12th level human, 15 points. I'm looking for something that buffs in advance and then just unleashes hellacious crazy damage in combat. High AC (>25) a plus. Can be druid himself or druid + animal companion, whatever. He'll have all the time he needs to buff, so feel free to pile on with that.
12th level human, 15 points. I'm looking for something that buffs in advance and then just unleashes hellacious crazy damage in combat. High AC (>25) a plus. Can be druid himself or druid + animal companion, whatever. He'll have all the time he needs to buff, so feel free to pile on with that.
What've you got?
Doug M.
many options... from the wierd ooze form to giant to a dino lover.
Goliath Druid (giant form):
ride a Trex.
feats:
1: heavy armor + great sword prof. (bulette armor)
3: power attack
5+7 : augument summon
9: lunge
11: imp crit.
AC comes from full plate + shield + barkskin.
ride the Dino, kill with it...
Option 2: the rider :
SKinshaper druid (master alter self)
mount = any flyer. (roc)
feats:
1: lance prof + heavy armor
3 : mounted combat
5: ride by attack
7: spirited charge
9: wheeling charge
11: power attack
mount takes: wingover, hover, power attack
fight options:
1. turn small (halfling) while you up +4 STR (archetype)
cast reduce animal all day long on mount.
be a super charger
2. trun into a strix (flying humanoid) and be a killer from above
the mage single attack:
druid - Saurian
turn into hippo
take vital strike.
cast the spell that up the attack by 2 steps.
do 16d8 + str...
Seconding the Goliath Druid, but instead of an animal companion take the Rage Domain instead. Wild Shape into a two-headed troll (for Regeneration 5, darkvision, low-light vision, scent, two claws, two bites, and rend) and keep your Stoneplate armor and whatever other gear. Buff with Strong Jaw, Greater Magic Fang, Stoneskin, Bear's Endurance/Bull's Strength, Airwalk, Echolocation. Your choice of Rage Power.
If you really want to hug Lockjaw + Aspect of the Bear + Powerful Shape + Strength Surge for grabs.
If you want to make them scared and entangled Rime Spell + Frostbite + Enforcer + Intimidating Prowess.
Tentacleez Human Druid(Kraken Caller) 12
18 Str, 12 Dex, 12 Con, 10 Int, 14 Wis, 7 Cha
Feats:
1) Improved Initiative (or whatever else)
Human) Improved Unarmed Strike
3) Weapon Focus(tentacle)
5) Feral Combat Training
7) Power Attack
9) Jabbing Style
11) Cornugon Smash
Nature Bond Domain: Plains (Note, gives Pounce 3/day at 12)
Wild Shape 5/day (though we are using Wild Shape to grow 6 Tentacles from Kraken Caller)
You didn't specify a gold limit, so I will assume fairly low.
2 Beaststrike Clubs (because they can function as tentacles)
Amulet of Mighty Fists (Cruel, spell storing)
Assuming at least a +2 Wisdom Headband
Dragonhide Breastplate +3, Spellstoring
Heavy Horse
Prep rounds:
Cast Liveoak to have a Treant minion (CR 8)
Cast Frigid Touch into the Spell Storing Armor to shut down other natural attackers for 1 round
Cast Frostbite into Spell Storing Amulet
Cast Greater Magic Fang to give all Natural Attacks a +1 for 12 hours
Cast Hunter's Blessing for +2 to pretty much everything in the Terrain and vs the creature type you suspect you will face for 12 hours
Use Wildshape to grow 6 tentacles, for a total of 8 with 2 Beaststrike Clubs for 120 minutes.
Cast Resinous Skin for DR 5/Piercing and chance to disarm Melee weapon using opponents for 120 minutes
Cast Stone Skin for DR 10/Adamantine for 120 minutes
Cast Barkskin for +5 natural armor for 120 minutes
Cast Echolocation for Blindsight 40' for 120 minutes
Cast Freedom of Movement for 120 minutes
Cast Greensight to see through thick plant matter if the encounter is in a forest for 120 minutes
Cast Heightened Awareness to add +4 to initiative check for 120 minutes
Cast 2 Protection from Energy's picking Cold and Fire(or whatever else if you have knowledge of the fight, Cold is important because Protection grants Immunity, meaning Frigid Touch will not stagger, and fire is common)
Cast Bone Fists for +1 bonus to natural armor and +2 damage for 12 minutes
Cast Chameleon Stride (domain, 20% miss chance) for 12 minutes
Cast Fickle Winds to shut down Archers for 12 minutes
Cast Strong Jaw to bring the tentacles up to 1d8 for 12 minutes
Cast Bristle to convert up to 4 natural armor into damage for 12 minutes
Cast Antilife Shell to hedge out non-reach enemy melee fighters for 12 minutes
Cast Haste(from domain) for 12 rounds
Cast Siphon Might on the Horse granting yourself an enhancement bonus to Str of 1d6+5 (going with an average of 3, so +8) for 12 rounds
Cast Vengeful Comets to attempt to counter spellcasters for 12 rounds
Cast Lockjaw to add grab to one of your attacks for 12 rounds.
Cast Frostbite to add 1d6+12 nonlethal cold damage and Fatigue to the next 12 natural attacks.
Tentacles are secondary natural attacks, but if you only have 1 natural attack type, it is considered a primary attack.
Initiative: +9
Without Bristle = AC 26
9 Tentacle attacks (haste, 2 Beaststrike, 6 from Kraken Caller): at +21 to hit (9 bab, 8 str, 1 weapon focus, -3 Power Attack, 1 Greater Magic Fang, 2 Charging, 2 Hunters Blessing, 1 Haste)
for 1d8 + 22 damage (8 Str, 2 Hunters Blessing, 6 Power Attack, 2 Bone Fists, 4 Bristle)
+1d6+12 Nonlethal Cold for Frostbite
+1d6 per attack that has already hit this round (Jabbing Style)
If all attacks hit, it should be something like 9d8+198 +36d6(Jabbing Style, or 8d6 depending on your reading of Jabbing Style) + 9d6+108 nonlethal cold. Average about 500 damage.
