Monk conversion from back of the book damage?

[lordredraven]

The Pathfinder legacy section talks about giving monks the operative trick damage without a roll. An I reading that correctly? That would mean a 5th level monk would be doing 1d8+str bonus+ level damage from weapon specialization + 3d8? So realistically something like 4d8+7 damage a hit at 5th level... That seems really high. Anyone got another reading on that?

[VampByDay]

I don't know where you are getting your stats from, but that's not what the legacy chapter says. It is that a monk deals damage as if he was an operative with a one-handed operative weapon (level no more than monk level)+trick attack.

At level 5 there are only 2 operative weapons that qualify (both level 1, the tactical baton and the cheapest knife) each do 1d4 dmg. Plus, operative weapons only add 1/2 level to damage from weapon spec; so a monk deals 1d4+3d8+2(+str mod).

Now if they get to full attack doing that, then that might be high, but as it stands, this is exactly as much damage as an operative. Monks don't have to roll for the trick attack, but can't use it at range, seems like an even-ish trade to me.

[lordredraven]

Thanks on the correction on the operative weapon damage. Still with a full attack and only +1 str mod the monk is doing 16 dmg avg of an attack and 32 a round on two hits. That's alot at 5th level

[Metaphysician]

I imagine having a high damage full attack would be balanced somewhat by the inability to wear armor at all.

[whew]

Does the monk's attack count as archaic? That's -5 to damage.

[VampByDay]

Plus it's unclear if they can full attack while dealing damage. It says "they deal damage as an operative trick attack without having to roll.". That could be taken as not taking the action to roll, or not needing to make the roll. If the latter, then it still takes a full action to move and make the trick attack, meaning they can't full attack.

[oldskool]

Hmmm, the full attack thing is tricky. At max level the damage potential is slightly behind advanced melee weapons, but by level 5 it would be a lot more damage. Weapons don't really start scaling until 7th or 6th if you're a Solar Weapon Solarian.

I've been kicking around ideas myself to combine the D6 Operative melee weapons with the damage of Improved Unarmed Strike. I'd also add the same type of text from the Vesk Unarmed damage feature for 1.5 x level = damage + Str mod. So far my end goal aim is 15D6 + 1.5 Level + Str which can hit around 90 damage on average. However lower level scaling needs a lot of work.

**edit originally had a lot more to say, but really this is a problem with lower levels and not top end. It is a place for me to start and work backwards though.