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Folks remember a few other things.
First there is no right or wrong here. There are just opinions.
Second our Gm has hinted that something is about to happen.
Third Some people are not even citizens. No reason to stay.
Fourth Brevoy is on the brink of civil war. Minor things can be the last straw. Last but not least. For many many people religion is very important. A change in the political views have always led to consequences. England between Elizabeth and mary stewart. We as players have diffrent views but our characters may not. This is not bad at all, in fact it makes the story just better
Points 2-5 ('Last' being #5): applause. :P :) Do not, as they say, throw yourself onto your sword before the messenger has even gotten to the castle gates.
Point #1: always hated this, because it's as blatantly black and white as so many of the arguments that precede it. I agree that there is no 'One True Way' to RP; there are many, many, many different good roleplaying styles. So there is no 'right way' to play. However, there are wrong ways to play, and throwing yourself onto your sword in sour-grapes protest before the messenger has even gotten to the castle gates is a good example.
My personal creed has always been 'know your subject matter'. Wikipedia sure as hell helps these days, even with just a casual scan; if you treat the king like you would your RL country's leader (US for a lot of us ... well, okay, maybe not the Australian Prime Minister, those guys get up to some seriously weird hijinks ... Queen of England? Emperor of Japan?), his guards like the Secret Service or whatever is appropriate for you, and the nobility like, well, nobility or other high officials (for the US, maybe senators, cabinet secretaries, and supreme court justices?) then you probably won't go too far off the mark.
Just remember that the King's Guards are probably the only armed people in the room - because WE weren't to be armed, not EVERYONE wasn't to be armed, and what use is a Kingsguard without a weapon? - and without your armor, most of you are sporting ACs of 10-14 at best. At 7th level, we may be becoming forces to be reckoned with, but we aren't there yet ...
Its ok I'm from NZ so you can mock Australia's PM all you like, full support. You can also mock our PM as well for that matter, Kiwi's are pretty relaxed about that sort of thing.
As far as learning subject material, fully support that, although I try to keep my PC's personal motivations firmly in mind. For instance, I know that antagonising a powerful player in Rudolf is probably a bad idea on Ishana's part (and she probably knows that herself, with her reasonable intelligence), but under the circumstances, it was perfectly IC for her to do so regardless. Then again, I might be playing Ishana a little bit recklessly as she has the advantage of magic should things get tricky.
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Point #1: always hated this, because it's as blatantly black and white as so many of the arguments that precede it. I agree that there is no 'One True Way' to RP; etc
I learned a long time ago while working with two sides of racial ethnecies in conflict that in the end I have to accept a live and live mentally. Otherwis that this can lead from a minor misunderstanding to major conflict. For the sake of a better story I won't join in. We can have a purly theoretical discussion via email, but not here, please. I have heard some good arguments, some bad( again in my opinion) but I am here to tell a story. And every good story needs some conflict.
Some are between people, some between one in himself. Think of Boromir in LotR, Tyrion in GoT, or Durzo in the Nightbringer. Let us tell the story!
I learned a long time ago while working with two sides of racial ethnecies in conflict that in the end I have to accept a live and live mentally. Otherwis that this can lead from a minor misunderstanding to major conflict. For the sake of a better story I won't join in. We can have a purly theoretical discussion via email, but not here, please. I have heard some good arguments, some bad( again in my opinion) but I am here to tell a story. And every good story needs some conflict.
I concur here. I just woke up and wanted to read the new threads on the discussion hoping that it was about the story lines....I wish I could open a bottle of wine at 7AM.
I agree with some and disagree with others that is the way things are. I do not and will not force my point of view on to anyone. People do not always agree with the actions of others. Please just agree to disagree.
I have seen this happen in other campaigns where player A does something that Player B, C and D do not like or agree with
Players B, C and D go on an extended rant about what it is Player A did and why it is wrong. This would go on and on and then (which in my OWN opinion) players B, C and D start to tell Player A how he should play his own character. This is followed up with paragraphs of the rules, quotes, and then the dissecting of Player A's own words.
1 This is a game
2 This is still a game and it should be fun and if you are not having fun, go play checkers then.
3 The GM/DM is the only GOD in the game. They know the story lines and no matter what we as players do, we will never know as much as they do. So we should not try to dictate where a story line is going. We do not know how things are going to turn out or what happened before to lead up to this point.
4 In the end this is still a game.
Everyone made their points..some are valid and some are not
The individual player has created their own character and they will know how their own character would react to a situation. They have that power and no one else.
This is the discussion thread and it is being used as such. I just would like to see it not get out of hand. Let us move forward and allow the GM to run his own game.
