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I am brand new to DMing and still learning how to wing it when my players go off "script". They went to the Direption and discovered the papers in Davaulus' name. Last game, they very nearly went to the guards at the castle in an attempt to tell the Queen what they'd learned. They got sidetracked, but may still try to approach her.
Has anyone else run into this? Thoughts on what happens if they tell the castle guards that they suspect the Queen's Physicians are actually helping to spread the plague? Although I think it would be a very interesting development, it seems a little daunting for me right now to head in the direction of them being imprisoned or tried for treason or something of that sort. Is it logical to think the castle guards even know what's going on? Or that they would pass a message onto the queen herself (or someone higher up)? Any suggestions?
The castle guard most likely does not have any idea the Queen hired Davaulus via the Red Mantis to eradicate Korvosa's poor. The Grey Maidens may not even know.
Despite the name the Queen's Physicians are minions of Davaulus, and the Queen will disavow herself of any knowledge of their nefarious acts if they are exposed. She may even make a show of sending the Grey Maidens to arrest them, which will actually give them a chance to "escape" and relocate their operations, unless the Player's Characters can discover them in their den of disease under the Hospice in time.
I think we tried this whole "audience with the queen thing"
my wife figure out the coins really early on, and was all intrigued, super into solving the issue, and we kinda thought the Hell knights were behind what was going on….
I can't remember how we got deflected away from seeing the queen tho… All I know is , we didn't
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I am brand new to DMing and still learning how to wing it when my players go off "script". They went to the Direption and discovered the papers in Davaulus' name. Last game, they very nearly went to the guards at the castle in an attempt to tell the Queen what they'd learned. They got sidetracked, but may still try to approach her.
Has anyone else run into this? Thoughts on what happens if they tell the castle guards that they suspect the Queen's Physicians are actually helping to spread the plague? Although I think it would be a very interesting development, it seems a little daunting for me right now to head in the direction of them being imprisoned or tried for treason or something of that sort. Is it logical to think the castle guards even know what's going on? Or that they would pass a message onto the queen herself (or someone higher up)? Any suggestions?
The queen is a major manipulator. If my PCs were to approach her with this news, I'd have her tell them that she is glad they told her, but she doesn't know who she can trust anymore. Some of the guards have turned out to be unreliable (think of Vancaskerin and his buddies, or other guards who have deserted), now the physicians are traitors and her Grey Maidens are - let's face it - still inexperienced. So she asks the PCs - the only ones she can trust - to look into the problem. Of course she can give the traitorous doctors and cultists the heads-up, so they are expecting the PCs ... In this case I would remove the Grey Maidens from the hospital, but you can put extra mercenaries (or even red mantis assassins) in their place.
I second Vergee's suggestion.
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MrVergee makes a very good suggestion. What you should do depends upon how you want your characters to feel about the Queen at this time, and it also depends upon how your Ileosa sees the PCs.
To the PCs, she presents things exactly the way MrVergee suggests. The one thing I might add, however, is some dialogue to show Ileosa's faith in Davaulus as a doctor. Suspicions are not facts. The "proof" is just a piece of paper. She doesn't discount the PCs' discovery, but she also doesn't immediately take it as fact. Basically, the PCs are accusing Davaulus of starting a plague so that he could charge Korvosa a king's ransom to cure it. Seeing as how he is a leading expert in his field and has done similar work stopping plagues in other cities (that may or may not be a lie--your choice), he is either a savior or the worst kind of person imaginable. Look at it this way, Ileosa can't come out seeming like a moron for hiring this guy. She asks the PCs to be discrete in their investigation, if only for the people of her beloved Korvosa. Right now, Davaulus is the only hope they have. If it turns out that the PCs are wrong, spreading rumors now will make it impossible for him to do his job. Obviously, if they are correct, then Davaulus will be executed and a new solution will be pursued. Either way, there is no reason to get the people any more worked up until the facts are made clear--for the sake of the city, of course!
Option 1: Ileosa decides to go all in on eliminating the PCs now.
Obviously, a move right then in the castle is dangerous. The characters have probably been building a positive reputation, and in order to get to the Queen a LOT of people had to see them. No need to make a move immediately. Instead, she informs Davaulus that he's got a group of adventurers on his tail, negotiates a better rate over the slip-up (every gold piece counts when you're subjugating a city), and has the defenses of the Hospice increased significantly.
