can you add the fiendish template to an NPC half elf?

[Timothy Ferdinand]

Okay, so the fiendish creature simple template (Bestiary 1 pg 294) is designed for creatures from the outer planes - on that basis, if a half-elf had been born in, for example, the Abyss, could that half-elf have the fiendish template and be wandering the material plane because it was summoned there? I am assuming this is okay as various Paizo products present fiendish dryads (for example) so I assume you could also have a fiendish half elf - or for that matter a fiendish human?

[Lakesidefantasy]

Yes, there is nothing stopping you from adding the template to most anything.

[blackbloodtroll]

Are you the DM?

[Timothy Ferdinand]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Are you the DM?

yes, but I have a very "legally minded" table of players, so I thought I'd just check as I can't recall seeing a fiendish human or fiendish half elf in any Paizo product - though of course I might very well be mistaken!

[Sissyl]

Simple answer is that each template details what kinds of creature can have the template. That said, it usually doesn't break anything if you twist those requirements a little or even a lot.

[blackbloodtroll]

Timothy Ferdinand wrote:

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Are you the DM?

yes, but I have a very "legally minded" table of players, so I thought I'd just check as I can't recall seeing a fiendish human or fiendish half elf in any Paizo product - though of course I might very well be mistaken!

Well, "legally", there is a thing known as "DM Fiat".

[I3igAl]

Timothy Ferdinand wrote:

Okay, so the fiendish creature simple template (Bestiary 1 pg 294) is designed for creatures from the outer planes - on that basis, if a half-elf had been born in, for example, the Abyss, could that half-elf have the fiendish template and be wandering the material plane because it was summoned there? I am assuming this is okay as various Paizo products present fiendish dryads (for example) so I assume you could also have a fiendish half elf - or for that matter a fiendish human?

I'd say yes, if your setting has cities of hell elves or hell humans. Under this circunstance their offspring could be Fiendish Half-Elves.

You might also consider treating those as Tieflings mechanically though.

Another origin story might just be your ordinary next door half elf, who got exposed to fell magic. Maybe a wizard did it :).

The forgotten realms have a race of demon elves btw: http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Fey%27ri

[Kazaan]

Yes, while Outsiders are most commonly associated with other planes, they aren't the only ones there. Outsiders are "made" of material from other planes and have no body/soul duality. But you can very well have Humanoids, Animals, etc. who do have body/soul duality, but have, for a long time, been exposed to the "background noise" of a particular plane that they react physically to it and undergo appropriate changes. So it is entirely valid to have a Fiendish Half-Elf, just as much as having a Fiendish Wolf or a Celestial Warhorse. Now, Half-Fiend, on the other hand, while technically a valid choice, would defy logic as it is specifically for the offspring of an Evil Outsider and a non-Outsider while Half-Elf is the offspring of Elf and Human. Logically, you couldn't make a Half-Fiend Half-Elf because Half-Elf assumes that the other half is Human. You could make a Half-Fiend Elf which is technically half Elf, but not the core race Half-Elf.

[Lifat]

I disagree with Kazaan. Nothing in the rules state that half-elves can't reproduce themselves, so a half-fiend half-elf could be the result of a half-elf and a fiend mating.
And there is no actual rules against making a half-fiend half-elf.

[Sissyl]

No. Thank god we don't have miscegenation laws anymore.

[LazarX]

Timothy Ferdinand wrote:

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Are you the DM?

yes, but I have a very "legally minded" table of players, so I thought I'd just check as I can't recall seeing a fiendish human or fiendish half elf in any Paizo product - though of course I might very well be mistaken!

You need to remind your players that YOU run the game, not the books. Don't be afraid to change things under the hood when they get too cocky and jaded.

My players know that I will quit running a campaign if the rules lawyering goes beyond a level that I will tolerate. So they tend to be very conservative about using such.

[Kazaan]

Lifat wrote:

I disagree with Kazaan. Nothing in the rules state that half-elves can't reproduce themselves, so a half-fiend half-elf could be the result of a half-elf and a fiend mating.

And there is no actual rules against making a half-fiend half-elf.

Good point. I hadn't considered that. I went back and saw in the description write-up that half-elves can breed with each to create "pureblood" half-elves so that means it wouldn't be out of line to have a half-elf + fiend yield a half-elf with the half-fiend template. Good catch.

[Lakesidefantasy]

A quick look through the Worldwound and one finds references to fiendish giants, werewolves, and all kinds of animals; even a fiendish treant.

[dragonhunterq]

While I think on, there is nothing that says a 1/2 elf is exactly 1/2 and 1/2. It is sufficent to be not entirely one or t'other. In the ARG there is a reference to a child of a 1/2 orc and a full orc still being considered a 1/2 orc.

[Victor Zajic]

Timothy Ferdinand wrote:

Okay, so the fiendish creature simple template (Bestiary 1 pg 294) is designed for creatures from the outer planes - on that basis, if a half-elf had been born in, for example, the Abyss, could that half-elf have the fiendish template and be wandering the material plane because it was summoned there? I am assuming this is okay as various Paizo products present fiendish dryads (for example) so I assume you could also have a fiendish half elf - or for that matter a fiendish human?

You can, buy Half-Fiend is more fun.