This question came up while discussing another topic.
Basically, a Bloodrager 8/Dragon Disciple 10 already has every feat on the bonus feats list for the Draconic Bloodline (their Bloodrager level for Bloodline is increased by Dragon Disciple which continues to give a bonus feat at 6 and every 3 levels after, plus Dragon Disciple gives a bonus feat from the same list at 2 and every 3 levels after. By level 15 you have all the bloodline feats, and 1 more to pick at level 18), and has to select one. None can be taken twice, so what do you do?
Retrain one of your existing feats that can be taken as a bonus feat into something else, then relearn it in the bonus feat slot.
I thought you couldn't retrain bonus feats? Or more accurately, couldn't retrain them except into another legal option for the feat.
If you could just retrain limited bonus feats into anything, they're basically just limitless bonus feats with a price tag. Which people would abuse to the nines.
Well, I don't think it works the way you say it does. You have 1 bloodline feat from being a level 8 Bloodrager. Dragon Disciple adds to your Sorcerer level for bloodline powers, not Bloodrager. Unless there is some FAQ I haven't found? So it looks like you're a 10th level sorcerer which gains 1 bonus feat. Then you get to add 3 more from the Dragon Disciple prestige class. By a strict interpretation it should be from the Sorcerer bloodline, but I'd allow it to go from either Sorcerer or Bloodrager bloodline list.
You get less feats than you think you do from Dragon Disciple.
A dragon disciple adds his level to his sorcerer levels when determining the powers gained from his bloodline.
The word "powers" refers to "bloodline powers", and not everything in the bloodline (a bloodline is basically made up of powers, bonus feats and bonus spells).
So a Bloodrager 8/Dragon Discie 10 would have 4 bonus feats: 1 from bloodrager (lvl 6) and 3 from Dragon Disciple (lvls 2, 5 & 8)
You get less feats than you think you do from Dragon Disciple.
A dragon disciple adds his level to his sorcerer levels when determining the powers gained from his bloodline.The word "powers" refers to "bloodline powers", and not everything in the bloodline (a bloodline is basically made up of powers, bonus feats and bonus spells).
So a Bloodrager 8/Dragon Discie 10 would have 4 bonus feats: 1 from bloodrager (lvl 6) and 3 from Dragon Disciple (lvls 2, 5 & 8)
Except the rest of the ability proceeds to contradict the first sentence.
If the dragon disciple does not have levels of sorcerer, he instead gains bloodline powers of the draconic bloodline, using his dragon disciple level as his sorcerer level to determine the bonuses gained. He must choose a dragon type upon gaining his first level in this class and that type must be the same as his sorcerer type. This ability does not grant bonus spells to a sorcerer unless he possesses spell slots of an appropriate level. Such bonus spells are automatically granted if the sorcerer gains spell slots of the spell's level.
Despite not being specifically a power, the ability still grants the spells (assuming you can cast them) of the base bloodline ability, which would imply it indeed gives all aspects of the base bloodline ability, which would include bloodline feats, as well as spells.
I always read Blood of Dragons as giving bloodline Powers always, and also granting the bloodline spells if the stated requirements were met. No mention of bloodline feats, so they are not granted. The fact that Dragon Diaciples have a seperate entry granting bloodline feats reinforces this in my mind.
If the situation where all blooine feats were exhausted actually came up I would, as a HR, offer the improved versions of any of the standard choices that had them.
Thinking about base Sorcerer, this wouldn't be a problem. Base sorc gete bloodline feats at 7, 13, and 19. Only 3, which would mean at most 2 would fall in the Dragon Disciple range. If you took it earliest level (5), you'd get a bonus feat same level from both Sorc and Dragon Disciple (7), and then Dragon Disciple doubles frequency so 1 more at 10, 13 they cross again so you get 2, then Dragon Disciple would end, and first level back to Sorc you'd be ready for your last at 19, which is 7/8 available feats, one of which (Power Attack) may not be attainable if your Str is too low (you'd have to start at <9 Str and place no attibute boosts into it), so you'd become the epitome of the Draconic Bloodline, having everything possible for anyone to get.
That perfect numbering makes sense to me. However the level synchronization of getting feats same level could hint the opposite way that it's intended to replace Bloodline's base feat granting.
It's really only the Bloodrager that mucks it up, since as a half-martial it doubled down on their bloodline feats without adding more to the list. Matter of fact, it actually removed one overall feat. They onky have 7 to pick from, Cleave having been added in place of Quicken Spell AND Skill Focus (Knowledge: Arcana). Plus the bloodline feat levels don't line up, they're staggered at 6 9 12 15 18.
I always read Blood of Dragons as giving bloodline Powers always, and also granting the bloodline spells if the stated requirements were met. No mention of bloodline feats, so they are not granted. The fact that Dragon Diaciples have a seperate entry granting bloodline feats reinforces this in my mind.
This is how I read it as well. The bonus spells are progressed because it says they are, the feats are not because it doesn't say they are. The bonus-pells are likely worded that way because you could go something like: Fighter-4/Bard-1/Dragon-Disciple-10. In this case your bonus spells would come long before you actually have the spell-slots to use them.
Hoorah! I had to delve into old threads from 2009, but apparently this was FAQd for sorcs.
Yes powers, yes spells but only if you're a sorc, feats at the DD rate. As nice as everything lines up.
So that fixes the problem for the character, however it doesn't answer the question regardless of my player's character being wrong (most of the feats are useless to him anyway). If some class combination makes it that you already have all your bonus feat choices, what do you do?
You get less feats than you think you do from Dragon Disciple.
A dragon disciple adds his level to his sorcerer levels when determining the powers gained from his bloodline.The word "powers" refers to "bloodline powers", and not everything in the bloodline (a bloodline is basically made up of powers, bonus feats and bonus spells).
So a Bloodrager 8/Dragon Discie 10 would have 4 bonus feats: 1 from bloodrager (lvl 6) and 3 from Dragon Disciple (lvls 2, 5 & 8)
Except the rest of the ability proceeds to contradict the first sentence.
If the dragon disciple does not have levels of sorcerer, he instead gains bloodline powers of the draconic bloodline, using his dragon disciple level as his sorcerer level to determine the bonuses gained. He must choose a dragon type upon gaining his first level in this class and that type must be the same as his sorcerer type. This ability does not grant bonus spells to a sorcerer unless he possesses spell slots of an appropriate level. Such bonus spells are automatically granted if the sorcerer gains spell slots of the spell's level.Despite not being specifically a power, the ability still grants the spells (assuming you can cast them) of the base bloodline ability, which would imply it indeed gives all aspects of the base bloodline ability, which would include bloodline feats, as well as spells.
"Bonus Spells" is what is written in almost every spellcaster class, as that is the extra spell slots you gain for having a high ability score.
It has nothing to do with the bloodline powers.Blood of the Dragons, when I read it, is just stating that if you have sorcerer levels then you add your dragon disciple on top of it when determining your level of existing spellcasting class, regardless if you have levels of sorcerer or not.
Because you lose out spellcaster levels from dragon disciple, you may have correct level to gain a new spell level of spells known, but you wouldn't since you didn't gain a spellcaster level from dragon disciple.