from. It wasn't just a complete non sequitur. x)

[LinnormSurface]

I'd really enjoy a more generalized undeath/void-themed versatile heritage, without the rather specific vibes carried by Dhampir. For some concepts you can use Dhampir to make it mostly work, but it doesn't quite fit for a lot of void-infused character concepts.
I suppose some sort of vitality-themed versatile heritage as an opposite could be interesting, as well, though I don't have as much interest in that, personally.

An ancestry themed around alchemy would be pretty interesting too, like they might actually have four humours(or six, since the four humours were often assigned classical elements and Golarion has 6 of those) and be able to synthesize alchemical items from their flesh, and things like that.

More relevant to the current discussion topic, I really like the idea of mothfolk, and more arthropod-folk in general.

[exequiel759]

LinnormSurface wrote:

I'd really enjoy a more generalized undeath/void-themed versatile heritage, without the rather specific vibes carried by Dhampir. For some concepts you can use Dhampir to make it mostly work, but it doesn't quite fit for a lot of void-infused character concepts.

I suppose some sort of vitality-themed versatile heritage as an opposite could be interesting, as well, though I don't have as much interest in that, personally.

An ancestry themed around alchemy would be pretty interesting too, like they might actually have four humours(or six, since the four humours were often assigned classical elements and Golarion has 6 of those) and be able to synthesize alchemical items from their flesh, and things like that.

More relevant to the current discussion topic, I really like the idea of mothfolk, and more arthropod-folk in general.

There's borai in Starfinder 2e playtest. They are undead without void healing.

[moosher12]

LinnormSurface wrote:

I'd really enjoy a more generalized undeath/void-themed versatile heritage, without the rather specific vibes carried by Dhampir. For some concepts you can use Dhampir to make it mostly work, but it doesn't quite fit for a lot of void-infused character concepts.

I suppose some sort of vitality-themed versatile heritage as an opposite could be interesting, as well, though I don't have as much interest in that, personally.

An ancestry themed around alchemy would be pretty interesting too, like they might actually have four humours(or six, since the four humours were often assigned classical elements and Golarion has 6 of those) and be able to synthesize alchemical items from their flesh, and things like that.

More relevant to the current discussion topic, I really like the idea of mothfolk, and more arthropod-folk in general.

Starfinder 2E also confirmed a Corpsefolk versatile heritage for its first adventure path, which I've been wanting for the same reasons, for making characters like Jaethal from Kingmaker. They described it as ranging from full on obviously undead to vaguely gaunt and gothic, so seems it'd fill a good range of generic undead but not beholden to being a zombie, mummy, vampire, or ghost.

exequiel759 wrote:

There's borai in Starfinder 2e playtest. They are undead without void healing.

Borai was cool, but my big hangup was it not having void healing. Good for some character concepts, but not quite when you want a void healing character.

[LinnormSurface]

Oh right, I forgot about Borai. I'd need to check, but that could maybe be what I'm looking for, so thank you!
Somewhat unfortunate about the lack of void healing, though, I suppose.

As another idea , it'd be really nice to see more universal ancestry feats, since it'd help the ancestries that don't get much added to them, like shisks or goloma or vishkanya, have more options to pick from with their ancestry feats. It's not a perfect fix, but I think it could help.

[Perpdepog]

If void healing is what you're after, you could also pick up the Revenant background. Not a heritage, but it's pretty easy to slot in.

[Agonarchy]

There's certainly a lot of room to develop void ancestries. I'd personally like to see about four diverse ancestries and a non-undead versitile heritage so there's enough variety for full void campaigns without overlap and without anyone needing to be a corpse.

[NoxiousMiasma]

JiCi wrote:

Ok, time out...

What's so special about "solitary bee" to warrant a Thriae heritage again? Isn't a "solitary bee" a worker or a soldier that just... struck on its own?

No, solitary bees are bees that aren't eusocial at all - no hives or workers for the entire species! That's actually the overwhelming majority of all bees on earth. As for a niche as a heritage, there's a few options - solitary bees include basically all the novel nest-making bees, like mason bees, carpenter bees, and leafcutter bees, so giving a solitary heritage a crafting focus could work. Alternatively, as solitary bees with stings don't die from stinging (no queen to keep carrying on the hive's genes), a sting-based natural attack would also be an option.

[JiCi]

NoxiousMiasma wrote:

JiCi wrote:

Ok, time out...

What's so special about "solitary bee" to warrant a Thriae heritage again? Isn't a "solitary bee" a worker or a soldier that just... struck on its own?

