Both regarding Prismatic Wall, on p360.
"The wall as a whole is immune to counteracting effects of the wall’s level or lower; each color must be counteracted by its specific spell, as described in chromatic wall."
Does the semicolon indicate a counterpoint, that is, that the wall as a whole can be countered by a Dispel Magic of higher level than the wall? Or does it indicate that (unlike Chromatic Wall) each of the spells cast to dispel colors of the wall must be higher level than the wall?
"You can pass through the wall and ignore its effects."
Is "blocking stuff" one of its effects for this purpose, ie, it does not block your spells?
This is a confusing one but I'll try my best, and bump the post while I'm at it
First "The wall as a whole is immune to counteracting effects of the wall’s level or lower;" I believe this is simply rewriting the normal degrees of successes for the Counteract rule.
Second "each color must be counteracted by its specific spell, as described in chromatic wall." I think this is where I ran into most of my own confusion. At first I thought to look at all of the counteracting rules from Chromatic Wall but that just created more inconsistencies with Prismatic Wall regarding the counteraction levels. I think all we are supposed to take away from this line is that the spells used to counteract the colors stay the same.
In short, I agree with your second supposition, it indicate that (unlike Chromatic Wall) each of the spells cast to dispel colors of the wall must be higher level than the wall.
As for the question about ignoring effects, I don't think you could normally cast through it due to the very mundane reason that the wall is opaque. If you could somehow see through it to target someone or something on the other side, then yes, you would ignore all of the spell/energy blocking effects of the wall.
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The prior version of this spell was impossible to get rid of with the normal "get rid of a magic effect" spells, and had a specific spell that would strip away each layer.
I believe the intent of the new version of this spell is to maintain that same approach, but soften the impossible part of it to let a heightened "get rid of magic effect" spell take it out.
I don't think they meant for it to take one such suped-up spell per layer, so I'm pretty sure each color is counteracted by their listed spells with normal counteract rules rather than needing to be equal or higher level.
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Yea, it takes either a Level 10 Dispel Magic or the series of other spells.
(I notice that very few NPCs or monsters have this capability, potentially making it a fast win for PCs in certain battles.)
But there's still the big question of whether or not your own spells, missiles, etc. pass through the wall because you can "ignore its effects".
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On the topic of what "You can pass through the wall and ignore its effects." means.
You is you - not you, your spell effects, or other things you might try to have pass through (such as your vision, or your arrows).
And beyond that the sentence is saying that you are exempt from what normally happens to creatures that pass through the wall - not that you can behave as if the wall weren't there entirely.
Hmm. Fair enough. I'd assumed that "ignoring it" meant, as you said, that you can behave as if the wall wasn't there.
This does seem to make Prismatic Wall a rather weak spell for its level, though. A level 5 wall of stone is more flexibly placeable (although 10' less tall), also blocks everything both ways, can't be passed through at all (rather than being able to be passed through with some damage and save) and can't be dispelled.
Comparing to a wall of stone means comparing what happens to the creature(s) you want on the other side of the wall when you cast it:
wall of stone they spend a few actions and walk through the hole they smashed in it.
prismatic wall they either spend quite a few spells dismantling it, or they "take the hit" and Stride through - which because they might not survive doing that, maybe they just stay on the other side of the wall.
hyphz wrote: Hmm. Fair enough. I'd assumed that "ignoring it" meant, as you said, that you can behave as if the wall wasn't there.
This does seem to make Prismatic Wall a rather weak spell for its level, though. A level 5 wall of stone is more flexibly placeable (although 10' less tall), also blocks everything both ways, can't be passed through at all (rather than being able to be passed through with some damage and save) and can't be dispelled.
Prismatic Wall/Sphere have the benefit that you can use forced movement abilities or spells to push enemies through it and use it offensively. It’s very strong with quicken to create and push in the same round or with Time Stop to set up more than one wall.
Xenocrat wrote: hyphz wrote: Hmm. Fair enough. I'd assumed that "ignoring it" meant, as you said, that you can behave as if the wall wasn't there.
This does seem to make Prismatic Wall a rather weak spell for its level, though. A level 5 wall of stone is more flexibly placeable (although 10' less tall), also blocks everything both ways, can't be passed through at all (rather than being able to be passed through with some damage and save) and can't be dispelled.
Prismatic Wall/Sphere have the benefit that you can use forced movement abilities or spells to push enemies through it and use it offensively. It’s very strong with quicken to create and push in the same round or with Time Stop to set up more than one wall. Just had a player use this in our Kingmaker campaign to split a boss from his allies allowing the players to make it two smaller easier fights instead of one big one.
As a GM I found the wall to be quite difficult to deal with as it can't be reasonably dispelled without 9th level spells (which the enemies don't have) or walking through and eating a pile of damage and debuffs. One of the lieutenants charged through it and was so damaged and weakened by it that the players mopped him up in a single round.
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Sounds like everything is working as intended then. Player tactics like that are supposed to have impact.
I am expecting that Prismatic Wall went the way of the OGL. It wasn't reprinted in Player Core. So while it is still usable, it won't be referenced in any more Pathfinder content.
Finoan wrote: I am expecting that Prismatic Wall went the way of the OGL. It wasn't reprinted in Player Core. So while it is still usable, it won't be referenced in any more Pathfinder content. And as a GM who likes high level play may I say, good riddance. The spells are such mechanical pains in the butt to run with any level expedience.
Loved the thematics and power, groaned every time play crawled to a halt when it was cast.
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