Another of the smaller changes I like is that Tunneled Lore explicitly mentions binding starless spirits as well--I don't recall that from previous versions.
Page 33, Bloodsworn Binder
- Bind Spirit: "...maximum spirit level, which is which is...", extra "which is."Page 34, Brawler
- Description: "Instead, they pursuit whatever occult lore will help...", should be "pursue."
- Description: [Wording] "...and abandon the pursuit altogether" sounds a bit weird here. Should it be "...and allow them to abandon the pursuit altogether?"
That way the sentence would be "They pursue whatever occult lore will help augment their bodies enough to...allow them to abandon the pursuit altogether."Page 34, Occult Bruiser
- Bind Spirit: "...maximum spirit level, which is which is...", extra "which is."Page 35, Cavalier
- Description: [Wording] "direct troops, form battle strategies, and charge into the fray" is repeated in the second half of the paragraph. Perhaps this could be "On both sides of the conflict, cavaliers stand and fight, willing to die for their beliefs..."Page 35-36, Orders [Wording]
- Order of the Company refers to gender:
Challenge: "...issues a challenge, he receives a +1 bonus..."
Order Abilities: "...gains the following abilities as he increases in level."However, the other two orders do not:
Challenge: "...issues a challenge, add a +1 bonus..."
Order Abilities: "...following abilities with increases in level."Also, while the Order of the Occult Eye refers to "he or she", the Order of Salendrios refers to "their (singular)." The Order of Salendrios also refers to "he" in the ability descriptions.
While I prefer the wording in the Order of the Company (it is similar to other Paizo Orders), the three Orders should all share the same wording.
Page 36, Order of Salendrios
- Challenge: "This bonus increases by +1 every four levels that the cavalier possesses.", should be "...increases by +1 for every four levels..."Page 36, Pactsworn Knight
Bind Spirits: "...maximum spirit level, which is which is", extra "which is."
Page 374: Ceremony Gone Awry has the wrong formatting.
The feeblemind spell doesn't need to list all of that, after all—it only lists what the spell affects.
Yes, but Feeblemind does say:
The affected creature is unable to use Intelligence- or Charisma-based skills, cast spells, understand language, or communicate coherently.
If that's how the ability should behave, it needs to say "as Feeblemind".
Though, you said it worked like Baphomet's Blessing, but without anything saying "as <spell>", we might have table variations.
As is, the ability does not affect the character at all other than "minus X" to int-based checks. He retains even the ability to speak.
If that's the intent, if fine with how it's written.
Another of the smaller changes I like is that Tunneled Lore explicitly mentions binding starless spirits as well--I don't recall that from previous versions.
Yes, that is SUPER welcome. I still wish Amateur Occultist contained this provision, or a Second Feat allowed for it.
Yes, but Feeblemind does say:
The affected creature is unable to use Intelligence- or Charisma-based skills, cast spells, understand language, or communicate coherently.
The granted ability doesn't impart any of those penalties onto the character, which is why it doesn't work like feeblemind.
As is, the ability does not affect the character at all other than "minus X" to int-based checks. He retains even the ability to speak.
This is correct.
Page 113 - Marat's "Bodyguard" power should probably specify that it's a feat, since other things have that name.
Only feats are capitalized out of context.
So I am just wondering about something that's irked me since his update; General Hessant Patron of Lost Soldiers Longsword power. Is there any chance that it can be changed back to its previous version were you could summon a longsword as a full round action, or at least allow the enhancement and enchantments be applied to any sword-like weapon and not just longswords?
No chance.
It does mention the Maelstrom in Bestiary 2 in the aeon entry that they "build order from the chaos of the Maelstrom", and in the Bestiary, in the demon entry that, "The Abyss is a vast (some say infinite) realm, far larger than any other plane save possibly the primal chaos of the Maelstrom itself", so I think he's probably safe.
Anywhere it says "Malestrom" is a typo. We intended to use Limbo.
Actually, I remember thinking when reading the Mishpo legend that you probably don't really need to spell Asmodeus as Asmodius, given his state...and if you did want to differentiate him, well, there are definitely some other spellings that would be cool...I like Asmodai or Ashmedai or even Asmodaios myself.
