I know my intention is to take 6 levels of arcanist and 10 levels of evangelist, level 6 is proving to be a difficult choice for me however
If I take the level in arcanist I will get the following
*+1BAB
*+1 on all saving throws
* Level 3 casting
I will achieve all of this at level 7 with the going into evangelist class at level 5 instead, and of course I will get earlier access to the evangelist abilities...
I'd definitely take your six levels of Arcanist first. Getting those 3rd level spells should be a priority, and delaying access to them until 7th level is going to hurt.
I just think you'll be happier weathering the delayed progression if you can at least cast 3rd level spells like Fly, Haste, Fireball, etc.
And I say that as someone who quite likes the Evangelist PRC.
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I'd definitely take your six levels of Arcanist first. Getting those 3rd level spells should be a priority, and delaying access to them until 7th level is going to hurt.
I just think you'll be happier weathering the delayed progression if you can at least cast 3rd level spells like Fly, Haste, Fireball, etc.
And I say that as someone who quite likes the Evangelist PRC.
Agreed
3rd Level spells are the nice sweet spot. You should grab them and then go into your PrC.
That is what I am heavily leaning towards as is. Out of curiosity, and it is a VERY LONG way to go (But I feel a plan in place might affect my level 6 choice). What other PrC give full casting? I can only find Loremaster, and I know there are others
Harrower does. Don't know how useful that is though.
Hellknigh Signifier maintains full casting. A bit more Gish.
And cannot be taken with NG...too bad would not mind a little gish (Big reason for going evangelist for me is actualy the higher BAB/skill points with only a minor lost in class abilities)
For the record, I am not considering classes that I would need to dip into something as being full caster (ie Mystic Thurge)
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I was curious about this question myself. Arcanist 5/ Evangelist or Arcanist 6/ Evangelist? Obviously the Arcanist only build has the advantage at 6th level. But at 7th level and beyond they'll have the same spell and Arcanist class feature progression. So here's the specific advantage of each progression vs. the other at each level. This is just the advantages at that level, they aren't cumulative.
Level 7
Arcanist 6 - +1 to reflex saves
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, +1 dodge bonus to AC.
Level 8
Arcanist 6 - +1 to fort and will saves
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, First Boon
Level 9
Arcanist 6 - + 1 to all saves
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, extra language
Level 10
Arcanist 6 - +1 BAB
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, +4 on all untrained skills
Level 11
Arcanist 6 - +1 to all saves
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, Second Boon
Level 12
Arcanist 6 - +1 bonus to fort and will saves
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, +1 dodge bonus to AC
Level 13
Arcanist 6 - +1 bonus to reflex saves
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, extra language
Level 14
Arcanist 6 - +1 bonus to fort and will saves, +1 BAB
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, Third Boon
Level 15
Arcanist 6 - +1 bonus on all saves
Arcanist 5 - +4 skill points, Spiritual Form
So basically Arcanist 6/Evangelist is going to have slightly better saves at most levels and better BAB at two levels. Arcanist 5/Evangelist is going to have 4 more skill points (total) and get all the Evangelist class features a level early.
Personally I'd take getting the boons and spiritual form one level earlier over a +1 on some of my saves.
No, the cherry feature of Evangelist is that after level 1 you still get all the special abilities of one previous class of your choice (in this case archanist), while BAB is +3/4, Hit Dice is D8, and 6+int skills. You do need to perform an hour observation to your god each morning to access them
Otherwise the special abilities (except 10) can be described as nice but not amazing
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Don't you loose out of getting access to the Arcanist Exploits if you jump to Evangelist?
Asking as some of the level 10+ Arcanist Exploits are crazy good.
Nope. Evangelist gets all the features of the aligned class except HD, BAB, saves, and skills. So you get the exploits, just a level later than a full Arcanist.
I was curious about this question myself. Arcanist 5/ Evangelist or Arcanist 6/ Evangelist? Obviously the Arcanist only build has the advantage at 6th level. But at 7th level and beyond they'll have the same spell and Arcanist class feature progression. So here's the specific advantage of each progression vs. the other at each level. This is just the advantages at that level, they aren't cumulative.
** spoiler omitted **
So basically Arcanist 6/Evangelist is going to have slightly better saves at most levels and better BAB at two levels. Arcanist 5/Evangelist is going to have 4 more skill points (total) and get all the Evangelist class features a level early.
Personally I'd take getting the boons and spiritual form one level earlier over a +1 on some of my saves.
Thank you for the break down, It is very helpful... I assume you would agree with arcanist level 16 then?
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Thank you for the break down, It is very helpful... I assume you would agree with arcanist level 16 then?
That would be my assumption, at which point the two paths become the same again.
Unless you want to take another full-casting progression prestige class - for some reason - you are giving up a huge amount if you don't go Arcanist after finishing Evangelist.
Two exploits and 2 arcanist pp does not seem "Huge" to me, what am I missing? Assuming Full Caster (Right now I am leaning towards Loremaster)
Two exploits and 2 arcanist pp does not seem "Huge" to me, what am I missing? Assuming Full Caster (Right now I am leaning towards Loremaster)
Can't seem to edit, after rereading the post this was in response to I realize that I misinterpreted what you were saying: I read it as (basically): You should stay in arcanist instead of (the more likely) you should stay in full casting class (including arcanist or a PrC that includes full casting)
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Two exploits and 2 arcanist pp does not seem "Huge" to me, what am I missing? Assuming Full Caster (Right now I am leaning towards Loremaster)Can't seem to edit, after rereading the post this was in response to I realize that I misinterpreted what you were saying: I read it as (basically): You should stay in arcanist instead of (the more likely) you should stay in full casting class (including arcanist or a PrC that includes full casting)
Editing locks after an hour.
Yeah, I meant that the second way. Stay as a full casting class. I don't know what the top level you expect your campaign to be. If for some crazy reason you expect to make character level 21 then stay Arcanist to get the 20th level capstone. Otherwise you can decide between the exploits you get from staying Arcanist vs. whatever benefits the full-casting prestige class gets you.
honestly expect ~17-18 planning as if 20.
looking at full caster level prc's now...leaning towards Loremaster...not sure yet....Loremaster or scrollmaster (can't think of name) are the 2 I am thinking of
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honestly expect ~17-18 planning as if 20.
looking at full caster level prc's now...leaning towards Loremaster...not sure yet....Loremaster or scrollmaster (can't think of name) are the 2 I am thinking of
If you are just using Paizo material scrollmaster is a wizard archetype, not a PrC.
Cyphermage, maybe? That might be a decent choice by that level. Unless you are in a really high-wealth game it's debatable at the lower levels if the advantages you get casting from scrolls are worth the fact that most of your class features are tied to expendables.
yes cyphermage is what i was thinking