I'm sorry if this is in the wrong section, this is my first time actually posting on these forums.
Anyways I want to make a character that fits the role the Maiar in the Tolkien universe fill. For those who don't know the Wizards in those books are actually an equivalent to angels who were sent by the gods(valar), or demi-gods to help guide the people of Middle Earth and assist them in defeating Sauron. They swore an oath not to use the full potential of their power and to intervene as little as possible. They took the forms of old men and each watched over a part or aspect of middle earth.
What I want to do is create a character similarly powerful with a similar code of conduct. I want to make it clear I am not making Gandalf, or any of the other wizards specifically. The things I want to accomplish with this character is:
-Be a power Spell Caster
-Know a great deal about the world and how it works
-Be a mythic character
-Have the traits of a celestial being
-Have shape shifting abilities
-To understand most languages
and so on.
The idea is this character is deliberately overpowered, but cannot actually use themselves to their full potential except in dire circumstances or for extremely thematic moments. It's more about roleplaying the character than how they interact with combat.
I would love class suggestions, race suggestions, custom race suggestion, gear and feats, spells anything at all you guys think could make this work. There is leeway in how broken they can be, but I would like to keep it reasonable and within the confines of the rules of course. They will be level 20 and tier 10 mythic with non-mythic PCs which might be enough of a power level difference to sell this angle pretending to be human motif.
I was considering using something like an elf or Asimar and putting the Celestial Blessed template on them permanently and making them a white mage arcanist. Because the Maiar's magic is natural and innate to them. I also heavily considered a druid. I ma also considering the archmage mythic path.
Any reason you are choosing not to start with a full celestial near your required power level with the right flavor, and do modding with mythic and class templates as needed? Several Azata or Angels might fit the bill.
Any reason you are choosing not to start with a full celestial near your required power level with the right flavor, and do modding with mythic and class templates as needed? Several Azata or Angels might fit the bill.
Because I'm unfamiliar with the complete ins and outs of the mechanics I guess. I am not sure exactly what you're saying.
**EDIT**
Sleep Brain makes me dumb, the reason is I figured it would be easier to make them like a regular PC. Taking an actual angle and modding it around seemed a bit daunting especially not knowing where to start. It's also supposed to be a PC, not an NPC. Fitting it on a character sheet easily would be nice.
It just seems that a Maiar would Start as a celestial being and grow or be modified to a specific purpose. Your flavor is a greater being sent down to influence or inspire, without ruling. Using a mortal/Player Character base and building it up is going to have the feel of a mortal raised up, and is likely to be more proactive on a regular basis.
If you look at a lot of the Celestial Beings, the Start with most of your requirements, being celestial beings and all. Roleplaying-wise, you have have the separateness built in.
I had a lot of the same things in mind when thinking of how to accomplish this character. Honestly I think I am going to drop the mythic aside from some key aspects like the immortality.
I may use the hit die and BAB of the outsider when you create your own monster and apply that to a class along with other benefits of one of the Angels or Azata like suggested above. The only issue is I actually want to have a few damage spells or otherwise offensive spells as possible.
I meant to mention this but forgot but I want a definite focus on protective magic, utility magic and the like. Mostly based around light where possible. A lot of abjuration magic, and maybe divination. Some evocation spells work, but nothing from say, necromancy of course. Which those kind of restrictions I also feel a lot of the inherent spell like abilities for angels and the like don't match the character and would have to be stripped out.
I actually considered druid for wild shape specifically.
As far as the code or duty I would say the character cannot kill unless absolutely necessary against something irredeemably evil. For example demons are evil by nature and thus cannot ever change their ways, but an evil dictator could and thus I could kill the demon but not the dictator. To make it simple. I also would have to refrain from using my full potential as mentioned above, and that I would have to guide the characters on their journey to better the world.
I am ruling out Wizard simply due to the nature of how they cast magic, the spell book and what have you. If I choose a class from that spell list, if I choose c lass at all, it will be Arcanist or Sorcerer. I also considered the Witch because it's a happy medium between the wizard and druid.
I agree with wisdom and intelligence being the top most priority. It's hard to discern what is what in the real world because they're intrinsically linked, but I would be inclined the favor wisdom, but intelligence could be the primary stat too. Charisma also being important.
I am also considering adding the venerable stat bonuses to reflect the age but without the penalties to reflect the immortality.
I'll have to look at the actual abilities of each celestial outsider to determine what does and doesn't fit. Any ideas at all are welcome.
Oh and a bright and glowing longsword for good measure. Potentially a staff, and I forgot to mention, but maybe it was obvious, this is an unarmored character. I want it to fit that Odin as a sage theme, the wandering wizard theme.
1 level dip in to monk(wis to AC) + some decent bracers of armor(because Gandalf secretly wears a pair.
1 level dip in to monk(wis to AC) + some decent bracers of armor(because Gandalf secretly wears a pair.