Its a typo—should be Asmodeus.
I'm working on a list of various things myself, though while I'm on Mishpo, is there a reason he's all the way in the back (pg. 376)? I noticed Death Howls (pg. 311) and Milo of Clyde (pg. 291) aren't in the Spirits section either, which was a bit odd to me.
Can you elaborate on this? What's the issue you're seeing?
Just got through more archetypes--some more great changes! So far, every archetype I've read through seems viable and fun to play. Except for the anti-pact magic archetypes. . . who'd want to play those? ;) To be honest, I may drop one of those in my game to see what havoc it could wreak with my party!
Also, Alex, do you prefer I put the stuff I find in "spoiler" tags to save space or would you prefer it to just be in the post?
Can you elaborate on this? What's the issue you're seeing?
I think he's referring to the location of their legends and why they aren't in the Spirits chapter like with the other spirit legend stories, which all appear after the spirit in question.
"1/2" - There are several places where the symbol "½" is used vs. the long form "1/2":
Page 35, Order of the Occult Eye, Skills
Page 36, Order of Salendrios, Skills
Page 37, Occult Domain, Spiritual Surge
Page 48, Spirit Realm, Maledict Touch
Page 62, 2-Point Evolutions, Absorb Occult Energy
Page 284, Detect Pact Spirits, 3rd Round
Page 285, Exorcist's Lament, Description
Page 287, Occult Sight, Description (2nd paragraph)Page 39, Druid
- Description: Last sentence states "...ancient woods were pactless men fear to tread.", should be "where."Page 39, Nightfang Servant
- Bind Spirit: The next-to-last sentence mentions "...resist a suicide soldier's...", should be "Nightfang servant."
- Bind Spirit: The last sentence mentions "pactsworn pagan" instead of "Nightfang servant."
- Lore of the Weald: "...she can cast one less spell per day...", "less" should be "fewer."
- Attuned to the Weald: "...abilities only function on the Nightfang Weald.", should this be "...in the Nightfang Weald."?Page 39, Pactsworn Pagan
- Bind Spirit: "...The spirit's level may not exceed by the pactsworn pagan's...", remove "by."Page 40, Warbinder
- Bind Spirit: "...The spirit's level may not exceed by the warbinder's...", remove "by."Page 41, Gunslinger
- Description: "...as their newfangled weaponry and brash sense of vigilante justice seldom connects...", should be "connect"Page 41, Occult Avenger
- Description: "...help them claim the vengeance upon their foes.", "the" is unnecessary.
- Avenger's Grit: Second sentence mentions "panache" instead of "grit."
- Bind Spirit: "...The spirit's level may not exceed by the occult avenger's...", remove "by."
- Revenge Pact: The second sentence, "An occult avenger can only seal pacts with spirits that lists one or more creatures of her chosen type as a favored enemy." is unnecessary, as two sentences later it is stated that "...she can seal pacts with spirits that list any of her chosen creature types as a favored enemy."
- Revenge Pact: The last paragraph repeats information mentioned in the previous paragraph.Page 42, Pactsworn Hunter
- Dimished Spellcasting: "...possesses 1 less spell per day...", should be "1 fewer spell."
- Bind Spirit: "...The spirit's level may not exceed by the pactsworn hunter's...", remove "by."
Just for clarification, Pactsworn Protector and Empyrean Friar are the only archetypes that should have the "cannot take the Extra Binder Secret feat" restriction?
Multiple Instances:
- Diminished Spellcasting: "...possesses 1 less spell per day...", "less" should be "fewer."
Occult Sadist, Pact Protector, Magus, Occult Medium, Soul Screamer, Pactsworn Warpriest, Weird Witch
- Diminished Spellcasting: "...receives one fewer spells known...then is presented...", should be "spell" and "than."
Soul Muse, Occult Medium, Soul Screamer
- Bind Spirit: "...The spirit's level may not exceed by the <archetype name>'s...", remove "by."
