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Please elaborate a). Is it 1) He intentionally fails to defend the innocent, or 2) He tries to defend the innocent but fails?
Hoping for 1) ;)
Hmm, I will bite.
1) I´d go with shirking his responsibility to protect the innocent. Sometimes, the Paladin can´t do it for whatever reasons (i.e. a 2nd level paladin faced who learns of a rampaging dragon is perfectly in the right to call for help rather than try to challenge the monster.
2) Works. I´d actually state that adhering to the faith of his or her divine patron is more important than adhering to the letter of the code of the organization.
3) A paladin shall not steal. The player should be penalized for his or her own sins, though, i.e. by having to buy more nachos.
I´d probably have a talk with the player (which might lead to the paladin falling) in case of a paladin having blatant disregard for his codes or morality. Torture and rape are a fine example, but unnecessary stealing, killing etc definitely merits a good look.
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A paladin falls in my campaign if they go through with an evil action after I warn them it will cause them to fall.
1. They espouse an interpretation of their "Code" that differs slightly from mine.
2. They act upon it.
[/sarcasm]
a) He fails to defend the innocent;
b) He flouts the tenets of his god; or
c) He tries to steal the GM's nachos.
We've changed the nature of Paladins in our game a bit - they represent the cardinal aspects of alignment specifically; in other words, Paladins either embody Good, Evil, Order or Chaos primarily... but there's a fair bit of leeway even within those accepted parameters. Case in point, one of the examples we use is Batman and the Joker - Batman might be a Chaotic Good Paladin of Chaos whereas the Joker would be a Chaotic Evil Paladin of Chaos and the two still remain bitter enemies. The Batman works outside of the law for good because he recognizes its ultimate limitations whereas the Joker sows chaos and discord for its own sake, indifferent to (or even because of) the suffering it may cause innocents.
Its been very popular and worked incredibly well thus far, requiring only tiny tweaks to the existing rules. It also makes 'falling' both less likely to happen and more obvious when it should be considered.
Bottom line - if a Paladin in your campaign spends all of his time (or even half of it) worrying about when or if the GM is going to take away his class abilities, then you're probably doing it wrong. When a Paladin is created, it should be made because the player wants to role-play according to a specific code, whatever that code is, and that that code be agreed upon by both he and the GM ahead of time. If the player's attitude is that he simply wants a 'Fighter with Smite' free from any code of conduct whatsoever, then the GM should probably discourage him or disallow the class.
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a. third time this have been done in like three days
2. it was pretty bad those times too
d. booooo get off the stage
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8. If he voluntarily jumps off a cliff
9. If he is successfully pushed over the edge of said cliff
10. If he fails his save vs. a Grease spell in an appropriate situation
11. If he is successfully tripped
(I almost forgot)
12. If he drinks the GM's milk
He fails his acrobatics check on the icy bridge next game session.
Silly, yes, but still very true :)
He fails his acrobatics check on the icy bridge next game session.
Silly, yes, but still very true :)
You're such a downer ...
Never.
RP'd actions should have RP'd consequences. Assuming he is actually part of an order, if they find out, they'll call him on the carpet.
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5. They fail to tie their bootlaces.
6. The arcane trickster secretly ties his bootlaces together.
13. Someone claps their hands.
14. Every time someone rings a bell.
He'll fall when he comits a horribly evil act.
He should not have to worry about petty things, but if he does something blatantly evil, like eating a live kitten, yeah, he's going to fall.
Yes.
XD.
My favorite houserule for how paladins work is that they are required to have sworn some oath (or oaths) to uphold, depending on their patron deity (decided upon by GM and player together). Like a paladin sworn to eradicate dragons. Or sworn to bring freedom to a kingdom. Or sworn protect a king. They could be CN, so long as they continually uphold and fight for their oath. If they break their oath, or commit some action that contradicts their oath, they fall. (Admittedly, this raises some questions about how the detect and smite abilities work, but I figured this thread was more on the RP side of things anyway. I have house rules for this, too, but that's a different topic.)
... if someone rolls a Paladin.
15. If anyone is mad at him for any reason out of game.
a) He fails to defend the innocent;
b) He flouts the tenets of his god; or
c) He tries to steal the GM's nachos.
a) I agree if he/she willingly ignores to do so. If he/she has to face a greater threat it may be justified to fail to defend the innocent.
b) I'd say that a champion of a diety, that ignores the tenets of his diety has a lot to answer for: starting by falling from grace.c) Everyone knows that Steve Jackson Munchkin rules clearly state: You bribe the DM with food -> you go up a level. So I think that stealing from the DM costs you a level right??????
