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So my Magus is working on an intelligent weapon, and I was wondering what the caster level is going to be for the weapon's spells... ultimately what is the DC for saves. I was going to put a 2nd and 1st level spell into it.
The caster level for these effects is equal to the item's caster level. Save DCs are based off the item's highest mental ability score.
They are cast spells, but not of any defined class. I think the creator's class in which he has a caster level to qualify for his crafting feat should determine whether the item's effects are arcane, divine or psychic, so in this case it casts arcane spells.
Generally speaking Intelligent Magic Items are something players aren't suppose to be able to create.
This is one of those "oft stated but seldom cited" principles. Does anything in any of the core books state this?
Generally speaking Intelligent Magic Items are something players aren't suppose to be able to create.This is one of those "oft stated but seldom cited" principles. Does anything in any of the core books state this?
In 3.5 D&D it was specifically allowed. Pathfinder did leave out the relevant section however. The section from 3.5:
To create an intelligent item, a character must have a caster level of 15th or higher. Time and creation cost are based on the normal item creation rules, with the market price values on Table: Item Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma, and Capabilities treated as additions to time, gp cost, and XP cost. The item’s alignment is the same as its creator’s. Determine other features randomly, following the guidelines in the relevant section.
As is, there is actually nothing in Pathfinder telling you how a character can actually create an intelligent item.
Sure there is. The magic item creation rules.
Sure there is. The magic item creation rules.
Then what are the prerequisites to make an item intelligence? What are the requirements for the special abilities? We know the prerequisites of all other magic items, but not intelligent ones. What feat is required? The normal item creation feat or Craft Construct? The rules say treat them as constructs, but just what does that apply to.
It isn't that the rules forbid the crafting of intelligent items. It is just that the rules are incomplete and give no guidelines like they do for all other items.
The rules for intelligent items are not part of the magic item creation rules, they are in a separate section and are, I think anyway, quite clearly guidelines for GMs.
In any event, as always a GM can disallow any custom magic item, and since any designed intelligent item would have to be a custom magic item, the GM can obviously disallow it, and I personally would.
@Jeraa: The prerequisites are the same as with any other custom magic item--ask the GM.
@Dave Justus: Of course the GM can disallow it. I'm not arguing that you must (or should) allow them in your game. My point is that the book in no way states that the GM should disallow it, so stating that intelligent items "are something players aren't suppose to be able to create" by default is a fiction, or at best just an opinion (man). They're as much a part of the game as any custom-designed magic item and should be treated the same.
@Jeraa: The prerequisites are the same as with any other custom magic item--ask the GM.
No. Every other magic item has its prerequisites specifically and clearly stated. That is not up the the GM (ignoring that the GM is always free to ignore the rules). The rules on all other forms of magic item are clear. The rules on intelligent items are not.
You are right in that the book does not outright disallow it. However, it also lacks any of the language that allows it. Unlike in 3.5 D&D, where is was explicitly allowed (well, as allowed as any other form of item creation).
I am not saying (and have never said) that the rules forbid it. I am saying the rules aren't clear on the process and requirements.
Edit: The core rules are vague at best. However, if you actually find the statblock of an intelligent item (there aren't many but Ultimate Equipment has some), you can see the requirements. There seems to be no special requirement to make an item intelligent (which there should be).
@Jeraa: The prerequisites are the same as with any other custom magic item--ask the GM.No. Every other magic item has its prerequisites specifically and clearly stated.
Not quite. Every premade magic item description has its prerequisites specifically and clearly stated. New (i.e., custom) magic items do not.
That is not up the the GM (ignoring that the GM is always free to ignore the rules). The rules on all other forms of magic item are clear. The rules on intelligent items are not.
You are right in that the book does not outright disallow it. However, it also lacks any of the language that allows it. Unlike in 3.5 D&D, where is was explicitly allowed (well, as allowed as any other form of item creation).
I am not saying (and have never said) that the rules forbid it. I am saying the rules aren't clear on the process and requirements.
Edit: The core rules are vague at best. However, if you actually find the statblock of an intelligent item (there aren't many but Ultimate Equipment has some), you can see the requirements. There seems to be no special requirement to make an item intelligent (which there should be).
New magic items, not crafted magic items. Many (most?) crafted magic items have its prerequisites specifically and clearly stated. Custom magic items do not--the process demands GM participation. Whether that participation is deeply involved or a simple "hell no" is up to the GM--again, per the rules.
I propose to my GM that I'd like to create chewing gum of annoyance and the desired effect. The GM yeas or nays; if yea (and only if yea), the GM comes up with prerequisites for making the item. The text offers guidelines for such decisions, but ultimately it's up to the GM to set the terms (or to disallow the whole process entirely). It's a similar process to researching custom spells--the GM sets the terms, but the rules provide a basis.
Custom intelligent items are just another subset of custom magic items. Whether players can craft them or not is subject to the same review process and demands the same GM attention any custom item.