Thoughts on a few possible class features for the Oracle


Oracle Playtest

Grand Lodge

I've been going back and forth with some people regarding the Oracle's curses and the interaction with revelation spells. What are your thoughts on the following changes to the Oracle's class features?

First, I think Oracles should be deemed the 'Focus Spell' spellcaster. What's in the playtest now seems to suggest that, at least. So either the Oracle should have the ability to do more interesting things with focus spells or they should be able to use them more often. My concern with the former is power creep, and my concern with the latter is spamming focus spells throughout the adventuring day.

My suggested solution is to grant at level 1 a 1/day use of a revelation spell that doesn't advance the Oracle's curse at level 1, just like their Advanced and Greater Revelation feats grant.

So at the start of the first combat they could potentially burst three focus spells in a combat, though then they'd be stuck with one focus spell per combat for the rest of the day. Then advanced and greater revelation feats, when they get it, grants them a total of 3/day no advancement of the curse.

That makes it so revelation spells don't have to get a buff and the oracle can't spam multiple of them every single combat, just one additional time per day. I think it's especially important to give oracles that option because there are currently two means of refreshing Focus Points (a gnome feat and a familiar) that oracle's cannot benefit from at all. And there will likely be more options to recover Focus Points in the future as well.

Second, What do you think about having some other minor benefit alongside the minor curse? Particularly for Life and Flames mysteries, the initial mystery benefit seems super lackluster; I mean, Life is a slightly better version of Toughness and Flame is a (very slightly) better version of Canny Acumen[Reflex]. Both are 1st level general feats. Whereas Battle Oracle gets exactly what I'd expect for the mystery benefit, and it's pretty good (heavy armor is great- better than what a Warpriest gets and I approve!). It wouldn't be anything game changing, but something that grants a reason to bump yourself to the minor curse effect in the first place is a good way to go. It could even be a benefit that ONLY applies when you are at your minor effect, and temporarily goes away if you go to Moderate or above on your curse level. Things like +1 bonus to your Mystery's associated skills or something like that would go a long way in my opinion.

Lastly what are your thoughts on having some harsh conditions placed on the oracle rather than unconsciousness if they advance their curse too far? I really like the thematic of "this person's curse is wracking their body so much they cannot function" but having them knocked out will likely only lead to a character's untimely and narratively-disappointing death. Something like Doomed 1+Flat Footed, and can no longer use Revelation Spells for the remainder of the day or something like that. Harsh penalties, but if a character is in a bad situation already, they still have a chance to get to safety.


I like the idea of them having focus spells as their core mechanic and using their focus spells both increases their curse both the positive and negative aspects.

I would be happy to have more variety and options in focus spells and less regular spell slots if this was done right. More of the feats could apply to focus spells or to increase the benefits of being at higher level of curses rather than just punishing detriments.

The adding doomed condition instead of passing out is a good idea, not as keen on the idea of losing access to cast revelations for the rest of the day but perhaps increasing the minimum level of your curse for the rest of the day would work, so after pushing it you can't go below the moderate level of your curse until you have 8 hours of rest.


personally I am hoping that the psychic becomes the focus caster. focus spells seem ideal to replicate true psionics better than the 1st edition Psion.


Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber

i definitely like how much emphasis on focus casting the oracle has.

as for overclocking, i think instead maybe they should just be locked at their highest curse level and can't refocus out of it until they sleep.

Grand Lodge

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My issue is if they're continuously able to cast focus spells without having to refocus then that can make the balancing between the classes fall apart.

If you're unconscious you can't cast focus spells, so I don't see why being conscious and unable to cast focus spells would be anything but an upgrade in my opinion.

Which is why I like the idea of a class feature (maybe just a line under Curse or Mystery) that states 'Once per day you may cast a revelation spell without advancing your curse.' It grants Oracles a way to utilize their major class feature better without compromising the integrity of the 2e system as a whole. In addition, having that class feature makes Advanced Revelation and Greater Revelation not become mandatory feats, but nice bonuses so an oracle will have at least 1 use per day but as many as 3 uses of revelations per day that don't advance the curse.

A fairly major drawback should be put in place if you overclock yourself with revelation spells. But like I said before, unconsciousness is pretty bad, narratively, and can lead to a lot of in-fighting and drama at a table.