No, solitary bees are bees that aren't eusocial at all - no hives or workers for the entire species! That's actually the overwhelming majority of all bees on earth. As for a niche as a heritage, there's a few options - solitary bees include basically all the novel nest-making bees, like mason bees, carpenter bees, and leafcutter bees, so giving a solitary heritage a crafting focus could work. Alternatively, as solitary bees with stings don't die from stinging (no queen to keep carrying on the hive's genes), a sting-based natural attack would also be an option.

Oh... I see now... It's a type of bee, not a class :p

Thriaes already can sting and don't die from it. They also have merope consumption, which effects depend on their classes.

In this case, thriae heritages would be based on bee species, including solitary bees, but the "classes" could be level 1 feats, like "do you want to start your adventuring career as a worker, a soldier or none at all"? Merope would then affect you accordingly.

Also, other similar insects could be added as heritages, like wasps and yellowjackets.

[Kobold Catgirl]

The "yellowjackets/paper wasps/bumblebees/honeybees" heritages are what we went with, too.

[JiCi]

Kobold Catgirl wrote:

The "yellowjackets/paper wasps/bumblebees/honeybees" heritages are what we went with, too.

Interesting

What did you guys do for the classes? Can any thriae be a worker or a soldier, for instance? Are these "local terms" for the game's classes (Fighter to Soldier)?

[Maya Coleman]

JiCi wrote:

Ok, time out...

What's so special about "solitary bee" to warrant a Thriae heritage again? Isn't a "solitary bee" a worker or a soldier that just... struck on its own?

Worker - good at manual tasks

Soldier - good at combat

Seer - good with divine and primal spells, based on the Thriae Seer

Dancer - good with arcane and occult spells, as well as rallying troops Thriae Dancer

Constructor - Large, but NOT mindless, as I said, based on the Thriae Constructor

Queen/embassador - good at Diplomacy and other social skills

Solitary - ???

Ok, so for me this comes down to the nature of bees and how I personally think that would affect stats. Because bees are usually hive minded, I would then envision that a character of that ancestry would approach things with similar thought, and thus prevent certain traits like resourcefulness, survivability, inquisitiveness, and initiative (not game Initiative, but rather mental initiative). This translates in my mind to something that would lend itself to a class somewhere between Ranger and Investigator??? I am aware I sound a little ridiculous right now lol

[Kobold Catgirl]

JiCi wrote:

Kobold Catgirl wrote:

The "yellowjackets/paper wasps/bumblebees/honeybees" heritages are what we went with, too.

Interesting

What did you guys do for the classes? Can any thriae be a worker or a soldier, for instance? Are these "local terms" for the game's classes (Fighter to Soldier)?

Most of the "castes" are expressed as ancestry feats. Most of them are just skill feat+skill training feats, but "Worker Bee" grants a retrainable skill training similar to what elves can get, and there's one or two higher-leveled feats that build on the first-level ones or that allude to the old Thriae monster abilities.

We mostly didn't lean on the caste thing a ton, though. It just honestly wasn't the most compelling thing about Thriae/beepeople to us. There's a lot of focus on the prophecy stuff, teamwork, various industries, and the original Thriae's kind of cultiness.

[JiCi]

Fair enough :)

At first, the castes (thanks for the word) felt like heritages, until species were more appropriated. But yeah, Solitary, Mason, Carpenter, Honey, Bumble, Wasp, Yellowjacket and Hornet would work nicely as heritages.

[Kobold Catgirl]

We went with yellowjacket ("Yellowcoat"), paper wasp ("Bookbinder"), bumblebee ("Bumbleweaver), honeybee ("Meadowdancer"), and a lazy amalgamation of carpenter bees and stingerless bees ("Coppiceater") that gets a bite attack with the razing trait. All social bugs, since that was key to our theming! I'd love to see someone do a take that's more honed in on the stuff you're interested in here, though.

[Maya Coleman]

JiCi wrote:

Fair enough :)

At first, the castes (thanks for the word) felt like heritages, until species were more appropriated. But yeah, Solitary, Mason, Carpenter, Honey, Bumble, Wasp, Yellowjacket and Hornet would work nicely as heritages.

Heck yes! You see the vision!

[DMurnett]

I think at this moment the obvious gaps in coverage are fey ancestries and aquatic ancestries, so those are what I'd like to see more of (possibly at the same time). For fey we have all kinds of classics. Dryad, nymph, satyr, I guess nixie, leprechaun, satyr... Maybe redcap, or satyr... Uh... Satyr... Anyways, aquatic creatures have more room as well, off the top of my head tritons are an obvious pick, aquatic elves are an established thing (could be a heritage), and playable alghollthu is a good potential curveball (besides, we need more playable aberrations). That said my true number one most wanted ancestry is an Ooze. I love oozes and the closest we've gotten is the Oozemorph archetype which I would say is somehow worse than literally nothing.

