Goblin Squad Member
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This thread is our policy discussion thread and while questions concerning our policies are welcome...Thanks, that's why I came to this thread to ask the questions. And I specifically asked the questions generally because I was interested in the general policy, and not particularly interested in any specific occurrence.
It's a little difficult to parse, since you don't answer the question directly. From Bluddwolf's post, it sounded like he would be more than happy to target a Settlement or Company for something that happens on these forums, but he also makes reference to his post in the Roseblood Accord thread - and you echo that reference - that seems to say something else.
We will try our best that no company or settlement feels that it has been "singled out" for our predation, without our having declared them a feud or war target.I will also point out that this language is what prompted me to ask about declaring Wars or Feuds against meta-game organizations.
Thanks for taking the time to respond.
Wow, just Wow!! I had offered what you are asking for now, in the Roseblood Accord and your side said "that is not enough". Now all of a sudden you expect us to offer it back up again, and we are the bad guys who don't keep our word if we don't?
You have some set of goblin balls even bringing up what we offered in the accord. You need to own up to your hypocrisy first, before we move forward with anything constructive.
I'm in commute and will be in TS around 9:00 PM Est.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Wow, just Wow!! I had offered what you are asking for now, in the Roseblood Accord and your side said "that is not enough".
I am not asking for anything from you other than a clarification on UNC Policy. I thought I remembered a specific statement that you would not target players for anything that happened on the forums. If my questions are unwelcome, I'll withdraw them.
You need to own up to your hypocrisy first...
I honestly don't know what you're talking about. I asked sincere questions in the Roseblood Accord thread, of the community, of you, and of myself. I tried to give considered answers to those questions as well.
I think you're attaching a lot of baggage to my questions here that isn't warranted.
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Goblin Squad Member
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[From Bluddwolf's post, it sounded like he would be more than happy to target a Settlement or Company for something that happens on these forums, but he also makes reference to his post in the Roseblood Accord thread - and you echo that reference - that seems to say something else.
You know full well that I made that offer in the Roseblood Accord, and it was rejected. Now you call me on not holding to that offer, as if I'm going back on my word.
It would not have seemed to be or been "something else" if the original offer was accepted.
For lack of a better word, I call that hypocrisy.
Goblinworks Executive Founder
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Bluddwolf, honestly, I was absolutely sure that your offer to the Roseblood Accord was just a troll. Now, I'm not so sure.
Wouldn't it be better, to just recognise that you have a misperception of what was supposed to be this accord, maybe because, I don't know, of a not perfect choice of words on behalf of the authors of said accord ?
Look, I'm not a hypocrite : I ain't a fan of some of your members, but you don't strike me as a jerk, and your company objectives are totally fine. But I am under the impression that you want your roleplay, to have a "morally positive" image from other people.
Wouldn't it be better, to just accept that the alignment spectrum is made so that UNC & Roseblood are pretty much playing on opposite sides of said spectrum ?
I mean... I totally consider UNC, to be an evil company. But I absolutely don't consider the players of UNC, to be "evil", or "bad". You just are one of the sides of the game.
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Goblin Squad Member
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[From Bluddwolf's post, it sounded like he would be more than happy to target a Settlement or Company for something that happens on these forums, but he also makes reference to his post in the Roseblood Accord thread - and you echo that reference - that seems to say something else.You know full well that I made that offer in the Roseblood Accord, and it was rejected. Now you call me on not holding to that offer, as if I'm going back on my word.
It would not have seemed to be or been "something else" if the original offer was accepted.
For lack of a better word, I call that hypocrisy.
I'll call you out on it...and this is the correct thread to do that in.
1. We will not corpse camp or respawn camp a recent victim of anyone's attack, unless that victim is a feud or war target and it is in our best interest to prevent that character from returning to the battlefield.
2. We will not prey upon new players, in the starter area, unless they are feud, war, bounty or assassination targets. The only other exception is if it is our member(s) that are also new and attempting to learn the mechanics of the game.
3. We will never use the chat channel to mock or ridicule our victims.
4. We will be helpful to new players or those who ask for advice, including and perhaps in particular those who we have defeated in combat.
