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It never really made much sense to tie acid damage to earth elementals. It seems like after the designers tagged the other three elementals with the obvious energy types (water = cold, air = electricity, and fire = fire), they just tacked acid onto earth by process of elimination.
But, why not sonic damage instead? Sound is a compression wave moving through a medium. Earthquakes are waves as well. I think it fits better than acid. Sonic has always the overlooked energy damage type. There aren't a lot of spells that do sonic damage, but that can be fix with some new spells.
What would be the other implications of switching out acid for sonic damage? Should monsters with acid resistance be granted sonic resistance instead?
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The main difference is, as you say, a lack of resistance to sonics out there, but swapping out the resistances should, in theory, work.
This has bugged me as well, though my thought was replacing earth's damage type with bludgeoning (you're hitting them with rocks), and air with slashing (wind-burn abrasions).
For completion's sake, though, here's how a 3PP source explains it:
"The connection between the element of earth and the alchemical damage type of acid is not immediately obvious to those unstudied in alchemy and arcane knowledge. A brief explanation of the connection may be useful to those seeking to master the magic of stone. What spellcasters and alchemists simply call “acid” is, in fact, a wide variety of caustic materials able to burn, dissolve, or corrode through chemical reaction.
While liquid acids are well known, and have ties to the elemental plane of water, there are also solid caustic materials with ties to the elemental plane of earth. These include items such as lye (also known as caustic soda, a dry white material used in soap-making) and caustic potash (also known as alkali salt). The exact process by which these caustic solids burn and corrode is not the same as many liquid acids, but the effect on material exposed to them is very similar.
Thus there are two elemental sources with which “acid” may be aligned. Black dragons, for example, are tied to the element of water and call forth a wet acidic breath that is also linked to that element. Sorcerers with an elemental earth bloodline, however, call upon the power of caustic salts and deal acid damage with a connection to elemental earth. Despite the two different elemental and alchemical sources of these caustic materials, for purposes of spells they both qualify as “acid” for game rule purposes."
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Off the top of my head, it looks like your substitutions would work. It would be a definite flavor difference.
Regarding why earth = acid:
To make acid you need certain chemicals. Hydrochloric acid requires chorine (from salt). Salt comes from the ground, sulfer comes from the ground, nitrates and nitrites come from the ground. And so on.
But acids are almost always aqueous solutions so even if you have an earth element starting point it must be dissolved in water for the acidic nature to manifest. So while the active ingredient may come from the ground the bulk of the material is water and they are only reactive because they are so dissolved.
There is probably a better argument for giving lightning to earth due to magnetic and conductive materials being earthen in nature and the fact that electricity seeks to ground itself out.
Unfortunately in the setup of four elements five energies I have never found a way to make it make any sense.
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The easiest way would probably have been to not link them at all. Air is Air, Earth is Earth, Fire is Fire, Ice is Ice. Acid is Acid, Lightning is Lightning, etc etc.
Thinking about it more ... three of the 'elements' are matter, so connecting an energy type to them seems even screwier to me now.
Thinking about it more ... three of the 'elements' are matter, so connecting an energy type to them seems even screwier to me now.
I think of them as being more symbolic of the states of matter. Earth = solid, water = liquid, air = gas, fire = plasma.
That said, I agree 100% that trying to neatly attach "energy" types (that aren't even all energy) to elements is not something that really creates a logically-coherent system, and is something I actively work against in my house rules.
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D&D's setting makes philosophy literal. The original designers crafted a fantasy setting that makes philosophies regarding the classic elements a reality. This seems evident when you compare old literature regarding the elements with that of D&D and Pathfinder lore. As a result, fire, water, earth, and air exist not merely as matter or chemical processes, but as cosmic forces that gave birth to the Material Plane and everything within it. Energy types function as the raw power of those forces, which proves destructive to creatures with bodies made as result of those elements. This is partially why many outsiders from the outer planes have strong resistances or immunities to energy damage. Needless to say, our modern understanding of physics does not apply in this setting, something I think even the writers of Pathfinder material sometimes forget.
Besides, I see no point in trying to apply our understanding of physics and chemistry to the game. Technically, you could consider physical damage as energy damage since trauma is caused through delivering kinetic energy that rearranges matter in a way we consider destructive the object (or person) as a whole. The game uses "energy types" as a handy way to classify damage not caused by a solid object.
As for substituting sonic, I don't know. Associating a type of damage related to air with that of earth seems weirder than acid.
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Thunder is associated with lightning. I think that sonic energy should be associated with the element of lightning, the way fire energy is associated with the element of fire.
Oh, wait, that doesn't work, either.
And why is water + cold a thing? Because most ice cubes are made of water? Hell, I can make ice cubes out of organge juice...
Agreed, Water = Cold doesn't really have that much sway. It's more Fire vs. Cold + Fire vs. Water makes Cold = Water. It's really all Fire's fault for being two both at once.
Agreed, Water = Cold doesn't really have that much sway. It's more Fire vs. Cold + Fire vs. Water makes Cold = Water. It's really all Fire's fault for being two both at once.
