Reactive Feats

[Giorgo]

Is their a guide, article, forum posts or clear explanation somewhere on what "Reactive Feats" are, how to use them, and recommendations for synergies with weapon attacks, role features and combat effectiveness?

I am trying to understand these, but not getting far...

[Guurzak]

Here's the data:
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X Critical reactives take effect when you deal a crit

Deafening Critical: Oblivious: reduces Base Attack and Perception
Exhausting Critical: Exhausted: reduces max Stamina and Stamina Regeneration
Sickening Critical: Afflicted: deals damage over time and penalizes Reflex
Staggering Critical: Slowed: penalizes Speed and Reflex
Stunning Critical: chance to stun
Tiring Critical: Unimplemented?

Master of Opportunity reactives for fighters take effect when you attack while your target presents opportunity

MoO Suffer: Increase base damage
MoO Stand Still: Slowed: penalizes Speed and Reflex
MoO Stop: Chance to interrupt
MoO Slip: chance to apply Flat-Footed
MoO Stumble: chance to knockdown

Rogue reactives take effect when your target has flat-footed (or, future, if your rogue feature applies to the attack)

Bleeding Attack: Bleeding: deals damage over time and penalizes Fortitude
Slow Reactions: Slowed: penalizes Speed and Reflex
Befuddling Strike: Oblivious: reduces Base Attack and Perception
Crippling Strike: Drained: penalizes Base Attack and Base Defense

[<Kabal> Kradlum]

Is there a way to increase my chances of getting a critical?

[Guurzak]

Using attacks with Improved Critical is the obvious way. You also get crit chance if your attack roll is higher than your target's defense, so improving your weapon tier, upgrading your attack bonuses, and using attacks with Precise can all help.

[Giorgo]

@Guurzak,

Thank you for that clear explanation of what reactive feats are. I am still not clear on how they are used. There are general, fighter and rogue versions; trying to understand how to conbine with role features and weapons feats to make the best use.

On a separate note, do you also have a clear explaination on defensive feats? :)

[Guurzak]

Are you using "use" in a tactical or strategic sense? You don't use them at all, in a tactical sense; you slot them and then they automatically apply whenever the trigger conditions are met.

In a strategic sense, figuring out what combinations of reactives work best with your personal playstyle, training focus, and equipment loadout will be a personal and idiosyncratic exercise. If you have attacks that can take advantage of Afflicted, maybe Sickening Critical will work well for you. If you're a fighter with strong attacks versus opponents who are knocked down, MoO Stumble might fit into your design. Etc.

As far as Defensives go: overall, Defensives are weak and expensive. You would honestly be fine skipping them altogether, or buying any 3 at rank 1, slotting them, and forgetting about them until much later.

Lightning Reflexes, Iron Will, Great Fortitude: passively boost defense versus various spell attacks. These bonuses are small and costly compared to buying Reflex Bonus, Will Bonus, and Fortitude Bonus. For example:

Fortitude Bonus 1: 54xp for +4 Fort, always active
Great Fortitude 1: 124xp for +2 Fort, takes a slot

Toughness adds hit points, but again, less effectively and more expensively than just buying more Hit Points. In general, invest minimally in these four feats unless you have specific reason to want to maximize a specific defense after you've done everything else you can to raise it.

Blind Fight (rogues) is a niche feat which improves recovery rate when you are affected by Oblivious. Skip it unless you have specific reason.

Bravery (fighters) decreases the decay rate of Freedom and Mind Blank, which in turn help you remove control effects of various types. If you have ways to get those effects, this can be useful. It also adds a boost to Will defense, so skip Iron Will if your take this.

Strong Back: increases encumbrance. This is the no-brainer feat to slot here if you do any gathering or hauling.

My recommendation for Defensives is to train Strong Back as high as your Adventure feats will allow, add Bravery if you're a fighter, then fill up your remaining slots with any of reflexes/will/fortitude at rank 1 and leave them alone for now.

[Giorgo]

Guurzak wrote:

Bravery (fighters) decreases the decay rate of Freedom and Mind Blank, which in turn help you remove control effects of various types. If you have ways to get those effects, this can be useful. It also adds a boost to Will defense, so skip Iron Will if your take this.

On mobile, full reply later.

Does Bravery help to defend against whatever it is packs of wolves do that leave you motionless and the white circles that ogres scream at you? (Sorry for not remembering the name of effects)?

[DeciusBrutus]

Giorgo wrote:

Guurzak wrote:

Bravery (fighters) decreases the decay rate of Freedom and Mind Blank, which in turn help you remove control effects of various types. If you have ways to get those effects, this can be useful. It also adds a boost to Will defense, so skip Iron Will if your take this.

On mobile, full reply later.

Does Bravery help to defend against whatever it is packs of wolves do that leave you motionless and the white circles that ogres scream at you? (Sorry for not remembering the name of effects)?

I don't think mind blank or freedom resist knockdown or stun.

Also of note is that Master if Opprutunity applies to all attacks right now, including beneficial ones. Adding base damage to something with zero damage factor has no effect, but adding slow or knockdown to your cleric buffs is the opposite if what you want.