What is typically level 20 AC anyways? I figure for a fighter with full plate it's like 39 +5 plate= 14 +10 base +5 deflection, +5 nat and +5 dex. Another what 9 after a shield? So 48 AC
With all the stat boosting gear, manuals, celestial stat bonuses and the like I can get them to 36 AC with bracers of armor, amulet of nat, and ring of pro. Base dexterity being 14 +2 racial, +6 enhancement, +5 inherent so 27 Dex being +8
10 +8 +8 +5 +5 = 36, seems reasonable right?
Not sure I need the monk bonus all things considered.
Are you the GM creating a NPC or a player? If you are a player than you had better check with your GM to make sure he is ok with what you are doing. Gandalf was not a PC type character; he was more of a plot device than a real character. He could do anything he needed to be able to do. This is the same reason that Paizo does not stat out gods including demi-gods.
If this is going to be a PC then you need to abide by the normal rules regardless of concept. A game is not a novel so some concepts are not suitable for PC’s. Gandalf is one of those concepts. You can make a character with a lot of similarities to Gandalf, but he is not going to be able to do what Gandalf could do.
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Ability wise, Gandalf was the equivalent of a fairly low level Pathfinder Wizard... with immortality, a few artifacts, extremely high knowledge and Wisdom scores, and divine guidance / assistance.
He wasn't able to access his full power as a Maia until after he died and was sent back by Eru with a new mission... and even then only in extreme circumstances (pretty much limited to healing Theoden, saving Faramir from the Nazgul, and his almost battle with the Witch King).
Thus, what you are describing (20th level and Mythic Rank 10) is vastly different from the character... even after he was upgraded. If you're looking for just general thematic similarities then you might consider giving him a staff as bonded object / repository of his angelic power. Gandalf was noted, even among the Maia, for his Wisdom and retained much of that in his mortal form... as Saruman did his charismatic persuasion. So maybe allow one full power mental stat while reducing the others to more 'normal character' levels.
Reincarnated Druid is completely fitting. Plus when Saruman went astray he abandoned nature, but originally protected it.
With Pathfinder being a higher powered setting, Tolkien's universe winding down so to speak, you would have to do the equivalent compared to the rest of the universe, or something. It's a thematic similarity more than anything. I scrapped the mythic idea, aside from some key elements because the Maiar equivalent in pathfinder will be equal in power to the Balrog equivalent right? So we are looking at Balor power. This is more powerful than Gandalf, but if Middle Earth had the power of pathfinder that's where things would be I imagine. Make sense?
20 + 10 mythic might actually be too much more powerful than our comparison, the Balor.
Depends on what part of the combat you want to be at. Your tower shield fighter's AC (unboosted by feats) and your Wizard's AC are 12 points apart. That would turn a 20% miss into a 20% hit, or a reasonable chance to miss (50%) into an auto-hit (5% miss). Note that a Balor's highest to-hit is at +31, which means that your Wizard will get hit on a 5, while your Fighter only gets hurt on a 17 or higher. Assuming your WIS is the same as your DEX, you can push your AC to 44, or 45 if you use that monk robe body slot thing. This makes it so that you can go toe-to-toe with the Balor with a reasonable chance of not getting torn to shreds.1 level dip in to monk(wis to AC) + some decent bracers of armor(because Gandalf secretly wears a pair.What is typically level 20 AC anyways? I figure for a fighter with full plate it's like 39 +5 plate= 14 +10 base +5 deflection, +5 nat and +5 dex. Another what 9 after a shield? So 48 AC
With all the stat boosting gear, manuals, celestial stat bonuses and the like I can get them to 36 AC with bracers of armor, amulet of nat, and ring of pro. Base dexterity being 14 +2 racial, +6 enhancement, +5 inherent so 27 Dex being +8
10 +8 +8 +5 +5 = 36, seems reasonable right?
Not sure I need the monk bonus all things considered.
Well this was somewhere armor the realms of the stats I was going to use originally, with the monk AC bonus it would add an additonal 10, and with the robes an additional 1 on top of that, making the AC 47. I just wanted to be mindful of how strong this character could get, and to not over do it. Do the bracers stack with those monk bonuses anyways?
http://charactersheet.co.uk/pathfinder/#/statblock/583b6608cf04d50004a6f6f5
I'm sorry if this is in the wrong section, this is my first time actually posting on these forums.
Anyways I want to make a character that fits the role the Maiar in the Tolkien universe fill. For those who don't know the Wizards in those books are actually an equivalent to angels who were sent by the gods(valar), or demi-gods to help guide the people of Middle Earth and assist them in defeating Sauron. They swore an oath not to use the full potential of their power and to intervene as little as possible. They took the forms of old men and each watched over a part or aspect of middle earth.