I'm on the side that think they shouldn't have energy types attached. Earth should deal physical damage, which would trade lower damage for ignoring resistances.
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And why is water + cold a thing? Because most ice cubes are made of water? Hell, I can make ice cubes out of organge juice...
If you look at the arrangement of the elemental planes, you can see why water is associated with cold. The planes transition from air, water, earth, and then fire.
1) Electricity energizes particles into gas, resulting in the Plane of Air.
2) Cold causes air to condensate, resulting in the Plane of Water.
3) Acid reacts chemically with water, leaving behind precipitate and resulting in the Plane of Earth.
4) Heat melts earth into molten plasma, resulting in the Plane of Fire
Thus, each element is associated with the energy type that polarizes it from the other elements.
Perhaps make it so Acid=Water, and Cold=Earth? The reasoning being most acids are liquids or aqueous solutions, and solids conduct heat (and therefore also 'cold') most readily. Doesn't fit with established ideas about the classical elements very well though.
Thus, each element is associated with the energy type that polarizes it from the other elements.
I appreciate and can sympathize with your attempt to salvage the system, but, I mean, come on. Some of that is reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyyy stretching.
I could as easily say:
(1) Plasma is an ionized gas, so electricity is associated with the Plane of Fire.
(2) Higher altitude leads to lower temperatures, so cold is associated with the Plane of Air.
(3) Water is the "universal solvent," so acid is associated with the Plane of Water.
(4) Flint and steel are used to start fires, and flint is nothing but quartz (the second most common mimeral in the earth's crust) and steel is made from iron (which is mined from the earth), so fire is associated with the Plane of Earth.
Thus, each element is associated with the energy type that polarizes it from the other elements.I appreciate and can sympathize with your attempt to salvage the system, but, I mean, come on. Some of that is reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyyy stretching.
I could as easily say:
(1) Plasma is an ionized gas, so electricity is associated with the Plane of Fire.
(2) Higher altitude leads to lower temperatures, so cold is associated with the Plane of Air.
(3) Water is the "universal solvent," so acid is associated with the Plane of Water.
(4) Flint and steel are used to start fires, and flint is nothing but quartz (the second most common mimeral in the earth's crust) and steel is made from iron (which is mined from the earth), so fire is associated with the Plane of Earth.
That makes even less sense!
Though I did make the mistake when referring to plasma as plasma is gas, not fire or molten rock.
D&D's setting makes philosophy literal. The original designers crafted a fantasy setting that makes philosophies regarding the classic elements a reality. This seems evident when you compare old literature regarding the elements with that of D&D and Pathfinder lore. As a result, fire, water, earth, and air exist not merely as matter or chemical processes, but as cosmic forces that gave birth to the Material Plane and everything within it. Energy types function as the raw power of those forces, which proves destructive to creatures with bodies made as result of those elements. This is partially why many outsiders from the outer planes have strong resistances or immunities to energy damage. Needless to say, our modern understanding of physics does not apply in this setting, something I think even the writers of Pathfinder material sometimes forget.
This is true.
However, even with that tidbit, the whole thing doesn't make any sense.
Could just do away with it all using homebrew and archetypes. Earth domain with metal and caves subdomains uses no acids. Sorcerer bloodline would need some homebrew. Maybe natural armor instead of acid resistance then add iron fist and an earthquake spell like ability.
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In the Wu Xing (Chinese "elements" ) cold is associated with metal, while water is associated with electricity (lightening happens when it rains).
So we could have
Air (sonic)
Water (electricity)
Earth (fire)
Wood (acid)
Metal (cold)Of course one could go scientific and point out that cold and heat affect everything and thus should not be a type of energy associated with an element (since then they'd be immune to it).
If I'm not mistaken, the classical Wu Xing elements don't include air, but do include fire. Based on the "insulting" cycle, I might go with:
Fire - Fire. "Fire evaporates water."
Water - Electricity. "Water washes away (or penetrates earth)
Earth - Sonic. "Earth (rocks) breaks wood."
Wood - Acid. "Wood dulls metal."
Metal - Cold. "Metal shields against fire." (Also: fire melts metal, implying metal was cold to begin with.)
All in all, I'm least impressed with the assignment of Sonic. I'm most surprised by cold/electric; I'd have expected that metal would conduct electricity and water would cool stuff. But I suppose this systems pre-dates modern knowledge about electrical wiring.
I've always figured that cold, fire, and electricity made sense as "elemental" types, but that acid was a bad fit. I'd like to see more earth-based spells that deal physical damage types, like bludgeoning and piercing. Same goes for wind- and water-based spells.
Suppose the 4 elements correspond to 4 states of matter (earth=solid, water=liquid, air=gas, fire=plasma), and suppose the energy types are what they are, and decoupled.
The problem is when you have a Sorcerer with the Elemental bloodline... half the abilities are "elemental energy" attacks, or modifications thereof.
So... What to do!
Look at these...
If you decouple the energy types from the elements, what is a good rule of thumb for modifying these?