My master agrees that a Gunslinger would fit nicely the next campaign’s setting, so I’m ready to take the bait and make a Musket Master, even if the mechanics are a bit odd.
I noticed that many gunslinger advices are outdated, and the class has since been errataed (and nerfed a lot, mainly the Pistolero), so I’m here to ask a couple of advices, mainly for a mid-level build.
First: misfire.
As far as I know there are only a few ways to reduce misfire: reliable(+1), greater reliable(+3), and the dwarf/duergar favored class bonus.
I plan to use a double musket plus alchemical cartridges as soon as I can afford a +1 reliable weapon, so I assume a dwarf character and no multiclass until level 8 unless you suggest me something else.
Second: feats!
The Musket Master is feat hungry, and not being human hurts! There are too many nice feats, in particular the snap shot chain, please comment the following because I feel like deft shootist will be too late, even snap shot will arrive at 9.
Point Blank Shot, Rapid Reload (bonus), Precise Shot, Deadly Aim, Rapid Shot.
Weapon focus, Snap shot, Combat reflexes, Improved Snap shot, Signature deed.
Improved Critical, Dodge, mobility, Deft shootist.
Third: dips!
The problem here is that I need to wait after the eight level to dip, so I can apply a full -2 to misfire chanche from the favored class bonus.
Monk (sohei): i feel this is the best 2 level dip, the ability to act in the surprise round is golden, two bonus feats that I can use (I look at dodge mobility and combat reflexes), and +3 on will saves, the rest is decent.
Fighter: classic, much needed feats but hurts the already weak will save.
Wizard (diviner): the ability to act in the surprise round is golden, familiar with bonus to initiative is the icing on the cake, plus will saves and a few spells, but then I cannot dump Int. Please point to any spell/musket combo that I didn’t notice.
Any comment?
Best regards
Federico
Utik wrote: I plan to use a double musket plus alchemical cartridges as soon as I can afford a +1 reliable weapon, so I assume a dwarf character and no multiclass until level 8 unless you suggest me something else. Personally I find the dwarf's lack of a dexterity bonus to be problemic. The favored class bonus is useful, but not necessary due to quick clear.
I don't particularly recommend the double musket. It has a higher misfire chance and you need to pay for magical enhancements on both barrels separately, and I don't feel the extra capacity is worth those downsides when you're using an archetype that has an easier time reloading.
Don't take more than 5 levels of Gunslinger. Multiclass out immediately after getting Gun Training.
Utik wrote: Second: feats!
The Musket Master is feat hungry, and not being human hurts!
Your feat priority looks about right. Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Raid Reload, Deadly Aim, and Rapid Shot are correctly your top priorities, so you should be fine. Multiclassing Fighter can be very helpful with regards to feats, and the Weapon Master archetype in particular suits a Musket Master well.
Utik wrote: Wizard (diviner): the ability to act in the surprise round is golden, familiar with bonus to initiative is the icing on the cake, plus will saves and a few spells, but then I cannot dump Int. Please point to any spell/musket combo that I didn’t notice. Gunslinger/Wizard multiclass is a really cool character option. However, if you're going this path you definitely need to multiclass out immediately after the 5th level so your spellcasting capabilities can actually catch up.
You don't have to pay double to enchant the double barreled, it is just a firearm with capacity = 2, not a double weapon, as otherwise stated in the dagger-pistol.
TO me the misfire is the biggest issue, it stops the full attack in that round and hinder your number of attacks the next round even if you have quick clear, with a 8-th level dwarf and a reliable weapon I can reach a 0-rate for normal shots and 1 with alchemical cartridges, so I can dish out damage at a constant rate.
I did a (very quick) simulation of a 13th level gunslinger with a +1 reliable sacred distance Double Barreled Musket and standard equipment.
It does 1d12+20 for each hit at +18 to hit touch AC, if the enemy has a low touch AC (as many do) it's 2d12+40 shooting two barrels at +14 to hit.
With rapid, haste and iterative it's 5 attack per round, A LOT of difference where I live.
