Has anyone else noticed the funny spelling error in this booklet on page 14 (Sarcesian entry) where it states their Tactical Sniper Rifle damage as being 1d810+5? That's a nice hard hitter for a CR5.
My guess is it was supposed to be d8 or d10 (being a sniper rifle, my guess is d10).
Yeah, we have. We're waiting for someone to fix it. Sniper rifles seem to deal damage in d8s from what Owen said in the weapons thread, but that might be my brain making false memories again.
Either way, F~~*ING SPACE WINGS, YAAAAY!
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Damn it!
The beginning says that the monsters are created using a modified version of Simple Monster Creation rules. In that system AC is based on CR, not equipment or Dex.
The beginning says that the monsters are created using a modified version of Simple Monster Creation rules. In that system AC is based on CR, not equipment or Dex.
Wait, seriously? Is that confirmed somewhere?
If true, my heart soars. :) the biggest obstacle to my GMing of Pathfinder has always been monster stats. I've ended up creating them on the fly FAR more often than not because of it.
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"Pathfinder RPG players will notice differences in rules and terminology used in Starfinder monster stat blocks. Most dramatically, monsters in Starfinder aren't built using the same rules as player characters. Instead, they're created using a system of benchmarks similar to those found in Pathfinder RPG Pathfinder Unchained, which allows even relatively new Game Masters to create interesting, balanced monsters to throw against their groups."
"Grafts: The new monster-building system in Starfinder uses grafts, which are sets of abilities related to things like type, subtype, and class that a GM can add to a creature to give it flavor and abilities (see Pathfinder Unchained). For instance, the sarcesian presented on page 14 uses the operative graft to be an effective sniper without making the GM use the full class rules. Some grafts have specific requirements that must be fulfilled before they can be applied."
I agree with ENHenry, these rules allow for GMs to quickly prepare entirely custom yet balanced monsters without having to go through calculating skill points, attack, bonuses, damage, etc.
I meant defenses being based on CR and not derived from statistics. A monster creation system could (and should) totally produce statistics that line up with the final result. That stuff matters and people are going to notice. That's historically known, monster creation systems found in games like 4e that didn't bother with that produced nonsense outputs like gelatinous cubes with Reflex 16 and it sucked.
That's damn cool. I know a few folks who are gonna like that.
The beginning says that the monsters are created using a modified version of Simple Monster Creation rules. In that system AC is based on CR, not equipment or Dex.Ahh. I never did like those rules...
It also states that Feats will only be listed in the monsters stats listing if the creature can actively use them. Other feats that give constant bonuses will simply be pre calculated into the stat block and not listed, the example they gave was Improved Initiative.
So there could be dodge or some other defensive feat modifying those AC's that is not listed in the Feat summary since it is not an active feat to use.
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I really, really, really hate that. If the concern was making it unclear which feats are abilities they could have just... bolded them, or something, instead of making it mandatory for a GM to reverse engineer a stat block if they want to modify a creature or figure out what happens when they pick up gear they didn't start with.
I am also extremely curious now in how KAC and EAC are calculated.
In First Contact it says if you want to use the creatures in there in Pathfinder you can set their normal AC to whatever is higher of their KAC or EAC. Use the other AC for touch AC and subtract their Dex mod from their AC for flatfooted.
But all 12 creatures in the handout have KAC's and EAC's within either 1 or 2 points of each other. Generally the low CR creatures only have a 1 point difference and the higher CR creatures have a 2 point.
Does that mean touch AC spells just got seriously nerfed or is there some new mechanic for handling them?
All SF casters have 3/4 BAB, so their to hit rolls with spells should be high enough to hit EAC.
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Has anyone else noticed the funny spelling error in this booklet on page 14 (Sarcesian entry) where it states their Tactical Sniper Rifle damage as being 1d810+5? That's a nice hard hitter for a CR5.
My guess is it was supposed to be d8 or d10 (being a sniper rifle, my guess is d10).
Just got an errata update from Owen K. C. Stevens on this off a Facebook group.
It should be +51112.
I have also noticed that none of the monsters have any stamina point entry. All have hit points, and some have resolve points (which tells me that most do not have resolve points). So the question here would be whether we assume that stamina points = hit points or that stamina points are a PC only advantage.
I swear I read somewhere that monsters only have HP, but can't really find a source.