What I want to do is create a character similarly powerful with a similar code of conduct. I want to make it clear I am not making Gandalf, or any of the other wizards specifically. The things I want to accomplish with this character is:
-Be a power Spell Caster
-Know a great deal about the world and how it works
-Be a mythic character
-Have the traits of a celestial being
-Have shape shifting abilities
-To understand most languages
and so on.
The idea is this character is deliberately overpowered, but cannot actually use themselves to their full potential except in dire circumstances or for extremely thematic moments. It's more about roleplaying the character than how they interact with combat.
I would love class suggestions, race suggestions, custom race suggestion, gear and feats, spells anything at all you guys think could make this work. There is leeway in how broken they can be, but I would like to keep it reasonable and within the confines of the rules of course. They will be level 20 and tier 10 mythic with non-mythic PCs which might be enough of a power level difference to sell this angle pretending to be human motif.
I was considering using something like an elf or Asimar and putting the Celestial Blessed template on them permanently and making them a white mage arcanist. Because the Maiar's magic is natural and innate to them. I also heavily considered a druid. I ma also...
Than just simply build the character at the reduced power level. Gandalf never exceeded his imposed limits even at the cost of his own life.
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Celestial Sorcerer is worth looking at...as is Celestial Bloodrager for that matter.
The Mystery Cultist prestige class is another one to look at closely. It is not particularly powerful, but hits a lot of your flavor requirements. It fits with virtually any base class (it's prerequisites are all skill ranks + a single feat), but probably synergizes best with a Charisma caster, since you get a Charisma-boosting aura.
Celestial Sorcerer is worth looking at...as is Celestial Bloodrager for that matter.
The Mystery Cultist prestige class is another one to look at closely. It is not particularly powerful, but hits a lot of your flavor requirements. It fits with virtually any base class (it's prerequisites are all skill ranks + a single feat), but probably synergizes best with a Charisma caster, since you get a Charisma-boosting aura.
I definitely like some of what is in that prestige class.
I definitely like some of what is in that prestige class.Celestial Sorcerer is worth looking at...as is Celestial Bloodrager for that matter.
The Mystery Cultist prestige class is another one to look at closely. It is not particularly powerful, but hits a lot of your flavor requirements. It fits with virtually any base class (it's prerequisites are all skill ranks + a single feat), but probably synergizes best with a Charisma caster, since you get a Charisma-boosting aura.
It does mean sacrificing progression in the bloodline abilities.
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It does mean sacrificing progression in the bloodline abilities.I definitely like some of what is in that prestige class.Celestial Sorcerer is worth looking at...as is Celestial Bloodrager for that matter.
The Mystery Cultist prestige class is another one to look at closely. It is not particularly powerful, but hits a lot of your flavor requirements. It fits with virtually any base class (it's prerequisites are all skill ranks + a single feat), but probably synergizes best with a Charisma caster, since you get a Charisma-boosting aura.
A Robe of Arcane Heritage can help with that to some extent.
A Robe of Arcane Heritage can help with that to some extent.It does mean sacrificing progression in the bloodline abilities.I definitely like some of what is in that prestige class.Celestial Sorcerer is worth looking at...as is Celestial Bloodrager for that matter.
The Mystery Cultist prestige class is another one to look at closely. It is not particularly powerful, but hits a lot of your flavor requirements. It fits with virtually any base class (it's prerequisites are all skill ranks + a single feat), but probably synergizes best with a Charisma caster, since you get a Charisma-boosting aura.
Those aren't legal for Bloodragers.
FAQ here.
Ability wise, Gandalf was the equivalent of a fairly low level Pathfinder Wizard... with immortality, a few artifacts, extremely high knowledge and Wisdom scores, and divine guidance / assistance.
He wasn't able to access his full power as a Maia until after he died and was sent back by Eru with a new mission... and even then only in extreme circumstances (pretty much limited to healing Theoden, saving Faramir from the Nazgul, and his almost battle with the Witch King).
Thus, what you are describing (20th level and Mythic Rank 10) is vastly different from the character... even after he was upgraded. If you're looking for just general thematic similarities then you might consider giving him a staff as bonded object / repository of his angelic power. Gandalf was noted, even among the Maia, for his Wisdom and retained much of that in his mortal form... as Saruman did his charismatic persuasion. So maybe allow one full power mental stat while reducing the others to more 'normal character' levels.
Actually, his stats are thos of a Solar, he just hid them well
Make a Conjuration wizard who focuses on summoning music-themed creatures. Get enough together, have them play I Want You to Want Me, and you can be a conjurer of Cheap Trick.
What level are you starting at>?
I think you can take a simplistic approach with this type of adaptation and just have ol' Grey Beard be a high-level Aasimar Bard.
If the most experienced members of the Fellowship are 6th-level, their rocking out with a +4 to +6 BaB.
Gandalf would have a BaB of double that, and he's got magical items & spells to boost him even higher.
If you simply keep the rest of the characters low-level, a 17th to 20th level character will seem like an angel to them.