Demoralize with Cornugon Smash, Sicken with Cruel Amulet, Fatigue with Frostbite, most targets should be at a -5 to hit you once you have attacked them.
Should be able to stealth and still have some rounds left on short term buffs.
No where near some of the DPR maximum builds, but likely enough to get the surprise round pounce + win initiative Pounce and kill 2 creatures and relatively hard to stop with DR and tons of immunities.
Cave druid carnivorous crystal ooze for a base attack of 7d8+1.5xstr use strong jaw for 16d6+1.5xstr, then either grab vital strike+ improved vital strike for a 48d6+1.5xstr or dip monk and get feral combat training for a 3-6 attack flurry of blows at 16d6+1.5xstr per attack.
Notable Equipment: Fortuitous 9-ring broadsword, Spell Storing Amulet of Mighty Fists, Gauntlets of the Skilled Maneuver, Headband of Wisdom, Boots of Speed.
This build is based around the spell Aspect of the Wolf, which allows you to trip as a swift action (also +4 enhancement to STR and DEX). Lasts min/level, or 2min/level with an Extend Rod, so it's an easy pre-buff. Since AotW grants swift-action tripping and Fortuitous grants double-AoO's, you can swift-action trip a target for two bonus attacks with Greater Trip, regardless of what else goes on that round.
Unchained Flurry of Blows with a 9-ring broadsword means up to 4 full-powered two-handed sword strikes in a flurry (with Haste). So a full-attack with a swift action trip can deliver up to 6 sword strikes, each dealing around 25 damage with high accuracy when Divine Favor is running.
Alternatively, the Wolfsage can utilize Dazing, Empowered Stone Discus to throw 3 Divine Favor enhanced projectiles that average 25 damage each and each inflict Daze on a failed Will save. Throwing these stones can be done on the same round that the character uses a move action and a swift trip, meaning that they can still make two sword attacks.
Defensively, +22 WIS with a +4 headband and 16 DEX from Aspect of the Wolf is very solid AC when combined with Barkskin or Ironskin.
Stunning Fist can be used several times a day with their strong WIS score, and Frigid Touch can be placed in their Spellstoring amulet; these can be used by making an unarmed strike in place of a weapon strike, with Greater Magic Fang active. So besides just charging around the battlefield with heavy damage from sword-strikes and hurled stones, the Wolfsage can continuously apply Prone, Dazed, Stunned and Staggered across the battlefield to dominate multiple enemies.
Well, first time building a wild shaping melee druid so lets see how it comes out.
Vanilla Druid:
Class: 12 Druid Race: Skinwalker +2 wis, -2 int, (+2 str and +1 natural armor when shifted)
Str 16 +2 advancement +6 belt +8 plant shape = 32
Dex 14 -2 plant +4 cat's grace = 16
Con 12 +4 plant
Int 10
Wis 15 +1 advancement +2 headband = 18
Cha 8
Feats: Combat Reflexes, Improved Initiative, Natural Spell, Armor Proficiency:Heavy, Power Attack, <1 feat left to pick>.
Equipment: +1 Wild Dragonhide O-yoroi (Armor bonus 9, max dex 2)(20k)
Headband of Inspired Wisdom +2 (4k), Belt of Giant Strength +6 (32k),
Amulet of Mighty Fists: Holy(8k), Cloak of Resistance +4(16k), Strand of Prayer Beads: Karma only (20k), Ring of Protection +2 (4k), 2,500gp left.
Buffs: start of day: 3 Greater Magic Fang on Roots, use Karma Bead to get +5 with a CL of 16 = 16 hour duration (3).
Pre-combat buffs: Strong Jaw (raises base damage of roots and bite: 4), Freedom of Movement(4), Vine Strike (1 root now entangles: 2), Cat's Grace(2), Bark Skin (+5 natural armor: 2)
The idea is to Wild Shape into a Quickwood to take advantage of its 60' reach with the 3 roots. Also its a huge creature with a 5' space...so its a huge creature that fits in a single square...weird. With Strong Jaw raising the dice of its natural attacks it is going to have:
3 root: +25(2d8+16) 60' reach, +2d6 vs evil, power attack -3/+6
1 bite: +20(4d6+11) 15' reach, +2d6 vs evil, power attack -3/+6
And an AC of 33.
More buffs could be added. Firebug has a really good list. Also some of the gear can be easily improved with a little cash. I splurged on the Karma Bead because I thought there would be more long duration buffs but Greater Magic Fang was the only one I saw that lasted hours. It still pumps Fang to +5 (its only +4 at CL12) so it might be worth it?
If possible you want a Fly and Haste from any friendly caster. If you could figure out a way to get more AoO you'll be able to use them. Most encounters the BGs start within your reach. You still have 1 feat to spend, and feats can be moved around a bit. This isn't hyper tuned or anything.
Actually I didn't pick a nature bond either. Probably a domain that would really pump this, or take Druid Herbalism for free potions. Or get a dinosaur to fool around inside of your massive threatened zone.
There are lots of great options here. I wont give you a specific build but some general pointers.
Accuracy:
This can be an issue for druids. Wildshape is a +1 or 2 then everything else is conventional bonuses enhancment amulet/ weapon or greater magic fang, Stat belt and you 3/4th bab So we you will want to get creative rime frostbite is a good way to decrease AC. Flank with your animal using a menacing amulet and/or out flank. Hunter blessing. Use the Nobility domain as suggested.
