Tracking and Speed Consistency

[Barachiel Shina]

Alright, according to the Survival skill, we have this:

FOLLOW TRACKS: You move at half your normal speed while following tracks (or at your normal speed with a –5 penalty on the check, or at up to twice your normal speed with a –20 penalty on the check). The DC depends on the surface and the prevailing conditions, as given on the table.

So how does this function if, say, you're mounted?

For example, I have 30 ft. speed. If I move faster than 15 ft., I have a -5 penalty to track.

However, now I am mounted on a light horse with 60 ft. speed. I move 30 ft., I have no penalty. So why is it if I choose to move 30 ft. when unmounted I get the -5 penalty? What is it about a faster moving creature suddenly makes me better at tracking at 30 ft. than if I were to do it on foot...?

Or, let's go further, I now have boots of striding and springing, my speed is 40 ft. I can now move 20 ft. with no penalty, which is strange, because it was tough for me to move 20 ft. before without the penalty but now I can move faster it suddenly became easier...?

The ruling feels very nonsensical. This came up because last night one of the PCs got lost (a Magus), and two other PCs (a Wizard and Gunslinger) left to go track him down and find him. However, the lost PC was moving at normal speed while the other two (only one was trained in Survival with +14) would suffer a -5 penalty moving at the same speed, at which point they'd only catch up if the lost PC chose to stop for a very long time.

So the Wizard casted Phantom Steed, which has 100 ft. speed at the caster level he had. So that was when the question came up. How is it he can now travel and track with no penalty at 50 ft. speed, but were he to try that with the lower speed there's a big penalty?

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To solve this I think the speed should be static. Following tracks at 15 ft. is no penalty, with an additional -5 penalty for every doubling of the original speed (-5 at 30 ft., -10 at 45 ft., -15 at 60 ft., and so on).

[Bronnwynn]

It's amount of effort you put into moving, not the actual speed you travel.

[Dekalinder]

Think like this. During a chase, you search for clues 5-6 seconds, then move forward in the direction you found, then after a bit you stop to check again for new clues ecc. This averages at half searching time and half traveling time, so half speed on average, whatever your speed is.

[DM_Blake]

No penalty: you spend half your time moving and half your time searching around (not moving) looking for clues.
-5 penalty: you move normally and keep your eyes open for clues, might miss a few things.
-20 penalty: You run while looking for clues, might miss a lot of things.

With that in mind, riding a horse is the same thing but the horse just covers more ground while you do one of the above tracking options.

[Chess Pwn]

It doesn't really matter since you'll get there right when the GM wants you to anyways, regardless of how fast you go.

[Dekalinder]

Chess Pwn wrote:

It doesn't really matter since you'll get there right when the GM wants you to anyways, regardless of how fast you go.

Never waste skill points on the tracking skill. If it’s part of the plot, you’ll find it no matter what you roll. If it’s not part of the plot, then it doesn’t exist anyway.

[DM_Blake]

Chess Pwn wrote:

It doesn't really matter since you'll get there right when the GM wants you to anyways, regardless of how fast you go.

Dekalinder wrote:

Never waste skill points on the tracking skill. If it’s part of the plot, you’ll find it no matter what you roll. If it’s not part of the plot, then it doesn't exist anyway.

Both of these ideas are metagaming to an extreme. Many GMs, myself included, have little patience for such metagaming. Players who look at their characters as nothing more than a pile of statistics to be finely tuned to only those statistics that "beat the game" the fastest are not especially welcome at most ROLEPLAYING tables.

I, for one, make sure there are plenty of rewards for characters who use their skills. If I make it clear that they PCs need to act with urgency and they take their time, bad thing swill happen. I'll even torpedo the plot if the players are not taking it seriously.

For example, if you must track the footprints to follow the kidnappers who stole the princess, and you know they're traveling fast, you better not decide to move at half speed or the kidnappers will obviously get away. If you do that, the king will be furious, you'll be banished, or worse, and that plot line will fail. I'll even haunt you with it later, like when you're in the neighboring kingdom and someone important offers a quest, but then he recognizes you as the group who let the princess die so he refuses to give you the quest.

Likewise, if you must track those footprints at a faster speed but you have nobody who can track, well, good luck. You better be good at finding an alternative solution because this one won't work.

Now, to be fair, I wouldn't create a situation like this unless someone had points in Survival in the first place, but since he invested points in it, he'll get to use it and be the hero. Further, there might be times when it's useful as an extra bonus, such as the following:

GM: OK, the last monster is dead, here's your XP.
Player: We loot the monsters.
GM: they didn't seem to be carrying any treasure.
Player: Yeah, they probably have it in their lair. Let's find the lair.
GM: OK, track them back to their lair.
Player: None of us have any ranks in Survival.
GM: No problem, it's an everyman skill, give it a shot... Well, none of you rolled high enough so you have no idea where they came from. I guess this lair full of loot will be forever lost. Continue on your journey.

That use of tracking didn't disrupt the story, break the plot, or alter the tame in any way, except not having the skill means the PCs miss out on some deserved loot.

[Dekalinder]

@DM_Blake It's a joke taken from a satirical comic on the theme of railroading. Try laughing and you'll see it's going to make a lot more sense. There is no metagaming here, only sarcasm and hyperboli.

[DM_Blake]

Dekalinder wrote:

@DM_Blake It's a joke taken from a satirical comic on the theme of railroading. Try laughing and you'll see it's going to make a lot more sense. There is no metagaming here, only sarcasm and hyperboli.

Ahh, sarcasm. I laugh at sarcasm. Unfortunately, sarcasm is invisible on forum posts. Not only to me, but to anyone else reading this thread in the future.

I'm glad you were kidding. Some people actually do this. Your post might have encouraged more of it.