I am playing a Paladin in a Wrath of Righteous campaign. I reach level 7 next time we level up and am planning on taking Leadership. I've gotten GM approval to make my cohort a Lantern Archon. I've spent several hours tinkering with ideas for where to take the build once it starts gaining character levels and I'm coming up empty.
Low stats and no hands seem to eliminate all spellcasters. I'm thinking maybe just Paladin like me so I get extra healing and it'll have smite to up the occasional damage but this feels kinda boring. I will be taking Mythic Leadership so the Lantern Archon will get 5 Mythic Tiers of his own eventually.
Any ideas how I might turn a Lantern Archon into a decent utility NPC?
(Weird follow up question: Lantern Archons need to sleep, eat and breathe I take it, since nothing in their stat block says otherwise?)
Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ultimate2099 wrote: I am playing a Paladin in a Wrath of Righteous campaign. I reach level 7 next time we level up and am planning on taking Leadership. I've gotten GM approval to make my cohort a Lantern Archon. I've spent several hours tinkering with ideas for where to take the build once it starts gaining character levels and I'm coming up empty.
Low stats and no hands seem to eliminate all spellcasters. I'm thinking maybe just Paladin like me so I get extra healing and it'll have smite to up the occasional damage but this feels kinda boring. I will be taking Mythic Leadership so the Lantern Archon will get 5 Mythic Tiers of his own eventually.
Any ideas how I might turn a Lantern Archon into a decent utility NPC?
(Weird follow up question: Lantern Archons need to sleep, eat and breathe I take it, since nothing in their stat block says otherwise?)
Note their type.... Outsider. Look up the rules for the Outsider type.
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I'd recommend Bard. Turns him into a buff ball that also does all the knowledges, other thoughts would be skill monkey (mastermind investigator), or do a verbal only spellcaster. If you want to get truly silly, bring it as a master summoner for the express purpose of using the SLA to summon enough other archons to turn into Voltron.
My other serious suggestion (bard was the first) would be witch. Theses don't require hands.
The lack of hands is problematic but for somatic gestures, since they are just a series of gestures or motions It stands to reason that the archon would weave/shake/shimmy in mid air while casting for those components.
- Any class that gets an Animal Companion would be nice.
- Alchemist/Investigator doesn't require Somatic components.
- Skald would be a great buffer, and can cast heals & buffs (maybe your GM will let it use a special wand designed for it) for its standard actions in combat.
- This would probably suck, but you could take archery feats and specialize in the 'Light Ray' special attack.
- a Still Spell caster?
Expanding on my earlier post, a level 5 Witch (assuming you have a leadership score of 7), would get 3 hexes (up to 6 if you put all your feats into extra hex). Grabbing Evil Eye, Cackle, Aura of Purity, Fortune, Tongues, and Slumber would give you a solid debuffer that already flies and packs some nice utility to boot.
Rogue mayhaps? Dr ignoring ranged touch sneak attacks could be fun with a gaggle of skills.
Glutton wrote: Rogue mayhaps? Dr ignoring ranged touch sneak attacks could be fun with a gaggle of skills. Seems like a good one. Issue is they're ranged attacks, so it can't flank, and as a glow-blob it has trouble hiding and attacking from the shadows. Not sure if there is a way around this. Maybe concealment/hide via something like the blur spell? The rules are kind of vague.
You can also just increase their hit die as outsiders, I think.
You can also just ask your DM to let it cast without hands. I mean, it already can't wear MOST magic items and loses a buncha caster levels, who cares if it gets a little something extra?
Inquisitor. It has the same skill monkey uses as the rogue, but Judgements and Bane aren't hampered by being ranged.
Thanks for all the suggestions. two other suggestions I've been give by friends were fighter (to create a feat heavy harasser) or a synthesist summoner (for added durability). Do either of those seem viable? Could an archon synthesist still teleport and zap stuff?
Also, is it true that if my lantern archon cohort dies (which seems decidedly likely) that I'd need a True Ressurection or Wish to raise him? Anyone know how else I could get him back, preferably a lot cheaper.