5. This one is tricky and takes much thought and walking a tight rope: We will try our best that no company or settlement feels that it has been "singled out" for our predation, without our having declared them a feud or war target.
The five points above do not advocate positive gameplay, they are limitation on griefing. You can decide not to adhere to them, but it will not be the members of the Roseblood Accord that you will then need to answer to, it will be Customer Service team at Goblinworks as you petition your suspension/ban.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I'll call you out on it...and this is the correct thread to do that in.
The five points above do not advocate positive gameplay, they are limitation on griefing. You can decide not to adhere to them, but it will not be the members of the Roseblood Accord that you will then need to answer to, it will be Customer Service team at Goblinworks as you petition your suspension/ban.1. We will not corpse camp or respawn camp a recent victim of anyone's attack, unless that victim is a feud or war target and it is in our best interest to prevent that character from returning to the battlefield.
2. We will not prey upon new players, in the starter area, unless they are feud, war, bounty or assassination targets. The only other exception is if it is our member(s) that are also new and attempting to learn the mechanics of the game.
3. We will never use the chat channel to mock or ridicule our victims.
4. We will be helpful to new players or those who ask for advice, including and perhaps in particular those who we have defeated in combat.
5. This one is tricky and takes much thought and walking a tight rope: We will try our best that no company or settlement feels that it has been "singled out" for our predation, without our having declared them a feud or war target.
To be clear you are stating that you consider not following points 4 and 5 to be griefing? I would not assume GW will share that point of view. Following those 2 points is a nice thing to do, but I severely doubt it will be an expectation.
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Goblin Squad Member
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No, probably not 4. 1-3 and 5 would be though. You do not feel making a "company or settlement feels that it has been "singled out" for our predation, without our having declared them a feud or war target." would be griefing? What do you call griefing then?
Does the fact that #4 might not be relevant invalidate my point? It does not seem so to me.
Items 2, 4 and 5 are not anti griefing. There is no prohibition on killing new characters in the NPC zone, if that were the case they would turn off PVP in that zone.
Enjoy that then.
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Goblin Squad Member
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No, probably not 4. 1-3 and 5 would be though. You do not feel making a "company or settlement feels that it has been "singled out" for our predation, without our having declared them a feud or war target." would be griefing? What do you call griefing then?
I believe it's going to be called war as usual. Goblinworks has better things to do than interfere with intense rivalries when neither side is abusing mechanics in an unintended way. I don't think anyone who can't handle that will be cut out for this game long-term. This game will be brutal and conflict between companies and settlements is a major content generator.
Do I really need to define griefing behaviors that fall outside of that to you?
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Goblin Squad Member
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No, probably not 4. 1-3 and 5 would be though. You do not feel making a "company or settlement feels that it has been "singled out" for our predation, without our having declared them a feud or war target." would be griefing? What do you call griefing then?I believe it's going to be called war as usual. Goblinworks has better things to do than interfere with intense rivalries when neither side is abusing mechanics in an unintended way. I don't think anyone who can't handle that will be cut out for this game long-term.
Do I really need to define griefing behaviors that fall outside of that to you?
You do not need to do anything for me Andius.
Thankfully, we will not be playing in the same community...and while I sincerely hope everyone, including you, is able to enjoy this game, I am not going to get involved with policing the way you treat your community; they can do that. I am also not going to be the "positive game play" referee, GW can do that. I, and mine, will do our best to promote what we feel is positive game play by example. I am sure you, and yours, will do the same.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Wait, do the members of UNC believe that "Preying upon new players, in the starter area, NOT feud, war, bounty or assassination targets, by experienced players with developed characters" is an acceptable behavior, absent any particular agreement not to?
How many times do we have to answer the same questions to the same people? Bludd did not say that, pay attention.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Wait, do the members of UNC believe that "Preying upon new players, in the starter area, NOT feud, war, bounty or assassination targets, by experienced players with developed characters" is an acceptable behavior, absent any particular agreement not to?
This member may or may not believe that. But that's no business of yours.
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we will only know who is a griefer/evil/conqueror when the game goes live. Until then, we are only wasting time pointing fingers with no real proof.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Just so there is no confusion, the UNC has been a Chaotic Neutral company and open to individual characters who are CN, CG, CE and TN.
