Wizard 18...let's get quadratic!


Advice


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

So one of the rotating pool of GMs in my group has decided that he wants to run a mini-campaign when it's his turn again. For this, he's asked us all to make 18th-level characters. As soon as I heard this, I jumped on playing the wizard.

While he hasn't set out our ability score point-buy (I think it'll be 25, though), he has said that we'll have our standard WBL values, and that all first-party materials (e.g. anything published by Paizo) will be allowed.

So what I want to do is use this as a chance to run the sort of wizard that's always talked about in whenever the caster-martial disparity comes up as a topic. To that end, I wanted to ask what the best - or at least, most classic - options are out there for this. Off the top of my head, I recall the following:

Traits: Magical Lineage seems to be obvious here (though what metamagic feats are worthwhile is another matter). I'm less sold on Wayang Spellhunter, simply because I'm not at all sure what specific 3rd-level-or-below spell to pick.

Feats: Using two or more item creation feats seems like a no-brainer, what with the whole adjust their WBL upwards by 50% if they have two or more item creation feats guideline.

Spells: Traditionally, using create demiplane and astral projection in conjunction get brought up a lot. There's also greater planar ally and simulacrum (though the latter never made much sense to me, since it's at one-half the creature's Hit Dice, so in this case it'd be a 9th-level wizard). Obviously blood money is on the list.

Those are the ones that immediately come to mind; what else should I be looking at?


Alzrius wrote:

So one of the rotating pool of GMs in my group has decided that he wants to run a mini-campaign when it's his turn again. For this, he's asked us all to make 18th-level characters. As soon as I heard this, I jumped on playing the wizard.

While he hasn't set out our ability score point-buy (I think it'll be 25, though), he has said that we'll have our standard WBL values, and that all first-party materials (e.g. anything published by Paizo) will be allowed.

So what I want to do is use this as a chance to run the sort of wizard that's always talked about in whenever the caster-martial disparity comes up as a topic. To that end, I wanted to ask what the best - or at least, most classic - options are out there for this. Off the top of my head, I recall the following:

Traits: Magical Lineage seems to be obvious here (though what metamagic feats are worthwhile is another matter). I'm less sold on Wayang Spellhunter, simply because I'm not at all sure what specific 3rd-level-or-below spell to pick.

Feats: Using two or more item creation feats seems like a no-brainer, what with the whole adjust their WBL upwards by 50% if they have two or more item creation feats guideline.

Spells: Traditionally, using create demiplane and astral projection in conjunction get brought up a lot. There's also greater planar ally and simulacrum (though the latter never made much sense to me, since it's at one-half the creature's Hit Dice, so in this case it'd be a 9th-level wizard). Obviously blood money is on the list.

Those are the ones that immediately come to mind; what else should I be looking at?

Flagged to be moved to advice; this isn't really a rules question. Just asking for some opinions on how to make a build.


Since you're starting at a high level, I recommend either a Summoning specialist or a Blaster with Dazing and other riders on it. The awesome part of being a Wizard is that you can be both of those things without giving up any utility. If you specialize in one spell (say, Summon Monster or Chain Lightning) you can take Preferred Spell.

Summoning Wizards are easy to build (take the Acadamae Graduate trait and stack up Summoning feats, including Spell Perfection on Summon Monster). It's a bit harder to make a good blaster, Brewer's Guide is still a good starting point.


You may try something from this list:

Pretend you are mythic:

1) Get a Staff of the Master
2) Get Ascendant Spell (or paragon surge it if you are an half-elf)
3) Cast some spells as if you were mythic. Notable examples are haste (additional move action per turn) and contingency (you can target other people, on touch). Your team will love them.
4) Profit
Note: You'll need to recharge the staff and it's quite slow.

Economy flood:

1) Learn Fabricate and Blood Money
2) Use them together to produce stuff from nothing
3) Sell your new stuff
4) Profit
Note: This produces an infinite amount of wealth. Local/Global/Planar economy is going to have problems (Producing a million of swords may sound cool, but it's not funny if you are a mundane smith).

Herculean strength:

1) Get Expanded Summon Monster (or paragon surge it if you are an half-elf)
2) Cast SMIX and summon a great, white whale
3) Cast Anthropomorphic Animal on said whale
4) Magic Jar/Marionette Possession/Other variants said creature
5) With a strength of 52, you can blood money a Wish
6) Profit
Note: You can cast spells for free (with preparation). If you manage to touch 38 intelligence (18 base + 2 race (choose a good race) + 4 level + 6 headband + 4 lilitu + 3 age (age resistance or get reincarnated) + 1 wish = 38), you'll be able to cast 6 spells per day (assuming you are a conjuration specialist, otherwise you'll have to level up or get a scroll of wish), or SMIX and 5 wishes, to give yourself a +5 bonus on each ability score. Summon something that can heal the strength damage.

Parasite living:

1) Get Parasitic Soul
2) Once in a while, change your body with a better one
Note: you may become evil

Illusory, magical army:

1) Get Simulacrum and Blood Money
2) Start mass producing copies of whatever you like
3) Remember that they only have half of a lot of stuff
4) Realize that some abilities don't rely on HD (Apostate Devil boundless reach it's fantastic) and neither do Spell-like Abilities
5) Profit
Note: You have to know what are your trying to create, invest in knowledge.

Hope it helps.