Since the most obvious tool of Ileosa's "justice" right now is the Grey Maidens, and she can't very well trust anyone else to be in the Hospice, they are the weapon of choice. Obviously, the Queen's betrayal will be revealed, but since the PCs aren't going to live to tell of it, their revelation will be short lived. It ought to be fun when the party thinks they're doing the Queen's work, only to have their path of escape from the temple blocked by Grey Maidens. This can occur as soon as they get downstairs, or wait until after they have defeated Andaisin.
Springing the trap early means less potential damage to the plague operation, but it also means that the party will be more capable of escaping once the Queen's direct involvement is revealed. The deeper they are in the temple before the Maidens are committed, the more likely they will be forced to stand and fight--they will also be less difficult for the Grey Maidens to defeat.
If you decide upon the Maidens waiting until they party is battered from the fight with Andaisin, you will have them in a tough spot. If it goes south for your group, you have the convenient deus ex machina of Blackjack, which also helps set up great motivations for the party in Book 3. Normally I avoid those types of situations like the, well, plague, but since they get to return the favor pretty quickly I don't think it ruins the game experience much at all.
In this scenario, I would probably have a bunch of Grey Maidens waiting
in a building next door, only to be deployed if Davaulus fails. Davaulus would be informed that the PCs are on to him, and to prepare accordingly. Obviously, the Queen's involvement must be hidden, so no Grey Maidens can be deployed to help him defend the temple. What is she paying him for, anyway? To help with the ruse, have two Grey Maidens at the front door. They will act as if they are expecting the PCs (they are), and let them in with a nod and a wink (how hard is it to see a person wink in that helmet?).
The end of Book 2 is where the party becomes convinced the Queen is the enemy in most cases anyway, so having the PCs be made VERY aware of it isn't so bad. If you would rater keep the game running into book 3, try out Option 2!
Option 2: Ileosa decides to hedge her bets.
In this scenario, Ileosa isn't completely sure her Grey Maidens are ready to handle a group like the PCs. At least, not able to handle it quietly. Ultimately, it doesn't matter to Ileosa what the PCs think, so much as what the city at large thinks. She informs Davaulus of his incompetence, and demands to know what the Red Mantis are going to do about it. She isn't paying them a king's ransom to bungle the plan and ruin her reputation. She pulls the Grey Maidens out of the Hospice, if only to minimize her apparent involvement. She lets the doctor know that she will throw him under the donkey cart if this scheme goes public--so don't let it go public.
Now, Davaulus didn't get to where he is today by being timid. The man has a fair amount of confidence in his own abilities and the backing of the Red Mantis. I would treat the whole temple as on alert, really making the PCs earn it. Add some more physicians to make up for the Grey Maidens, or maybe just some mercenary thugs with surprisingly similar stats...
In this way, you can basically run the adventure as written, with a simple "I was wondering when you would show up" line added to a Davaulus or Rolth or Andaisin monologue.
If Davaulus succeeds and the PCs are defeated, Ileosa can continue as normal. If the PCs succeed, she has no direct involvement and can pin it all on the doctor. Rolth is also a nice target here. The two times I ran this AP I played Rolth up as a little unhinged, and in his own mind he thought the plague plot was all his anyway. I conveyed this to the PCs by having him scream to the clerics to stop the group from ruining his work. It ultimately didn't stop either party from determining that the Queen was behind it all, but it was a noble effort and I'll try it again if I am ever so lucky to run it for a third group. Also, do yourself a favor and let Rolth get away--he can be a lot of fun.
Anyway, in this case Ileosa makes sure that she can't lose either way the PCs' investigation turns out. Having hired the plaguemaker is a black mark on her decision making, but not nearly as bad as being the person who had the plague created to cull the city of offensive poor people. Obviously, whichever bureaucrat that is resisting the new order most will be executed for passing along the Davaulus recommendation, since he/she was obviously in league with the doctor. Maybe you can throw the PCs off the Queen's scent with this, maybe you can't. Honestly, you need the Queen-as-enemy to be revealed soon anyway, if only to drive the PCs out of the city at the end of Book 3.
Hope that inspires!