Dr:
For many of the builds Dr can be more of an issue for you and other classes. Focus on your amulet of mighty fists. There are some other spells like heart Of the metal (oil) and aspu shining scales that can help. Bristle can depending on your gm.
Four levels of druid, the shaping focus feat and then eight levels in a class or two which specialises in delivering beatdowns can be a fairly scary combo. Unchained monk and weapon master fighter works especially well for someone who likes the tentacles on a big octopus.
Cave druid carnivorous crystal ooze for a base attack of 7d8+1.5xstr use strong jaw for 16d6+1.5xstr, then either grab vital strike+ improved vital strike for a 48d6+1.5xstr or dip monk and get feral combat training for a 3-6 attack flurry of blows at 16d6+1.5xstr per attack.
Take it a step further. 1-4 level of barbarian, furious finish, shaping focus. Now you maximize those damage dice.
Wow wow so many cool options. Okay, let's start working through these.
666bender wrote:
many options... from the wierd ooze form to giant to a dino lover.
Goliath Druid (giant form):
ride a Trex.
feats:
1: heavy armor + great sword prof. (bulette armor)
3: power attack
5+7 : augument summon
9: lunge
11: imp crit.
AC comes from full plate + shield + barkskin.
This is not bad but while the T-Rex is great, Druids in armor leave me flat. Thematically, I want this guy to rip his foes to pieces with teeth and claws.
Quote:
Option 2: the rider :
SKinshaper druid (master alter self)
mount = any flyer. (roc)
feats:
1: lance prof + heavy armor
3 : mounted combat
5: ride by attack
7: spirited charge
9: wheeling charge
11: power attack
mount takes: wingover, hover, power attack
Armor again, and also this confrontation will probably take place indoors. Also, doesn't seem very druid-y? I mean couldn't this build be a barbarian or whatever?
Quote:
the mage single attack:
druid - Saurian
turn into hippo
take vital strike.
cast the spell that up the attack by 2 steps.
do 16d8 + str...
We need FCT for Jabbing Style and Power Attack, I guess?
Quote:
7) Power Attack
9) Jabbing Style
Wait wait. Jabbing Style is great, but if I'm reading the feat description right, you need to be able to flurry in order to use it, making it monk-only.
Possible alternative: give him reach (fewer tentacles), 14 Dex, and Combat Reflexes. Yes, that's not amazing. But I have a couple of PCs who have super high melee DPR and whose favored attack mode is thus "charge right in". So getting two or three immediate AoOs with Cornugon Smash intimidation checks should be amusing.
Quote:
11) Cornugon Smash
Nature Bond Domain: Plains (Note, gives Pounce 3/day at 12)
Wild Shape 5/day (though we are using Wild Shape to grow 6 Tentacles from Kraken Caller)
Cornugon Smash piles on the Intimidate checks, which is great.
Quote:
You didn't specify a gold limit, so I will assume fairly low.
2 Beaststrike Clubs (because they can function as tentacles)
Amulet of Mighty Fists (Cruel, spell storing)
Assuming at least a +2 Wisdom Headband
Dragonhide Breastplate +3, Spellstoring
Heavy Horse
Correct on low gold, since the PCs will be walking off with his stuff if they survive, and also because he's one of those "live in a dirty hovel in the woods" type druids. Beaststrike clubs: won't using two weapons gank his attack bonus pretty badly? The Amulet's Cruel property lets him stack Sickened upon Shaken, which is great.
Quote:
Prep rounds:
Okay I have to stare at these for a bit because this is super-optimized and will result in a TPK for sure if I don't nerf it at least a little. -- So does Tentacleez even have an animal companion? Oh no wait he doesn't, he took a domain, nm.
Cast Liveoak to have a Treant minion (CR 8) --> Probably not
Cast Frigid Touch into the Spell Storing Armor to shut down other natural attackers for 1 round --> Frigid Touch has no saving throw? Damn, that's vicious.
Cast Frostbite into Spell Storing Amulet --> So we're going to add Fatigued on top of Shaken, Sickened, and Staggered. Sure, why not.
Cast Greater Magic Fang to give all Natural Attacks a +1 for 12 hours --> Okay, goes without saying.
Cast Hunter's Blessing for +2 to pretty much everything in the Terrain and vs the creature type you suspect you will face for 12 hours -- [Looks up Hunters Blessing] Yeah, you're right -- it's +2 on pretty much everything.
Quote:
Use Wildshape to grow 6 tentacles, for a total of 8 with 2 Beaststrike Clubs for 120 minutes.
I'm thinking 4 tentacles (but with 10' reach and Combat Reflexes) and a single Beaststrike Club.
Cast Resinous Skin for DR 5/Piercing and chance to disarm Melee weapon using opponents for 120 minutes --> Oh I like this a lot.
Cast Stone Skin for DR 10/Adamantine for 120 minutes --> Yeah this also goes without saying
Cast Barkskin for +5 natural armor for 120 minutes --> Yeah
Cast Echolocation for Blindsight 40' for 120 minutes -- Yeah
Cast Freedom of Movement for 120 minutes --> Yeah
Cast Greensight to see through thick plant matter if the encounter is in a forest for 120 minutes -- It's not.
Cast Heightened Awareness to add +4 to initiative check for 120 minutes --> Minor but okay
Cast 2 Protection from Energy's picking Cold and Fire(or whatever else if you have knowledge of the fight, Cold is important because Protection grants Immunity, meaning Frigid Touch will not stagger, and fire is common) --> Acid, because one PC has an acid attack
Cast Bone Fists for +1 bonus to natural armor and +2 damage for 12 minutes -- Does this stack with Barkskin?
Cast Chameleon Stride (domain, 20% miss chance) for 12 minutes -- I guess? My current PCs don't use a lot of missile weapons.
