Hallucination- Perhaps an example of how Spell Heightening should work

[Siro]

I was looking through the spell section when I noticed something different about the 'Hallucination' spell. Most spells heighten version give you a set bonus for doing so [For example, casting 'Invisibility' at its 4th version allows you to act hostilely without losing it.}

However Hallucination gives you something different when you cast it at a higher level. It gives you choice in how the spell is heightened. For this particular spell, you have a choice to have the effect last longer {if your casting it at 6th level, you can increase the duration from 1 hour to 1 day} or have it affect more creatures {casting it 6th level, you can increase the targets from 1 creature to 10.). And I kinda of want to see this on more spells. I love the idea of having choice in how you heighten the spell {both from a gameplay, and roleplay perspective)

Think about something like this for the aforementioned 'Invisibility' spell. You can choose the original effect, or perhaps you can choose to be invisible to another sense in addition to sight {hearing, smell, heat, life, ect.) From a roleplay perspective I like the idea that when your using more power for the spell {and assumingly having better expertise in how it works because you are a higher level), you can choose what that additional power goes to, in this case either by fixing a flaw with the spell, or adding another aspect to it. From a gameplay perspective I like the idea of choice in spells, as you can be more strategic with them, and bring about more situations that can lead to difficult choices. (For example, say a Wizard is facing off against a Ranger and her Bloodhound. The wizard can use original option of the Heighten Invisibility to stay invisible even when attacking, but the Bloodhound can sniff her out. She may instead use the second option to become invisible both in sight and scent, allowing her to stay hidden from both creatures, but breaks when she attacks.) It can also give a spell new uses, with the price being the spell uses a higher resource {as heightening already does}

Of course, there maybe balancing issues that would have to be addressed if something like this became more common. {Not getting into 'Spells are too Nerfed in PF2/Spells needed to be Nerfed' argument here.) But when you give a spell more options in what it can do, you make it more powerful because of it, as you can then apply it to more situations then before. Let take the Invisibility example above. The limited duration of the spell hampers its ability to be used for Stealth {generally limited to small quick sections.) However, by adding the option to render you invisible to both sight and sound, it increase its use for Stealth, as you can move quicker because you no longer have to worry about noise. So a spell that may have only gotten you into the doorway of the jail cell to free an ally, now gets you all the way into the guard room.

Anyways sorry about the ramblings, and I would love any of your guys thoughts on the idea.

[Vali Nepjarson]

There's actually a lot of cool ideas that seem underutilized in the Playtest. I presume because they want to see how we like the ideas before they apply them to more things across the board.

Personally, I like how Heal, Harm, and Magic Missile can be adjusted based on how many actions you use when casting it, and I think that this should be applied more often.

Hallucination, giving you different options when heightening it, is another great example, which could be very useful.

Using Haste as an example, since it is one of the most divisive spells in the Playtest, with people either loving or hating its across the board nerfs. I think it could be much more interesting using either of these principles.

Using the principle of Hallucination, Haste could heighten in a couple different ways. It could either, when heightened to spell level 7, be able to be applied to up to 5 targets, or could be super-charged into one Target so that they get both the baseline effect of gaining an extra action, but something else as well. Perhaps a +2 circumstance bonus to Reflex saves and AC, or maybe removing the limitation that the extra action must be used to only Stride or Strike.

Haste could also use the Heal/Magic Missile principle. Cast it using one action and it has a range of touch. Cast it using two actions and it has a range of 30 feet, exactly as is right now. But cast it using all three actions and it effects all targets of your choice within a 30 foot aura, but the duration drops from 1 minute to until the end of the target's next turn. Then when heightened it would add the +2 to AC and Relfex saves effect.

Basically, what I'm saying is that they need to play around with some of their more interesting ideas.

[Siro]

Vali Nepjarson wrote:

Personally, I like how Heal, Harm, and Magic Missile can be adjusted based on how many actions you use when casting it, and I think that this should be applied more often.

Hmm, your right. I knew that those types of spell were few, but I thought the pool was a bit larger then that. {guess because Magic Missile is an iconic spell, and Clerics will most likely to use the Heal and Harm spells regularly, that made the pool seem a bit bigger to me.) Yeah, I can also see that mechanic being implemented for other spells, make the spells more powerful, but at the cost of actions for it.

[Elleth]

Yeah that sounds fun.

Also seconding the "love how Magic Missile, Harm, and Heal work"