How much Influence should it cost to rule an existing settlement?


Title Question.

I have a player character that, due to circumstances, is playing entirely behind the scenes. Using Downtime Rules exclusively.

And for fun we're trying to play as strictly to the rules as possible, even if that means him becoming grossly OP.

But the PC has the goal of becoming the ruler of Sandpoint and possibly attempting to use Kingdom Building rules to make it the Main port of his Airship fleet. (Downtime magic item crafting is silly)

I think politicking should be something the Influence Capital is perfectly suited for.


Sandpoint is a small town run by an elected mayor.

So becoming the ruler would involve making everyone like you better than whoever else is running for mayor.

So you should be spending both money and influence on winning the race. But it doesn't make him the "ruler". It would make him the mayor. And while he could probably get approval to do something like build an air field he's still going to have to pay for it.

Yeah admittedly I haven't looked at the Kingdom Building rules in a while (since it'll be a while still until he has that level of influence anyway) so I couldn't remember what level of control you need to have in order to use the Kingdom Capital.

That's a good start though. And depends if he's willing to try to setup Sandpoint to secede from the Varisian empire... Which is its whole other 'deal'. :D

So the question is: What amount of Influence, Gold, and/or time, should need to be spent in order to win a race? And is there a good metric to put up against a settlement's size?

Edit: Varisia is just a bunch of city states! This might make it easier he just needs to gain influential control over Magninar. >.>

Sandpoint and the coalition run by Magnamar aren't a democracy, its a feudal oligarchy headed by the Mayor of Magnamar who is 'elected' by the nobles that are recognized as part of the house of lords there. And they only have a vote on who the mayor is when some faction tries to remove the current Mayor, who is more like a King than the actual King of Varisia.

Sandpoints Mayor should be an appointment, most likely by the agreement of the 4 local noble houses. Though it could actually be appointed by the Mayor in Magnamar. It really isn't discussed.

While it is certainly possible to become the ruler of Sandpoint, the Downtime and Kingdom Building rules will not help you do so. Downtime will help you accumulate bonuses to rolls in Sandpoint, but there is no skill check to take over. You need to make a plan and carry it out. That might involve things that Influence and other resources generated by downtime can help with, but you'd be adventuring in town and taking risks. Not doing something that doesn't involve the rest of the players.

And even if you do succeed in becoming the ruler of Sandpoint, Sandpoint isn't a separate Kingdom from Magnamar. You don't qualify to use the Kingdom Building rules because you aren't actually sovereign over the lands. The surrounding lands look towards Sandpoint as a point of contact and civilization, but the armies are based out of Magnamar. The patrolls come from Magnamar. The taxes go to Magnamar. Sandpoint pays taxes to Magnamar. The only way to actually use the Kingdom Building rules would be to break away from Magnamar. I don't think the locals would be thrilled, and most certainly neither Magnamar or Riddleport would ignore the town of Sandpoint declaring its independence.

As for building an airport in Sandpoint...use the downtime rules. It is just a series of rooms plus a few teams. If you are using the downtime rules to generate enough magic resources to make your crafting turn a profit, you should be comfortable with these rules as well.

Also downtime magic crafting generates a profit when you use magic resources, but not crazy amounts of it. If you up the DC to double your crafting progress that means you craft 2,000 gp per day, which generates 1,000 gp profit per day. That assumes you can generate 20 magic resources per day as well. Getting a cohort or another player with Cooperative Crafting can let you make even more but its effectively the same profit per person. And Sandpoint has a purchase limit of 10k so at most a single player should be able to generate 5k per non-adventuring day using this method.

Though my wizard use Fabricate to craft Keelboats (we were on a river). 1k of expenses plus a 5th level spell equals a 500gp profit. Or if you use Goods and Magic to generate the capital that is 500gp in materials to produce 1000gp profit when you sell the Keelboat for half market value. I made a deal with the GM to only sell 2 boats per week. I could of convinced him to give me the full sales value since I owned the local shipwright and one of the docks but I thought it was fair to say the other 1,500gp involved in the sale went to the businesses.

When I was doing all of this Sailboats (10k each) were also possible with Fabricate for a high enough level wizard. They aren't much bigger than a Keelboat but with 3 times the profit per spell.

That sort of money flowing into a party without adventuring generally isn't good for a campaign. Too much unearned wealth make the party too flush with magic items to leave a real challenge for the party without redesigning every encounter. The best way to prevent that from happening is to not give the players a lot of downtime. Adventuring is what you here for anyways, right?

That is all fantastic information thank you!
Yeah dealing with crafting limits and settlement purchase limits is going to be difficult. We're currently looking into shipping/teleportation circles and using multiple settlements for selling.

And as for the money thing this is the kind of campaign where anything goes. Otherwise none of this probably should have been allowed. XD For this game we're specifically trying to "break" the game. As long as we can justify that's how the RAW is meant to work. *Shrug* (and yes we could seriously destroy it. But I guess we're... Breaking it within reason...?)

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