Cast Fickle Winds to shut down Archers for 12 minutes --> Same
Cast Strong Jaw to bring the tentacles up to 1d8 for 12 minutes --> Oh hell yes
Cast Bristle to convert up to 4 natural armor into damage for 12 minutes --> Hmm. Have to think about this.
Cast Antilife Shell to hedge out non-reach enemy melee fighters for 12 minutes --> Tactically clever but probably not the way this guy would roll
Cast Haste(from domain) for 12 rounds --> Of course
Cast Siphon Might on the Horse granting yourself an enhancement bonus to Str of 1d6+5 (going with an average of 3, so +8) for 12 rounds --> This does allow a Fort save, which is a none too impressive DC 16. Might be simpler just to cast Bull's Strength?
Cast Vengeful Comets to attempt to counter spellcasters for 12 rounds --> at this level it's not much of a deterrent, but I like your thinking.
Cast Lockjaw to add grab to one of your attacks for 12 rounds. --> Maybe. Not sure I want to grapple a PC who's more powerful.
Cast Frostbite to add 1d6+12 nonlethal cold damage and Fatigue to the next 12 natural attacks. --> Discussed above
Quote:
Tentacles are secondary natural attacks, but if you only have 1 natural attack type, it is considered a primary attack.
I think this modified, somewhat nerfed version gets
Initiative +10
Without Bristle - AC 27
7 Tentacle attacks (haste, 1 Beaststrike, 4 from Kraken Caller): at +19 to hit (9 bab, 6 str, 1 weapon focus, -3 Power Attack, 1 Greater Magic Fang, 2 Charging, 2 Hunters Blessing, 1 Haste)
for 1d8 + 19 damage (8 Str, 2 Hunters Blessing, 6 Power Attack, 2 Bone Fists, 4 Bristle)
+1d6+12 Nonlethal Cold for Frostbite
This is still pretty insane, and should give my PCs fits. Liking it.
I have a few builds, which are a little different from those already proposed.
Brutal Goliath (Fighter/Druid)
Spoiler:
Key concepts: A druid that can shapechange into a troll in order to wade into combat
Trait: Giant-blooded
Race: Human or Half-elf or Tiefling or Half-Orc
Racial Trait: Focused Study(Human), Ancestral Arms (Half-elf), Variant Option 16(Tiefling), Orc Atavism or [Shaman’s Apprentice & Toothy](Half-Orc)
Class: Fighter (1), Druid(X)
Archetypes: Titan Fighter – Fighter / Druid – Goliath Druid
Domain: Rage
Eldritch Heritage Bloodline: Abyssal
Feats: Exotic Weapon Proficiency [Butchering Axe], Power Attack, Skill Focus, Eldritch Heritage, Furious Focus, Improved Eldritch Heritage
Suggested Feats: Die Hard, Deathless Initiate, Cleave
Suggested Gear Glove of Storing, Oversized Butchering Axe (Furious, Vicious, Furyborn), Cracked Opalescent White Pyramid (Butchering Axe), Irongrip Gauntlets
Key Features:
Base Damage for the Oversized Butchering Axe is 4d6
Weapon is 2-handed so you get 1-1/2 Str +3 per -1 via power attack
With Enlarge person damage then becomes 6d6
At 3rd Level (assuming nat 20 str & E person) Dmg = 4d6+12 (24 avg dmg)
At 13th Level you can assume the form of a troll gaining regeneration & rend
At 15th level you can assume the form of a huge giant (8d6 butchering axe)
At 19th level( (assuming nat 30 str & wildshape & rage) Base Dmg = 8d6+40 (64 avg dmg)
Beast Riding Caster (Oracle/Druid/Cleric)
Spoiler:
Key concepts: A Spellcaster with a powerful beast
Key Stats: Charisma (Oracle), Wisdom (Druid)
Race: Halfling
Racial Traits: Caretaker and Fey-Quickened
Classes: Oracle(4), Druid(1), Oracle/Druid/Cleric(X)
Archetype(s): Pack Lord (Druid)
Mystery: Nature
Domains (cleric only): Chivalry Inquisition and Animal (Feather or Fur)
Key Curse: Lycanthropy (wolves)
Revelations: Nature’s Whispers (1st), Natural Divination (3rd), Bonded Mount (5th)
Key Feats: Nature Soul (1st), Animal Ally (4th)[assuming re-training], Extra Revelation(5th), Boon Companion(9th)
Key Features:
This build features multiple stacking sources of animal companion/bonded mount. The Pack Lord archetype allows you to distribute those levels however you want, meaning you can have as many animal companions as you have levels to work with. Though no single animal companion can have HD more than your level+1.
While you don't get an animal companion until 4th level your animal companion will be powerful for your level. At 5th level a single animal companion would be calculated using a druid level of 7. At 20th level you could have your main companion calculated using a druid level of 26 and a 2nd companion calculated at level 15. Alternatively, you can have multiple animal companions at your level.
It's also worth noting the whole build only takes 4 feats, meaning you have a lot of freedom with the rest of your feats.
Gonna be the 4th person to tell you Goliath Druid, but I'ma add to the builds so far.
Titan Fighter, as Lord Kailas has suggested, is a massive damage increase. And as juantamad has said, Rage is a really key ability for the Goliath Druid to pick up. Here's why:
You're going to Vital Strike. Every turn. For OMG damage. And you'll maximize most of that damage.
Your build will look something like Goliath Druid 4 / Titan Fighter 1 / Goliath Druid X / Barbarian 2 / Goliath Druid X.
Titan Fighter you dip for 1 level to be able to wield a weapon of one size larger than yourself. This means when you do get to Goliath Druid's upper levels, you'll be Huge size with a Gargantuan weapon that you've enchanted with Impact to make it hit like a Colossal weapon. Woof.
