What Is "Maximum Movement For The Round"?

[Azothath]

At some point I like to post some RAW in the Rules Forum to touch base and cut down on the various assumptions people are making. Alas, in this case I got altered text without indication from PFSRD20 (and that's on them). Glad someone noticed and even had the website's source(!).

I'm amused no one to date posted the correct text. The sections I posted should be central to the discussion.

I'd agree that the rules require interpretation. It's a game and not a very good model of reality.

[Derklord]

Azothath wrote:

I'm amused no one to date posted the correct text. The sections I posted should be central to the discussion.

There aren't any really definite descriptions, as the CRB doesn't have a glossary.

"Base Speed" and "Base Land Speed", seem to mean exactly the same, your land speed before encumberance:
"Your speed while unarmored is your base land speed." pg. 192
"A barbarian’s base speed is faster than the norm for her race by +10 feet. (...) Apply this bonus before modifying the barbarian’s speed because of any load carried or armor worn." pg. 31
"This spell gives you a +10 foot enhancement bonus to your base speed. It has no effect on other modes of movement, such as burrow, climb, fly, or swim." pg. 305
All race descriptions say they "have a base speed of X feet".
The Character Sheet on pg. 570 has, under the header of "speed land", boxes for "base speed" and "with armor", followed by boxes for "fly", "swim", "climb", and "burrow".

"Land Speed" seems to be your speed after encumberance:
"a dwarf’s land speed remains 20 feet even in medium or heavy armor or when carrying a medium or heavy load." pg. 150

As the bonus or penalty on Acrobatics checks to jump based on speed is keyed off "base land speed", it's not affected by encumberance.

None of the above helps explain what "maximum movement for the round" is, though.

[bbangerter]

Derklord wrote:

As the bonus or penalty on Acrobatics checks to jump based on speed is keyed off "base land speed", it's not affected by encumberance.

Which rule is of course immediately contradicted by the text in various spells and abilities that increase/decrease your speed. A few of them, like barbarian, mention is as a change to base speed, most of them just to a change in speed. Yet all of them point out that they increase/decrease your jump checks "as normal for increased speed".

e.g. "Base speed" and "speed" are really synonymous within the rules. Anything that affects your speed is also affecting your base speed.

The alternative is that your jump roll is not effected by encumbrance would suggest that you could still jump while carrying more than your maximum load.
"A character can lift as much as double his maximum load off the ground, but he or she can only stagger around with it."
Even though you can only stagger around with this load.

[Derklord]

bbangerter wrote:

Which rule is of course immediately contradicted by the text in various spells and abilities that increase/decrease your speed.

Er, no? All my quote said was that the bonus or penalty to jumping is unaffected by encumberance, not that it's unaffected by bonuses.

bbangerter wrote:

e.g. "Base speed" and "speed" are really synonymous within the rules. Anything that affects your speed is also affecting your base speed.

That is literally what I wrote: ""Base Speed" and "Base Land Speed", seem to mean exactly the same, your land speed before encumberance"

bbangerter wrote:

The alternative is that your jump roll is not effected by encumbrance would suggest that you could still jump while carrying more than your maximum load.

My quote was only about the bonus or penalty to jump checks based on speeed ("Creatures with a base land speed above 30 feet receive a +4 racial bonus on Acrobatics checks made to jump for every 10 feet of their speed above 30 feet. Creatures with a base land speed below 30 feet receive a –4 racial penalty on Acrobatics checks made to jump for every 10 feet of their speed below 30 feet." CRB pg. 88). And yes, I already said it was "way weird" that it's unaffected by encumberance, but that's what the rules say.

[Matthew Downie]

bbangerter wrote:

"Base speed" and "speed" are really synonymous within the rules. Anything that affects your speed is also affecting your base speed.

In general, things that change your speed are changing your Base Speed. However, that doesn't mean this is always the case...

The Encumbrance table lists 'Base Speed' and 'Reduced Speed'.

Quote:

Table: Armor and Encumbrance for Other Base Speeds

Base Speed | Reduced Speed
5 ft. | 5 ft.
10 ft.–15 ft. | 10 ft.
20 ft. | 15 ft.
25 ft.–30 ft. | 20 ft.
35 ft. | 25 ft.
40 ft.–45 ft. | 30 ft.
50 ft. | 35 ft.
55 ft.–60 ft. | 40 ft.

Eg, if you're a PC who wears heavy armour (which reduces your speed from 30 to 20), and someone casts Haste on you, your Base Speed goes up by 30 (assuming that Haste does affect Base Speed, which is not explicitly stated). However, this means your actual speed only increases to 40. I wonder how many players do this correctly?

It sounds plausible that 'Base Speed' specifically means 'speed before encumbrance effects are applied'.

On the other hand, it sounds kinda dumb if wearing heavy stuff is the one speed-modifying thing that has no effect on your ability to jump...