Need help with Sorcerer Build


Advice


I've built a Sorcerer and my stats are as follows.

Sorcerer lvl 2
Arcane Bloodline

Str 7, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 20.
Feats: Eschew Materials, Spell Focus (Conjuration), Augment Summoning.

I've also got a Hare familiar that gives me +4 to initiative.

So far, my spells are;
0 - Detect Magic, Read Magic, Prestidigitation, Acid Splash, Light,
1 - Color Spray, Magic Missile,

Personality wise, I've got it figured out. Avid follower of Nethys, believes non-casters are second-class citizens, but is willing to teach if they're capable of learning. Anything to increase the family of Nethys. Also very cautious of unknown magical items.

I want to gain Deific Obedience at lvl 5, and prestige into Evangelist at lvl 6, but it comes at the cost of a single sorcerer level, meaning I won't get the benefits of lvl 20 sorcerer (I believe). I find it acceptable, but I want to know if I should trade out Spell Focus (Conj) and Augment Summoning for something else.

I'm looking for versatility in this build. Finding spells (Example: Grease, Stone Shape, Image spells) and feats that boost this potential. What would you guys recommend to help me achieve my final goal?

Silver Crusade

Do you intend to Summon Monsters frequently? If yes, keep and use those Summoning feats. If not, choose something else.

Grand Lodge

I'd drop augmented summoning and focus on Conjuration of the non-summon variety...

Grease, Glitter dust, Pit spells, Aqueous Orb, Black tentacles

I personally would grab greater Spell focus instead of Augmented.

At first Bloodline feat grab Improved initiative. This will off set the lost of the Hare if you take Improved familiar....which you should. Dust Mephits are REALLY good. 1/hour Blur and 1/day wind wall are AMAZING SLA to add to your limited spell selection.

Then I would grab persistent spell early at 5 just cause I know 7 is improved Familiar. This will make glitterdust just stupid nasty abuse spell not to mention Aqueous Orb becoming a save or DIE reflex.

At level 9 I would grab Spell penetration just because your bound to grab a blast spell somewhere along the way.

At 11 I would prolly grab another Meta magic since I am working towards spell perfection @ 15. 2 really good meta magics here are Empower (if you have a few blast spells worth it) or Dazing if you pick versatile blast spells like Flaming Sphere.

At 13 I would grab Quicken spell. Around here you get another Blood Line Feat. Spell Focus will be your go to. Look at your spell list and pick based off the tend in spells your having. Remember this is your 2nd favorite school. Evocation will prolly be a strong pick. I personally love Necromancy as it has Tons of Debuff potential and most the spells have effects even if they save. Ray of enfeeblement is an amazing first level spell at this point.

At 15 it is Spell Perfection. Pick an annoying as heck spell and make one of your meta magics free to apply to it. Never cast it normally again. I recommend Glitterdust or Aqueous Orb for conjuration. You could also just be cheap and Build for the abusive Dazing Fire Wall....it wins fights. Your just gonna have to find out whats fun for you.

After 15 I recommend just grabbing more meta magics that round you out. Or that can applied to your Spell perfection. Or you can spell perfection again. Or you can Greater Spell focus.


Fruian Thistlefoot wrote:

I'd drop augmented summoning and focus on Conjuration of the non-summon variety...

Grease, Glitter dust, Pit spells, Aqueous Orb, Black tentacles

I personally would grab greater Spell focus instead of Augmented.

At first Bloodline feat grab Improved initiative. This will off set the lost of the Hare if you take Improved familiar....which you should. Dust Mephits are REALLY good. 1/hour Blur and 1/day wind wall are AMAZING SLA to add to your limited spell selection.

Then I would grab persistent spell early at 5 just cause I know 7 is improved Familiar. This will make glitterdust just stupid nasty abuse spell not to mention Aqueous Orb becoming a save or DIE reflex.

At level 9 I would grab Spell penetration just because your bound to grab a blast spell somewhere along the way.

At 11 I would prolly grab another Meta magic since I am working towards spell perfection @ 15. 2 really good meta magics here are Empower (if you have a few blast spells worth it) or Dazing if you pick versatile blast spells like Flaming Sphere.

At 13 I would grab Quicken spell. Around here you get another Blood Line Feat. Spell Focus will be your go to. Look at your spell list and pick based off the tend in spells your having. Remember this is your 2nd favorite school. Evocation will prolly be a strong pick. I personally love Necromancy as it has Tons of Debuff potential and most the spells have effects even if they save. Ray of enfeeblement is an amazing first level spell at this point.

At 15 it is Spell Perfection. Pick an annoying as heck spell and make one of your meta magics free to apply to it. Never cast it normally again. I recommend Glitterdust or Aqueous Orb for conjuration. You could also just be cheap and Build for the abusive Dazing Fire Wall....it wins fights. Your just gonna have to find out whats fun for you.

After 15 I recommend just grabbing more meta magics that round you out. Or that can applied to your Spell perfection. Or you can spell perfection again. Or you can...

I like where this is going, but I was planning on gaining Craft Wondrous Item at 3rd and Deific Obedience at 5th, So I can prestige into an Evangelist at 6th level, going full tilt on it until 16th level and finishing out with Sorcerer for the last four levels.

