Cernunnos

[Tinalles]

I have a player who has expressed an interest having her PC become a worshiper of Cernunnos, primarily as a less-stuffy alternative to Erastil.

I've found precious little about him. The only two sources I found are the Bestiary (p. 23) and the Chronicles of the Righteous (p. 54), which yielded the information that he's an azata loner who likes forests and dalliance.

Is there anything more known about him? I'm perfectly happy to make up homebrew material as needed, but if there's any more canon stuff out there, I'd rather know about it.

Thanks.

[Alleran]

Given that he's an actual real-world deity, you could draw on RL sources to supplement what's available in the PF books.

[Indagare]

Well, for homebrew there's some info on wikipedia. I'm not sure how helpful it will be.

There's also a wickedly cool picture of him.

[doc the grey]

Yeah if you have access to what is in the Bestiary 4 you are already ahead of most of us man. I've been waiting for my subscription to hit since last week and the wait's killing me.

[Tinalles]

Oh, is there something about him in Bestiary 4?

*checks blog post with table of contents*

Yes, yes there is. And I had no idea.

See? THAT is exactly why I posted a question! I will of course supplement with historical sources as appropriate -- I work in an academic library, I'm sure I can dig up some stuff about him. But it's good to use the stuff that's already been made!

Thanks!

[W E Ray]

He seems like he'd make a good Agathion Deity -- or is that just me?

[Mojorat]

Apparently he will be in the nee beastiary.

[Mythic Mikaze]

Given his roots he seems like a good fit for a god/Empyreal of Old Sarkoris* right alongside Pulura and as a Green Faith ally.

Not to mention the witch patron angle. :)

*Now there's a possible reason for his seeming obscurity in Chronicle of the Righteous: It's a relatively recent development, because most of his worshippers died with Sarkoris. Go fig that a benevolent "Horned God" should be supplanted by demons. Makes one wonder how less knowledgable crusaders would react upon seeing his abandoned shrines and temples.

[Evan Tarlton]

Mythic Mikaze wrote:

Now there's a possible reason for his seeming obscurity in Chronicle of the Righteous: It's a relatively recent development, because most of his worshippers died with Sarkoris. Go fig that a benevolent "Horned God" should be supplanted by demons. Makes one wonder how less knowledgable crusaders would react upon seeing his abandoned shrines and temples.

That would help explain some of the persecution which some people suffered during the earlier Crusades.

[Tinalles]

I've been reading up on the historical sources, including diving through a variety of academic journals. The article "Cernunnos: Origin and Transformation of a Celtic Divinity" by Phillis Fray Bober (American Journal of Archaeology, Vol. 55 No. 1, Jan, 1951) is pretty good, though of course decidedly academic.

Older sources such as John Rhys' "Lectures on the Origin and Growth of Religion as Illustrated by Celtic Heathendom" (starting pg. 77) contain some useful information as well, and have the advantage of being freely available online. But I tend to trust them a bit less -- scholarship of the late 19th century often strikes me as unreflectively paternalistic.

The best online source I've found is ΚΑΡΝΟΝΟΥ : to CARNONOS. It's clear, lucid, well-illustrated -- and carries its own ideological baggage, in that it was written by an anonymous Gaulish reconstructionist, i.e. a neo-pagan seeking to restore the worship of pre-Roman Gallic deities. So the writing is religiously motivated. That said, the scholarship seems careful -- the writer cites both primary sources (viz. Julius Caesar) and modern academics (the article by Bober I mentioned above), and the writing avoids making any major unsupported leaps of logic. As long as you're aware of the author's angle, I think it's a good source.

That also raises a point worth making: Cernunnos, "The Horned God", and Herne the Hunter are not necessarily the same -- but they are alike in that certain variants of neopaganism feature their worship.

So, you know, if your group happens to have a wiccan, neo-pagan, or other practitioner of alternative spiritual traditions, it would be diplomatic to discuss it with them before introducing Cernunnos into your game. Or else simply omit him silently, for the same reason one would likely not plop a stat-block down and announce that it's Allah, God, Yahweh, Ganesha, Buddha, or any other actively-worshiped deity.

[Devastation Bob]

Chronicle of the Righteous lists his favored weapon as a club, Bestiary 4 says it's longbow. Too bad there's no boon listing for him in CoR either, he seems pretty badass in his Bestiary writeup.

[Icyshadow]

Longbow would fit better in my opinion.

[Changing Man]

Club? Longbow? I'd be more inclined to say Spear- at least when considering RealWorld depictions (modern depictions, that is- I'd have to ask my druid friends about archaeic depictions)

[AlgaeNymph]

Devastation Bob wrote:

Chronicle of the Righteous lists his favored weapon as a club, Bestiary 4 says it's longbow.

And his writeup was a mess. In Bestiary 4 he has Improved Critical (scimitar)...and a club with a scimitar's threat range.

Changing Man wrote:

Club? Longbow? I'd be more inclined to say Spear- at least when considering RealWorld depictions.

That's...a good idea. Should I change that or leave his melee weapon as a scimitar?