[Guurzak]

Stephen Cheney wrote:

In general, Mind Blank comes from and protects against "crowd control" that keeps you from taking actions (or alters control of your actions, e.g., Confusion), but not from moving. Freedom comes from and protects against anything that keeps you from moving. So Nausea (can move but not use actions) is Mind Blank and Immobilize (can act but can't move) is Freedom.

Things that do both (like a full Stun that prevents you from both moving and taking actions) go under Freedom.

Freedom should protect you from knockdowns and stuns. However, Bravery does not give you Freedom; it reduces the decay of Freedom that you already have. So it won't help you gain immunity to stuns, but if you are already immune to stuns, Freedom will make that immunity last longer.

[Nihimon]

• Mind Blank (Misc. Buff) This stacking buff improves resistance to mental control effects. [Stack Size] added to defense total vs. affected Control effects
  
• Freedom (Misc. Buff) This stacking buff improves resistance to mental control effects. [Stack Size] added to defense total vs. affected Control effects
  
• Immobilize (Blocker) This crowd control prevents the character from moving (but not from attacking). It is resisted by Freedom.
  
• Interrupt (Blocker) This effect causes the attack the target is currently animating to immediately fail (if it is still within its interruption window). It is resisted by Mind Blank.
  
• Knockdown (Blocker) This effect is essentially a Stun that is animated as knocking the target prone, and thus gives the character a defensive bonus against ranged attacks. It is resisted by Freedom.
  
• Stun/Paralyze (Blocker) This effect prevents the target from moving or using any actions. It is resisted by Freedom.

This is from the Effects listed in one of the early Alpha guides. It's the first tab in Nihimon's Reference Sheets at Pathfinder Online (Public).

[Giorgo]

Still confused, what is Bravery good for? Is it worth using a defense slot? What monsters is it useful against?

On a similar note, how can a dedicated figher defend against wolves and ogres special attacks?

[Nihimon]

Whenever a Blocker effect is applied to you, it also applies stacks of either Freedom or Mind Blank, depending on which one resisted it. Those stacks of Freedom and Mind Blank decay just like stacks of Bleeding decay; Bravery simply slows down the rate.

[Schedim]

And remember that a lot of effects has no effect on mobs currently, like Interrupt, Knockdown and Immobilise ...

[Ravenlute]

"MoO Slip: chance to apply Flat-Footed"

This also applies Flat-Footed to yourself when you have opportunity, especially when using some kind of Target Self ability.

[KarlBob]

Ravenlute wrote:

"MoO Slip: chance to apply Flat-Footed"

This also applies Flat-Footed to yourself when you have opportunity, especially when using some kind of Target Self ability.

Thanks for the tip. I'll add it to my personal "Never Slot This" list.

[Giorgo]

Guurzak wrote:

Are you using "use" in a tactical or strategic sense? You don't use them at all, in a tactical sense; you slot them and then they automatically apply whenever the trigger conditions are met.

In a strategic sense, figuring out what combinations of reactives work best with your personal playstyle, training focus, and equipment loadout will be a personal and idiosyncratic exercise. If you have attacks that can take advantage of Afflicted, maybe Sickening Critical will work well for you. If you're a fighter with strong attacks versus opponents who are knocked down, MoO Stumble might fit into your design. Etc.

In a strategic sense, and the figuring out part is the whole reason for this post. (Grin) I am slowly getting there I hope.

When you say "taking advantage of..", do I match reactive feats to the special effects of a weapons primary weapon feat?

Example:

Spear/Spike (add Slowed 5)+ Staggering Critical (keys of Slowed)?

The idea is that with combo when I use the "Spike" attack when it does it effect, it does it at a more powerful impact?

There is a "Master of Opportunity: Stand Sill (adds Slowed to target presenting Opportunity)"; but that is useless as none of the Spear weapon attack primary's grant Opportunity, correct?

Does that also mean that most of the Fighters MOO reactive feats depend on other roles setting up conditions to make use of it; so not really useful in solo play? Or am I even more mixing things up...

[Schedim]

Giorgo wrote:

Example:

Spear/Spike (add Slowed 5)+ Staggering Critical (keys of Slowed)?

The idea is that with combo when I use the "Spike" attack when it does it effect, it does it at a more powerful impact?

There is a "Master of Opportunity: Stand Sill (adds Slowed to target presenting Opportunity)"; but that is useless as none of the Spear weapon attack primary's grant Opportunity, correct?

Not useless as anyone moving gets Marked with Opportunity and as you have greater reach you can use it on them before they can attack you (and in the future the Opp. Flag will hang on a bit longer than it do now).

Secondly it works fine on those stupid archers that just stands there and tries to pin you with arrows while you skewer them (and the same with throwing stuff and some utilities).
Lastly you can use it on people that tries to run away from you...

[KarlBob]

Schedim wrote:

Not useless as anyone moving gets Marked with Opportunity and as you have greater reach you can use it on them before they can attack you

One small quibble: If you press Shift while moving, your character will slow down to a walk. Walking characters do not present Opportunity.