According to the text Limited Wish works. That's as cheap as it gets.
Archon synth could teleport and zap, since the synth body counts as the archon.
I like Imbicatus' suggestion, problem with Inquisitor is I always overlook it because you REALLY have to know what you're doing to make it work right (it's just easy to screw up). So I usually forget it.
Actually, Witch might work. Spellcasting would be a hassle but the hexes and harassments that witches do so well don't require gear, components, or hands. Just stick with non-somatic or stilled spells.
How about an item crafter?
Naturally low intelligence, item crafting and int-based casting would actually be kinda hard. Hm.
Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Covert Operator wrote: How about an item crafter? The archon replies.... "Look Ma! No Hands!"
boring7 wrote:
Seems like a good one. Issue is they're ranged attacks, so it can't flank, and as a glow-blob it has trouble hiding and attacking from the shadows. Not sure if there is a way around this.
Make your opponent blind. Everything from glitterdust to dirty tricks.
boring7 wrote: Naturally low intelligence, item crafting and int-based casting would actually be kinda hard. Hm. Outsider wrote: Due to their varied nature, outsiders also receive 4 additional class skills determined by the creature's theme. Pick Spellcraft as one, and have at least one rank. Class skill of +3, Int 6 mod of -2, Take 10 of +10, and one rank adds up to 12. You can reliably scribe scrolls of 7th level. You can brew any potion. You can make any wand. Crafting DC's are easy. Add a few ranks, and the DC you can hit goes higher.
With most casters, you can get a familiar. Aid another gives +2 more on the skill. I second the Witch as a debuffer. As a Ninja, you can get Vanishing Trick, letting you go invisible long enough to sneak attack. Your light shows, but you get all the benefits of being invisible.
/cevah
Cevah wrote: boring7 wrote: Naturally low intelligence, item crafting and int-based casting would actually be kinda hard. Hm. Outsider wrote: Due to their varied nature, outsiders also receive 4 additional class skills determined by the creature's theme. Pick Spellcraft as one, and have at least one rank. Class skill of +3, Int 6 mod of -2, Take 10 of +10, and one rank adds up to 12. You can reliably scribe scrolls of 7th level. You can brew any potion. You can make any wand. Crafting DC's are easy. Add a few ranks, and the DC you can hit goes higher.
With most casters, you can get a familiar. Aid another gives +2 more on the skill. I second the Witch as a debuffer. As a Ninja, you can get Vanishing Trick, letting you go invisible long enough to sneak attack. Your light shows, but you get all the benefits of being invisible.
/cevah Skills: I suppose this is true. Still it's a net -(lots) vs. your average int-based arcane caster-crafter, which makes things more of a hassle when you don't have the right spells if nothing else.
To make witch work you need a different casting stat than int for the same reasons. I don't recall if there is an archetype that uses charisma/wisdom, (obviously scarred witch doctor isn't really an option).
The fighter option can actually be pretty nice, if you take the snap shot tree you can do some damage.
Hmm...I wonder if there's a way to shrink down so you're even harder to hit, maybe end up hiding in the paladin's hat and shooting from inside a little cage of arrow slits like a helmet-mounted zappo turret.
Just noticed: You get no casting as an Int based caster. Zero level spells as a Cha based caster. 1st level spells as a Wis based caster. So being a caster is bad unless it is secondary or trades out spellcasting. You can fix this with a headband, and level stat bumps, but that is a steep price to pay. Still, a familiar helps the action economy. Class spells are usable via wands instead of UMB.
With a Con of 12, you can be a martial, but a ranged character would last longer.
/cevah
In theory it might get a stat block and be able to put a 15 or an 18 in something, but even if it does it gets a -4 to Int to overcome.
Little embarrassing I didn't pay attention to that at the outset, but so it goes.
Also note that given the description of a lantern archon's body, you would probably have a difficult case arguing that it has any magic item slots at all.
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