Aragon (CN) is likewise a settlement open to CN, CG, CE and TN
Currently all companies are part of the UNC charter. Members of the newly formed The Vigilant (CG) are members of UNC. We will raid with each other, defend each other and otherwise support each other.
The UnNamed Company = CN, Barbarian Raiders and Bandits with some Assassins thrown in for laughs!
The Vigilant = CG, Rangers, Druids, and whomever else considers themselves defenders of freedom and nature.
The CE division does not yet have a name. Since I consider that this alignment has been much maligned, I am leaning to a name that would encourage those to extol the virtues of both Chaos and Evil.
The Exalted Bastards is my suggested name for this division.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I would like to know what specific plans you have for early EE. I know it will be a time to just fool around and have fun, but what about settlement vs settlement PVP? Will you be testing other settlements to see if they are weak and unskilled in battle? I have my own view on who looks like they might be easy but we will see when EE starts.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I would like to know what specific plans you have for early EE. I know it will be a time to just fool around and have fun, but what about settlement vs settlement PVP? Will you be testing other settlements to see if they are weak and unskilled in battle? I have my own view on who looks like they might be easy but we will see when EE starts.
Too soon to tell. There are some some who don't believe SvS will be ready for even OE. There are a few who also don't expect to see many of the same people on the forums now, even make it to OE.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I would like to know what specific plans you have for early EE. I know it will be a time to just fool around and have fun, but what about settlement vs settlement PVP? Will you be testing other settlements to see if they are weak and unskilled in battle? I have my own view on who looks like they might be easy but we will see when EE starts.Too soon to tell. There are some some who don't believe SvS will be ready for even OE. There are a few who also don't expect to see many of the same people on the forums now, even make it to OE.
I wasn't too clear in my question, this is a PVP game will you be heading over to a nearby settlement to raid them and kill whoever is around? I know that settlement conquest is in the far future , but it seems each settlement will have to choose another settlement to be game content when EE starts.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Yes, the UNC will be raiding (PVP) various targets, based on the division's focus.
UNC - Raiders / Bandits will raid for greed's sake. High value and low risk targets are ideal. Using Outpost / POI raiding (Hostility Mechanic); Raiding Caravans (SAD or Ambush); Using Feud or faction mechanic to raid enemies.
The Vigilant - Raiding / Feud mechanics vs. Slavers or enemies of Aragon. Also using sanctioned methods against strip miners / exploitive harvesters and faction targets.
The Exalted bastards - Raiding for Destruction of Outposts / POIs. Killing enemies of Aragon, UNC or TEB without mercy but still within sanctioned methods, unless extreme circumstances dictate differently.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Yes, the UNC will be raiding (PVP) various targets, based on the division's focus.
UNC - Raiders / Bandits will raid for greed's sake. High value and low risk targets are ideal. Using Outpost / POI raiding (Hostility Mechanic); Raiding Caravans (SAD or Ambush); Using Feud or faction mechanic to raid enemies.
The Vigilant - Raiding / Feud mechanics vs. Slavers or enemies of Aragon. Also using sanctioned methods against strip miners / exploitive harvesters and faction targets.
The Exalted bastards - Raiding for Destruction of Outposts / POIs. Killing enemies of Aragon, UNC or TEB without mercy but still within sanctioned methods, unless extreme circumstances dictate differently.
Just to add to this.....
Unless Aragon is solely a UNC holding, then Aragon is not UNC, but UNC will be solely for Aragon.
The ruling council of Aragon will determine who her "enemies" for purposes of feud or war. The UnNamed Company will share those, but Aragon may not share UNC targets.
Contrary to possible belief the UNC does not have any predetermined targets on or off the table. Contractual and Risk vs. Reward are the two major considerations. A third consideration is the specific roles of our divisions.
Will the Vigilant attack and kill for the purpose of greed? No! They are Chaotic Good, and have a higher purpose of anti slavery and defending nature from exploitation.
Will the Exalted Bastards attack and kill for the purpose of greed? No! They are Chaotic Evil, and will kill for "at cost" or free because that is what they do.
Will the UnNamed Company attack and kill for the purpose of greed? Abso.. F'ing.. Lutely!