Plus it will get Improved snap shot, signature deed (maybe targeting for debuff), improved critical and it's a feat away from deft shootist.
At the moment I'm playing an archer Bard in a campaign that is about to end, so I already covered the ranged/arcane path and at higher level enemy saves are strong, I feel this options can be quite more consistent in dispatching enemies (other players will take the utility spot).
I fear that the gunslinger/wizard would have many options but not very strong, in the end it would better to shoot in the surprise round, and then continue to shoot, than cast lousy 5 level behind spells, but maybe I'm not seeing something great.
First Note -> Which point buy? Which level are you starting? Which technological leve? Knowing this helps with your questions
Second One -> The feat hunger, increased misfires and ammo problems can be dealt with a simple +1 named Shadowshooting, the problem being the money to put it in your weapon, which in turn comes to the level at which you would start.
Third One -> Which is your idea for gunslinger, i mean is your char defined as a musket master or open for other concepts?
My favorite solution to misfires is Slate Spider, but that only works for one minute per day. So how many fights per day you expect to be in is certainly a factor.
20 point buy, 3rd to 16-18 level maybe, "normal" tech level as pathfinder manual, so early firearms but no problem in gathering gunpowder, alchemicals, custom enchantments.
I don't know Shadowshooting, I'll go search.
I don't have still a clear concept, I always hated d&d and firearms in the past, so this is a challenge for me and the DM too.
Mainly I will hang around with those strange weapons others don't use, make a lot of noise, and kill foes, like a nerd warrior (oh boy, why don't you just use a sword?).
Utik wrote: You don't have to pay double to enchant the double barreled, it is just a firearm with capacity = 2, not a double weapon, as otherwise stated in the dagger-pistol. My apologies, you are correct. I must have been confused by the Spellslinger Wizard archetype, which has an ability to enhance firearm weapons but must target each barrel separately.
Utik wrote: I fear that the gunslinger/wizard would have many options but not very strong, in the end it would better to shoot in the surprise round, and then continue to shoot, than cast lousy 5 level behind spells, but maybe I'm not seeing something great. Haste will easily pay for itself on the following round, a battlefield control spell like Black Tentacles can be quite disruptive to enemies, Fly and See Invisibility are both extremely convenient spells to have access to, and defensive spells like greater invisibility can make you an utter pain to deal with. I particularly like the Shadow Conjuration spell to create illusionary fog around your party. Your allies get a save to disbelieve it and see through it, but enemies have to actually enter the fog to get their save to disbelieve, forcing ranged enemies into melee reach of your allies. However, it'll take you a while to reach these kinds of spells so this kind of build won't pay off immediately. I've built a few Gunslinger/Wizards and they're really appealing at high levels but take a while to come into their own.
I sincerely sugest ditching dwarf and going tiefling with prehensile tail for a two weapon build (Misterious Stranger 1/ Trench Figther 3/ Whatever u want 17) using fighter feats for rapid reload and after getting Shadowshooting on your guns retraining it or alternatively Human Musket Master 5/Inquisitor 15, whihc is pretty funny and sinergistic.
I don't see shadowshooting can avoid misfire, it is stated nowhere in the rules.
It looks like I'm the only one concerned with misfire, maybe being human and taking the RAcial Heritage feat will net me the bonus to dex and the reduced misfire.
It can help with having a less missfire rate as you are not using alchemical ammo, guess i didnt explained it.
I'm lookin also at the Warpriest, the ability to cast personal buff as swift actions seems very synergic with the damage output of the gunslinger, but I fail to see very strong buffs at a first look.
The prehensile Tail uses a swift action, so I think it can reload only once per round with this method.
Prehensile Tail: Many tieflings have tails, but some have long, flexible tails that can be used to carry items. While they cannot wield weapons with their tails, they can use them to retrieve small, stowed objects carried on their persons as a swift action. This racial trait replaces fiendish sorcery.
No, no what i meant is the rule that lets you pass weapons, shields and etc free between your appendages, which would let you free a hand for reloading purposes.
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