Yeah I already said rulers don't define a kingdom or their people. I don't think much else needs to be said on that little topic. Not from me anyways. :)
It seems to me like the king knows his position pretty well. He has a title but little else. No real land settled, no army, no people, and no truly loyal support sense all or perhaps most of his people basically came from a family member who is gambling that he can make a puppet kingdom for his own advantage. It's a smart move to get us in his camp and in a way absorb us.
That creates a counter balance to his own families investments and reputation. Forces he can play off of each other as needed to get his intended results without having to "pick a side" as it were. Looks like he is trying to jump that first big hurdle with a political marriage. That's my take on it.
I can't speak for anyone else but Aolis, he is not chaotic but firmly neutral good in his actions. Even if it looks differently on the outside, which we should all know if never even half the picture. Which is sort of the vibe I get from everything between the King and Amavin. Their is a good deal more depth to it on both sides in my opinion. I am more interested in a wait and see approach with maybe a little meddling, cause that's how you find out things you shouldn't know. ;)
P.S. Good overviews of Lawful Good and Chaotic Good to me. Makes Amavin look pretty mellow for her alignment so far.
Yeah that would be my assessment as well RE Amavin's alignment. Amavin is largely CG due to Ishana's influence, its not hard to see her shifting to NG in future under the right circumstances, but yeah, her CG alignment was downplayed a little bit since I felt it suited her character a little more and made her more approachable as someone that favours diplomacy. Obviously, it hasn't worked out that way, but that was the general idea behind her at the time.
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Yeah I already said rulers don't define a kingdom or their people. I don't think much else needs to be said on that little topic. Not from me anyways. :)
l'etat, c'est moi. And a LOT of histories other rulers might not agree. Granted most rulers rulership didn't survives his own death, often hasted by his own subjects because of his deeds, they had a LOT of control while it lasted. And some rulerships lasted for generations, because of his absolutistic and ruthless rules. Example Tokugawas in japan, or some of the egyptian, persion ones. ;-)
The successor of a well-liked and good ruler would be wise to maintain the policies of his predecessor - if only to enjoy the same popularity. That's another way that a ruler's legacy can outlive him.
Corsario, I'm sending you a PM with a couple of things. Questions and the like.
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Ok, trying to ease the things here.
- The long way plan is for all the characters to work together. No two "friendly competing" kingdoms side-by-side, no two warring ones. If your character is not able to compromise and play nice with the other kids in the sandlot, I strongly recommend you change it ASAP so he can.
- There won't be a king, queen, religion or laws that ALL of the characters think are the best. There will always be some of the characters that won't quite like something. So they will need to compromise and tolerate, or they will "pack their things and go live elsewhere", which for us means "leaving the campaign". I have not finished checking characters and whatnot, so if your character is unable to compromise and will leave please let me know so I don't spend more time checking it.
- I am afraid some of you are jumping the gun here. There are A LOT OF STUFF still to happen before you need to worry about the wedding. And that is if the wedding EVER take place. Ever heard of the The Milkmaid and Her Pail?
omg... I miss ONE day and there are over 50 posts between discussion and gameplay... I'm almost kinda glad I missed the discussion blowup because I hate these kinds of discussions... would much rather just play my character.
Anyway - on to read the gameplay thread now.
Oh, and I am swamped here and posting will probably be sporadic until Sunday night. I am between two sunday deadlines with a BOATLOAD of things to finish by next Sunday. I have no choice but to complete certain tasks by then. (Being freelance has its perks but also it's downsides.)
Sorry for any missed rp until this is over... no slights are intended.
-Azrael and Hareth
Aolis, are you including PCs in that sweep? Cause, uh, my ears are kinda pointy...
Feel free to get you POINT across to Aolis.
I know I feel dirty after that pun it was so bad. Anyways PCs are welcome to the sweep. :)
Aren't you the one looking? :P But besides Aramil, Ishana (Amavin's cohort) is an elf, Alysandra's a half-elf, as are two members of the Couriers, Alexander (if he's actually still around posting ... ??) and Azrael's cohort, Hareth.
Plus there's two independents you've yet to talk to, Coalhouse and Merus.
Aolis is done intruding.....for now. So giving you guys the option of being picked up on during his looking over of the crowd. Let me know here or IC if you prefer. Otherwise just going to wait on the DM to see if anything stands out. ;)
Point of clarification, all PCs and cohorts are invited to the king's meeting?
PCs only.
I also got the sense that the halfling Verisisi was reasonably discreet in passing out the messages; certainly the one he gave to Coalhouse was passed via spy-style handshake. So I'd presume unless Axhammer gets a spectacularly good perception roll (natural 20, perhaps, because he's got a +0 and might have to beat that DC 25 Sleight of Hand by Coalhouse) he'll only notice the one he was slipped.