I hope that clears things up
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Goblin Squad Member
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Yeah that helps a lot, I was getting ready to ask what is Aragon that UNC is not. However I am still wondering just what is UNC then, You have 3 CC's so you are not a company and also you are not a settlement .How will UNC be governed if it is not the same as Aragon and yet it has 3 companies ,is it a metagame guild? If Aragon is not UNC then I can't see the separate organization.
It seems UNC will have to become Aragon or try to exist as an entity that PFO does not support in-game.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Yeah that helps a lot, I was getting ready to ask what is Aragon that UNC is not. However I am still wondering just what is UNC then, You have 3 CC's so you are not a company and also you are not a settlement .How will UNC be governed if it is not the same as Aragon and yet it has 3 companies ,is it a metagame guild? If Aragon is not UNC then I can't see the separate organization.
It seems UNC will have to become Aragon or try to exist as an entity that PFO does not support in-game.
The nature of the land rush separates settlement from company. Not all of our votes are UNC members, and so they will have a voice in Aragon that will be a part of many voices and not just UNC.
This is why we listed "Aragon (CN)" in the land rush and not The UnNamed Company. Aragon is to be "bigger" than the UNC, but if it does not end up that way, it will be big enough for us.
Motto: "In Chaos we are bound only by our Love for Freedom"
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Goblin Squad Member
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I prefer the term "divisions" rather than "companies" for the 3 within UNC. We are all UNC, however, we each apply the river freedoms and obtain our own goals in different ways, basically our motivations are different. Each division covers an alignment within the Chaotic axis.
The UNC is and always has been governed by a council. The council is overseeing each of the divisions. Each division will perform on their own, as a separate company would, though assistance will always be provided as needed. Such as the Exalted Bastards could provide more muscle for UNC when they do a raid, or the UNC could support the Vigilant on an anti-slavery raid, provided there is profits to be made. (such as the slaves are harvesting a gold mine or something.)
UNC is both a meta concept (something similar to PAX I guess) but also an in game company (our greedy members). If each division is unable to support itself with the numbers needed to be effective, then they will be dissolved back into UNC and it will be treated as a failed venture.
Aragon is simply a settlement, a place for any and all chaotics to call home, and for any willing to respect the river freedoms to visit. The UNC and each of its divisions, will be calling Aragon home. If we are the only company to do so, then we will be the leaders of Aragon. If other companies also call it home, then they will also sit on the council. Regardless of who makes up the council, they are the only ones that will determine the course that Aragon will travel, enemies, alliances, trade, growth, ect.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Trying too hard right now man, I'm sorry. You've probably been up for a while haven't ya?
I won't judge if he is trying to catch me into saying something I don't intend. That would prove to be pretty hard actually, I am often too honest for my own good, and I speak what I believe.
I will answer the question he may have on his mind.....
Will the UNC raid Pax owned outposts, POIs and caravans? Yes, we will and we have said that to Pax leadership on multiple occasions. They understand it, they get it, they understand us, they know PFO is an Open World PvP MMO that will be very competitive.
We are not looking to play FarmVille / Sim City River Kingdoms edition. We (UNC) are thinking "PvP 9/10". The other 10% of the time I'm on a bio break or grabbing a sandwich or mixing me a Captains and Ginger Ale!
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Goblin Squad Member
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Trying too hard right now man, I'm sorry. You've probably been up for a while haven't ya?I won't judge if he is trying to catch me into saying something I don't intend. That would prove to be pretty hard actually, I am often too honest for my own good, and I speak what I believe.
I will answer the question he may have on his mind.....
Will the UNC raid Pax owned outposts, POIs and caravans? Yes, we will and we have said that to Pax leadership on multiple occasions. They understand it, they get it, they understand us, they know PFO is an Open World PvP MMO that will be very competitive.
We are not looking to play FarmVille / Sim City River Kingdoms edition. We (UNC) are thinking "PvP 9/10". The other 10% of the time I'm on a bio break or grabbing a sandwich or mixing me a Captains and Ginger Ale!
To prevent any miscommunications: "PAX" can be replaced with ANY COMPANY in PFO. The UNC will target anyone at any time we are paid to. Only companies safe will be members of Aragon, or that we already have a contract to protect. (and even that has an expiration date.)