But why Barbarian? You'll want a limited number of Rage rounds. 2 levels and the Rage Domain should net you a pretty good number. I like to take UC Barbarian and get Accurate Stance. You're only making one attack per round, and it's going to be a kill on most anything you hit. The only time you fail is when you miss. Don't. Ever. Miss. Okay, so it's not worth it for a few points of to-hit rating. Why you want Rage rounds is Furious Finish. When you use Vital Strike, you can choose to end a Rage to maximize damage. Did we go over how your weapon has huge, huge damage dice?
Feel free to Rage cycle with the Cord of Stubborn Resolve. What do you care about some non-lethal damage, when you heal every round and have absurd HP. No fatigue, ftw!
"But won't these 4 levels of dip effect my Wild Shape?" Nope! Shaping Focus takes care of that for us! Woo woo!
Next trick... You already get Regeneration when you're a Troll, so why not also get Ferocity? Pauldrons of the Juggernaut can get you that. Now, you don't die for being below 0 HP and you also don't ever go unconscious! Congrats, you're an unstoppable force starting at level 12. The one way that someone COULD mess you up is using heavy Fire or Acid damage, but Druid has Resist Energy and Protection from Energy on their spell list. You can also switch over to being a Rock Troll and your Regeneration gets turned off by Sonic. Sure, you're a size smaller, but that's a fair price to pay for immortality.
For ultimate cheese, start off with the utterly broken Butcher's Axe that is a 3d6 at Medium size and just grows to be a world-ender when it counts as Colossal.
I dunno that there is anything more fierce than a caster with 8th level spells, that's Huge sized with a Colossal weapon, Vital Striking for hundreds of damage per round, is more-or-less immune to HP damage, has very high Fort and Will saves, reach of "the whole battle map," and just for s@#&s and giggles can command the weather, summon more beasts to the field, cause earthquakes, and all the fun stuff a caster Druid does.
We need FCT for Jabbing Style and Power Attack, I guess?
Just Jabbing Style
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Wait wait. Jabbing Style is great, but if I'm reading the feat description right, you need to be able to flurry in order to use it, making it monk-only.
You do not need to be flurrying (in fact the feat never mentions Flurry), it just says that if you have already hit the target with an unarmed strike, you do additional damage with other unarmed strikes. Feral Combat Training makes it so you can use Jabbing style with the tentacle attacks.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Correct on low gold, since the PCs will be walking off with his stuff if they survive, and also because he's one of those "live in a dirty hovel in the woods" type druids. Beaststrike clubs: won't using two weapons gank his attack bonus pretty badly? The Amulet's Cruel property lets him stack Sickened upon Shaken, which is great.
Actually, looking at Beaststrike Club again, Tentacle is not one of the options. For some reason I had remembered it as "Pick a natural attack" not "Pick a natural attack from this list". So scrap the club. Thats kind of depressing, I have a half elf version of this (though will multiclass) that is currently level 4 in PFS and had just gotten an boon from a scenario that made his club giggle when used. I had intended to upgrade that to a beaststrike club and make him a tickle monster. However, you can now give him a heavy wood shield +2 or so to cover the AC loss from Bristle.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Possible alternative: give him reach (fewer tentacles), 14 Dex, and Combat Reflexes. Yes, that's not amazing. But I have a couple of PCs who have super high melee DPR and whose favored attack mode is thus "charge right in". So getting two or three immediate AoOs with Cornugon Smash intimidation checks should be amusing.
This druid should likely get the surprise round on the party and pounce someone, or win initiate and pounce someone. Probably both. If you are waiting for them to charge in... You can drop the Pounce if you want, and pick up the Growth Domain for extra reach. Swap out a 2nd level spell for Cats Grace for more AoOs.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Cast Bone Fists for +1 bonus to natural armor and +2 damage for 12 minutes -- Does this stack with Barkskin?
Bone Fists is an untyped bonus to Natural Armor "+1 bonus to natural armor", Barkskin is an enhancement bonus "+2 enhancement bonus to the creature’s existing natural armor bonus". Things like Beast Shape are worded slightly differently "and a +2 natural armor bonus."
The way I read it, is that Beast Shape sets the natural armor bonus to a certain amount. Its confusing because "natural armor bonus" already has "bonus" in the name. Bone Fists and Barkskin are untyped and typed bonuses to the natural armor bonus respectively.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Cast Chameleon Stride (domain, 20% miss chance) for 12 minutes -- I guess? My current PCs don't use a lot of missile weapons.
Also, it is concealment, so can continue stealth.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Cast Siphon Might on the Horse granting yourself an enhancement bonus to Str of 1d6+5 (going with an average of 3, so +8) for 12 rounds --> This does allow a Fort save, which is a none too impressive DC 16. Might be simpler just to cast Bull's Strength?
Yeah, I was mostly just squeezing out some extra damage. Though it is at least a +6, max of +11 enhancement bonus to strength compared to +4.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Cast Vengeful Comets to attempt to counter spellcasters for 12 rounds --> at this level it's not much of a deterrent, but I like your thinking.
Its still extra damage, and from some reason I thought it could trigger concentration checks, since it mentions when you are targeted. Rereading it I am not positive the timing works the way I thought it did, because it says you make the immediate reaction when you are affected by the spell. Regardless, it spreads the damage around the party, making it feel more threatening without focus fire.
Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Cast Lockjaw to add grab to one of your attacks for 12 rounds. --> Maybe. Not sure I want to grapple a PC who's more powerful.
You mentioned they like to charge in. Are they using 2h weapons? You can't use a 2h weapon while grappled.