I have also noticed that none of the monsters have any stamina point entry. All have hit points, and some have resolve points (which tells me that most do not have resolve points). So the question here would be whether we assume that stamina points = hit points or that stamina points are a PC only advantage.
Yeah. Also, all of the CR 4 monsters in First Contact, despite having different roles, creature types, and ability score modifiers, have exactly 52 HP, EAC 16, and KAC 18. I'm really hoping that's just an astonishingly unlikely coincidence.
There are three such creatures, so maybe they all work out to having average hit points for their CR for some reason.
One sign that hit points are not tightly coupled with CR is that the human space pirate crew member (CR 1) has more hit points than the contemplative (CR 2).
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Also if you look at the three CR 4 encounters, you'll see that they all have different CON scores. The Space Pirate captian is a Soldier with a con 1, the Security Robot is a construct with con -, and the Ksarik is a plant with con 4.
Assuming that you get con bonus per level, that means different classes/ types have different vaules, that just happen to be give similar hp values.
Breaking this down, The soldier gets 12 + con (13) HP per level to get 54. The plant gets 9 + con (13) per level to get 54. The construct gets a flat 13 per level to 54.
Of course, this is all working on the assumption that con affects HP.
52 HP is the same amount of HP a CR 4 Combatant with Extra Hit Points from Pathfinder unchained gets. The Contemplative has 18 HP, which is the same as a CR 2 Spellcaster from Unchained. The Space Pirate Crewman has 20 HP, which is the same as a CR 1 Combatant with Extra Hit Points.
Pathfinder Unchained monster gen HP was totally unlinked from ability scores, and whatever system Starfinder uses seems heavily based on that one (which is weird, since it was unpopular and saw little use, but Paizo could have fixed its flaws and just kept its HP values). It seems highly likely that Starfinder monsters have HP unrelated to their Con.
i wonder if spells and effectst that target abilities still exist or if they just make adjustments to the modifiers instead of damage to the direct value...
I guess there are such grafts, else it would be boring - and seriously I expect the whole process to be advanced vs pfuc
I was not able to get a copy over the weekend so please pardon me if these are no brainers...
If attack and defense are divorced from PC rules, do entries not have specific gear? If i throw a power armored, minigun toting, mercenary at the PCs is there nothing left to loot? or do i just warn the PCs that while the Merc was shooting single targets for 1D10+10 the gun actually is a 4D4 cone weapon?
Are grafts automatic for some types, like undead always have the undead trait graft?
I feel like this system should allow a lot more customization for creating enemies but it also sounds like the attack, damage, AC and HP are hard coded at each CR, which is it?
Was there any DR/Hardness/energy resistance in the book? I am still really worried about how that will carry over with so many energy weapons out there and no static bonuses for overcoming DR.
As I recall both DR and Energy Resistance are still in.
I was not able to get a copy over the weekend so please pardon me if these are no brainers...
If attack and defense are divorced from PC rules, do entries not have specific gear? If i throw a power armored, minigun toting, mercenary at the PCs is there nothing left to loot? or do i just warn the PCs that while the Merc was shooting single targets for 1D10+10 the gun actually is a 4D4 cone weapon?
Gear is written in the NPC entries with specific items named, such as a d-suit IV with gray force field (20 temporary HP), an Eoxian Wrackstaff, a dual ion laser pistol with 6 batteries, a spell gem of dominate person, and a spell gem of teleport in the case of the Necrovite.
I assume the armor in an NPC's gear entry is based on its AC. So a d-suit IV no doubt gives a PC around the same AC as the Necrovite has.
Are grafts automatic for some types, like undead always have the undead trait graft?
Yes, an undead without the undead graft would be the same as an undead without the undead type; not undead.
I feel like this system should allow a lot more customization for creating enemies but it also sounds like the attack, damage, AC and HP are hard coded at each CR, which is it?
Both? They're basically averages as on the normal monster creation table, except they're now averages for a specific combat role instead of just overall averages for that CR, and you can customize them to have variations using various grafts and abilities. It's no different than putting templates on and giving feats to a monster made using HD, or customizing its ability scores.
Simple monster creation simply doesn't bother with different creature types having different HD sizes with different bonuses per HD, because those ultimately aren't stats, they're just a complicated way of figuring out the stats, and then trying to find what CR a monster should be after you've built it.
