Since CompLang says the caster only gets the literal meaning of a language, what would happen if it was used on heiroglyphics? Egyptian heiroglyphs use pictograms to convey meaning in more than one way. As a made-up example of how actual, real Egyptian heiroglyphs work, sometimes a glyph of a duck means "duck" and sometimes it means the "D" sound, and sometimes it's part of another meaning entirely depending on proximity of other glyphs. Since CompLang only gives you the literal meaning of a language, would it interpret pictograms accurately, or literally? The spell description specifically says it does not decipher codes. Are pictograms not a form of code when used in the way Egyptian heiroglyphs were? They were not an alphabet that could be read like English. Real humans tried unsuccessfully to decipher heiroglyphs for thousands of years due to the many ways each glyph is used and the fact the language can be written and read from right to left, left to right, or even vertically, only succeeding after discovering the Rosetta Stone which decrypted the language accurately for them.
What do you believe the rule is?
Heiroglyphs aren't a "Concentration" puzzle. You understand the writing as it is written. If the heiroglyphs literally say "I am going to see a man about a horse.", that's what you'd understand, but you might not understand that that is a colloquial phrase meaning "I am going to the bathroom." If there is a hidden message if you treat the phrase as an acrostic, the spell will not reveal the hidden message, only the plain one. The spell does what it says it does.
Yeah you get the message they pictograph depicts (as long as it counts as a language) but no nuance or insight.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
My understanding is that they would correctly interpret normal context cues, but that as soon as it gets into subtext and additional hidden meanings you're a bit at sea without appropriate linguistics checks.
That said, if a GM told me that a language was unhelpfully translatable with Comprehend Languages, I'd be hoping for a fun puzzle to solve to get at the meaning of the alien language.
If you don't have a fun (for the players) follow up to "no, Comprehend Languages doesn't work," then I'd recommend saying yes instead.
My understanding is that they would correctly interpret normal context cues, but that as soon as it gets into subtext and additional hidden meanings you're a bit at sea without appropriate linguistics checks.
That said, if a GM told me that a language was unhelpfully translatable with Comprehend Languages, I'd be hoping for a fun puzzle to solve to get at the meaning of the alien language.
If you don't have a fun (for the players) follow up to "no, Comprehend Languages doesn't work," then I'd recommend saying yes instead.
This is a nice sentiment, but not practical. Will you create a puzzle for every single thing written in this language? This might make a great idea for a group of 1st level adventurers in a dungeon where they have limited alternatives and are trying to translate an ancient stone tablet, but that's only one use case. In real life the ancient Egyptians are gone, but not necessarily so in a fantasy world. If I have a living culture in my game world that writes everything in heiroglypics, it's not practical to create a puzzle for every sign, poster, book and label this culture writes.
Besides, even in the case of an ancient dead language, if your players are using the CompLang spell instead of role playing to figure it out, they are already trying to skip gameplay and an additional puzzle in their way is not likely to excite them. They could go find someone who speaks the language to translate for them, they could use Linguistics and a library to figure it out, there are lots of alternatives. But instead they pushed the magic win button to skip gameplay and normalize the in-game world into plain English... they already aren't interested in a puzzle.
Besides I'm not sure if I'd want to use my limited GM prep time on mitigating a 1st level spell failing to make the PCs lives easy.
...If the heiroglyphs literally say "I am going to see a man about a horse.", that's what you'd understand, but you might not understand that that is a colloquial phrase meaning "I am going to the bathroom."...
Wait - that's what that phrase means? I thought it was just a generic phrase for "I gotta go do something" - but used for situations when you don't really want to tell the other person what it is you are going to go do... whatever the reason... could be you are doing something shady - could be that if you told the person, it would spark another long conversation, and you are short on time...
Have i been using it wrong? have i just been telling people "i gotta go take a crap?" all this time?
Since CompLang says the caster only gets the literal meaning of a language, what would happen if it was used on heiroglyphics? [...]
What do you believe the rule is?
Heiroglyphics are a writing system -- as a matter of fact, the Latin alphabet is just an extensively modified set of hieroglyphics. As per the spell text, "[t]he spell enables you to understand or read an unknown language." Ancient Egyptian is a language, so you can understand or read it. Hieroglyphics are no more a form of code than Times New Roman characters are.
As I interpret the spell, you get the same level of understanding of the material that an ordinary, literate person who understands that language would. So you would not be confused by homographs (e.g., you will understand when the word "PECHEUR" refers to a fisherman and when it refers to a synonym -- the words are spelled the same, except for an accent mark, in French, but most French typography doesn't put accents on CAPITAL letters.) You will understand ordinary metaphors and idioms, so phrases like "Today, the White House said that..." won't confuse you into thinking of a talking building. You will even be able to deal wth ordinary typographic mistakes, so leaving a vowel out in the middle of a sentence won't cause problems.
What it won't do is solve riddles for you or recover secret information. So, for example, if the (translated) text said something like "look under the floorboards of our old clubhouse for the stuff," you won't know where the clubhouse was, and you won't know what the "stuff" is, even if it would have been obvious to the two gang members exchanging messages.
Owner - D20 Hobbies
|
I have not heard this phrase before; is it from (American) English?
“See a man about a horse” is a western alteration of the English phrase.
I’m a fan of comprehend language cutting through all puzzles and just dumping you into answers. The less puzzles I need to sit and check my email during the more fun I have with games.