Nightfang Servant, Occult Sadist, Pact Protector, Occult Investigator, Pactsworn Magus, Pactsworn Champion, Foe Reaper, Fringe Binder, Occult Shaman, Pactsworn Assassin, Esoteric Dilettante
- Bind Spirit: "...maximum spirit level, which is which is limited...", remove extra "which is."
Pactmaker, Occult Chemist, Occult Exploiter, Soul Muse, Herald of the Legion, Soul Screamer, Seal-Bound Sorcerer, Spirit Caller, Pactsworn Warpriest, Weird Witch, Soul WeaverPage 43, Inquisitor
- Description: "..who are equally feverous...", should be "ferverous"Page 43, Occult Sadist
- Bind Spirit: "...(see lore of pain).", should be "...(see lore of the wicked)."Page 44, Occult Sadist
- Touch of Pain: "For example, the Extra Lay On Hands feat grants nan inquisitor...", "nan" should be "an."
- True Pain: "...becomes permanent unless removed by heal or a similarly powerful effect." Should "heal" be italicized?Page 45, Investigator Talents
- Mind Over Madness: "...against a mind-affecting effect, he rolls his initiative die twice...", should be "inspiration die."
- Rogue Talents: "...select in place of an as an investigator talent...", "as an" can be taken out.Page 45, Occult Investigator
- Bind Spirit: The feature mentions "...spirit of his choice that belongs to his chosen constellation (see tunneled lore)." There is no Tunneled Lore class feature for the Occult Investigator.Page 47, Ki Powers
- Banishing Palm: "When a monk with this ki power uses the banishing palm ki power...", should be "exorcising palm."
- Exorcising Palm: "...any spells or effects affecting it that possess or exorcise mental control...", should be "exercise."
- Exorcising Palm: "...all effects that possess or exorcise mental control...", should be "exercise."Page 47, Empyrean Friar
- Binder Secret: "...using his monk level as her effective pactmaker level when determining if she meets...", should be "his" and "he" to match the gender in the rest of the archetype description.
- Binder Secret: "...this ability and she cannot...unless she...", should be "he" to match the gender in the rest of the archetype description.Page 48, Spirit Realm
- Gray Mockery: "...you attempt a touched attack...", should be "touch."
- Gray Mockery: The first DC listed is the same as an Oracle's normal revelation DC--does this need to be there?
- Gray Veil: "...minutes worth of this ability equal to the number of creature to which...", should be "creatures"
- Maledict Touch: "Bestow malady" should be "bestow pact malady."
- Maledict Touch: The DC is the same as an Oracle's normal revelation DC--does this need to be there?Page 49, Spirit Realm
- Spirit-Touched Summons: "Creatures you summoned are called...", should be "summon."
- Untethered Soul: "...causing you body to crumple into a heap.", should be "your."
- Vision of Terror: "Mirage arcana" should be italicized.
- Final Revelation: The next-to-last sentence mixes voices--it should be: "Each day after regaining your spell slots, add one spell on any divine spellcasting class's list to your list of spells known until the next time you regain your spell slots."Page 49, Occult Medium
- Bind Spirits: "...spirit of her choice that belongs to her chosen constellation (see tunneled domain)." There is no Tunneled Domain class feature for the Occult Medium.
- Revelations: Refers to "spirit medium" instead of "occult medium" multiple times.
I have forgotten, it's been a long time since the last PDF to look over, where do I go to do that again?
You should have received a copy of the early access PDF through your email, as a free digital download from DriveThruRPG. If it's not there, check the spam folder.
Got it. Thanks.
One thing I do kind of want to complain about a little is the seal of living darkness binder secret, or more accurately, how many neat binder secrets use it as a prerequisite that I want on non-Intimidate builds. Horrid skean, shade step, shroud of shadows, tendrils of darkness...but if I'm not investing into Intimidate, it feels like a tax for something I probably won't be using to get to the fun stuff...then again, that might just be me, since I usually prefer Diplomacy and Bluff, saving Intimidate for debuff builds. I dunno, if it's a balance thing, I'll accept it, it's just something that's bothered me when making some binders/pactmakers in the past.