I think what is really interesting and has potential for more storytelling, is the intense drawback of overclocking while still allowing the Oracle to fight their way out of danger. Your table's flame oracle can shoot off one more fire ray as a last ditch effort to take down the BBEG that's killed three of your party members, but doing so fatigues the Oracle and gives them the doomed 1 condition as well as losing their revelation spells until they rest for 8 hours and make daily preparations again. Or something of the sorts. Having them just fall over unconscious just makes the whole thing either a pain the whole table has to deal with or a mechanic that will never, ever occur. Let it have meaning, so that when it occurs it helps create a good story for the table. Unconsciousness is just a cop out IMO.

I'm really, really hoping designers are at least considering these, because I love the oracle class and I don't want to see them turn into a Cha-based cleric

TL;DR Giving Oracles the ability to overclock their revelation spells without literally becoming a drag to party members is major as it can help lead to good storytelling and less IRL dissent among players.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

"Hey, I'm not going to be at game the next two weeks, I'm gonna Alpha-strike then you can carry me around for the next couple of weeks, then I'll 'roleplay' my 'unconsciosness' the week after that..."

Yeahhhhh.... no thanks.


Syries wrote:
Which is why I like the idea of a class feature (maybe just a line under Curse or Mystery) that states 'Once per day you may cast a revelation spell without advancing your curse.'

That sounds like an ability I wouldn't really make use of. Rather than force it on everyone as a class ability, I think it makes more sense to be available as a feat.


Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber
Syries wrote:


If you're unconscious you can't cast focus spells, so I don't see why being conscious and unable to cast focus spells would be anything but an upgrade in my opinion.

it's supposed to be an upgrade since the current unconscious thing is garbo. mindful you're stuck at your highest curse level, so you're either effectively slowed 1 or something else horrible.

also if you just get doomed, does that mean you can still refocus and/or just keep casting and get higher doomed condition. the lvl 17 curse already gives you doomed so this would give you doomed 2 after level 17 at the very least.

Grand Lodge

Right. I forgot about Extreme Curse.

I'm fine with being unable to cast revelation spells if you cast one while at the height of your curse, and unconsciousness is indeed garbo. If you're locked at your highest level of curse it doesn't stop you from just being able to cast revelation spells over and over again and just deal with the major curse effects. Again, you're dealing with balancing the number of times an oracle can cast a focus spell vs any other spellcaster casting a focus spell.

RexAliquid wrote:
Syries wrote:


Which is why I like the idea of a class feature (maybe just a line under Curse or Mystery) that states 'Once per day you may cast a revelation spell without advancing your curse.'
That sounds like an ability I wouldn't really make use of. Rather than force it on everyone as a class ability, I think it makes more sense to be available as a feat.

It might be fine as a feat, but I'm thinking in terms of any mysteries in the future that would be considered blaster caster mysteries (Flame mystery included)

Divine spell list is pretty terrible for blasting spells, especially if you don't worship a deity, which Oracles don't have to. Especially at early levels you're relying on revelation spells like fire ray to deal damage. There was even a situation with my 4th level life oracle where I wished I could just cast a revelation spell just one more time to help out the party. And since oracles don't get any 1st level feats (nor do they have class features that grant them 1st level feats like wizards, clerics, bards, and druids) i just feel it's most appropriate to incorporate that 1/day ability in the revelation spells class feature.


There should be an ability allowing to select spells from different domains/mysteries.

Grand Lodge Designer

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Bardess wrote:
There should be an ability allowing to select spells from different domains/mysteries.

There are a few that do this, but admittedly they're a bit higher in level. (See Mysterious Repertoire and Diverse Mystery feats.) There might be some room to pull those down a bit.


Bardess wrote:
There should be an ability allowing to select spells from different domains/mysteries.

For different domains, all it would take is a modification of the feat 2 Domain Acumen. Right now, Domain Acumen lets you take the initial domain spell from the other domain associated with the mystery, the one the player rejected at character creation. Yep, spend a 2nd-level feat to get an option that the player passed up at 1st level.

But would an improved Domain Acumen give access to any domain, or could it find a middle ground between the rejected domain and all domains?

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