I'll just pop in to recommend a Nature Fang Druid. If wildshaping is something you want, you will have to look elsewhere. Nature Fang gives it up, along with some other minor 'druidic' abilities for Studied Target (as a Slayer), sneak attack (1d6), and Slayer Talents starting at level 4. This resolves the Druid's "to hit" issue, making it effectively full BAB.
The choice of a domain with an familiar, and picking the Protector Archetype, effectively gives them d12 HD at level 5, and d16 (or twice their normal) at level 11, via sharing damage with their familiar. Also, crocodile domain gives you scaling sneak attack damage, and you can always trade out a domain power for a Divine Fighting Technique (such as with Gorum, allowing vital striking on a charge).
If you want an animal companion, spend a few feats to get Animal Ally. You have them to spare since you get slayer talents. I suggesting getting Gorum's fighting style for early access Improved Vital strike. Once you get higher level spells, you can mimic wildshape through the Animal Shapes spell, as well as for your whole party.
If VMC is an option, you can pick up Barbarian for rage goodness. If you'd like to deviate 4 levels into Rogue, you could pick up the Scout archetype and get the ability to sneak attack at the end of a charge, but I really don't recommend it outside of specific circumstances.
The most interesting non-Wildshape Druid is the Halcyon Druid, which gets to pick bonus Wizard spells. Forget Wildshape, take Monstrous Physique II and go Calikang with Dimensional Dervish...
Wow wow so many cool options. Okay, let's start working through these.
666bender wrote:
many options... from the wierd ooze form to giant to a dino lover.
Quote:
the mage single attack:
druid - Saurian
turn into hippo
take vital strike.
cast the spell that up the attack by 2 steps.
do 16d8 + str...
? Okay, can you spell this out for me?
Doug M.
yap :
take Saurian druid fro super strong summons when needed.
build will be :
lvl 1 : augument summoning.
3: power attack
5: planar wild shape
7: OPEN
9: quick wildshape
11: vital strike
(2 open, can be: Lunge, toughness, maneuver or whatever)
round 1 : fast wild shape (move action) into Megafauna, Arsinoitherium (base att = 4d8). + cast 1 buff spell (strong jaw)
you attack once, for 16d8 (base 4d8 >>> 12d8 from strong jaw + 4d8 vital strike) + all the STR / power attack bonuses.
you have DR (planar wild shape)
all spells are prebuffs or summon dinosaurs.
here is another super stong option :
druid 4 / unchanied barb (rager) 8
Base DR = 4 (barbarian).
great hp.
wild shape as lvl 8 druid (large elemental) wielding a great axe and moving through the floor without AOO with cover....
1. you can speak
2. you can slam or axe
3. you can rage
4. you can wild shape well.....
Druid can add trip (wolf) Grapple (anyting with GRAB).
Druid dont have to have AC if there is another fighter, use super reach (plants).
Druids can be tactical (earth elemental earth glide into position).
Druids can Debuff very well (Rime + enforcer feats & frost bite spell)
Druids can build walls, humper the area's movement, summon beaststicks and much much more.
a combat isnt a flow of HP running from one to another, it can be won with wit, with tactics .
i had a druid once with spring attack...... odd, i know.
but when you realize you can earth elemental into the floor after your attack or fly away, you realize you can win a fight VS a fighter 5 levels above you .....
earth elemental (small) with improve cover are the best scouts as well (+8 imp. cover, +4 size) and can enter the floor freely.....
so scout the enemy, understand it's weakspot, poison it's food and waters, than at night, as the camp is weak, earth glide in.... trun into a huge, pre-buffed animal and kill the entire camp.
Improved unarmed strike And (BAB+6 or flurry or brawler)
That being said, you could just take a one level dip in monk(master of many styles) and instead of spending a feat on improved unarmed strike you could pick up both jabbing style and jabbing master.
tentacle cloak is only once per day and it occupies a cloak slot. Doesn't seem worth it for a PC, but I guess for an NPC its fine.
That being said, you could just take a one level dip in monk(master of many styles) and instead of spending a feat on improved unarmed strike you could pick up both jabbing style and jabbing master.
tentacle cloak is only once per day and it occupies a cloak slot. Doesn't seem worth it for a PC, but I guess for an NPC its fine.
Common misconception. Jabbing Master is not a Style feat. On the Style feat chains, only the initial feat is a Style feat, the rest are simply combat feats. Master of Many Styles only lets you ignore prereqs for Style feats. However, you can use the Wildcard feats (at 6+) to gain them... but you have to meet the prereqs.
Elemental body focused druid. Used in PFS to great effect
7 levels Nature priest( Ferocity sub domain or glory domain )
1 level Anger Id rager
3 levels Unchained monk
Assuming you want to go all in with damage
start with 19 strength, upgrade at 4,8 and 12
22+6 belt+8 elemental body+6 Rage= 42 strength
16+6 headband = 22 wisdom
Ac : 10+8 monk+4 barkskin+6 wild shape-2 size+4 mage armor= 30Ac
Melee : 5 attacks, with haste and extra ki attack, dragon style, strong jaw, bone spikes, power attack, reckless rage and ferocious strike. +3 furious Aomf and monk robe.
9bab+16str-2size-4Pa+5enh+1WF+2heroism+1haste=+28
+28/+28/+28/+28/+23
6d8+44
And due to rage with elemental body you have a boatload of hit points, not even mentioning the crit and bleed immunity.
That being said, you could just take a one level dip in monk(master of many styles) and instead of spending a feat on improved unarmed strike you could pick up both jabbing style and jabbing master.
tentacle cloak is only once per day and it occupies a cloak slot. Doesn't seem worth it for a PC, but I guess for an NPC its fine.
Common misconception. Jabbing Master is not a Style feat. On the Style feat chains, only the initial feat is a Style feat, the rest are simply combat feats. Master of Many Styles only lets you ignore prereqs for Style feats. However, you can use the Wildcard feats (at 6+) to gain them... but you have to meet the prereqs.