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Goblin Squad Member
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Trying too hard right now man, I'm sorry. You've probably been up for a while haven't ya?I am UNC now and have an interest in them being strong and avoiding decisions that will weaken them later , like some guilds have done.
Really? How did I miss that? As chaotic as we are, we do have a process to be followed and there is vetting to be done.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Really? How did I miss that? As chaotic as we are, we do have a process to be followed and there is vetting to be done.Trying too hard right now man, I'm sorry. You've probably been up for a while haven't ya?I am UNC now and have an interest in them being strong and avoiding decisions that will weaken them later , like some guilds have done.
If you don't trust me you should say so and get it out in the open. I know that you know I joined , If you prefer I will wait 10 weeks and leave . I can stay out of it and you won't be hearing from me on your threads.
I did after all sell my vote to end up here, rather strange how that worked out.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Kindness repaid with threats? Bah, typical bandits! *Shakes Fist*
OOC: About trust, nothing about my posts here have anything to do with whom I trust.
Actually I was talking to Bludd, and his earlier comment that was about me trying to trap him into saying something, that indicates he may think he is on some hit list of mine, I just was trying to figure out how they don't think UNC is Aragon. It won't even matter for a long time but someday it could result in a political mess that weakens the settlement.
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Goblin Squad Member
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If you don't trust me you should say so and get it out in the open. I know that you know I joined , If you prefer I will wait 10 weeks and leave . I can stay out of it and you won't be hearing from me on your threads.
I did after all sell my vote to end up here, rather strange how that worked out.
Although we appreciate your vote in the land rush, that is not the same thing as company membership.
You should vote for Aragon because as a settlement it will offer you the services, or social interaction you are looking for.
You should join a company that matches what your looking to do in the game and to build strong bonds with a group of players for mutual support and gain.
I am not closing the door here, I'm just explaining the two are not the same. We have a process for joining our company, supporting the settlement is one part of it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Well I am really confused now about how it is I joined Aragon but not UNC, however I did give you vote so we will leave it at that. I haven't decided what character to roll yet, and now I understand that I am not part of UNC so I don't have to decide yet. So who is the Aragon leader that I joined up with? Is it you, LOL. I'm pretty sure I joined some guild , that is what it said I was doing.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think I see where the confusion is coming from, the land rush page has you click a (join) button and then your application must be approved . However it could just say (vote) and that would be more accurate. It leads you to think you have joined a guild instead of just casting a vote ,which is what you are doing.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think I see where the confusion is coming from, the land rush page has you click a (join) button and then your application must be approved . However it could just say (vote) and that would be more accurate. It leads you to think you have joined a guild instead of just casting a vote ,which is what you are doing.
Ahh, I did not realize that is where the confusion was coming from. I can see how that would be misleading.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The way that the landrush page is set up has it "your joining a guild, and therefor giving them your vote so they can get a settlement." However, it was ALSO said that just because you join a company (vote for their settlement) does NOT require that you be a member of that same company once EE and OE comes. Right now it is basically just votes for who gets to be the first 30 settlements, but is done in a way to give those 30 to the top (largest) 30 guilds.
There has been much confusion surrounding this and one of the things why there has been talk and discussion concerning what the vote means. Joining the company or supporting the settlement.
We at the UNC, and as founding members of Aragon, are treating any votes we receive as support of the settlement Aragon, while membership to UNC (and the 3 divisions of) are a separate matter.
Also, I am the "leader" of Aragon in that I started the guild for the land rush 2 poll. Just FYI :-)
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Goblin Squad Member
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Most of it will depend greatly on how settlement membership works in game. If it is similar to a guild membership, where you ask for, or receive an invite and then you are tagged as a member of that settlement, then anyone that wishes to join Aragon, weather a whole company or as an individual, as long as you meet any alignment reputation requirements (again pending in game restrictions) will be allowed to join.
Joining the UNC is a separate process that, I would assume, is similar to joining any other company on the forums. Do your motives align with ours? Do you intend to support our cause and follow our rules? If so, then you can join. Come to the website and put in an application.
As of right now, until we get in game, Aragon is a meta concept and a poll option on the land rush 2 boards. (Which should be noted, ALL settlements are the same, meta concept and a poll option until we all get in game.)