Don't forget to permanancied all of it yourself. All of it. Whether you think you'll use it or not, if you can't think of a reason it's more harm than good, use your infinite munnies to make yourself a walking, glowing example of flesh-to-spell. Get as many of each ioun stone as can stack, such that you can trade off fancy glowing rocks as desired.


I read that title and now I'm singing it in my head to the tune of "Let's Get Retarded" by Black Eyed Peas. Let's get quadratic... let's get quadratic in here...


Item Creation Feats: Craft Wondrous Items, Craft Rod.
Makes those headbands cheaper, and really makes that rod of quicken (greater) available. You don't use armor, so Craft Arms and Armor is of little use to you. Craft Construct could be nice.

Remember, stat belts & headbands are NOT limited to +6.

Other Feats: Leadership. Get minions to do it for you.

If you go Witch instead, get the Coven hex, and go wild with minions augmenting your caster level when you apply permanency to spells. Also, at 18th, you get Grand Hex, including the following: Forced Reincarnation (my favorite), and Summon Spirit (Grab any 18th level caster you want, as per planar ally).

Be sure to pay attention to high level class features. Unfortunately, too many happen at 20th, but some come early like the Witch's above.

Crank up your SR, as you will likely be out of easy reach of martials, and can usually have things to make them less likely to hit. [Greater Invisibility, Blur, Wind Wall, Fly, Mirror Image, ...]

Ioun Stones can be quite nice, as can their resonant powers.

Ring of Spell Turning is quite nice. As are Perls of Power.

/cevah


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Some very great suggestions so far! Thanks for these!

I'm trying to figure out if there's any particular reason I can't create a simulacrum, then cast astral projection, and have the astral body possess the simulacrum via magic jar, giving me at-will bodies that, when killed, cause me only mild inconvenience. Is there any particular reason that combination wouldn't work (or otherwise be disadvantageous)?

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

want blasting ability?

0) Blood Money to make spells free
1) Create a demiplane
2) fill it with Simulacra of yourself
3) craft a ring gate to your demiplane
4) send a simulacrum on adventures for you; mount one ring on its chest
5) mount the other on a wall in your demiplane that all the simulacra have to stand in front of during adventures
6) in combat have the simulacra simultaneously cast 100 or so empowered 9th level fireballs or lightning bolts through the gate
7) profit.
8) permanent telepathic bond between the simulacrum wearing the ring and your actually character so that if things go south you can teleport in to save the day


metamagic: persistent, quicken, extend
spell perfection, (Greater)Spell Penetration, (Greater)Spell focus
Staff of the master or 5

If you want a new body, use polymorph any object on a Diplodocus to turn it into... anything you want really. Then use extended greater possession and enjoy your 200+ hitpoints and 40 strength. Just refresh the greater possession every morning.


Alzrius wrote:

So one of the rotating pool of GMs in my group has decided that he wants to run a mini-campaign when it's his turn again. For this, he's asked us all to make 18th-level characters. As soon as I heard this, I jumped on playing the wizard.

While he hasn't set out our ability score point-buy (I think it'll be 25, though), he has said that we'll have our standard WBL values, and that all first-party materials (e.g. anything published by Paizo) will be allowed.

So what I want to do is use this as a chance to run the sort of wizard that's always talked about in whenever the caster-martial disparity comes up as a topic. To that end, I wanted to ask what the best - or at least, most classic - options are out there for this. Off the top of my head, I recall the following:

Traits: Magical Lineage seems to be obvious here (though what metamagic feats are worthwhile is another matter). I'm less sold on Wayang Spellhunter, simply because I'm not at all sure what specific 3rd-level-or-below spell to pick.

Feats: Using two or more item creation feats seems like a no-brainer, what with the whole adjust their WBL upwards by 50% if they have two or more item creation feats guideline.

Spells: Traditionally, using create demiplane and astral projection in conjunction get brought up a lot. There's also greater planar ally and simulacrum (though the latter never made much sense to me, since it's at one-half the creature's Hit Dice, so in this case it'd be a 9th-level wizard). Obviously blood money is on the list.

Those are the ones that immediately come to mind; what else should I be looking at?

Depends what your wealth is. If normal WBL level, wizard. If you are 18th level naked on deserted island, Cleric is by far better.

Scarab Sages

What's really going to limit you is your spell selection - what spells are in your spellbook? If you have the time, you should really sit down with your GM and discuss how you'll determine that.

So at a minimum, you have:

- Your starting spells, including:
--- 3+Starting INT 1st level spells (probably 3 or 4)
--- all 0 level spells

- At least 34 additional self-researched spells, including
--- up to 4 9th level spells
--- up to 8 8th level spells (Minus the number of 9th level spells)
--- up to 12 7th level spells (Minus the number of 8-9th level spells)
--- up to 16 6th level spells (Minus the number of 7-9th level spells)
--- up to 20 5th level spells (Minus the number of 6-9th level spells)
--- up to 24 4th level spells (Minus the number of 5-9th level spells)
--- up to 28 3rd level spells (Minus the number of 4-9th level spells)
--- up to 32 2nd level spells (Minus the number of 3-9th level spells)
--- up to 34 additional 1st level spells (Minus the number of 2nd-9th level spells)

That sounds like a lot, but the spaces fill up fast. Beyond that, any spells you need will need to be from a purchased using your WBL.

- If you purchase the spell from a scroll, you still need to make a check to copy it to your book, which will depoend on the level it was copied at, etc. You'll need the GM to adjudicate that.

- If you do additional independent research, I believe the guide 1000 GP plus a week's study per spell level, but again it's up to your GM.

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