I agree that your interpretation is reasonable, but is there an FAQ on this some where? I've looked over the feats again and I can't find any place where this is called out. What I can find are places that completely fail to identify any of them as "style" feats and other places that clearly identify all of them as "style" feats.
The Master of Many Styles ability fuse styles references style feat stances, but that wording isn't used for the bonus feat section.
That being said, you could just take a one level dip in monk(master of many styles) and instead of spending a feat on improved unarmed strike you could pick up both jabbing style and jabbing master.
tentacle cloak is only once per day and it occupies a cloak slot. Doesn't seem worth it for a PC, but I guess for an NPC its fine.
Common misconception. Jabbing Master is not a Style feat. On the Style feat chains, only the initial feat is a Style feat, the rest are simply combat feats. Master of Many Styles only lets you ignore prereqs for Style feats. However, you can use the Wildcard feats (at 6+) to gain them... but you have to meet the prereqs.
I agree that your interpretation is reasonable, but is there an FAQ on this some where? I've looked over the feats again and I can't find any place where this is called out. What I can find are places that completely fail to identify any of them as "style" feats and other places that clearly identify all of them as "style" feats.
The Master of Many Styles ability fuse styles references style feat stances, but that wording isn't used for the bonus feat section.
Master of many styles was nerfed a long while ago along with every other thing with similar wording so anything with can select style feat with out needing the prerequisites can only take the 1st feat in the chain, because that is also the time were they "clarified" that only the 1st feat in the chain is the "style" feat, basically martials had nice things then paizo flipped the heck out because they were doing good things in pfs and pfs complained and now martials can't have those nice things any more. This was also around the time were pummeling charge was changed to only work with unarmed strikes.
I never played monks, so I only became aware of this archetype about a year ago along with complaints that it had been nerfed in some way and was completely indifferent to it at the time. So, I've only seen the post errata version of it. After looking at the ability and seeing some style feat chains where every single feat is explicitly marked as being a style feat, seeing other instances where none of the feats were marked as such and finally seeing big lists that say "style feats" and then every such feat listed with no indication between them. I came to the conclusion that the intention is that all of them must be style feats and therefore eligible for the ability listed in the post errata master of many styles ability.
I would love to see some where, where it has been clarified that only the 1st feat in a style chain is a style feat. Based on what I've found I only see people making these claims without reference. I'm not saying that such an interpretation is wrong. I just would very much like to read it 1st hand instead of relying on 2nd hand knowledge. Only because on more then one occasion I've been told that X was a certain way because of the RAW. Only to be corrected again when i tried to use that way. As a result I tend to not trust any statement I see that I can't tie to a RAW or dev statement.
As a swift action, you can enter the stance employed by the fighting style a style feat embodies. Although you cannot use a style feat before combat begins, the style you are in persists until you spend a swift action to switch to a different combat style. You can use a feat that has a style feat as a prerequisite only while in the stance of the associated style.
This line makes it so only the 1st feat in the chain is the "style" feat and you can only use feats that have that style as a prerequisite while using that style feat.
As a swift action, you can enter the stance employed by the fighting style a style feat embodies. Although you cannot use a style feat before combat begins, the style you are in persists until you spend a swift action to switch to a different combat style. You can use a feat that has a style feat as a prerequisite only while in the stance of the associated style.
This line makes it so only the 1st feat in the chain is the "style" feat and you can only use feats that have that style as a prerequisite while using that style feat.
Unfortunately, the statement still works even if all 3 feats in a chain are style feats. The last line about only using feats that have a style feat as a pre-req could simply be refurring to feats like Combat Style Master.
The wording on Weapon Style Mastery doesn't make much sense if only the first feat in each style chain is a style feat. It wouldn't need to specify that the two style feats you pick have to come from different styles. It could easily say any 2 style feats the same way the aforementioned combat style master does. Even more confusing the feat its self is clearly flagged as a style feat even though there is no style associated with it.
Quote:
Both ArchivesofNethys and PFSRD only applies the 'Style' tag on the first feats in the series. The other feats in the feat trees are combat feats.
I know this isn't true. If you look at this page which lists style feats and scroll to the list at the bottom you'll notice most (but not all) style feats in this list have been flagged with the style tag. What's more if I click on something like say Wolf Savage the description also has the style tag even though it's the 3rd feat in the style chain.
I 100% agree that there are typos. Primarily because of the lack of consistency. From a balance standpoint it makes sense if only the first feat in each style chain is a style feat. Unfortunately, just because something makes sense and seems fair and balanced. It doesn't mean it's correct as per RAW.
Wonderstell wrote:
And really, pre-errata MoMS was just stupid. Imagine if the ranger worked the same way?
"Oh yeah, just take any 10th-level combat style feat at level 2. Hell if we care."
I agree. I read the post errata version of the ability and my gut reaction was "WTF?". Monkey style for example is written to be taken by a monk only at 5th level+, Brute style you normally have to be 6th level to take and have 5 other feats. Both of these are legal options no matter how you interpret the ability. So, jabbing master didn't seem out of line given its 8th level and only takes 6 feats.
I'm used to monk being played by munchkin players thanks to abilities like what MoMS has.
To get back on track, let's start with some good buff spells that you can add to almost any build:
Bull's Strength / Bear's Endurance / Owl's Wisdom (cast them to prevent the need of belts/headbands on the character)
Invigorating Poison: up those stats some more with an Alchemical bonus.
Fickle Winds: screw Archers that do not have an answer to this (highly unlikely at this level, but still)
Stoneskin / Resinous Skin: DR is good, stack them if you have the chance.