I can agree here, however it does definitely seem as if it were used as a balancing option. I really like those abilities you've listed, but I've never built a character around intimidation. Just not for me. But, since it seems to be a balance thing, it is what it is.
That said, I'm definitely happy that Ghost Touch was officially added to the Occult Weapon list. Granted, you still have to select it when binding the spirit you're switching out its bond for, which makes it far less versatile, but, having some way to deal with incorporeal, even if they don't often come up, is very nice to have anyways. Because screw Wraiths, Shadows and Ghosts. They can be mean.
Totemic Sage: Bind Spirit and Totemic Alignment both replace your 4th level rage power.
Ballad of the Tall Man: Five things:
There's a weird spacing error between "within" and "30 feet", presumably caused by the picture.
The flavour text says you cause one target to be unable to see you, but in fact it's one per bard level. It would be good to clarify whether you become visible if you attack, etc, like with Invisibility. Just adding "(as Invisibility)" or "(as Greater Invisibility)" should do. Granted, it takes a full round action so you'll have some trouble attacking but AoOs could still trigger, for instance.
Does the performance involve singing and/or orating? The skill requirements would imply that, but it doesn't explicitly say so, and obviously whether you have to make a noise or not is kind of important for an invisibility effect.
Finally, the power seems kind of weak: you have to spend your full round action every round to use it, right? Or have I misunderstood the rules for masterpieces?
Occult Avenger: Avenger's Grit refers to Panache
Seal Edged Pactmaker: "At 11th level, she can either increase the bonus one pact augmentation provided by +2 or increase the bonus that two pact augmentations provide by +1." Provided should be provides?
"At 17th level, she can either increase the bonus one pact augmentation provides by +3, increase the bonus that three pact augmentations provides by..." The second provides should be provide.
Also, I feel that there should be a quicker way to explain this rule. And would it be better to double, triple, etc the normal bonus? Otherwise it ends up rather imbalanced between the pact augmentations, giving anything from half a trait (if applies to initiative) to an entire feat equivalent (if applied to the dodge bonus to AC) and more. Fortification and Fleet are even worse off, getting a +1% chance to negate a critical and +1 foot of speed.
On the other hand, doubling will cause issues for things like Invulnerability, or if you take certain augmentations multiple times. Hmm...
Unbound Pactmaker: Loses the ability to select Compression at 4th level, and scent and swim at 16th. Or a lot of options are unnecessarily included in multiple lists, if the higher level selections are intended to be additional choices.
Also, you're told to select a type of animal when making the pact, but this seems to be unnecessary as the only thing you do with it is choose one of the abilities from the list (which the animal possesses). Since the appearance of the mutation is up to the player, your choice of animal makes no difference whatsoever to your character, provided the animal has the ability you're taking. All the rule means is that you have to comb through the bestiary trying to find an animal with the ability you're looking for.
Rogue: Disrupting Offensive doesn't specify how much the DC is increased by.
Demon Eye Exemplar feat: Misshapen Arm is formatted incorrectly.
Occult Infusion feat: "If you prepare spells in advanced"
Page 71, Under Demon Eye Exemplar, the Misshapen Arm option should be highlighted in red, and its in normal black.
Page 88, Under Starless Spirits. The first sentence says there are 14 constellations, plus starless. Should be 13 (as far as I know).
I love the art, BTW, it was worth the wait.
Page 16, under Ectoplasmic Resonance it says "and effects do not
cause damage do not have a reduced chance to effect an incorporeal
opponent." Not sure what's trying to be said here. Pretty sure just a grammar error.
Greensprout Rapscallion, Page 300.
Under the Greensprout Pact, the last sentence reads:
"Once this decision is made, it cannot be changed (except by the seasons of youth greensprout trick)."
That trick is actually called Shades of Youth. Also, I believe it should be in italics in the text.
Page 356 - Aging Effects.
Last sentence of the first paragraph reads, "An aging effect can reduce a creature’s ability scores below 1."
Should that be "can not"?