[Maya Coleman]

DMurnett wrote:

I think at this moment the obvious gaps in coverage are fey ancestries and aquatic ancestries, so those are what I'd like to see more of (possibly at the same time). For fey we have all kinds of classics. Dryad, nymph, satyr, I guess nixie, leprechaun, satyr... Maybe redcap, or satyr... Uh... Satyr... Anyways, aquatic creatures have more room as well, off the top of my head tritons are an obvious pick, aquatic elves are an established thing (could be a heritage), and playable alghollthu is a good potential curveball (besides, we need more playable aberrations). That said my true number one most wanted ancestry is an Ooze. I love oozes and the closest we've gotten is the Oozemorph archetype which I would say is somehow worse than literally nothing.

Gonna have to second, third, and fourth this ooze mention.

[JiCi]

DMurnett wrote:

I think at this moment the obvious gaps in coverage are fey ancestries and aquatic ancestries, so those are what I'd like to see more of (possibly at the same time). For fey we have all kinds of classics. Dryad, nymph, satyr, I guess nixie, leprechaun, satyr... Maybe redcap, or satyr... Uh... Satyr... Anyways, aquatic creatures have more room as well, off the top of my head tritons are an obvious pick, aquatic elves are an established thing (could be a heritage), and playable alghollthu is a good potential curveball (besides, we need more playable aberrations). That said my true number one most wanted ancestry is an Ooze. I love oozes and the closest we've gotten is the Oozemorph archetype which I would say is somehow worse than literally nothing.

IMO...

- Fey-blooded should be a versatile heritage, especially for nymphs.

- Aquatic heritages may be a hard sell, because, well... 90% of adventures are happening on land. Right now, the ONLY thing that would favor aquatic heriatges would be a book about the Shackles... which I think Paizo already did back in P1E's debuts.

- Oozefolks would be cool, but again, we need a lore reason. If the Age of Lost Omens somehow awakened clusters of oozes, jellies and slimes, which they rapidly reproduced, then I could see this happening.

[keftiu]

JiCi wrote:

- Oozefolks would be cool, but again, we need a lore reason.

Does the giant thinking ooze-lake in Nex count?

[BotBrain]

Fleshwarping producing sentient oozes, an alchemist's experiment gone wrong/very right, the WoI leads to an ooze god showing up or gaining prominence.

It would be dead easy.

Or make them aliens and backport them from SF2e.

[Maya Coleman]

BotBrain wrote:

Fleshwarping producing sentient oozes, an alchemist's experiment gone wrong/very right, the WoI leads to an ooze god showing up or gaining prominence.

It would be dead easy.

Or make them aliens and backport them from SF2e.

I buy it.

[Brinebeast]

I happily point out that there are already four intelligent ooze peoples in Golarion, all of which could be adapted to their own Ancestry.

Apallie, Thorgothrel, Doppeldrek (Awakened), Mezlan

If you are not familiar with the above, I recommend checking them out on Archives of Nethys.

[Ravingdork]

Pathfinder 1st Edition had the Oozemorph archetype of the Shifter class (Ultimate Wilderness) as well as the Mezlans*, so "ooze people" do exist in the world lore already.

We just need the mechanics to bring them into 2nd Edition.

*:

Which I believe had a player-facing option as well, though I haven't been able to find it at the time of this writing.

EDIT: Damn. Ninja'd by a slippery brinebeast.

At least I can still be useful by linking things for people.

Apallie | Thorgothrel | Doppeldrek (Awakened)

[Perpdepog]

Brinebeast wrote:

I happily point out that there are already four intelligent ooze peoples in Golarion, all of which could be adapted to their own Ancestry.

Apallie, Thorgothrel, Doppeldrek (Awakened), Mezlan

If you are not familiar with the above, I recommend checking them out on Archives of Nethys.

I've always wanted mezlan and thorgothrel to be playable, ever since PF1E; they feel like they'd be a blast to play. You'd have to tone down some of the mezlan's defenses, like their immunity to crits and precision damage, but that's true of any ooze to one degree or another. Mezlans could have heritages inspired by the original tasks they were transformed into mezlans to achieve, with feats based around shapeshifting, creating weapons from their bodies, absorbing and resisting magic, and being able to regenerate from near death.

Thorgothrels would be, in some ways, easier, since you could link being critted or struck with precision damage to striking and damaging their armiture. I'm not sure what heritages they'd have, maybe ones linked to the kinds of devolution they are interested in, or the sorts of technology they adapted to themselves, but they could have feats centered around genetically adapting allies or enemies, using strange sciences, and adapting their armiture and the shell of force around them for various purposes.