Strong Jaw: boost the damage die
Barkskin: you know why.
As for a build, "best" is determined by the situation. More importantly, where is this taking place? Cave, open field, forest, swamp, etc etc. This can influence tactics a lot, including prebuffs.
For my Druid build, I will use my Blight Druid from pfs as a base and add a forest terrain as terrain (also add some actual tactics, as my Druid is a lazy bum): pre-buff as diminutive animal, area control opening, pounce as large/huge animal.
Human Blight Druid 12, with either a familiar or a domain with familiar.
Base ability scores 16-13-14-11-14-7
Lvl 4 and 8 +Con, lvl 12 +dex for 16-14-16-11-14-7
Feats: Improved Unarmed Strike, Improved Grapple, Toughness, Natural Spell, Kraken Style, Greater Grapple, Quick Wild Shape.
Pre-buff: Wild Shape in Diminutive animal, Bear's Endurance, Bull's Strength, Cat's Grace, Owl's Wisdom, Greensight, Resinous Skin, Stoneskin, Strong Jaw, Fickle Winds, Hunter's Blessing (forest), Invigorating Poison + Violet Venom, Thorn Body, Caustic Blood, Communal Resist Energy/Protection to Energy, Swarm Skin (on Familiar)
Only required magical item: Ring of Sacred Mistletoe.
Stats after buffing:
Diminutive animal: 20-24-24-11-18-7 / HP 167 / AC 21 / Init = 9 (forest)
Large animal: 28-16-24-11-18-7 / HP 167 / AC 17
Huge animal: 30-14-24-11-18-7 / HP 167 / AC 16
Large Earth elemental: 30-16-26-11-18-7 / HP 179 / AC 18
AllDR 10/adamantine and 5/Piercing
Sneak up on party as diminutive animal (max stealth ranks would result in a +36 or something) to try and gain a surprise round.
Surprise round: Cast Plant Growth (if it obscures sight is not stated, but Greensight just to be sure).
Round 1 : Either cast an Entangle-type spell (Thristing Entangle if you're evil), or swift action Wild Shape in huge Pouncer and Pounce. Send in army-ant-swarm-familiar.
Round 2 and on: either swift action wild shape and pounce, or continue destroying whoever you pounced.
The Ring of Sacred Mistletoe allows the druid to walk through enchanted plant-life (including Plant Growth and Entangle) without being hindered/damaged by it. The tactic is all about letting yourself get hit to activate Caustic Blood and Thorn Body, damaging those that are stupid enough to attack said druid. The Plant Growth will hamper anyone who cannot deal with the massive movement restriction, allowing the druid to stay close for mauling and Caustic Blood shenanigans. The Army-Ant-Swarm-Familiar can harass anyone who cannot get out.
I know this isn't true. If you look at this page which lists style feats and scroll to the list at the bottom you'll notice most (but not all) style feats in this list have been flagged with the style tag. What's more if I click on something like say Wolf Savage the description also has the style tag even though it's the 3rd feat in the style chain.
Pathfinder SRD is in no way an official source. They're pretty good, but they screw up at times; they even sometimes add additional text to an entry when trying to "clarify", and end up rewriting the rules wrong.
In this case, PFSRD doesn't even agree with itself. Click on many of the feats marked with "style" in that list, and they aren't marked with "style" on their actually entry.
If you look up Wolf Savage on Archives of Nethys (also unofficial) it doesn't have the "style" tag.
Never rely on PFSRD when making an argument about some technical point.
If you look up Wolf Savage on Archives of Nethys (also unofficial) it doesn't have the "style" tag.
Archive of nethys is to my knowledge the official sanctioned website for pathfinder info now that paizo has closed down their site for pathfinder and given it over to the archives.
I know this isn't true. If you look at this page which lists style feats and scroll to the list at the bottom you'll notice most (but not all) style feats in this list have been flagged with the style tag. What's more if I click on something like say Wolf Savage the description also has the style tag even though it's the 3rd feat in the style chain.
Pathfinder SRD is in no way an official source. They're pretty good, but they screw up at times; they even sometimes add additional text to an entry when trying to "clarify", and end up rewriting the rules wrong.
In this case, PFSRD doesn't even agree with itself. Click on many of the feats marked with "style" in that list, and they aren't marked with "style" on their actually entry.
If you look up Wolf Savage on Archives of Nethys (also unofficial) it doesn't have the "style" tag.
Never rely on PFSRD when making an argument about some technical point.
???
Im glad you agree with me that it contains typos?
1:"Look at x or y and you'll see z is true"
2:"when i look at y, i see that z isnt true and there are obvious typos"
3:"dont look at y, it has errors"
Archives of nethys also identifies weapon style mastery as a style feat. Even though it has no style or feat chain associated with it.
I appreciate the responses, but a simple "there is no official statement, but my understanding is X which is mostly corraborated by this unofficial source. Who generally does a good job of getting things right" is perfectly acceptable.
Cool, thank you. I will keep that in mind for future buids.
I apologize to the OP for derailing the thread.
Edit: archives of nethys is an official representative for pathfinder content. Meaning they have full acess to information and errata. Unfortunately, since they do not site errata that has been incorporated its not readily apprent if something is a typo if it seems off. If information apears differently on the site then from printed material and its not addressed in any errata then i still have to assume the printed version is correct, unless the site now supersedes all printed material.
I appreciate the responses, but a simple "there is no official statement, but my understanding is X which is mostly corraborated by this unofficial source. Who generally does a good job of getting things right" is perfectly acceptable.
We can corroborate what we're saying about (Style) tags with hardcover book or PDF.
If you're waiting for an official statement "clarifying" that only the feats with the (Style) tag on them are proper Style feats in the same way that only feats with the (Combat) tag are proper Combat feats, you're going to wait forever.