[Schedim]

KarlBob wrote:

Schedim wrote:

Not useless as anyone moving gets Marked with Opportunity and as you have greater reach you can use it on them before they can attack you

One small quibble: If you press Shift while moving, your character will slow down to a walk. Walking characters do not present Opportunity.

Something mostly forgotten! But mobs don't use it and walking towards someone dropping longbows is nearly as bad as provoking Opportunity...

[Nihimon]

Schedim wrote:

... walking towards someone dropping longbows is nearly as bad as provoking Opportunity...

+1

[Guurzak]

Schedim wrote:

dropping longbows

word to your hoes, I came to drop bows.

[Bluddwolf]

Guurzak wrote:

Rogue reactives take effect when your target has flat-footed (or, future, if your rogue feature applies to the attack)

Bleeding Attack: Bleeding: deals damage over time and penalizes Fortitude
Slow Reactions: Slowed: penalizes Speed and Reflex
Befuddling Strike: Oblivious: reduces Base Attack and Perception
Crippling Strike: Drained: penalizes Base Attack and Base Defense

Here we have another aspect that is denied to the Rogue because the Rogue features no longer produce Flatfooted.

Not only do the Rogue Class Features not grant their bonuses, but neither do the Reactives.

I do not buy into the phantom flatfooted condition that some claim exists. If I don't see the Flatfooted icon on my target, my target is not flatfooted. "Acts as a flatfooted condition" was an excuse used in another thread, and that is BS as far as I'm concerned.

Rogues are broken, period! All of their Class Features and Reactives need to Proc off of Distressed, not Flatfooted which they no longer produce.

[Schedim]

Bluddwolf wrote:

Here we have another aspect that is denied to the Rogue because the Rogue features no longer produce Flatfooted.

Not only do the Rogue Class Features not grant their bonuses, but neither do the Reactives.

I do not buy into the phantom flatfooted condition that some claim exists. If I don't see the Flatfooted icon on my target, my target is not flatfooted. "Acts as a flatfooted condition" was an excuse used in another thread, and that is BS as far as I'm concerned.

Rogues are broken, period! All of their Class Features and Reactives need to Proc off of Distressed, not Flatfooted which they no longer produce.

There are stuff that produce Flatfooted, but the thing that would be a gamechanger would be the actual implementation of the "All start combat as Flatfooted" that was mentioned a couple of months ago...

But as Bludd says, the Role of Rogue is non-existant, the thing we have is a badly nerfed Fighter-light of little use ...

[Hobson Fiffledown]

So, is the short of this "Don't use Reactives, they're all broken"?

[Schedim]

Hobson Fiffledown wrote:

So, is the short of this "Don't use Reactives, they're all broken"?

Nonono! They just need some thinking and fiddling with. Especially the Rogue ones. In order to use most of them you have combine them with the Feint Utility.

[Neadenil Edam]

So exhausting critical is a bad thing in PvE as it gets the enemy archers into the "interrupt phase" quicker ?

[Guurzak]

How does "reduces max stamina and stamina regen" have anything to do with attack animation speed? Either your opponent has the stamina to execute his attack, or not.

[Neadenil Edam]

Guurzak wrote:

How does "reduces max stamina and stamina regen" have anything to do with attack animation speed? Either your opponent has the stamina to execute his attack, or not.

NPC archers do not initally interrupt, they switch to an interrupting attack once they have low stamina.

[Jakaal]

its the lowest stamina attack with both Longbow and Shortbow so that is the first attack they can use again once they run out and start regening.

[Guurzak]

Fair enough. Vs archer mobs, avoid exhausting effects if your attacks are interruptible.

[Ravenlute]

Bluddwolf wrote:

I do not buy into the phantom flatfooted condition that some claim exists. If I don't see the Flatfooted icon on my target, my target is not flatfooted. "Acts as a flatfooted condition" was an excuse used in another thread, and that is BS as far as I'm concerned.

I'm with ya there on that one Bludd.

[Guurzak]

Nobody's claiming that it exists now- it's on the drawing board but isn't implemented/working yet.

[Nihimon]

If a target does not have the Flat-Footed condition, but one or more Rogues are treating it as Flat-Footed due to Sneak Attack, it's an open question whether the Rogues will see the Flat-Footed icon, but it's a certainty no one else will.

[<Kabal> Daeglin]

Ravenlute wrote:

Bluddwolf wrote:

I do not buy into the phantom flatfooted condition that some claim exists. If I don't see the Flatfooted icon on my target, my target is not flatfooted. "Acts as a flatfooted condition" was an excuse used in another thread, and that is BS as far as I'm concerned.

I'm with ya there on that one Bludd.

My understanding is that it does not exist yet, but it is the eventual intent as described. Story of the rogue ;)

[Giorgo]

Giorgo wrote:

Is their a guide, article, forum posts or clear explanation somewhere on what "Reactive Feats" are, how to use them, and recommendations for synergies with weapon attacks, role features and combat effectiveness?

Based on feedback so far, I would say that is a "no". Follow up question: is anyone going to create such a guide for better understanding Reactive Feats & Defensive Feats (I think Sspitfire1 has something)?