Crafting a Wonderous Item with multiple low level spells each command activated 1 per day

[timmypaddins]

I am currently building a 7th level Ranger with Craft Wonderous Item. He wants to make a <insert item type>, which has the following 1st level ranger spells added to it, each of which has 1 charge per day, usage based on a Command Word (they could be any of the spells, I am just choosing these for now):

Feather Step
Glide
Iron Beard
Jump
Resist Energy

They are all 1st level spells. I understand that a Ranger's caster level is current level - 3, right, so he would have a caster level of 4.

As an aside, is the Ranger REQUIRED to make items as CL 4? Or can he chose to make them at a lower CL to limit the cost of the item? I am assuming he can right now, and the below calculations would change is he can't.

So, as far as I can tell, the costs would be as follows:

Feather Step = CL 1 = Base Price: 360
Glide = CL 1 = Base Price: 360
Iron Beard = CL 2 = Base Price: 720
Jump = CL 1 = Base Price: 360
Resist Energy = CL 1 = Base Price: 360

I am assuming they would count as "different", so am multiplying the lower costs by 1.5, giving:

Feather Step = CL 1 = Base Price: 540
Glide = CL 1 = Base Price: 540
Iron Beard = CL 2 = Base Price: 720
Jump = CL 1 = Base Price: 540
Resist Energy = CL 1 = Base Price: 540

Giving a total of 2880gp. With no item slot, this would be 5760gp market price.

To make this would be 2880gp, but if restricted by class or alignment, it would come down to 2016gp.

Can anyone see a problem with this logic?

As I was rereading this, would the charges correspond to the item as a whole, rather than the individual spells? I am thinking it would, in which case, the above could be split into 5 separate, slotless items, for actually LESS money, of 1512gp, as one would not need to pay the 50% increase for the different powers, right?

Cheers

Padster

[Meirril]

The way your proposed item is stated out each spell can be activated once per day.

Also the GM may put some limits on this sort of item. Like he might insist that you use an appropriately slot for the item effects. Especially if you split them up.

Or that your slotless items aren't worn. Having to retrieve them from a pouch makes such items a bit less convenient, which goes a small way towards balancing them vs existing items.

And your GM might just adjust the value of the item. The formula are a guideline for making an item. If the item turns out to be more valuable than the formula suggests the creation and market value need to be adjusted.

Not that I think your proposed item is too powerful. Just making custom items can get really abusive if its done a lot. Once a player in our group tried to convince us that a 'stone of cure light wounds' for 2000gp was fine. Unlimited cure light wounds, because there was a 'rule' for it. Nobody else in the group though that would be fine.

[OmniMage]

You have some flexibility with caster levels with magic items. You can use any caster level, so long as it is high enough to cast the spell in question. For instance, a Wizard making a magic item with a level 2 spell would need a minimum caster level of 3, because 3 is the level Wizards get 2nd level spells.

If you are making a magic item slotless, I would skip the step where you multiply the costs of other abilities by 1.5. Think of it this way. If you were to make multiple magic items, each with their own slot, there would be no price multiplier. If you moved them all to a single slot, there would be a price multiplier of x1.5 because you are freeing up the other slots for more magic items. If they don't use any slots, then you pay even more because they are not items that play the slot game.

Another way to think of it, think of slotless is the way things normally are. You are using slots for price reductions.

I would also skip the step where you restrict the item by class or alignment. They function more like security features than restrictions. It would be difficult for someone to steal them and then use them against you.

[timmypaddins]

OmniMage wrote:

I would also skip the step where you restrict the item by class or alignment. They function more like security features than restrictions. It would be difficult for someone to steal them and then use them against you.

You know, I have never got this discount.

It IS like a security feature, so as to ensure others cannot use it. For that kind of effect I would say it should cost MORE, because it is a security feature, and it can't just be picked up and used by any old dude.

Really don't get the logic of Pathfinder sometimes.

Cheers

Padster

[OmniMage]

I would reserve some of the blame for Wizards of the Coast. They're the ones who designed 3rd edition. Paizo copied the book, made some mods, but kept most of the material.

*WotC made 3rd edition open source long ago, so anyone can release their own version. Don't try this with a rpg you don't know.

I remembered something. For prices, not every item is suitable for the slotless prices. The Pearls of Power are priced normally despite being slotless. I consider weapons to be slotless. Scrolls, potions, staves and many other item have their own rules for pricing.

I wish there was more information for magic item creation.

[Dave Justus]

timmypaddins wrote:

It IS like a security feature, so as to ensure others cannot use it. For that kind of effect I would say it should cost MORE, because it is a security feature, and it can't just be picked up and used by any old dude.

Really don't get the logic of Pathfinder sometimes.

It makes perfect sense that you would have to sell an item like this for less, but not that you can craft it for less. Unfortunately, those two are always related to each other. The original focus of the crafting rules was to help GMs develop custom magic items and determine a fair market price for them. Players crafting custom items was much less of a focus.

Using the modifier for market value, but not crafting cost works out pretty well for this type of thing though, making it a security feature that costs if you ever want to sell the item on and not getting a discount to create. You only get a bargain if you happen to find an item that matches you up for sale (which only happens if the GM wants it to happen anyway).

[Cevah]

The only time in a previous character's massive crafting that I ever used the 30% discount was to limit a sacred bonus to only the faithful. I did this because of the theme, not for the savings.

That said, the general GM guide is: A restriction that does not restrict is not a restriction. That is to say, an item that only you can use does not get you a discount.

The formula for a 5 1st level spells w/1 at CL 2 not 1 is:
one item: 720 + 4*(360)*1.5 = 2880
slotless: 720*2 + 4*360*2 = 4320

When slotless, it is better to make separate, then if one gets zapped, the rest are still there. Likewise, if one is stolen, the replacement cost is less.

With all this said, it is actually the second rule. The first is to see the price of a similar thing. Closest I can think of is the Cloak of the Hedge Wizard. These give a 0th level spell at will and two 1st level spells 1/day. Formula for that is: 900 + 2*360*1.5 = 1980. The actual price is 2500. Using the same ratio, your prices go: 2880 -> 3636.36; 4320 -> 5454.54. As a GM I would round to 3625 and 5450.

/cevah