[BotBrain]

I think the easiest way to get around crit/precision immunity is to just say in combat you need to have some kind of semi-solid form whcih means you can have your "head" knocked in or something. You could still give crit/precision resistance, which would certainly be unique.

[Maya Coleman]

Ravingdork wrote:

Pathfinder 1st Edition had the Oozemorph archetype of the Shifter class (Ultimate Wilderness) as well as the Mezlans*, so "ooze people" do exist in the world lore already.

We just need the mechanics to bring them into 2nd Edition.

** spoiler omitted **

EDIT: Damn. Ninja'd by a slippery brinebeast.

At least I can still be useful by linking things for people.

Apallie | Thorgothrel | Doppeldrek (Awakened)

This makes it even better actually because now if it gets brought back, it can be called "Pathfinder 2: Ooze Boogaloo." Or perhaps "Pathfinder 2: Electric Boogalooze?"

[DMurnett]

JiCi wrote:

IMO...

- Fey-blooded should be a versatile heritage, especially for nymphs.

- Aquatic heritages may be a hard sell, because, well... 90% of adventures are happening on land. Right now, the ONLY thing that would favor aquatic heriatges would be a book about the Shackles... which I think Paizo already did back in P1E's debuts.

- Oozefolks would be cool, but again, we need a lore reason. If the Age of Lost Omens somehow awakened clusters of oozes, jellies and slimes, which they rapidly reproduced, then I could see this happening.

IMO

- Feyblooded definitely could and possibly should be a heritage but I think more fey ancestries should take precedence. If I wanna run a First World campaign I want multiple fitting ancestry options, ideally at least 4 so a standard party can fit with no overlaps, and right now we just have Sprite and Feyblooded wouldn't really fix that. That said... Porque no los dos?

- The thing with aquatic ancestry options is that while the need for them isn't huge in general, in the cases that it's important it's very important. There's no aquatic adventures because there's not enough player options to run them. I wouldn't count out a Shackles book in particular either since we haven't gotten much about it in 2e.

- As many have pointed out oozefolk candidates already exist but even if they didn't, is it really that big of a stretch that Paizo could make something up? Why are intelligent slimes more unbelievable than any number of existing ancestries?

[LinnormSurface]

JiCi wrote:

IMO...

- Fey-blooded should be a versatile heritage, especially for nymphs.

Personally, I think nymphs are enough of their own thing that they'd be better as an ancestry than a versatile heritage, especially with how easy it is to decide what the heritages would be. I suppose the power level could be a concern, but there's already a sense of progression with the base nymph -> nymph queen, so imo adding a "lesser nymph" ancestry wouldn't feel too disruptive.

I do agree that a generalized feyblood heritage would be a nice addition as well, and I can see the logic for satyrs even if they don't personally interest me much.

DMurnett wrote:

JiCi wrote:

- Aquatic heritages may be a hard sell, because, well... 90% of adventures are happening on land. Right now, the ONLY thing that would favor aquatic heriatges would be a book about the Shackles... which I think Paizo already did back in P1E's debuts.

- The thing with aquatic ancestry options is that while the need for them isn't huge in general, in the cases that it's important it's very important. There's no aquatic adventures because there's not enough player options to run them. I wouldn't count out a Shackles book in particular either since we haven't gotten much about it in 2e.

I think we're very nearly in a good place here, what with azarketi, athamaru, merfolk, assorted heritages, and probably something else I'm forgetting. That said, I'd really like an aquatic elf heritage at minimum, and I think the sea is a great place for some sort of aberration ancestry, and/or a cephalopod/other mollusk/crustacean ancestry/ancestries, in addition to perhaps an ancestry of some sort that doesn't live underwater but lives near it.

DMurnett wrote:

JiCi wrote:

- Oozefolks would be cool, but again, we need a lore reason. If the Age of Lost Omens somehow awakened clusters of oozes, jellies and slimes, which they rapidly reproduced, then I could see this happening.

- As many have pointed out oozefolk candidates already exist but even if they didn't, is it really that big of a stretch that Paizo could make something up? Why are intelligent slimes more unbelievable than any number of existing ancestries?

I definitely agree with this take, and I'd also like to point out that with the Darklands retcons, there's a decent space for an entirely new oozefolk ancestry to be "discovered", since the current canon knowledge there has already been cast into doubt fairly heavily. I wouldn't mind some more Darklands ancestries as well in the same book as well(potentially serpentfolk???), but I definitely would really really like oozefolk in particular.