Circe's Runes: first, the minor granted abilities section is labeled major; second, on the page listing the runes themselves, the division between major and minor spells has no obvious purpose.
@Luthorne Great write-up for Chapter 1--I'll finish up the archetypes I was looking at and compare to your list so I don't repeat anything.
Some comments regarding what I've been reading so far (somewhat all over the place, really):
- The archetypes are really solid, balanced and with unique flavor. Also, you can still have a self-hating Pactsworn Assassin. :D
- The lore engulfing the book, from spirit legends to minor descriptions, is wonderful.
- Again, the artwork and style are amazing--really great job!
Circe's Runes
- Vesgtigial Bond: "...and can bypass a rune of Circe without setting it off." This is confusing, as "Rune of Circe" grants spell-like abilities, and only one of two of those can be set off (alarm, explosive runes) and they already have conditions to designate those who can bypass them. Maybe your runes could act as if affected by the Selective Spell metamagic feat for those chosen instead?
- Table 4-2: Circe's Runes: It looks like the Rune for "Spider" and "Tongue" have been switched from what they were in the previous PDF. (I'm assuming the rune for "Spider" should be the one with eight legs.)
[Mechanics]
I tried looking through the old feedback thread, and couldn't find the answer to this question.
Can you use Seance of Circe to evict a spirit that you bound using Seance of Circe? (It acts as if you had used Expel Spirit and spirits bound using Seance of Circe cannot be ended using Expel Spirit.)
Page 161, False Alignment, Sentence 3: You should be your
Page 163, Woodland Strike should be woodland stride
Page 171, Crocadile Heritage: The presented formula (for natural armor bonus) looks wrong, ending at level 25, rather than 20.
Overall, I really like what I've read so far. Good job.
Page 121 - Humble Ohbal has two sections named "Major Granted Abilities"
Page 179 - Same thing for Circe's Runes
Page 257 - Under the Negate Death Major Ability, "You completely nullify one harmful effects as an immediate action". That should probably be singular. XD
Page 196, Under legend, it says "On the day of his coordination", I think it should be coronation.
Page 198, Etheric Step, says its a standard action twice in the same sentence.
One thing I do kind of want to complain about a little is the seal of living darkness binder secret, or more accurately, how many neat binder secrets use it as a prerequisite that I want on non-Intimidate builds. Horrid skean, shade step, shroud of shadows, tendrils of darkness...but if I'm not investing into Intimidate, it feels like a tax for something I probably won't be using to get to the fun stuff...then again, that might just be me, since I usually prefer Diplomacy and Bluff, saving Intimidate for debuff builds. I dunno, if it's a balance thing, I'll accept it, it's just something that's bothered me when making some binders/pactmakers in the past.
You need the seal of darkness to essentially "summon" all of those cool shadowy powers. Put another way, the seal of darkness "secret tree" is all of the old war shade abilities compiled. They need to be tiered because of their power level. (They're REALLY good for secrets, as you seem to have noticed.)
Also, the reason that there are a bunch of stories that aren't in Chapter 4 is that traditionally (see PMU 1 and 2 and SoPM and VoPM) we use the stories as sort of "filler pages" for other chapters. They break up sections that are rules-heavy and round out chapters that needed more content. Its a conscious choice that we've been doing for years.
Does the performance involve singing and/or orating? The skill requirements would imply that, but it doesn't explicitly say so, and obviously whether you have to make a noise or not is kind of important for an invisibility effect.
Its creepy singing / orating, but it doesn't interfere with the invisibility. Think of it as "ominous background music."
Finally, the power seems kind of weak: you have to spend your full round action every round to use it, right? Or have I misunderstood the rules for masterpieces?
They're like bardic performances—maintained as a free action once its started unless noted otherwise.
I tried looking through the old feedback thread, and couldn't find the answer to this question.
Can you use Seance of Circe to evict a spirit that you bound using Seance of Circe? (It acts as if you had used Expel Spirit and spirits bound using Seance of Circe cannot be ended using Expel Spirit.)
Nope. That's specifically why the sentence is there—to prevent endless spirit cycling.
