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You propel your grabbed or restrained foe a great distance. You can throw the creature any distance up to 10 feet, plus 5 feet × your Strength modifier. If you successfully throw the creature, it takes bludgeoning damage equal to your Strength modifier plus 1d6 per 10 feet you threw it.Attempt an Athletics check against the foe’s Fortitude DC. You take a –2 circumstance penalty to your check if the target is one size larger than you and a –4 circumstance penalty if it’s larger than that. You gain a +2 circumstance bonus to your check if the target is one size smaller than you and a +4 circumstance bonus if it’s smaller than that.
Critical Success You throw the creature the desired distance and it lands prone.
Success You throw the creature the desired distance.
Failure You don’t throw the creature.
Critical Failure You don’t throw the creature, and it’s no longer grabbed or restrained by you.
So, does this count as an "unarmed attack" to gain the benefits of weapon specialization or mystic strikes? I'm pretty sure it doesn't based on RAW, but I definitely think it's weird if you can't treat the damage as the various monk damage types or add the bonus damage from weapon specialization. I think it's already generally suboptimal compared to striking, so it could use the minor damage buff from these two things.
I would say no. Also, the point of these two feats isn't raw damage. It is battlefield control.
Well the point of crushing grab is entirely to deal damage. I think it should at least count as the various materials monk can do like cold iron and silver for that piddly damage
Crushing grab adds a small amount of damage to your grapple. The main purpose of grapple is battlefield control. You don't take Crushing Grab unless you plan to be grappling, ergo controlling the battlefield.
That said, I'd probably allow the cold iron silver stuff myself. Not sure if that's supported by the rules but it makes sense to me. But weapon specialization? Nah. By comparison, the barbarian feat Thrash explicitly gets Weapon Specialization damage, but that's a separate action you have to use, not a free rider on the grapple action.
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if they counted as unarmed strikes for any reason, they'd say it explicitly - Pathfinder rules don't function via implication
Yes, obviously. I'm more concerned that, at the very least, these feats were designed with the assumption that they would work with mystic/metal strikes, but weren't supported that way
Whirling throw isn't an attack at all. Which is great, because it means you can use it on the same turn that you grapply, with no MAP on your athletics check.
Can you use Whirling Throw on the Dwarf PC in your party?
I don't see any reason you couldn't. They'd still take the damage, so i dont think you'd want to make a habit of it...
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I don't see any reason you couldn't. They'd still take the damage, so i dont think you'd want to make a habit of it...
However, forced movement doesn't provoke reactions from movement, so if your parties barbarian/fighter really wants to move 30ft towards enemies to save an action, it might be worth the damage.
Anyone remember the Battle of Helm's Deep? :-)