So far this seems like it's going to be a high wealth campaign so I could benefit from making my own magical items. Spread the wealth of Nethys, as it were.


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My recommendation to you is forget Sorcerer.

Now, I don't give that recommendation lightly. I love sorcerers. They are an extremely flavorful and excellent class in my opinion that often gets overlooked.

But your personality and desire for versatility really just scream Wizard 1 (scryer)/ Cleric 1 (forget what domain) to do early entry Mystic Theurge until you can jump into Evangelist at level 6. At the end of the game, you should be able to cast 9th level spells from either list.

If you have your heart set on Sorcerers though (I don't blame you for this either), Just go straight Sorcerer and use your feats on things that help you land spells or Metamagic, since the Arcane bloodline is good with them.

Summoning and Illusion Spells are your ticket items. Grab a bunch of spells from whatever towns you can and pick up a Mnemonic Vestment so you can cast any one spell once per day you have on scroll, or just use the scroll in emergencies. My 14th level sorcerer has paid for his vestment many times in saving money this way.

I don't think you need any Summon Monster spells until SM III, before then pick up spells like what you have along with, Silent Image, Grease, Glitterdust, you know, the good ones. At level 8, Shadow Conjuration is the most versatile spell in the list, SMV at 10 for Hound Archon.

If you have high wealth -and- plenty of free time, Craft Staff is the key to true sorcerer versatility. Simply use UMD and Mnemonic Vestment and scrolls to put whatever spell you want on whatever staff you want so you're not stuck with even Sorcerer spells. My Sorcerer uses Bestow Grace almost every dungeon now for amazing saves.

If you have a lot of money, nothing beats the versatility of Limited Wish at level 14 for that spell you wish you had. By 16, add or switch to a Robe of Arcane Heritage so you can get your capstone early. Being able to swap casting levels for any spell you have on a staff added to any spell you want on a staff is a marvelous thing. After that, Shades at 18 will give you every Summoning spell down the list, and the rest is gravy.


So, Oterisk, you're saying stick with the original idea, but skip out on becoming an Evangelist.


Yeah, losing the caster level is not worth the benefits in my opinion. Having played a Sorcerer and constantly feeling behind the gun because I'm already a level behind the wizards, yeah, it's still a fun thing, but to be two levels behind without something like major early stat bonuses (Dragon Disciple) or the ability to put anti magic shell on an arrow (Arcane Archer) or something like that. From what I understand, your bonuses from the obediences really aren't worth losing a spell level for, as they won't give you higher level spells and more spells. If you're not mixing in anything else besides being a caster, giving up a caster level is like taking a level of Expert. You get some nice skills but that's about it.

Early entry Mystic Theurge is going to be way more versatile than your sorcerer, and have higher level spells at the same time (or before you if you take Evangelist) way more spell slots per day and the ability to make scrolls of 70% of the spells available period. (not to mention more skills, class skills and better saves. Wood Oracle has access to a 2nd level SLA (scrolls, books, staves, lotta wood involved). One level of that will give you 11th caster level Oracle, 14th level Sorcerer at level 15, so that's nifty. Going Wizard instead is a bit MAD, but you'd still get access to 8th level spells by level 16 (unless you used Evangelist to copy Mystic theurge and hit level 20 with for 8th level oracle spells and 9th level wizard spells.)

But not making something complicated has it's own merits. With the stuff I mentioned in the previous post, you'll have plenty of options to keep you guessing and you'll also have staying power due to your staves, so it's just a matter of preference anyway. The best thing to do is pick your path and pursue excellence in it, as long as it fits with your story, you'll have a good time.


What race is your Sorcerer? If you're a Human (or Half-Orc, or Half-Elf), you can pick the Human alternate favoured class bonus of an extra spell per level:
"Add one spell known from the sorcerer spell list. This spell must be at least one level below the highest spell level the sorcerer can cast."

It's always good for a sorcerer to know more spells!

You might also want to check out the other bloodlines out there and invest in the Eldritch Heritage feat tree to get some cool bloodline. It would be a feat heavy and a bit slow. You'd need to invest in Skill Focus for the bloodline focus of the other desired bloodline. Then Eldritch Heritage at level 3 (CHA 13+), Improved Eldritch Heritage at level 11 (CHA 15+), and Greater Eldritch Heritage at level 17 (CHA 17+).

But in the long run, it could make things interesting. You could, for example, ultimately have a sorcerer taking up aspects of the Djinn bloodline. Skill Focus (Planes) would be cool if that's already your bloodline skill. Then Electricity Ray at 3rd level, Whirlwind at level 11 and finally Elemental Movement at level 17.

You may not want to do either of those things, but those are two options.


Eschew Materials, Spell Focus (Conjuration), Augment Summoning, Craft Wondrous Item, Combat Casting, Superior Summoning, Improved Initiative, Persistent Spell, Dazing Spell

Here are the Feats I was looking at, this'd be at lvl 12. But I'm thinking of replacing Augment and Superior with Spell Focus (Illusion), and Greater Spell Focus (Conj)

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