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That "stealth check+20" was a copy and paste.
That "stealth check+20" was a copy and paste.
Are you replying to me? What's your point?
When you said "for" were you not saying that you use "stealth check+20" as the DC, instead of to modify the DC?
That "stealth check+20" was a copy and paste.Are you replying to me? What's your point?
When you said "for" were you not saying that you use "stealth check+20" as the DC, instead of to modify the DC?
IIRC you told me that was incorrect. Yes that is the DC to pinpoint before any other modifiers come into play.
IIRC you told me that was incorrect.
Instead of recollecting, you could just go look at what was written.
Yes that is the DC to pinpoint before any other modifiers come into play.
What are you even talking about?
The rules say:
"A creature can generally notice the presence of an active invisible creature within 30 feet with a DC 20 Perception check."
And:
"It's practically impossible (+20 DC) to pinpoint an invisible creature's location with a Perception check."
So there you go.
That has nothing to do with stealth. That tells you the DC, and it tells you how to modify the DC to pinpoint.
The rules then go on to say:
"There are a number of modifiers that can be applied to this DC if the invisible creature is moving or engaged in a noisy activity."
Check that out: Modifiers to the DC!
One of the modifiers is when the "Invisible creature is..." "Using Stealth" and the Perception modifier is "Stealth check +20"
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The FAQ system is intended to clarify things in the rules that are unclear. It is not intended to get an official response on whether or not something that is explicit in the text should actually be in the game at all.
Do not abuse the FAQ system.
"Is invisibility intended to grant a bonus to stealth checks?"
"If you would like to see this officially addressed, please click the FAQ button on the upper right corner of this post."
"Please do not use this thread to argue whether or not invisibility does grant a bonus to stealth checks. What the rules currently state is not the point. Please keep discussion as to whether, ideally, being invisible should grant a bonus to stealth checks."
If the intent of the OP was "what should the Perception DC/modifier be for invisibility?," the above text doesn't indicate that, at all.
The question was "Is invis supposed to grant a bonus to stealth", and it was a silly question, even though the OP was asking for someone else who refused to participate in the thread. In any event the "Staff response: no reply required." counts as "of course it does since that is what the book says".
I am surprised it even got 26 FAQ's.
My rant is over before my post gets deleted.
This thread has the merit of having clarified certain things vis-a-vis invisibility ; Grick's explanations did that for me.
I'm glad I managed to read it to the end without my head exploding, though :-).
Do not abuse the FAQ system.
That wasn't my intention. Apologies. Won't happen again.
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"Is invisibility intended to grant a bonus to stealth checks?"
"If you would like to see this officially addressed, please click the FAQ button on the upper right corner of this post."
"Please do not use this thread to argue whether or not invisibility does grant a bonus to stealth checks. What the rules currently state is not the point. Please keep discussion as to whether, ideally, being invisible should grant a bonus to stealth checks."
If the intent of the OP was "what should the Perception DC/modifier be for invisibility?," the above text doesn't indicate that, at all.
The problem is that the question don't address the real quandary:
Grick, and a few people with him, is convinced that the static Dc of 20 to notice a invisible creature add up with the piece about adding your stealth check +20 to the Dc of noticing a stealthily character, for a total DC of 40+the stealth check, and 60+the stealth check to pinpoint him.
If he si right plenty of people has played invisibility wrong for years.
"Is invisibility intended to grant a bonus to stealth checks?"
"If you would like to see this officially addressed, please click the FAQ button on the upper right corner of this post."
"Please do not use this thread to argue whether or not invisibility does grant a bonus to stealth checks. What the rules currently state is not the point. Please keep discussion as to whether, ideally, being invisible should grant a bonus to stealth checks."
If the intent of the OP was "what should the Perception DC/modifier be for invisibility?," the above text doesn't indicate that, at all.
The problem is that the question don't address the real quandary:
Grick, and a few people with him, is convinced that the static Dc of 20 to notice a invisible creature add up with the piece about adding your stealth check +20 to the Dc of noticing a stealthily character, for a total DC of 40+the stealth check, and 60+the stealth check to pinpoint him.
If he si right plenty of people has played invisibility wrong for years.
He is not right about that. The DC to notice and the DC to pinpoint are two different things, but we went over that in another thread, and Paizo knows about it so instead of rehashing it we can just sit back and wait.
Also, I'm hesitant to hit FAQ on this as I believe that the way the title/opening post represent the argument it will cause whoever from Paizo looks at it to say, "Of course Stealth adds a bonus, duh." and not look at the actual issue. Which is how the bonuses listed under Perception, Stealth, and Invisibility are intended to interact/stack with each other.
I'm just saying.
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"Is invisibility intended to grant a bonus to stealth checks?"
"If you would like to see this officially addressed, please click the FAQ button on the upper right corner of this post."
"Please do not use this thread to argue whether or not invisibility does grant a bonus to stealth checks. What the rules currently state is not the point. Please keep discussion as to whether, ideally, being invisible should grant a bonus to stealth checks."
If the intent of the OP was "what should the Perception DC/modifier be for invisibility?," the above text doesn't indicate that, at all.
I agree. "may have been badly worded" was perhaps a vast understatement.
I can't speak to the OP's intent, though I believe I commented on the problems with the original question early in the thread.
I had hoped that if the FAQ was addressed, consideration would be taken of at least some of the debate in the thread. Now I know that only the original question will be considered and will take that into account in other FAQ requests.
This post by SKR and a the other in that thread explain very well how the FAQ system work. The discussion about a FAQ post generally isn't read when answering the question, so a badly worded FAQ don't work.
He is not right about that. The DC to notice and the DC to pinpoint are two different things, but we went over that in another thread, and Paizo knows about it so instead of rehashing it we can just sit back and wait.
But this thread has been considered for the FAQ while the other thread hasn't, AFAIK.
The other thread, here, has 12 FAQ hist against 27 on this one.