In simple monster creation you start with the CR and built the stats around it, instead of starting with HD, building stats from them, and then trying to find a CR based on those stats.
Was there any DR/Hardness/energy resistance in the book? I am still really worried about how that will carry over with so many energy weapons out there and no static bonuses for overcoming DR.
DR and Energy Resistance have both been confirmed, yes.
Ok, this makes some sense. So, if using CR appropriate gear than the AC and weapons on your opponents (that use gear at least) will be roughly on par with the PCs? How does that affect charactger wealth if you are picking up 4-6 weapons every fight that are roughly on par with your current gun? Maybe i am assuming too many humanoid opponents that use gear but i am more used to see stronger stats on enemies that either use weak weapons backed up by brute force static modifiers, huge weapons that have lots of dice, or natural attacks that dont care about either.
I assume that most encounters, like in PF, are going to have you facing lots of lower CR creatures instead of creatures of your level, so most gear you find will be of lower level than yours. The CR 13 necrovite is going to be a mini boss to a level 13 party, perhaps a boss to a level 10 party, and it won't be a common mob for any party below level 16.
However, gear jumps up in level every few levels, not every level. There is no level 2 laser pistol for example, but there is a level 1 pistol and a level 4 pistol.
So a level 4 party might fight a CR 4-7 "boss", it would be using a level 4 laser pistol, but all his henchmen would be using level 1 laser pistols.
interesting though, would a spell still apply a -2 penalty to strength or just a -1 to hit/damage? basically do you word abilities as if used against PCs or enemies since they have different layouts for their stats, who do you make do the extra math? or shift it all to penalties to derived values like Hit/Damage, Saves etc.
STR does apply to melee damage for monsters in SF, so I wouldn't be surprised if it also applied to hit rolls.
Monster damage in PF seems to be (CR Appropriate Weapon) + CR + STR for melee and (CR Appropriate Weapon) + CR for ranged.
i suppose that energy resistance wont be too bad so long as you are keeping your weapon up to your level, a 6D8 laser isnt too slowed down by fire res 5. though i hope we wont see as many immunities...
I am not as sure with DR, under the new system can it be overcome or do you just have to soak it every time and keep your damage up to compensate there as well?
I am pretty sure I read somewhere that having weapons specialization helps in negating some or all of a targets DR and Energy Resistance depending on the weapon used.
I just noticed that monsters in First Contact still have associated experience values. We're probably keeping levels by kill count, then.
never was a fan of that, just giving sesseion and quest based xp
To me, it's not a negative thing to have HP divorced from ability scores, because:
1) it makes calculations behind the scenes quicker when I have to stat up a monster on the fly
2) the PCs will still never know exactly how many HP the monsters "are supposed to have." If this ever becomes a problem, varying HP by monster slightly (+10 HP here, -5 HP there) will solve that without complicating things too much. I'm far more likely to be bothered by ACs being known quantities, but that doesn't bother me either because players fighruing out what the AC of a creature is during combat is a good thing, and actually speeds up play. (I do enjoy the lightbulb on players' faces when they "find the magic number" on an opponent :))
never was a fan of that, just giving sesseion and quest based xp
me neither, though I imagine both will be supported. I haven't given out XP in my "F20" games in probably 15 years now.
It doesn't seem like anything, other than maybe skill checks, is definitely connected to monster ability scores.
Saving throws, for instance. None of the monster ability scores seem to factor into saves (goblins have +3 Dex and only +2 Reflex, Haan have +4 Dex but only +4 Reflex, Security Robots have +5 Dex and only +4 Reflex, etc), and they seem to be generated using the same schema as Unchained monster generation. All of them match or are within 1 point of the numbers that system generates from creatures of the same role and creature type. For instance, the Ksarik and Security Robot clearly have the same base saves of +6/+6/+3, but the Ksarik got the Unchained system's modifier for plants (+2 Fort) and the Security Robot got the system's modifier for constructs (-2 All).
Melee damage might be connected to Strength, but it's unclear. It definitely wasn't in Unchained. There could just be a mandate to assign a creature's highest score to Strength if it's intended to smash people, unlike Unchained where a giant monster can be assigned Str -2 and still attack for 3d6+40 (that's an actual system output).