Actually, I just realized that Axhammer's first post has him talking to Coalhouse as if the half-orc were still there. Coalhouse hasn't been there for a while, since Alysandra retrieved him and they moved off to mingle, Coalhouse to the Aldori, Alysandra to the Lord Mayor.
In game terms, the Paladin-plus-Coalhouse conclave was Social Round 1; Coal left and went to talk to the Aldori in Social Round 2; we're in Social Round 3 now, when the notes are distributed ...
...and neat, it looks like Christian invented 'klicks' as a private combat range, and the phonetic alphabet as a semi-private language, so that only his cohort and followers could understand the distances and points involved. Do the rest of the Coursers and their followers know it too?
BTW Dagit, you realize that Selina leaving even before dinner would be a severe insult to the host, right? Just sayin'.
Dagit, she couldn't already ... ? Okay. :P
And I know what you mean, Axhammer, but I've played HERO System for too long to not be comfortable with it. I think in Imperial, alas, and have to convert to metric, but still ...
I hate my auto correct..klicks.
I was in the Army and yes I am using my limited knowledge of the military for this character...lol
In our history correct, in a fantasy world who knows what they had...it is fantasy after all...lol
The default is to go off RL history, unless written otherwise.
So many posts... My recovery is going well but my brain is still too drug-addled to be able to read through all these posts (and follow them). Like I said before, feel free to bot me as necessary and I'll try to start posting as soon as I can.
Sorry for the back to back post, needed to give Sacha a little face time. On a side note, that was a productive 3rd round. Got a job application from a spy/assassin, let's see how the interview portion goes later on. ;)
Sometimes I wish the Diplomacy rules were not so restrictive, not that it doesn't work in our favor sometimes. But then again it's not worth the price of nuttiness that could come of it. Aw well, at the time I did not know we would be meeting the king a second time, the result was good anyways so hopefully it will due. ;)
@Amavin
That's why we have labtops and tablets. But really just keep a box of tissues, a waste basket, and a lot of water near by. It will pass, even if it feels otherwise. Personally I find a nice long hot bath when I'm sick makes me feel better by leaps over pure bed rest for some strange reason. Get better.
Yeah, but due to my circumstances, having a laptop next to me had been unwise. A bowl maybe, but something I just recently spend some money on, I'll keep at a safe distance :)
Still, things are improving a little, I'm mostly dealing with after-effects now, and asthma complications. I'm prolly 80% and expect to be 100% in a couple of days, most likely. Hot baths are really useful :)
Dagit, just in case you missed it, that was effectively 'swear fealty or leave'. Leaving = leaving the game.
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Dagit did swear... he just didn't say it directly.
Effectively he said "as long as the gods will it" in other words as long as Dagit is alive. He will continue to work until the gods deside that Dagit's time has come, if the king didn't get that then he is pretty dull... perhaps I did explain a little oddly...
He ENTIRELY 'got it', but it doesn't look like you bothered to read the king's reply, or the one he gave Axhammer before you.
The room fells silent as Rupert frowns.
"And who decides if the gods will it? I requiere a swear of fealty from you, not from your gods. If you are unable to do it, leave and let those you are willing go with me to fulfill our destiny, and I hope your gods grant you something good elsewhere."
As with Axhammer, the room and Rupert feel silent.
"If you are unable or unwilling to swear fealty to my house, and can only wish for your gods to help me, I thank you for your good wishes and bid you goodbye, and good luck whenever else your destiny takes you, which won't be in my kingdom."
Translated from Diplomatic: "Don't effin' waffle. Swear your personal oath directly to me, or go somewhere else." That means no 'so long as the gods will it'; it means 'Come Hell or high water, I will go down fighting tooth and nail to make your dream come true.'
Edit after the double-post: And you're still effectively waffling. I suggest you delete both your posts, or at least the second one, then edit the first one to apologize, then rewrite it to say something like "I misspoke. I swear my oath to you for so long as the gods give me breath," or something of the sort.
Personally, I wouldn't allow it to 'suffice with staying on'; you didn't swear. A natural 20 is fine, but it can, after all, be beaten. And you're still effectively waffling.
I suggest you delete both your posts, or at least the second one, then rewrite the first one to say something like "I misspoke. I swear my oath to you for so long as the gods give me breath," or something of the sort.
Yeah, we get that, and that's what you said, and I gotta admit, if I were playing any sort of 'sacred character' I'd probably have done the same thing, so I really DO appreciate it as good RP. :)
But look at it from the Surtova's point of view. Kings who aren't also priests tend to be a bit wary of the god-touched saying what might effectively mean 'as long as you're doing fine I'll stay, but the minute it gets tough I'm outta here, buddy' - because they have no way of 'checking up' on what you claim the god(s) are telling you. :/