I am updated up to this point! Dario will DROWN in fixes when he returns from vacation! (Keep'em coming!)
Page 80 - Shield Against the Supernatural isn't highlighted the way other feat names are.
Page 81 - Supernatural Slayer's flavor text should be italicized.
Nope. That's specifically why the sentence is there—to prevent endless spirit cycling.I tried looking through the old feedback thread, and couldn't find the answer to this question.
Can you use Seance of Circe to evict a spirit that you bound using Seance of Circe? (It acts as if you had used Expel Spirit and spirits bound using Seance of Circe cannot be ended using Expel Spirit.)
That's what I thought, but I wanted to make sure.
Due to those restrictions, that would mean Circe's Runes's major can be used a maximum of <Number of bound spirits> times per week (-1 if you can't expel her). If you use her major you're also locked into a poor pact with a spirit for a week with either no limited-use abilities or half uses for limited-use abilities for its entire duration.
While the associated penalties are balanced for what the ability gives you (and balanced vs. Expel Spirit), the week-long pact duration seems a bit harsh. It changes her ability from "emergency" to "only as a very last resort," which feels weird as a major. Even other situational-use majors aren't as limited (or even if they are, they don't have the penalties).
It seems like a 24-hour pact duration would be sufficient?
Granted, I'd still bind her for Rune of Circe and Circe's Fury, but I'd try to avoid using her major if possible.
Also, can you use Seance of Circe on Circe's Runes?
Also, can you use Seance of Circe on Circe's Runes?
Yes.
And Circe is very much an exception to how most spirits function. Her real "powers" are her spell-like abilities and other granted abilities, whereas her major is very much an, "Oh snap!" button that you're likely not going to want to use.
And Circe is very much an exception to how most spirits function. Her real "powers" are her spell-like abilities and other granted abilities, whereas her major is very much an, "Oh snap!" button that you're likely not going to want to use.
Ah, I understand--the mechanics are a perfect fit, then. It makes her a prime candidate for Reweave Spellcasting, Undying Aid, or other features that replace/expend a spirit's Major Granted Ability. :)
So, I actually had a question involving Circe's Runes now that it's been brought up, and maybe this was answered already and I simply missed it.
Under the Boon it says those linked can "bypass" a rune of Circe without setting it off. But under the Rune of Circe ability, it simply allows you to cast them as spell-like abilities and says nothing of turning them into actual runes of any kind.
Are they cast as normal spells (through spell-like ability)? Or are they spell-like runes one simply leaves about? And if the latter, how does that work with things like the major from the Door rune, the major from the Dowser Rune and such? Essentially, what does the boon mean by, "Setting it off" or "Bypassing" them?
Also, another side question since I don't have bestiary 1, how many skeletons are in a troupe of skeleton? I can't seem to find it online.
page 207, Legend. Says "After three wars and a twice as many centuries"
remove "a"
page 214, Second Head, Should be higlighted in red and isnt. Also, as a personal thought, requiring wish or miracle to remove curse available at level 11 seems really nasty, especially since most of those curses would wreck a character.
page 215 Serapith's Protection: While you are bound to Serapith,
you gain a +1 deflection bonus to your AC and a +2 resistance
bonus on saving throws for every 4 binder levels you possess,
to a maximum bonus of +5.
Do the save bonuses go to +10 or only only +5. Its worded in a confusing way that many GMs would rule against. Maybe say "to a maximum bonus of +5 and +10"
page 216, Legend. says "he is decapitated one of the king’s most skilled knights", should be "decapitated by one of the"
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So, I actually had a question involving Circe's Runes now that it's been brought up, and maybe this was answered already and I simply missed it.
Under the Boon it says those linked can "bypass" a rune of Circe without setting it off. But under the Rune of Circe ability, it simply allows you to cast them as spell-like abilities and says nothing of turning them into actual runes of any kind.
No idea. Expect it deleted.
Also, another side question since I don't have bestiary 1, how many skeletons are in a troupe of skeleton? I can't seem to find it online.
13. (Both sent to Dario.)
Page 377: "Willian Ashley" - that should be William, please. :)