As far as other ancestries I'd mostly prefer some attention placed on old ones more than anything(fleshwarp and vishkanya especially, though I'd also like some more goloma feats perhaps), but I would enjoy some arthropod-like people or serpentfolk as well. There's implications of an upcoming book that would cover the Impossible Lands, so that could help with the first two of those hopefully, assuming it's not just all class and archetype options.

[Berselius]

Honestly? I think we're pretty much covered in terms of possible ancestries. I think what we need now is some more Ancestry Feats.

[Zoken44]

What about a collective people? like you are a living swarm. Instead of being made of specialized cells, you are made of specialized creatures of the same species. feat trees growing into either resistance and immunity to precision damage or self-heal and regeneration. Weakness of course to splash damage.

[OceanshieldwolPF 2.5]

Zoken44 wrote:

What about a collective people? like you are a living swarm. Instead of being made of specialized cells, you are made of specialized creatures of the same species. feat trees growing into either resistance and immunity to precision damage or self-heal and regeneration. Weakness of course to splash damage.

So something like Starfinder’s copaxi?

[Oh, Deer Lord]

Zoken44 wrote:

What about a collective people? like you are a living swarm. Instead of being made of specialized cells, you are made of specialized creatures of the same species. feat trees growing into either resistance and immunity to precision damage or self-heal and regeneration. Weakness of course to splash damage.

Would absolutely LOVE a swarm ancestry, with different heritages for if you're made of worms, leeches, bees, spiders, etc.

I know alignment now only exists as a broad concept, but most swarms that walk are unrepentantly evil, so it would take some creative implementation to create a "good" or "neutral" swarm ancestry lore-wise.

The Spathinae from Starfinder are a great example of that.

Heck, as someone very excited for Starfinder 2e, would be thrilled with a 2e version of the Spathinae I could port over!

[Oh, Deer Lord]

A hyper-specific wish that I don't expect to see come true: a snake ancestry. Basically humanoid, human-sized snakes with arms and tails instead of legs. A few different heritages that paint different types of snakes in broad strokes: desert, jungle, aquatic, venomous, etc. Feats that do things like let you climb a tree or constrict a foe you have grappled. There's a great homebrew version, but something official would be wonderful. :3

[Oh, Deer Lord]

I agree with the calls for an ooze ancestry!
(Yes, I'm aware Battlezoo has one and I love it. I just like to be able to use things for society play one day.)

[keftiu]

Oh, Deer Lord wrote:

A hyper-specific wish that I don't expect to see come true: a snake ancestry. Basically humanoid, human-sized snakes with arms and tails instead of legs. A few different heritages that paint different types of snakes in broad strokes: desert, jungle, aquatic, venomous, etc. Feats that do things like let you climb a tree or constrict a foe you have grappled. There's a great homebrew version, but something official would be wonderful. :3

Nagaji have had a Heritage for this since they were introduced, I believe!

[PossibleCabbage]

keftiu wrote:

Oh, Deer Lord wrote:

A hyper-specific wish that I don't expect to see come true: a snake ancestry. Basically humanoid, human-sized snakes with arms and tails instead of legs. A few different heritages that paint different types of snakes in broad strokes: desert, jungle, aquatic, venomous, etc. Feats that do things like let you climb a tree or constrict a foe you have grappled. There's a great homebrew version, but something official would be wonderful. :3

Nagaji have had a Heritage for this since they were introduced, I believe!

Sacred Nagaji- replaces your fangs unarmed attack you get a Tail attack (d6 B, finesse) and you get a +2 circumstance bonus to resist grapple and trip.

No problem with taking this heritage on any Nagaji, but as with all heritages you run into the issue of "you can't be this and also be a Nephilim, Dhampir, etc."

[JiCi]

PossibleCabbage wrote:

keftiu wrote:

Oh, Deer Lord wrote:

A hyper-specific wish that I don't expect to see come true: a snake ancestry. Basically humanoid, human-sized snakes with arms and tails instead of legs. A few different heritages that paint different types of snakes in broad strokes: desert, jungle, aquatic, venomous, etc. Feats that do things like let you climb a tree or constrict a foe you have grappled. There's a great homebrew version, but something official would be wonderful. :3

Nagaji have had a Heritage for this since they were introduced, I believe!

Sacred Nagaji- replaces your fangs unarmed attack you get a Tail attack (d6 B, finesse) and you get a +2 circumstance bonus to resist grapple and trip.

No problem with taking this heritage on any Nagaji, but as with all heritages you run into the issue of "you can't be this and also be a Nephilim, Dhampir, etc."

Then again, what you're asking for is a "Late Awakening" or "Awakened [ancestry] Heritage" feat for other ancestries :p

That... would be much easier to add XD