Option 2: Ileosa decides to hedge her bets.
In this scenario, Ileosa isn't completely sure her Grey Maidens are ready to handle a group like the PCs. At least, not able to handle it quietly. Ultimately, it doesn't matter to Ileosa what the PCs think, so much as what the city at large thinks. She informs Davaulus of his incompetence, and demands to know what the Red Mantis are going to do about it. She isn't paying them a king's ransom to bungle the plan and ruin her reputation. She pulls the Grey Maidens out of the Hospice, if only to minimize her apparent involvement. She lets the doctor know that she will throw him under the donkey cart if this scheme goes public--so don't let it go public.Now, Davaulus didn't get to where he is today by being timid. The man has a fair amount of confidence in his own abilities and the backing of the Red Mantis. I would treat the whole temple as on alert, really making the PCs earn it. Add some more physicians to make up for the Grey Maidens, or maybe just some mercenary thugs with surprisingly similar stats...
In this way, you can basically run the adventure as written, with a simple "I was wondering when you would show up" line added to a Davaulus or Rolth or Andaisin monologue.
If Davaulus succeeds and the PCs are defeated, Ileosa can continue as normal. If the PCs succeed, she has no direct involvement and can pin it all on the doctor. Rolth is also a nice target here. The two times I ran this AP I played Rolth up as a little unhinged, and in his own mind he thought the plague plot was all his anyway. I conveyed this to the PCs by having him scream to the clerics to stop the group from ruining his work. It ultimately didn't stop either party from determining that the Queen was behind it all, but it was a noble effort and I'll try it again if I am ever so lucky to run it for a third group. Also, do yourself a favor and let Rolth get away--he can be a lot of fun.
Anyway, in this case Ileosa makes sure that she can't lose either way the PCs' investigation turns out. Having hired the plaguemaker is a black mark on her decision making, but not nearly as bad as being the person who had the plague created to cull the city of offensive poor people. Obviously, whichever bureaucrat that is resisting the new order most will be executed for passing along the Davaulus recommendation, since he/she was obviously in league with the doctor. Maybe you can throw the PCs off the Queen's scent with this, maybe you can't. Honestly, you need the Queen-as-enemy to be revealed soon anyway, if only to drive the PCs out of the city at the end of Book 3.
I like Knick's second option the best. This way Ileosa has total deniability, no matter how things turn out. Either result is okay by her: if the PCs lose, she got rid of those nosy adventurers, if the PCs win, she tied up a loose end (the doctors).
I do understand the problem with the sunken ship, though. I'm at the start of the second book as well and I dropped the news about the ship. My players have been curious about the vessel as well and I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to go to the shipwreck before I planned for them to do so. Still, that won't pose too much of a problem. All the encounters for this adventure fall into two categories: the ones related to fighting the disease and its consequences on the city, and the ones fighting the bad guys. In my preparation the disease-fighting scenes come first, the fight against the bad guys come second. But if the bad guys get tackled first, there still is the need to cope with the disease and its influence if the PCs want to save Korvosa's civilians.
I have made the information on the ship indirect, though. It does not implicate the doctor, but rather points to an abandoned villa where the PCs can find more info on 'Davaulus' (his name is Doctor Dave Saulus in my campaign, because Davaulus is too much of a give-away) and his evil schemes. The villa is a reworked version of Misgivings, Foxglove Manor, from Rise of the Runelords # 2. I'll be including the Graul homestead from # 3 as well on the way over there. Later on I want to make the PCs more instrumental in making the cure as well. Since none of the PCs have alchemy as a skill, they will need to enlist an outsider's help in producing the cure, but the information they bring in from the 'bad guys' will be very important in speeding up that process. The PCs will further aid the production of the cure by looking for an ingredient needed to copy the medicine quickly. This quest will be an adapation of The Conquest of Bloodsworn Vale, where a special mushroom grows.
Knick, I'm especially impressed by the depth of your response.
That was pretty short compared to most of my posts...
You are very welcome, of course!
But seriously, I'm happy to go on and on about this particular AP. I also specialize in out-metagaming experienced players. So if any more questions come up just throw them up on the board!
That was pretty short compared to most of my posts...
Lol, true, but it's always a pleasure to pick your mind for ideas.